PDA

View Full Version : The Dummy's Guide to Robertson Carbing



MountainGoat
07-09-2016, 05:25 PM
Hello ladies and gentlemen;

I just got my Carb Kit from Bill Robertson and I'm trying to do the install. It doesn't exactly come with directions, but none of it is that hard if you know your car. I know the fuel system extremely well as I'm converting to carb due to fuel system issues.

Specifically, I was having pressure issues with my K-Jet -- I wasn't getting enough pressure for the injectors to inject. However, after having replaced literally every part in my K-Jet system and having no joy, it was starting to feel like spending good money after bad. When Bill's carb kit offer came up, I decided to make the switch.

Yes, I could have bought a 200-some dollar pressure meter tool and carefully tested every aspect of my K-Jet to find the problem. Yes, I probably could have gotten it to work -- but I didn't want to. Anyway, no need to start a controversy -- suffice to say, for my own reasons and to get around a problem, I've chosen to carb.

...

So, first off, I unboxed everything I got from Bill and labeled each thing. Here's pics with my crude handwriting labels.

My flash made the note unreadable -- so it's (counter clockwise) the baffle, a barbed bolt that I have no idea what it's for (pending inquiry with Bill), and hose clamps.

44299

Next, we have fuel filter (left) and fuel pump. I seriously need to not use my flash anymore, sorry guys ...!

44300

The carbon filter plate.

44301

Going clockwise from upper right, my new fuel injectors :) Or 6 blank bolts to fill the holes. 6 O-rings, and a bag of bolts and washers ... I believe those are for the manifold.

44302

Various greebles that go on the carb ... a bracket to mount my microswitches (upper left, going counter clockwise), some mounting hardware for the throttle and transmission cables, some bolts, and a spring. all part of the mounting hardware for the throttle/auto trans stuff.

44303

And finally, the fuel line tubing. I didn't unpackage these because it looked like it would be a pain in the butt to put back in the package :P

I also had a box with the air filter assembly in it, but I didn't take a picture of it because it was already self-contained. These pictures are mostly for me to keep track of what I have.

44304

....

So with that out of the way, here's the state of my engine bay when I started. You can see, I've got K-jet installed but my injector fuel lines are going nowhere. I was doing my fuel-in-jars testing. fuel comes out fine when there's no injectors, but the second I put the injectors on ... no joy.

44305

I put my injectors in the jars and pressed down on the air intake plate to de-pressurize the system, then I unbolted each fuel line from the fuel distributor. I like to make a little tourniquet of shop rag around the bolts before loosening them to make sure any gas that may still be there doesn't make a mess. There wasn't much because I already took the pressure off.

A familiar sight to anyone with K-Jet problems. SEE YA LATER JARS! NOT GONNA MISS YOU!

44306

Once everything was unbolted, I took the fuel distributor out. Then the air intake see-saw mixture unit thing under it. Then the front air pipes of the manifold. I carefully detached the microswitches for my auto trans, and then I disconnected the throttle and auto-trans cables from the spool.

Finally, I detached the spool, and at this point the base of the air intake was removable. There's some bar that connects the throttle spool to a secondary spool on the air intake ... I couldn't get that to come off, so I just left them conjoined.

The "metal trapeze" as I tend to think of the K-Jet manifold is held on by four bolts. My 4 bolts were in TERRIBLE shape; in fact, one broke off.

44309

I'm going to have to figure out how to extract that :( All four bolts were in awful shape, I'm kind of amazed none of the other broke.

And then, my first look at the valley ... YUCK! It's a swimming pool!

44311

The sludge down there seems to be water and coolant -- somewhat more water than coolant by my estimation. The car hasn't been out in the rain or anything in the past year, but who knows what's gone on before that.

I blocked up my injector / cylinder / spark plug holes and cleaned up the coolant lake as much as I could with what I had on hand. Going to need more paper towels :( My next task is to figure out what happened before putting the engine back together. It can never just go easy, huh?


Stay tuned for the next exciting episode ...! Maybe next time without my camera flash.

