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Jonathan
12-12-2015, 11:34 AM
My car is stored now for the winter and with a handful of different jobs I am planning on completing, I figured I'd document it all in one place.

Some of the jobs I've already found how-to threads for, and others I haven't. I'll post links to what I'm using as references and what questions I still have.

My garage is not quite big enough for the DeLorean and my DD, so that means I clean snow off the Pontiac when I need to, but have loads of room to work around the DMC.

First thing up is removing the rear fascia.

I found this thread helpful, especially Nick's post #7 listing out the major steps:

http://dmctalk.org/showthread.php?7138-How-to-remove-rear-fascia

My fascia has almost all of those studs that are epoxy'ed right into the plastic rusted and broken off. I have had one of the replacement lower metal edging strips for a while. It is held in place well with the top five bolts and nut, but not very well on the lower seven. I have those replacement SS studs to put in as replacements.

These pics are from a couple winters ago.

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Once the rear fascia is out, I'll replace any fasteners or hardware that I can. And generally just clean it up from any leftover grime or spider's webs that were lingering inside. Depends on what I find as to what else gets done.

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It all came out pretty well with nothing new breaking. I took it out as one piece and then separated it afterwards. The nine screws along the top were easy, but the three nuts along each side that are kind of in behind were a bit of a pain to get a grip on. They came out eventually though and new nuts will go on to replace the rusty ones that came off. I hadn't realized there are two more studs, one on each end that hold those corner trim pieces in place. One of mine that pulled out is still attached to the bracket, the other is no where in sight.

My engine bay light works ok, but every so often doesn't come on unless you whack it lightly with your hand. I cleaned up the contacts and tightened the clasp that holds the bulb in there so we'll see if that helps. It doesn't cast a lot of light IMO, so more decoration than anything else.

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As Dana said in another thread where I mentioned this, the shock absorber piece could stand to come off and get recoated to help it from getting water logged.

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I have been needing to replace the bearing in at least one of the idler pulleys and will do this now. What it was doing was getting off centre just enough to catch the belt edge on the sharp edge of the metal bracket and this shred quite a lot of very fine rubbery bits all over the engine area around it. I noticed the cir-clip ring on the side you can see was not clipped all the way in and I'm wondering if that was causing any of the wobbling?

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http://dmctalk.org/showthread.php?12126-Bearing-replacement-for-A-C-idler-pulley

I have replacements for both license plate lights. The lenses, brackets, screws, all of it. I could have done those with the fascia still attached but figured this would be a better time to do it.

I also have a replacement upper right hand muffler bracket to put in. The original isn't broken, but looks fatigued and I was going to change it proactively. I have a starter heatshield to put on as well as my car never had one when I first got it. I also have a couple last pieces of my throttle spool safety recall kit to put on that I hadn't realized where they went until seeing a post from Dana showing where they go (thanks!).

That's about it for the moment. Cleaning is first up on the agenda.

Domi
12-12-2015, 11:39 AM
Thanks for sharing your work, and good luck for the next steps :thumbup:

Jonathan
12-21-2015, 10:40 PM
Nothing half-assed, right?

Lacking good access to the spark plug wires, distributor cap and rotor with most everything still in place, I went gung-ho and removed the intake manifold.

I really appreciated having the how-to from Mike (opethmike) as the steps were great to follow. Not easy, but straight forward for sure. Much of this had never been removed since I have owned the car, or longer. I paused with some penetrant spray on a couple screws (specifically the ones on top of the intake holding the air mixture unit in place) but eventually got everything apart and nothing snapped or broke (yippey!).

It's really filthy in a lot of places. Mostly the air mixture unit is really dirty and so is the top surface of the intake (the surface you can't normally see very well when the mixture unit is above it). What kind of advice do you have on cleaning these things? Some sort of engine degreaser? Any areas to avoid getting it into or onto (assuming I mask off the fuel distributor to keep it from getting dirty)?

The valley actually didn't look all that bad. It was dirty, but dry. And loose dirt mostly, like bits of all kinds of things and likely some left over from mice at some point over the years. I haven't started cleaning yet, vacuum cleaner is first up. But I did poke around with a screw driver and what I got to didn't have much moisture in it (other than where some fuel spilled from the lines dangling above).

No shortage of things to do over the holidays, that's for sure.

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Rich_NYS
12-22-2015, 12:08 AM
NICE!

Great to see you tearing into things, man....you ain't playin' round this year! :thumbup:

How about that impact absorber thing? "While you're in there....!"

