Bob Brandy's fullsize windows

[dmcjohn]

Hi lads,

I've tried before (I think on the old DMCtalk) to try and get some proper pictures of the custom windows Bob put in his car. This is the best I found so far, but still not great.

http://www.offto55.com/offto55.com/Replicas_files/Picture%205.jpg

Does anyone have details on this conversion? I've heard conflicting stories - some say they are electric and go all the way down, then I heard elsewhere they are manual sliding windows which slide to the rear?

Thanks,
John

[TTait]

I have no direct knowledge of that conversion, but I don't think you can drop the glass.

While it looks like its possible to get a full sized piece of glass into the lower half of the doors mass, it would first require heroic reworking of the door structure to do it, but thats not the deal killer as I see it.

If you think back to physics class you will recall that the amount of force a lever transfers depends not just on the weight pushing down on it, but how far that weight is from the fulcrum (pivot). If you take that already heavy piece of glass and then move it another 2' or so farther out from the hinges (when the door is open) you probably nearly double its weight, in terms of force on the torsion bar. That is, with the window down the door would feel significantly heavier than if it was up.

If you tried to balance the torsion bar to compensate for the window in its down position, it would break, but even if it didn't - if you opened the door with the window up it would shoot up like a rocket.

Our drop glass is much smaller overall, and constitutes less of a shift in weight.

That would leave you two options then, either safety interlocks that would prevent the door from being opened unless the window was mostly closed, or installing some kind of hydraulic door lift.

I'm aware of Proto 1 and one other car having windows that slide open, but I have not heard of anyone getting drop glass to work.

[content22207]

They are electrically operated, and they do indeed go all the way down:
3411 3412

Bob reports that JZD himself was very approving of them at DCS'00.

Bill Robertson
#5939

[TTait]

Ahh - cool, not full sized glass.

[EdR5150]

Picture taken right after a failure with the CO2 system...

[dmcjohn]

Hi Ed,

Thanks a mil for that great pic! I'd love to see this someday, or even a video of the window going up and down.

Thanks again,
John

[content22207]

Has anybody tried the radical step of contacting Bob or Ryan directly? They're members of the Delorean Midwest club. I believe Bob worked with Ken Koncelik on DCS'09. Tiffany may also have contact info.

Bill Robertson
#5939

[Bob635]

We are working on making kits available for the drivers door since this is the window that most drivers need to fully open.

There is NO ALTERATION of the door, the crash bar or other components. The full size window tracks bolt to the top of the door and the crash bar in the door. You do have to drill holes and insert threaded rivets so that everything bolts together.

You can also resinstall the stock window at a later time since none of these components are used or altered. (though once you drive your D with the window all the way down and be able to wave to people and go through a drive through.. )

We are also working on an installation video on how to install the full size window.

[dmcjohn]

Hi Bob,

Cool, sounds great - I'd be interested in a set for my 4 seater.

When you get a chance I'd love to see a video of the window going up and down and maybe a video from the inside while the car is driving with the windows down.

Well done on the conversion, it looks great and is one of those things I think DMC should have done from the beginning - it would seem to me to make the car much more practical.

Thanks!
John

[2k1Toaster]

I could have sworn in a documentary I saw about Delorean they had one parked on a street and asking strangers to be focus-group-esque testers. Rating the looks and functionality and at what price point they would or would not buy one. That model looked to have sliding windows, not the tiny roll down windows.

[DeloreanJoshQ]

Reminds me of a Lotus Esprit S1 window setup...
http://www.autozine.org/Archive/Lotus/classic/Esprit_S1_5.jpg


I wonder if the vertical trim blocks the side-view mirror vision?

[Bob635]

The full size windows are made of Lexan. Consequently, they weight significantly less than the glass windows.

The full size window weight 10 lbs less than the stock glass ones.

That is a 20 lbs savings for the total car-both doors.

[dvonk]

is it necessary to dial down the torsion bars after installation due to the lighter doors?

[Farrar]

We are working on making kits available for the drivers door since this is the window that most drivers need to fully open.

Bob, this is fantastic news. Do you think the average owner would have the necessary skill to install the new window system?

Also, welcome to DMCTalk. :)

Farrar

[Bob635]

Yes, the original proto car had a slider window. However, the opening was behind the driver and therefore not very useful.

[Bob635]

We have removed both the heavy glass windows and the old heavy solenoid lock.

We did readjust the torsion bars. Less torque on them should make them last longer.

[Bob635]

I think with the installation video the average owner should be able to install these.

[Bob635]

The vertical H track for the window is located so that it does not interfer with the drivers view of the mirrors. This means that the passenger window is different than the drivers window!

[dmcjohn]

We are working on making kits available for the drivers door since this is the window that most drivers need to fully open.