MountainGoat
07-09-2016, 11:20 PM
The barbed bolt mentioned in my post that I could not figure out its purpose, as it turns out, is for plugging the fuel line return hole in the fuel pump boot.

content22207_2
07-09-2016, 11:38 PM
a bracket to mount my microswitches (upper left, going counter clockwise)

44303



That is actually the throttle cable bracket. It bolts to the bar across the back of the intake manifold with the 7x10mm bolts. Upper hole in the bracket is for the throttle cable hollow bolt, lower hole is for the shift point cable hollow bolt.

Throttle cable bracket, with cables still attached, stays in the car whenever you take the intake manifold off -- just like K-Jet. In this pic you can see my bracket slung over the passenger valve cover:

44318

Microswitch bracket is already bolted to the carburetor. You may want to take it off to attach the microswitch (much easier). Microswitch holes are slotted to allow the microswitch to be adjusted fore/aft. Position the microswitch so it is tripped when the throttle plates are fully open:

44317

MountainGoat
07-09-2016, 11:43 PM
That is actually the throttle cable bracket. It bolts to the bar across the back of the intake manifold with the 7x10mm bolts. Upper hole in the bracket is for the throttle cable hollow bolt, lower hole is for the shift point cable hollow bolt.

Throttle cable bracket, with cables still attached, stays in the car whenever you take the intake manifold off -- just like K-Jet. In this pic you can see my bracket slung over the passenger valve cover:

44318

Microswitch bracket is already bolted to the carburetor. You may want to take it off to attach the microswitch (much easier). Microswitch holes are slotted to allow the microswitch to be adjusted fore/aft. Position the microswitch so it is tripped when the throttle plates are fully open:

44317

Thanks for the clarification!! :) That does make more sense. I'm going to review the pictures you sent me in detail when it comes time to mount the carb itself to make sure I don't have any more mix-ups.

content22207_2
07-09-2016, 11:47 PM
The "metal trapeze" as I tend to think of the K-Jet manifold is held on by four bolts. My 4 bolts were in TERRIBLE shape; in fact, one broke off.

44309

I'm going to have to figure out how to extract that :( All four bolts were in awful shape, I'm kind of amazed none of the other broke.


Electrolysis/galvanic corrosion. You've got enough meat hanging out that you should be able to put a baby pipe wrench (optimal) or a 5" pair of Vise Grips on it and break it free by hitting the tool with a hammer, like an impact wrench:

44319

In the future hit your socket wrench with a hammer to break free other bolts, especially coolant distribution pipe (Y pipe) bolts and bolts holding on the water pump.

Bill Robertson
#5939

MountainGoat
07-09-2016, 11:55 PM
Electrolysis/galvanic corrosion. You've got enough meat hanging out that you should be able to put a baby pipe wrench (optimal) or a 5" pair of Vise Grips on it and break it free by hitting the tool with a hammer, like an impact wrench:

44319

In the future hit your socket wrench with a hammer to break free other bolts, especially coolant distribution pipe (Y pipe) bolts and bolts holding on the water pump.

Bill Robertson
#5939

I'll give that a try, thanks for the advise. I've been dreading the Y-pipe bolts since I've read those are notoriously bad about breaking.

content22207_2
07-10-2016, 01:39 AM
Constant torque is what snaps the fasteners off. Use hammering action to break them free. Put sacrificial anti-seize on the replacement fasteners. I use military spec zinc anti-seize, specifically designed for steel fasteners into aluminum (http://www.mcmaster.com/#10105k41/=137s2zg). This is the same stuff the Navy uses. I've also used hot dipped galvanized washers for extra sacrificial anode, especially in the cooling system (look closely at washers on my coolant distribution pipe and thermostat housing).

Bill Robertson
#5939

content22207_2
07-10-2016, 08:56 AM
Just put my manifold back on after popping it off for another thread. This is the antiseize I use on the hold down bolts:

44333

Bill Robertson
#5939

MountainGoat
07-10-2016, 04:02 PM
DAY 2

Okay - so I can't install the fuel pump until parts come in, and I want to replace my water pump and associated pipes because of my mysterious coolant in the valley. I can't afford that right now, so I'm a little stuck.

My agenda today was to remove the K-Jet stuff I didn't need anymore, and to clean up the valley as best I could for now.

Here's what I took off:

44342443434434444345

There's quite a few vacuum hoses that are now dangling. The carbon filter stuff goes completely unused now if I recall correctly -- that's why there's the filter plate included. So the bundle that goes to the carbon filter goes away. I'll refer to Bill's diagrams when it comes time to hook vacuum hoses up. I took some pictures so I'd remember what I left dangling.

