So what's the future for LCAs?

[rundmc]

Hey all,

Just wanted to find out if anyone can tell me what the future holds for LCA replacements in the near future? With the SS ones no longer offered, does anyone know if DMCH is planning another option for owners?

[Mark D]

Good question!

I'm in the middle of a full suspension rebuild, so if there is a better option than sand blasting and repainting my old ones I'd be interested.

[stevedmc]

Hervey rebuilds them for $125 each and according to his website he is welding an additional plate to the bottom to make them even beefier. It looks like a really strong rebuild.

Henninger has a beefy LCA he sells for $425. This is what I have on my car.

With options like these, there is no reason to buy LCAs from DMCH.

If anyone needs cores to have Hervey rebuild let me know. I am planning to put my old ones on eBay sometime soon. Hervey has a $125 core charge.

[1batt4u]

S/S LCA no longer offered??? :angry4:

[DMCMW Dave]

Henninger has a beefy LCA he sells for $425. This is what I have on my car.


IMO Heninger's are the best option at the moment. VERY heavy though, probably 2X stock. But use OEM inner bushings.

Otherwise clean yours up and repaint. The rip-out failures that you sometimes see seem to happen at high (100K+) miles, or chronic driving on exceptionally bad roads.



With options like these, there is no reason to buy LCAs from DMCH.


No way to, either. Not available.

[rundmc]

Provided that Heninger has solved the machining issues. I had my entire suspension rebuilt with his arms only to find out they were too short, so I had to undo everything. I understand he has corrected this since I sent mine back in March of 2011, but does anyone have his current-production arms on their cars to verify?

[stevedmc]

Provided that Heninger has solved the machining issues. I had my entire suspension rebuilt with his arms only to find out they were too short, so I had to undo everything. I understand he has corrected this since I sent mine back in March of 2011, but does anyone have his current-production arms on their cars to verify?

Yes.

[Delorean Industries]

Stainless Works is finishing the jigs for our units and will have prototypes out to me in a few weeks. I will be testing hopefully the week of the 28th. We are seeing some really bad ones through our doors here and the need for a suitable replacement is keeping a few customer cars from making it out the door at this time.

[sean]

Stainless Works is finishing the jigs for our units....
Estimates on costs?

[rundmc]

Stainless Works is finishing the jigs for our units and will have prototypes out to me in a few weeks. I will be testing hopefully the week of the 28th.

Awesome. Keep us posted!

[Delorean Industries]

Estimates on costs?

365.00 per arm is what we are shooting for if I produce 10 sets. If we make more in the first batch I can bring the price down. Once I test the units I will offer a group buy option. Note these will come with new bushings installed and UK ball joints installed.

[rundmc]

Sign me up for a set of those.

[jawn101]

365.00 per arm is what we are shooting for if I produce 10 sets. If we make more in the first batch I can bring the price down. Once I test the units I will offer a group buy option. Note these will come with new bushings installed and UK ball joints installed.

Damn, that's a smoking deal.

[Delorean Industries]

We have one pair of lower ball joints from the UK left in stock as well. All others sold. I will bring over another order once we sell the last set.

SW also cut out the demo plates for our new adjustable front control arms we are developing. Lots of cool products on the way from DPI.

Addressing an email I just received. If an owner has a vehicle at a DMC facility we can per request send the parts directly to DMC. This includes everything we develop and sell.

[stevedmc]

365.00 per arm is what we are shooting for if I produce 10 sets. If we make more in the first batch I can bring the price down. Once I test the units I will offer a group buy option. Note these will come with new bushings installed and UK ball joints installed.

That is a bargain. Are they going to be thick like Henninger's?

[justlooking]

I hope that they'll be made similar to the stock arms. Heninger's arms are >double in weight compared to the stock arms (3 lbs, 4 oz without ball joint).

If I run over a curb, the LCAs should bust, and I should buy new ones. What shouldn't happen, is that I hit a curb, the LCAs are undamaged, and my frame mounts are twisted.

It's a question of whether you want your skis to fly off, or your legs to break.

[stevedmc]

I hope that they'll be made similar to the stock arms. Heninger's arms are >double in weight compared to the stock arms (3 lbs, 4 oz without ball joint).

If I run over a curb, the LCAs should bust, and I should buy new ones. What shouldn't happen, is that I hit a curb, the LCAs are undamaged, and my frame mounts are twisted.

It's a question of whether you want your skis to fly off, or your legs to break.