-I'm going to remove mine & post pics, so there's a little more peer pressure for ya -haha!

Jonathan
01-01-2016, 12:13 PM
Happy New Year!

Here's the link I mentioned with the how-to for removing the intake:

http://dmctalk.org/showthread.php?429-How-to-Removing-intake-manifold

The remaining spark plugs have been changed and the plug wires have been replaced.

The suggested order of plug wires used, from shortest to longest, to give the best arrangement for routing, was: 4, 1, 5, 2, 6, 3

Original plug wires and distributor cap in place:

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Original rotor (or might already be the new one, they both looked very similar and in good shape):

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New cap, rotor, plug and coil wires installed:

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Original cylinder O-rings from under intake manifold:

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An idea of how much filth was on the top of the intake manifold before I got started:

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And the intake manifold after I went at for the first round with some engine cleaner:

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DMC-81
01-01-2016, 05:09 PM
Looks good Jonathan!

I found that spray carburetor cleaner really worked good on the inside and outside of the intake manifold. Be careful though because it will remove the paint marks ( I see a blue one in your pic)... if you're trying to keep them.

Jonathan
01-01-2016, 09:00 PM
Looks good Jonathan!

I found that spray carburetor cleaner really worked good on the inside and outside of the intake manifold. Be careful though because it will remove the paint marks ( I see a blue one in your pic)... if you're trying to keep them.

Thanks!

I saw in one of your comments actually where you mentioned using Gunk Engine Cleaner/Degreaser. I happened to have some of that from a few seasons ago. Worked really well. Efficiently anyway... wish my shower cleaned that easy!

I hadn't thought to try and keep the blue paint marks. I hadn't given them any historical significance. Would those blue paint marks be part of the safety related recall somehow, like the red paint marks on the firewall? I recall (man, I gotta stop with the puns) there was a blue paint one in addition to the red paint one, but don't know all the details. I swear the intake looked as dirty as the bottom of a BBQ when I started, so cleaner is better for me!

DMC-81
01-01-2016, 11:03 PM
Thanks!

I saw in one of your comments actually where you mentioned using Gunk Engine Cleaner/Degreaser. I happened to have some of that from a few seasons ago. Worked really well. Efficiently anyway... wish my shower cleaned that easy!

I hadn't thought to try and keep the blue paint marks. I hadn't given them any historical significance. Would those blue paint marks be part of the safety related recall somehow, like the red paint marks on the firewall? I recall (man, I gotta stop with the puns) there was a blue paint one in addition to the red paint one, but don't know all the details. I swear the intake looked as dirty as the bottom of a BBQ when I started, so cleaner is better for me!

You're welcome, and good to hear. The Gunk engine cleaner worked well on the outside of the engine, but I also used the carb cleaner for the internal portions of the VOD job and to remove any remaining filth/carbon where it needed it.

I had a green paint mark where your blue one is. Perhaps someone else can comment on their significance. I just tried to keep any that I could.

Hey, I use puns with my kids. They always groan when I do, :facepalm: but I find it helps develop their language skills, and then they come up with their own. :)

Jonathan
01-02-2016, 11:30 AM
You're welcome, and good to hear. The Gunk engine cleaner worked well on the outside of the engine, but I also used the carb cleaner for the internal portions of the VOD job and to remove any remaining filth/carbon where it needed it.

I had a green paint mark where your blue one is. Perhaps someone else can comment on their significance. I just tried to keep any that I could.

Hey, I use puns with my kids. They always groan when I do, :facepalm: but I find it helps develop their language skills, and then they come up with their own. :)

I didn't have much fear going pretty liberally on the intake for cleaning, but not so sure the same approach would work with the air fuel mixture unit. It is pretty filthy too, but I don't want to get any of that cleaner, or the grime it is removing, down inside the fuel distributor. What's the preferred method for cleaning the mixture unit as one complete assembly?

Good call on the kids vocabulary. I remember that kind of thing when I was a kid with Aunts or Uncles and the kids groaning. And real nice to see you've got the first few miles under your belt with driving your own car. That there was a ton of effort and dedication you put into it. Great job.

DMC-81
01-02-2016, 04:01 PM
I didn't have much fear going pretty liberally on the intake for cleaning, but not so sure the same approach would work with the air fuel mixture unit. It is pretty filthy too, but I don't want to get any of that cleaner, or the grime it is removing, down inside the fuel distributor. What's the preferred method for cleaning the mixture unit as one complete assembly?