443464434744348

Finally, I prepared my new "fuel injectors" (aka bolts). I wanted to plug the injector holes ASAP to avoid contamination -- already I know some grit has fallen in there from when I changed the spark plugs :( HOWEVER... I learned the hard way that you need to put the boots, then the clamps, then the bolts in ... putting the bolts in the boots, then trying to clamp them, will not work because the bolt head is too big for the clamps to fit :(

So, I put them in just to plug the holes, but I need to pull the bolts out of the boots, clamp the boots, then put the bolts in next time I'm there.

Afterwards, I cleaned the valley as best I could. I will drain the coolant and start taking off the water pump parts next time I'm there.

4434944350443514435244353

MountainGoat
07-10-2016, 04:10 PM
Just put my manifold back on after popping it off for another thread. This is the antiseize I use on the hold down bolts:

44333

Bill Robertson
#5939

I've put in an order for some.

content22207_2
07-10-2016, 04:39 PM
I want to replace my water pump and associated pipes because of my mysterious coolant in the valley. I can't afford that right now, so I'm a little stuck.

Water pump from Autozone is $60: http://www.autozone.com/cooling-heating-and-climate-control/water-pump/valucraft-reman-water-pump/535584_0_0/
You would need a Volvo style bolt on pulley. Volvo PRV pulley bolts right up, but you need to jetison the upper A/C idler pulley (Volvo pulley has two belt grooves, outermost of which interferes with the upper idler). That is the setup I run. Sam Hill is running a 4 cylinder Volvo pulley with washers to space it out slightly. Aluminum single belt pulleys come and go as owners have them made -- a year or two ago a UK based owner still had some available. Volvo pump also has an extra port on the front that needs to be plugged -- 1/4 NPT pipe plug works perfectly:

44354

If any of the allen bolts that hold the pump back on snap I've got replacements.

Hervey is probably the cheapest source of hoses. I've xRef'd the outbound radiator hose (Gates 21215), but Hervey's is the same price as Amazon. Hervey does a complete set of hoses for less than $100.

Coolant distribution pipe is sealed with ordinary hardware store O rings. If it isn't leaking you may want to leave those until later (hold down bolts have a terrible reputation for snapping off). You can change the water pump with the Y pipe still bolted in place.

Bill Robertson
#5939

MountainGoat
07-10-2016, 10:13 PM
Water pump from Autozone is $60: http://www.autozone.com/cooling-heating-and-climate-control/water-pump/valucraft-reman-water-pump/535584_0_0/
You would need a Volvo style bolt on pulley. Volvo PRV pulley bolts right up, but you need to jetison the upper A/C idler pulley (Volvo pulley has two belt grooves, outermost of which interferes with the upper idler). That is the setup I run. Sam Hill is running a 4 cylinder Volvo pulley with washers to space it out slightly. Aluminum single belt pulleys come and go as owners have them made -- a year or two ago a UK based owner still had some available. Volvo pump also has an extra port on the front that needs to be plugged -- 1/4 NPT pipe plug works perfectly:

44354

If any of the allen bolts that hold the pump back on snap I've got replacements.

Hervey is probably the cheapest source of hoses. I've xRef'd the outbound radiator hose (Gates 21215), but Hervey's is the same price as Amazon. Hervey does a complete set of hoses for less than $100.

Coolant distribution pipe is sealed with ordinary hardware store O rings. If it isn't leaking you may want to leave those until later (hold down bolts have a terrible reputation for snapping off). You can change the water pump with the Y pipe still bolted in place.

Bill Robertson
#5939

Your post inspired me to do some shopping around and I think I can do this for 1/3rd or maybe even 1/4th of what it would cost to use DMCH parts. Which puts it a little more into my price range. I'll start ordering parts!

content22207_2
07-10-2016, 10:19 PM
I've been running an Autozone pump for years. As stated, you do need a bolt on pulley. On the plus side: bolt on pulleys won't ever work loose.

No matter what pump you get, you will either need to transfer over the disused TTS or plug the hole. It's M18x1 -- a common oil pan drain size. I'm running a BMW oil pan plug:

44369

Bill Robertson
#5939

MountainGoat
07-28-2016, 06:02 PM
So its taking awhile for my water pump to get here for whatever reason, but I anticipate I will be starting up this project again soon.