Just re-read this and realised you're only going to offer the drivers door conversion? To be honest I'd only modify both doors - I wouldn't go with a different window arrangement from one side of the car to the other - I'd want them exactly the same on both sides. Would you consider making the kit to convert 2 doors?

What kind of price are you thinking for the kit anyway?

thanks,
John

[Chris Burns]

I could have sworn in a documentary I saw about Delorean they had one parked on a street and asking strangers to be focus-group-esque testers. Rating the looks and functionality and at what price point they would or would not buy one. That model looked to have sliding windows, not the tiny roll down windows.

That Delorean was one of the Pilot cars I think that DMC would take around and show people. It's featured in the Pennmaker Documentary from 1980.

I do like the idea of getting more fresh air into passenger compartment of Delorean (especially if your AC quits working). I would be weary about making such a change though. Keep us updated on this and maybe make a video.

[kenny]

Hi Bob,
I am impressed with the engineering that would have went into developing this but I have questions over the durability of the lexan.
I work with Lexan (guarding around assembly machines) and it scratches VERY easily. Paper towel even scratches lexan.
Constantly raising and lowering the lexan through the window seals would concern me as well as even washing the windows. I think that they would be scratched up in under a year with regular use.
How have they been holding up on your own car?



The full size windows are made of Lexan. Consequently, they weight significantly less than the glass windows.

The full size window weight 10 lbs less than the stock glass ones.

That is a 20 lbs savings for the total car-both doors.

[dvonk]

i own a jeep wrangler, and the soft top vinyl windows scratch easily as well. i use Novus plastic polish to buff out any scratches and to remove oxidation. if you take care of them, plastic windows dont have to get ugly! :smile:

[content22207]

Can optical grade acrylic be shaped like Lexan? It is hundreds of times more scratch resistant.

Bill Robertson
#5939

[TTait]

I'd think popping for something with a UV coating would last longer too - less yellowing and clouding.

[Bob635]

Bill,

The window are made by ProGlass. They make the plastic windshields for race cars. (NASCAR). The windows are made of the same material so it is very tough and scratch resistant.

Bob

Tom,

I believe the ProGlass has the UV resistant inhibitors. The windows have not yellowed in over 14 years. Gees, I can't believe it has been that long!

Kenny,

We have been very pleased with the durability of the windows. According to ProGlass, this is special polycarbonate that has a silica or silicone coating that is baked into the surface to make it scratch resistant for NASCAR Racing.

All,

I need used original delorean power window motors with the lower drive sections. Don't need to tubing that usually gets bent - only the spring cable and clamp at the top.
We use parts from these, BUT have a much stronger set up that can't bend.

Many people have replaced these old bent units, with the new aftermarket upgrades. I still need the older units because they have a 5/16s drive cable rather than the 3/8 drive cable.

Bob

[Bitsyncmaster]

Can optical grade acrylic be shaped like Lexan? It is hundreds of times more scratch resistant.

Bill Robertson
#5939

All aircraft use lexan or other plastic. Even after years of blowing sand on it from the prop wash it holds up well. The weight savings and stronger for bird strikes require no use of glass.

[dmcjohn]

Hi Bob,

What kind of timeline are you thinking of for getting this to market?

Are you planning on offering a kit for both windows?

How much do you envisage the kit costing - even approximately?

Any chance you could upload some more pictures? If you could, I'd love to see a shot taken from the passenger seat looking across at the drivers window, with the door closed and someone sitting in the drivers seat - to get a sense of how the new window opening is positioned relative to your head position. Is it comfortable to put your elbow out the window while driving or is the opening too far forwards to do this comfortably?

Lastly, before you went down the lexan route, did you ever consider looking at cutting down a glass section from another car to make the 3 pieces required for your conversion? Maybe there is a car window out there with the same radius curve as the stock DMC window... and this window could be cut into 3 pieces and beveled at the edges...

Thanks!
John

[bunni]

Bumping this thread. Would like to see some cost estimates on this and if any progress on the kit has been made. I grew up not having AC in any of the family vehicles and very much prefer the windows down to feel the breeze, even in the dead of Phoenix summers.

-Kris
#4222

[TTait]

I ... very much prefer the windows down to feel the breeze, even in the dead of Phoenix summers.

-Kris
#4222

How many pounds do you lose per mile of driving that way? I know its a dry heat, but...

[bunni]

<OT>Never actually measured :D The worst part was going from PHX to Palm Springs CA, mid-summer, mid-day/evening, in a Civic that had no AC, with a failing radiator. I had to blast the heat on full in addition to having the windows down to prevent the car from overheating. It was like being in a furnace and the only way to cool off was a blowdryer in the face.</OT>

Back on topic, I am really excited for this and hope the kit is available on both driver and passenger sides. Awaiting more info!

-Kris
#4222