Good call on the kids vocabulary. I remember that kind of thing when I was a kid with Aunts or Uncles and the kids groaning. And real nice to see you've got the first few miles under your belt with driving your own car. That there was a ton of effort and dedication you put into it. Great job.

Thanks for the compliment!

For the mixture unit, I put saran wrap on the air plate and secured it with a rubber band (and left it on until I put the air cleaner housing back on the car). Also I put small pieces of blue shop towels in the fuel injector line holes. After that, I gently cleaned the unit with carb cleaner and a toothbrush (trying to avoid the NLA rubber gasket 102772). Then, I removed the shop towel pieces and gently cleaned the injection holes with carb cleaner and Q-Tips. I painted the fuel distributor with flat black paint. If you do this, avoid getting the paint where the copper sealing washers go, otherwise fuel will leak. Here's a before and after pic:

Before:
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After:
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Cheers!

opethmike
01-02-2016, 04:34 PM
Why not just remove the fuel distributor? It's only on with three screws. Remove it, be careful with the plunger, and you'll have a much easier time cleaning up the mixture unit thoroughly.

DMC-81
01-02-2016, 04:59 PM
Why not just remove the fuel distributor? It's only on with three screws. Remove it, be careful with the plunger, and you'll have a much easier time cleaning up the mixture unit thoroughly.

Good suggestion Mike. In my case, the car was running pretty well before disassembly. I wanted to minimize any chance of messing anything up, so I opted to leave the FD in place.

Jonathan
01-02-2016, 07:49 PM
Basically the exact same logic as what Dana just said. It was fine before I started and I'd rather not push my luck.

opethmike
01-02-2016, 09:55 PM
Fair enough, but in my opinion, I think there's a bigger chance of messing up the fuel distributor by leaving it on. But hey, to each their own :)

Jonathan
01-03-2016, 02:29 PM
I hadn't realized that the air going through the intake manifold crosses over from the RH to LH side as it enters at those two square-ish openings which the W-pipe connect to, to where it actually enters each cylinder.

The air coming in on the RH (passenger) side, goes down and across to the LH (driver's) side and feeds cylinders 4,5,6. The air then entering on the LH side, crosses over as it goes down and enters in to cylinders 1,2,3.

Must have been a matter of just physically getting everything to fit well into a small space as I don't know of any other reason why that would have been done. Anyone else know? Is it to purposely put some obstructions or channels in the way to either slow down the air speed for some reason or make it harder for some foreign object to fall directly in?

I don't think I would have noticed until when I was cleaning it and shone a flashlight into one of the openings just to double check for any debris left inside and I didn't see the light come out of the port I thought it would.

opethmike
01-08-2016, 11:19 AM
Doing it side to side like that actually isn't a rare thing in intake manifold design. It allows for longer runner length, which is better for torque at lower engine speeds.

Jonathan
01-26-2016, 04:48 PM
My engine is back together again. Did all the pre-flight checks for leaks or loose fittings or connections and then restarted the engine. Booya! She's running nice and smooth, idling well, and I think I came out of all of that on the other side in just fine shape.

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I allowed the fuel pump to prime a number of times before trying it initially. I think it cranked a couple tries first before initially catching. Then maybe two or three times it started, but died soon after. On about that 3rd try, it started and stayed running.

I did see a couple fuel leaks developing though once it had been running for five minutes or so. All connections at the distributor. Cylinder 1, 2 and the CPR connection that's down the left side just in front of the double, large return connection. They were "weeping" and not spraying, almost like you could see the metal darkening slightly but no dangerous, high pressure jet coming out.

I shut the car off, let it cool down, wiped the area and I think I even waited until the next day to tighten them a little further. I recall some advice with copper washers on these fuel lines is that any imperfections are to be somewhat absorbed by the softer copper metal, as opposed to the other way around. And to tighten it slightly beyond the recommended amount, then back it off, and then tighten back to where it was, giving the copper the chance to form around the part it wasn't sealing against. Some combination of that worked as they aren't leaking anymore. Don't really care what the book says you should do as the book isn't always very practical, so any gurus out there can zip it.

I also then got the chance to remove the jumpers I had on the backside of the Lambda ECU since two seasons ago I knew I had an electrical connection problem with the thermistor in the coolant distribution pipe in the valley. That was one connection I ensured was good when I was in there and so I was very pleased to see that once removed, the engine not only didn't zoom up to an idle stuck on 2,000 RPM like it has been doing prior to the bandaid jumpers, but it wasn't shuddering at all. I suspect this fix should have been a lot more temporary than I used it and I'll be excited to get the car out in the Spring to see how the performance and gas mileage has improved.