In the meantime, I'm sure someone else has noticed this ... but I was watching Back to the Future 3 and got a laugh when I saw the part that comes flying out of the engine. It's the fuel distributor! The closed caption was pretty funny, too. It's about how I feel about it ;)

44904

content22207_2
07-28-2016, 07:35 PM
Have you gotten the broken manifold hold down bolt out yet?

I just removed a broken coolant distribution pipe (Y pipe) bolt on my Volvo using the welded nut approach: http://dmctalk.org/showthread.php?14020-How-to-Remove-Broken-Bolts-Studs

All the other bolts were removed either by hitting the wrench with a hammer or with a small size impact gun (unfortunately you cant fit an impact wrench on a K-Jet manifold). I'm pretty sure this is the first time the intake manifold's been removed since 1983.

Bill Robertson
#5939

MountainGoat
07-28-2016, 08:19 PM
Have you gotten the broken manifold hold down bolt out yet?

I just removed a broken coolant distribution pipe (Y pipe) bolt on my Volvo using the welded nut approach: http://dmctalk.org/showthread.php?14020-How-to-Remove-Broken-Bolts-Studs

All the other bolts were removed either by hitting the wrench with a hammer or with a small size impact gun (unfortunately you cant fit an impact wrench on a K-Jet manifold). I'm pretty sure this is the first time the intake manifold's been removed since 1983.

Bill Robertson
#5939

Oh hey, that's a really cool trick to weld a nut on there -- I'll have to keep that in mind (I've got a MIG welder). I haven't pulled the bolt out yet, but I'm going to give it a try when the water pump comes in. My Delorean's currently parked in a workshop that's a 20 minute drive from the house, so I don't go out there unless I've got work to do on it :P As soon as it's running, it's coming home! Anyway, the anti-seize has arrived and hopefully next time I won't have this problem.

content22207_2
07-28-2016, 09:41 PM
No joke -- as soon as you weld the nut on the broken bolt will turn out with a simple flat wrench (particularly helpful if your weld bead slops over one side slightly, preventing a socket from sliding on...).

Bill Robertson
#5939

davidc89
07-28-2016, 10:17 PM
Sometimes it helps to weld the broken bolt/stud to a washer and then welding the nut onto the washer. But yeah it usually comes right out once you weld it! If the weld breaks, try again!

content22207_2
07-29-2016, 05:19 PM
So its taking awhile for my water pump to get here for whatever reason

Where did you buy your water pump? I bought one for my Volvo at Autozone Tuesday afternoon and just picked it up.

Bill Robertson
#5939

MountainGoat
07-29-2016, 05:32 PM
Where did you buy your water pump? I bought one for my Volvo at Autozone Tuesday afternoon and just picked it up.

Bill Robertson
#5939

Mine arrived today. I actually bought Special-T's kit so it would come with all the pipes I'd need and everything altogether. I found the price reasonable vs. picking it all up myself.

Pilot
09-19-2016, 02:37 AM
Any update?

DMCVegas
09-28-2016, 02:35 PM
Give Dave a call. I've heard a rumor that he's manufacturing his own manifolds in preparation for a DIY kit.

http://www.bauerleautomotive.com/

MountainGoat
11-03-2016, 09:51 PM
Okay ... sorry its been a really long time since I updated this. I had a bunch of other calamities come up that I had to deal with :) Now I'm back on this project.

Today, I worked on setting up the fuel pump. All my parts came in, and this seems like the easiest thing I can do right now. My Delorean is currently in a spot where I can't jack it up right now, maybe this weekend I will get to move it so I can finish the water pump.

I had a baffleless fuel pump from Special-T, so I lacked the original boot and whatnot. I ordered new parts from DMCH. Here's links to the parts in case you need them yourself:

The boot:
http://store.delorean.com/p-6555-fuel-pump-sealing-ring-boot.aspx

And, if you want to do the same as I did, the boot cap:
http://store.delorean.com/p-9083-fuel-pump-cover-seal.aspx

I chose to get the boot cap to keep water out -- you could also do Bill's suggestion of using a raincoat sleeve. I will probably do both in the end, just to make it super tidy and dry.