Maybe I am missing something, but if the thin LCAs break and your frame slams into the ground, you are likely to have frame damage at that point anyway.

[Delorean Industries]

We are not building ridiculous over the top beefy units that weight more then a crumple zone!

[Mark D]

365.00 per arm is what we are shooting for if I produce 10 sets. If we make more in the first batch I can bring the price down. Once I test the units I will offer a group buy option. Note these will come with new bushings installed and UK ball joints installed.

That is a pretty damn good deal, especially considering the ball joints run around 60 bucks each if I remember correctly.

Question though.... I already have a set of ball joints that I ordered direct from DMC club UK several months ago, so can the LCA's be ordered without ball joints? If not I can just sell my set of ball joints on ebay or here on the board I guess.

I definitely want in on this group buy pending testing of course. Are the LCA's going to be TIG welded and passivated?

[Delorean Industries]

That is a pretty damn good deal, especially considering the ball joints run around 60 bucks each if I remember correctly.

Question though.... I already have a set of ball joints that I ordered direct from DMC club UK several months ago, so can the LCA's be ordered without ball joints? If not I can just sell my set of ball joints on ebay or here on the board I guess.

I definitely want in on this group buy pending testing of course. Are the LCA's going to be TIG welded and passivated?

Tig welded to the same high standards our exhaust systems are manufactured to. In regards to fighting off corrosion you really don't have to if you use expensive stainless. For an additional charge we will offer a clear powder coat finish on the arms and will come standard with the non mill finish polished upgrade.
We will definitely work something out for you on the arms if you already have the joints along the lines of send yours in and we will install for you.

[rundmc]

Very excited about this. I'm all in.

[Byrne H&A]

1. Recent photo of Heninger and Assoc. LCA seperated from the rear urethane bushing showed a ball joint with grease fitting. This product has been marketed for 17 years and the grease fitting style ball joint was upgraded to a sealed ball joint 15 years ago. Therefore, the LCA had been in service at least 15 years.

2. Another upgrade incorporated in the product several years ago is a custom made high durometer urethane bushing with steel sleeve insert. Pressure to insert the urethane bushing with steel sleeve insert into the LCA rear bushing requires up to 3675 PSI to complete.

3. The anti-rool bar bushings are also custom made of high durometer urethane.

4. Last March four LCAs were incorrectly welded. Both sets were immediately replaced with correct units from stock.

5. Heninger and Assoc. LCA was designed and material specifications written by a structural engineering firm. A particular steel alloy was specified due to the flexing of the LCA. (Stainless steel was not specified as the metal work hardens when flexed leading to cracking, fracturing and seperation).

6. Heninger and Assoc. LCA with components is displayed at: www.Deloreanupgradeparts.com

[stevedmc]

This product has been marketed for 17 years and the grease fitting style ball joint was upgraded to a sealed ball joint 15 years ago. Therefore, the LCA had been in service at least 15 years.

I don't think it is wise to say a new product that hasn't been developed is better than a product that has been in service for almost two decades.

I know of at least one other vendor who recommends Heninger's LCA.

[Delorean Industries]

Quick update on this. Stopped in at SW today to speed up the process on a few other projects in the works. I supplied sw with a modified DXF file of the control arm design. I have increased the spring seat rings height by an additional .250 around the center to take care of the potential issue of a spring "shooting" if the frame gives way on a set of cut front springs dropping the arm even lower. Improperly cut springs are a real worry in this design since so many owners view it as an acceptable route to go.

We are also knocking around the idea of the addition of the lower control arm upgrade built into the kit as well.

[sdg3205]

Quick update on this. Stopped in at SW today to speed up the process on a few other projects in the works. I supplied sw with a modified DXF file of the control arm design. I have increased the spring seat rings height by an additional .250 around the center to take care of the potential issue of a spring "shooting" if the frame gives way on a set of cut front springs dropping the arm even lower. Improperly cut springs are a real worry in this design since so many owners view it as an acceptable route to go.

We are also knocking around the idea of the addition of the lower control arm upgrade built into the kit as well.

Josh,

I've been hoping a US-based vendor would develop something like the guys at DMC.eu did with these LCA support brackets (http://www.delorean.eu/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=20_143&products_id=95065). For those of us with good OEM LCA's it would be real peace of mind to have the additional support and reinforcement this product would offer... hopefully at a fraction of the price.

Thoughts?