A couple things I found which I'll share that may be helpful for others doing similar work on their car.

The intake manifold removal instructions I got were great, but while written for a manual trans car, they omitted at least one additional vacuum line connection we have on automatics. My car has two connections on the driver's side of the intake and one on the passenger side. The small one on the driver's side is what goes down to feed vacuum to the thermal control valve. The larger one on the driver's side not mentioned in the how-to is what goes down the side of the transmission to the vacuum modulator. The large one on the passenger side is what connects through a short (7") vacuum hose to meet a "tee joint" and I believe this is where one half of that tee goes forward to the brake booster.

Something else handy I found was in regards to early cars having a slightly different routing of the engine harness. Mine is one of those early harnesses, and while I'm not sure how much better or out of the way the late style ones are, the one I have can very much get in your way as it dangles above the valley when you're working. It can also get tangled or caught up when you try and snake the intake manifold back in place as well as the mixture unit. What I did was use a short bungie cord, that grabbed (gently) on to a meaty section of the harness and then I looped the other end of the bungie cord to the metal hanger rod along the firewall. This pulled on the harness just enough to keep it out of the way and let you work around it.

Shown here:

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Any of you that have cleaned out the little grid of pockets on the top of the crankcase know how deep a couple of those go. My normal vacuum cleaner extension wouldn't get in deep enough because even the smallest attachment I had was too wide. I kind of MacGuyver'ed what would almost be a child's pen or marker that I removed the writing parts from the inside and basically used as a very thin but firm tube to carefully slip down into those recesses and suck up what was in there the best I could. I'm sure you've all come up with your own solutions.

Last thing I found was how important the orientation of the hose clamps can be on certain coolant hoses in or near the intake and valley. The two I found that were causing me unnecessary problems getting my intake out initially and then back in, were the ones just in behind the water pump/thermostat assembly. If you can imagine all things removed, so you are looking down with an unobstructed view of that assembly, the hose clamps were on so that your screw driver you would point straight down and on the INSIDE of the thermostat. The problem with this is that the intake is a tight enough fit when it gets back to close to the electrical distributor, that if you cost yourself even only half an inch of less space with bad hose clamp positioning, it can make it a real bugger to try and get the intake manifold down and into place.

I started to see how this was much harder to get in than I felt it should be. Dave S.'s advice from years ago was to stop if something plastic or otherwise just won't go in. Stop and look why and don't keep forcing it. I knew the clamps needed to be spun at least 90 or 180 degrees and I was able to do this without spilling any coolant. Once out of the way and having the space I should have had, it went in nice and easy.

And that was that.

opethmike
01-26-2016, 06:46 PM
Gurus? I don't know of any gurus around these parts :) :) :)

Bitsyncmaster
01-26-2016, 07:25 PM
I've "MacGuyver'ed" a smaller hose onto my vacuum a lot of times. Usually just find some junk hose and tape it to the vacuum hose.

Glad to hear your back up and running and have fixed some of the problems.

Rich_NYS
01-26-2016, 07:49 PM
Awesome.....lookin' good!

DMC-81
01-26-2016, 09:44 PM
Yes, looking good indeed! Congrats Jonathan! :thumbup:

Jonathan
01-28-2016, 05:58 PM
Thanks for the compliments!

And if you don't have any paint you need to watch dry, here's a very boring 7 minutes of the engine idling after everything was put back together.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LQ4svVs1RT0&feature=youtu.be

Lwanmtr
02-23-2016, 02:40 AM
Hehe...Just in time, i needed something to occupy myself while some paint dried.

Looking good.

opethmike
02-24-2016, 08:08 PM
That's a strange fuel system in there; what is that? :devil:

sdg3205
02-25-2016, 02:14 AM
That's a strange fuel system in there; what is that? :devil:

K-winning. Charlie Sheen approved.

High pressure tiger blood.

Jonathan
02-25-2016, 07:50 AM
That's a strange fuel system in there; what is that? :devil:


K-winning. Charlie Sheen approved.

High pressure tiger blood.

Go do this somewhere else, please.

i.e.


All things being equal I'd like to see forum moderators put a swift stop with punishment to people that deliberately thread crap as well.

sdg3205
02-25-2016, 11:53 AM
Go do this somewhere else, please.

i.e.

I see.

We're adding "fun" to the "not allowed on dmctalk list." My bad. Back to business folks.

You can tell me a joke but don't you dare make me laugh.