Finally, if you're lazy and don't want to find a cheaper source, the clamp:
http://store.delorean.com/p-6553-hose-clip.aspx

So, the barbed bolt you get that comes in the baggie with the fuel stuff goes in the side hole in the boot. Since my boot was new, I needed to stretch that hole a bit -- I stuck some needle-nose in and opened them, working the rubber in different directions til it was loose enough to put the tip of the bolt in, then I put a little oil in so that I could work the bolt in. Holding the bolt with the needle-nose and sort of twisting it while pushing it in worked well for me.

I put a little oil on the bottom half of the boot and spread it around because I figured I'd have the same problem getting the pump in. I thread the 14-foot 1/4" fuel line through one of the ports on the boot-cap and then I thread it through the boot as well. I attached the fuel line to the barbed connector at one end of the pump, and used one of the fuel line clamps provided in Bill's kit to secure it.

Finally, I shoved the pump into the boot and got it seated flush with where the pump body widens out. Here's pictures of what it looked like.

47104
47105
47105
47106

The lip of the boot has 2 notches in it; you can use those 2 notches to route the wire. Or if you prefer, you can route the wire through the second hole in the boot lid. I'm going to use a spare bolt to plug the second hole of my boot lid -- be sure to do that!

Wiggle the lid back into place, being careful not to push the pump out of the boot while you're doing it. When you're done, it should look like this.

47108
47109

I haven't plugged the second hole yet in that picture -- I think one of the larger banjo bolts should fit in the hole. So long as its a tight fit, it should be fine.

Next -- pull the old fuel pump, and put the new one in. I ran short on time tonight so I stopped here for now. Next installment coming soon!

MountainGoat
11-06-2016, 12:11 AM
So today I put in the new fuel pump. I'll admit, I've been slacking on this one -- I hate dealing with the fuel tank. Its always going to be messy. This time around, I managed to minimize mess just by being very careful.

I apologize in advance -- I didn't take many pictures. I'm doing this myself and I didn't really want to get gas on my camera.

So, I opened up the hood and removed the plate over the fuel pump. Then I climbed into the trunk, which I find is usually the easiest way to work on this stuff. I undid the clamp around the base of the old pump first, and removed it to get it out of the way. I also disconnected the electrical wires.

I've got some disposable black trays 'left over' from Chinese takeout, and I took one of those and held it under the 2 existing fuel lines in roughly the middle of them. Then I cut them both with wire cutters. You could choose a less destructive method if you wanted, but my priority was to minimize mess and I didn't care about keeping the old fuel lines.

I let them drain for a bit into the take out tray which was the perfect size to fit. In my case, there wasn't really a lot of gas. There's still going to be spillage no matter what you do, so if you want, pack the area with paper towels. Either that, or be prepared to clean up afterwards.

I had a thick contractor bag ready to receive the old parts, so I pulled the old pump out and bagged it. I had Special-T's baffleless pump, so I did not have a baffle to contend with. I went ahead and removed the other half of the fuel lines that were connected to the barbed fuel connectors for the K-Jet fuel system. More gas leaked when I took those lines off, but not much. I capped the barbed connectors with some caps I got from Home Depot.

47156

These caps actually fit perfectly on the barbed connectors. You can get them from the section where they sell wire in-closet shelving systems and they're meant to cap the ends of those wire shelving units.

With that taken care of, it was time to put the new pump in. Bill provides what's essentially a baffle, but it's the bottom of a tin can with holes drilled in it. I put mine in the gas tank hole and ...... it wouldn't go in. It fit perfectly in the hole, and got stuck. I couldn't tap it in or anything. Looking closer, I saw there was a lip on the edge of the can and that lip was catching the gas tank opening. I wound up squeezing the can so it took on more of an oval shape, pushing it into the tank, and bending it back into a circle once it was inside.

My tank only had a couple gallons of gas in it, so I was lucky and didn't have to go swimming much to put this on. There's a hole in the bottom of the can, and it fits on the baffle bolt that's in the gas tank. The baffle bolt is straight down from the engine-side of the access opening (The "Top" of it, if you're sitting in the trunk facing the windshield like I was). Use the washer and bolt provided by Bill to fix the can to the bottom of the tank, being careful to keep the can from twisting around. You want the can to be basically aligned with the tank's access hole when you are done.