[QuadcityDMC]

I'm having Heninger and Assoc. LCA installed on my car now along with other upgrades/repalacement parts. I'd be happy to give a review when I get the car back, I'll have a 2+ hour drive back home. Plenty of time to form a review But to be fair my current front suspension is total crap so anything done to the front end is going to change the feel of the car.

There is nothing currently wrong with my stock LCA's but during the spring/shock install Dave found some odd installation methods. Combine that with PO and unknow "True" miles on the car (I think 60k+ miles).

[jawn101]

Josh,

I've been hoping a US-based vendor would develop something like the guys at DMC.eu did with these LCA support brackets (http://www.delorean.eu/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=20_143&products_id=95065). For those of us with good OEM LCA's it would be real peace of mind to have the additional support and reinforcement this product would offer... hopefully at a fraction of the price.

Thoughts?

I was checking these out just now and don't quite understand how they install. And the "details" URL is to the French forum... :) Does anyone have them or have any pics of how they install/work?

[sdg3205]

I was checking these out just now and don't quite understand how they install. And the "details" URL is to the French forum... :) Does anyone have them or have any pics of how they install/work?

I've been bugging vendors about these for a while. After seeing Bill's video showing how much movement the LCA allows under hard braking it certainly doesn't leave a feeling of comfort. In fact, when I drive now I don't fear breakdowns, stalls or the failure of a related system, I fear my front wheels are going to fall off if I break hard or corner too hard, and my LCA's seem to be in great shape, albeit a little rusty (which I'm taking care of this winter). That sway bar just doesn't seem adequate.

IIRC, the brackets mount on the joint to the frame and to the bolt for the shock. I'll see if I can find a picture. I could be mistaken, but I've heard it adds a tremendous amount of support.

[jawn101]

I've been bugging vendors about these for a while. After seeing Bill's video showing how much movement the LCA allows under hard braking it certainly doesn't leave a feeling of comfort. In fact, when I drive now I don't fear breakdowns, stalls or the failure of a related system, I fear my front wheels are going to fall off if I break hard or corner too hard, and my LCA's seem to be in great shape, albeit a little rusty (which I'm taking care of this winter). That sway bar just doesn't seem adequate.

IIRC, the brackets mount on the joint to the frame and to the bolt for the shock. I'll see if I can find a picture. I could be mistaken, but I've heard it adds a tremendous amount of support.

Oh, ok - I think I get it. Pics would help of course. I haven't seen Bill's video, maybe that's a good thing....

[sdg3205]

Oh, ok - I think I get it. Pics would help of course. I haven't seen Bill's video, maybe that's a good thing....

Here's Bills video:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CMHO4Aydk04&feature=player_embedded

[jawn101]

Here's Bills video:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CMHO4Aydk04&feature=player_embedded

I was right, I wish I hadn't seen that... Lol. I don't drive the car particularly hard but panic stops do happen.

[sdg3205]

I was right, I wish I hadn't seen that... Lol. I don't drive the car particularly hard but panic stops do happen.

Those are far from panic stops too! No lock-up or skidding to a stop.

[sdg3205]

Also, Josh is using the front LCA support brackets which can be seen here (http://dmctalk.org/showthread.php?1553-DMC-Spax-Shocks-Reviews-and-Driver-Adjustment-Settings/page4&highlight=Lower+control+support+brackets)

[Delorean Industries]

Also, Josh is using the front LCA support brackets which can be seen here (http://dmctalk.org/showthread.php?1553-DMC-Spax-Shocks-Reviews-and-Driver-Adjustment-Settings/page4&highlight=Lower+control+support+brackets)

I stopped using those and we now make our own with a different size bushing etc compared to Ed's offerings from the uk.

Another item stainless works makes for us of course. I just haven't updated the picture on our site yet.

[sdg3205]

I stopped using those and we now make our own with a different size bushing etc compared to Ed's offerings from the uk.

Another item stainless works makes for us of course. I just haven't updated the picture on our site yet.

Are the kits still $340, Josh? That's a lot more reasonable than ordering from the UK.

[Delorean Industries]

Are the kits still $340, Josh? That's a lot more reasonable than ordering from the UK.

Still 340.00. There are twenty sets coming from SW in a few weeks. 7 sets are already spoken for at this time.

[DCUK Martin]

DeLorean.eu (Ed Uding) is based in the Netherlands, very definitely not the UK.