I'd already prepped my pump and boot. I added a stainless steel clamp to the bottom of my boot to make sure it stayed secure on the pump -- I don't really want to mess around with this leaking or otherwise failing and hope this is the last time I'll be in my gas tank for the foreseeable future. So I slid the pump/boot into place, and made sure the lip of the gas tank was secure under the rubber lip of the boot.

I then used a clamp to hold the whole mess in place, and in the end, it looked like this.

47157

I need to route the fuel line and do the wiring still, but the messy / dreadful part is done. I spent the rest of my time cleaning up the old pump mess and tending to some minor gas spills that are pretty much inevitable with this sort of work. However, this went a lot cleaner than the last time I had my gas tank open -- doing the extra prep work and anticipating where things are going to drip / drain / leak is critical.

See you next time!

MountainGoat
11-13-2016, 09:46 PM
Okay, so I didn't get to do much because there's stuff in the way and I can't jack the car up right yet. I SHOULD be able to jack it up tomorrow :) Fingers crossed.

I went ahead and got rid of the charcoal canister and related hoses. There's a vent pipe that goes from the gas tank to the charcoal canister. Here's a picture; it's on the drivers side, forward corner. It's got a pipe that goes from here to the driver's side pontoon (or at least I think that's what you call the fiberglass body on the side of the engine compartment over the wheel!)

47328

I had great difficulty taking the pipe off; with some careful cutting I was able to loosen it up enough to pull it off. I found it interesting that the tube wasn't barbed like the fuel lines; it just has a lip, as you can see here.

47329

I used one of my shelving caps to cover up the tube. It didn't really want to go on there; I think this pipe has a larger diameter than the fuel lines. But with some twisting and coaxing, I got it on there.

47330

Finally, I unbolted the plate that holds in the charcoal canister. It took some maneuvering to get it out of the pontoon, as the canister is quite large. Three rubber tubes go to it; the line from the fuel, and 2 others I already disconnected in the course of the carb conversion. Mine was filthy after 30 years in the pontoon; I also had several nests of various wasps (mud wasps and paper wasps have at different times lived in there). If you're doing this in summer, be careful about that :P

47331
47332

I cut the rubber tubes to make it easier to liberate the plate, and added the plate and mounting bracket for the canister to my pile of K-Jet parts I don't need. The tubing and canister are going in the trash.

I also went through and fixed my "fuel injectors", getting them properly clipped in. And now I've done everything I can do without jacking up the car :P

MountainGoat
11-14-2016, 11:19 PM
So I cleared out the area around the D well enough that I could jack it up, and I started working on the water pump. My apologies for no pictures; this was all messy work and honestly its stuff you can find elsewhere. I'll start documenting with pictures again when I get to the interesting parts.

I drained the oil which went easy enough, and took off the oil filter. Then I had a conundrum; how to drain the engine block coolant without making a huge mess. I decided to start with the passenger side because that seemed easier.

If you're on your back, with your head pointed towards the passenger rear wheel, looking up, you'll see the hole where the oil filter was. Up and to the left (further "aft" on the engine) you'll see one of those funny square bolts. Its the same as the oil and transmission pan plugs. I figured I'd try to be smart and hold a funnel to catch as much of the coolant as possible. I put down a drip tray and I had a huge oil pan that was clean and who's purpose is for this kind of thing as opposed to engine oil.

The bolt came off pretty easy -- some people report its stuck, some people report it as fused in place. Mine came off with just a little bit of extra muscle, and after that initial push it was easy to remove by hand. I had my funnel ready and I unbolted the thing ...

And it was a TORRENT of fluid! I mean it was a waterfall of fetid coolant-water pouring down. My funnel was woefully inadequate, and while it did direct some of it, I was expecting like ... the oil pan level of liquid. No, this was a crazy rush of liquid. It got all over me, all over the floor, all over pretty much everything. To my credit, the majority of the fluid wound up in the pan and the pan was large enough to take it all. BUT ... it still splattered everywhere and it drenched me pretty good, too.

I think the funnel idea had merit and it actually did work to some degree, but I needed a funnel with a wider mouth. I used the more delicate funnel that I use to fill the transmission, rather than a srs bidnis high flow funnel. Also, goggles and a mask for the mouth would be a good idea. I wear glasses so I managed to avoid direct eye contact, but it did get on my face and was pretty nasty.