The video shown is, IIRC, Rafael from italy, not Bill's video, although he loves to promote it. It does not show the lower arm "flexing" at all, it shows the lower arm pivoting about its base mount along the axis of the end of the ARB. This movement is well within the design constraints of the arm, however undesirable the outcome is to the handling.

In short, the movement will not of itself do damage to the LCA.

[jawn101]

Also, Josh is using the front LCA support brackets which can be seen here (http://dmctalk.org/showthread.php?1553-DMC-Spax-Shocks-Reviews-and-Driver-Adjustment-Settings/page4&highlight=Lower+control+support+brackets)

I found this video in the 'Related' section showing the same basic view of a car running with the .eu LCA supports installed. It looks like these braces do quell the movement, so if Martin says that the movement isn't dangerous but probably is detrimental to handling.... these would help.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RgVfi8Dn6Rk

[jamesrguk]

DeLorean.eu (Ed Uding) is based in the Netherlands, very definitely not the UK.

The video shown is, IIRC, Rafael from italy, not Bill's video, although he loves to promote it. It does not show the lower arm "flexing" at all, it shows the lower arm pivoting about its base mount along the axis of the end of the ARB. This movement is well within the design constraints of the arm, however undesirable the outcome is to the handling.

In short, the movement will not of itself do damage to the LCA.

+1 don't mistake something that looks bad for somthing that is bad, as dramatic as that video may look the suspension was designed to move like this.

The new lower arm upgrades obviously minimise this movement and so should enhance steering feal, but there is nothing dangerous about the oem design.

It's easy to stumble across thread like this and start worrying!

J

[Patrick C]

It does not show the lower arm "flexing" at all, it shows the lower arm pivoting about its base mount along the axis of the end of the ARB. This movement is well within the design constraints of the arm, however undesirable the outcome is to the handling.


I've noticed much better handling with this kit, especially hard braking. Cliff S installed this kit before I did and likened the handling to his Lotus Elise. Much improved over stock DeLorean handling.

[DCUK Martin]

I'm sure it does. I would prefer to see something that provides a true lower wishbone rather than this sort of "half-way house". Lotus did it "properly" on later Esprits:

http://www.delorean.ie/images/009_oblique_view_lh_jpg.jpg


http://homepages.ipact.nl/~theunissen/index_files/image052.jpg

[Delorean Industries]

We have been producing control arms as quickly as possible and have worked through the order back log minus cars in line for restoration here. As originally promised the arms are 365.00 per side including a UK style ball joint and rear bushing. Here is a shot of one going together from my i phone. I posted a number of completed unit pictures on our company facebook page as well. I have more pictures I can post at the shop tomorrow.

[Delorean Industries]

Few pictures of our latest version of the arms. We ended up handing the project over to SW from start to finish. The arm is now offered as shown below.

[Domi]

Really nice improvement :thumbup:

[Bitsyncmaster]

Few pictures of our latest version of the arms. We ended up handing the project over to SW from start to finish. The arm is now offered as shown below.

Are these made to stock specifications or is it a thicker metal? What metal alloy was used?

[jawn101]

Wow that's a very different looking arm. Is it much stronger?

[Delorean Industries]

Are these made to stock specifications or is it a thicker metal? What metal alloy was used?

1/16 thicker than stock. 304 stainless. Obviously the pictures how the once piece folded design without the rear bushing, ball joint, arb and spring cup installed. Previous versions of this arm had as many as nine parts just to make this section alone.

[Delorean Industries]

Wow that's a very different looking arm. Is it much stronger?

When everything is installed on the arm. Ie everything mentioned in the above post it looks very close to a stock arm. The image is a bit fooling without everything attached and welded.

[jawn101]

When everything is installed on the arm. Ie everything mentioned in the above post it looks very close to a stock arm. The image is a bit fooling without everything attached and welded.

Oh, I gotcha. I was wondering... thanks :)

[Delorean Industries]

Missed the other part of your question Jon. They are stronger by all means but not over bearing as to put additional stress on other components. The design has been tested above and beyond at this point and is full proof.

[Chris 16409]

Can anybody comment on the lower ball joint provided by Heninger? I just had one of Hervey's Ball Joints fail, so I want something that will be reliable. Heninger said he's been selling these arms for over 15 years so they have been field tested very well. There were a few owners on this thread who have installed Heninger's arms. Any feedback would be welcome. The UK sourced lower ball joints seem to be of the best quality and are highly recommended. Heninger provides his arms complete with bushings and ball joints, so I couldn't really swap them out for the UK ones. I haven't had much luck with the other options currently available.