The cleanup took the rest of my available time for the night. I have no idea how I'm going to do the driver's side; I can reach the bolt, but I don't know how I'll direct and contain the fluid. I'll ask in the more busy thread how others have done it :)

MountainGoat
11-17-2016, 03:31 PM
So last night I went through and finished disassembling the engine portion of the water pump / cooling system.

I asked around and got some advise as to how to open up the driver's side engine block coolant drain without making a mess and got some tips.

Really, what I probably should have done is open the cooling system from the pipes under the car and drained it in the middle before draining the block. But, it's too late to lament that -- what I wound up doing was taking one of the large ziplock-style bags that Bill used to bag part of the carb kit, and I cut the bottom of it. I made a plastic sleeve/channel that I held up to the drain plug as I was undoing it. I got most of the coolant down the sleeve (and my plug wasn't at all seized up, thankfully!) and into a bucket I had under the car.

There was a LOT less coolant this time, so I'm thankful for that.

The next step is to remove all the coolant pipes coming out of the water pump. I had found that the previous owner had replaced all the "easy to reach" tubing -- the main tubes that go to/from the radiator and the passenger side tube that connects the pump to the block were all relatively new, as I could tell because the rubber still felt good and the pipe clamps were all brand-new looking stainless steel.

All the "hard to reach" tubes were original; the short driver side tube that goes from the water pump to the block, and the two rubber tubes that connect to the pipes in the valley, were all original. The clamps on these were clearly ancient and quite cruddy, and the tube material was incredibly brittle and was crumbling even as I was pulling them off. I was able to easily push my screwdriver through the tubing with practically no resistance, then twist the screw driver to pull the tubes off.

I took a lot of pictures but most of them were for me to remember how things go back together. Not many are very interesting, but here's one of the old tubing and what it looked like after I pulled it off the water pump (at the top of the pic).

47405

Compare to new tubing on the passenger side....

47406

The 'Y' pipe and the heater pipe you can see here:

47407

Again, you can see the old style pipe connector there at the bottom. Anyway, the 4 bolts that hold the 'Y' pipe in are notoriously bad about breaking off. I'm overly pleased with myself because I managed to get mine out without breaking them -- I got my socket secure on the bolt, then hit the socket with a rubber mallet to loosen them. Getting the angle right to do this was really tricky, but it paid off. Credit goes to Bill for teaching me that technique.

Those three rubber tubes are vacuum hoses. Two of them went to something I removed earlier -- part of the manifold, I think -- and the third went to a little junction. I took a lot of bad, blurry photos but this photo shows (kinda) the one vacuum line that was still attached to something.

47408

The hose easily came off at the black piece end (the hoses would NOT come off the Y-pipe end easily), and my Y-pipe was in reasonably good condition otherwise.

My heater pipe, however, was trashed. As I was pulling it out, rusty gross water was coming out of it. I'm pretty sure that was the source of my coolant leaks in the Valley. I have a new stainless one from Special-T that I will replace it with, so I added that to my metal scrap pile.

After all that, my water pump was ready to go. The thermostat on top of it unbolts with 2 little bolts. I think I need the thermostat and the back plate for my new kit, so I went ahead and took them off. I'll clean them tonight. The water pump comes off with 3 bolts you can get off with a Metric 13 wrench. I used the wrench-and-mallet technique for all 3 bolts to make sure they came off clean. The bolts are to the left and right of the pump, and then there's a third a few inches under the belt pulley.

There's a lot of other bolts that "look like" they belong to the pump, but do not - the pump has exactly 3. If you have to pull out your metric 11 wrench, you're doing it wrong. I accidentally unbolted this guy before I realized it wasn't holding on the pump -- I put it back on, and torqued it to 11 ft/lbs which I think is the right torque. I'm awful tempted to make a map of every bolt on the engine and what its torque value is cause the delorean service manual can be a little haphazard with the info :P

Here's a picture with the bolt circled that I took off by accident. if anyone knows the proper torque on this guy, let me know, it's the bolt RIGHT next to the water pump bolt.

47409

And then I was done for the night -- my valley is completely exposed! I did some cleanup. Tonight, I'm going to really scrub the crap out of my valley (literally!) and then if I have time I'll work on flushing the rest of the coolant system.

47410