NEW Integrated pump sender combo!

[82DMC12]

Hey everyone,

I have had the new pump developed by DMCH installed since April 30th. DMCMW informed me I was probably the first owner to have one 'field installed'.

I am not able to give full impressions yet because the car I am restoring on the side is a non-runner and still needs a little work before I can actually start driving it for the first time in 20 years. This car belongs to a local owner who I am doing the restoration for. So I can only attest to the completeness of the kit and the installation ease.

I received the kit well-packaged as always from DMCMW. Kit contains the pump itself (with controller attached), a rubber grommet/seal that goes around the top half of the pump and seals the tank hole, two new black fuel hoses, four fuel hose clamps, two modern FI-style connectors for the hoses (very common style I have seen on Chrysler fuel injection parts), a sending unit hole blanking plate made of stainless steel with a gasket, a fuel filter kit, a big clamp for the pump, and a set of detailed instructions.

Installation is very easy! I won't rehash the instructions but basically you remove EVERYTHING from the tank including the sender, clean the tank really well while you are in there, and disconnect both original electrical connectors. Cut off the old hoses from the barbs (no need to unscrew the compression fittings). Push the new-style barb connectors onto the new hoses and attach them to the pump. They simply snap on with a secure fit. Place the new pump clamp over the tank opening. You push the new pump into the tank and then rotate it so that the hoses are pointing towards the filler neck. This is important so that the pump clears the OEM tank mounting stud and so you can get the pump cover plate back on correctly.

Once the pump is in position, I pushed down on the pump to get it into the tank hole as deep as I could. There is a lip around the top of the pump to keep the big black gasket from sliding over the pump. You will not be able to get the lip on the tank to touch the lip on the pump - it will seem like it isn't in all the way but it is. You then tighten the big clamp securely. I checked and the pump is definitely not going anywhere.

Then you hook up the hoses to the metal lines, install the blanking plate, connect the electrical connectors to the original harness, and zip-tie the controller to the filler neck.

Since my fuel system was totally cleared out it took a few seconds to re-pressurize. The pump came on right away when jumping the RPM relay. I would say it sounds very close to the original pump, maybe a tad quieter. I only have about 4 gallons of gas in the tank so I don't know what it will sound like with a full tank.

Obviously I don't know how well the sender works because this car is undriveable due to leaking radiator and stuck brakes. Hopefully in a week or two I can provide better information for that.

But anyway, it's here, it goes in easy, the instructions are superb, and I'm a little jealous that my car doesn't have one yet. Check out the pics!

Andy

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[Witchboard]

Nice. Might have to pick me one of these up when my pump dies. The sender, kinda works... Thanks for the detailed pics.

[ccurzio]

This is all well and good and I'm really excited about this unit, but what's killing me is that it seems impossible to actually BUY one. :(

[82DMC12]

This is all well and good and I'm really excited about this unit, but what's killing me is that it seems impossible to actually BUY one. :(

I talked to Julee this afternoon and it sounded like they are taking orders now.

Andy

[DavidProehl]

Looks awesome! Thanks for sharing the pics!

[jawn101]

So does this eliminate the need for the pickup hose, the baffle, the screen and the boot?

[DMCMW Dave]

So does this eliminate the need for the pickup hose, the baffle, the screen and the boot?

Yes. And the sender.

[jawn101]

Awesome. That right there makes it worthwhile. Thanks Dave!

[Chris Burns]

How much are they?

[82DMC12]

$399

[living_the_dream]

What's the main reasons to getting the new fuel sender unit? I'm out of the loop on this one

[82DMC12]

What's the main reasons to getting the new fuel sender unit? I'm out of the loop on this one

I'm not sure that many people will swap out functioning pumps and senders for this, but if you are doing a total tank service it sure is a nice way to go.

I hope to get this car started this weekend, Monday at the latest. But without good brakes I won't be going far. I'm most interested in how well the sender works.

Andy

[Bitsyncmaster]

I'm waiting to see if it stops that pump buzz when the gas gets hot.

[Nicholas R]

Are there any available pressure or volume specs available? Like I remember reading in the past that the stock pump was capable of something like 75psi at 29gph (I believe). Is this the same or has int increased. Just wondering if it's increased. I'm sure it's possible. This pump for instance is capable of 43gph at 85psi: http://www.speedwaymotors.com/MSD-In-Line-Hi-Pressure-Fuel-Pump,31226.html?parentDisplayId=41792

[82DMC12]

Are there any available pressure or volume specs available? Like I remember reading in the past that the stock pump was capable of something like 75psi at 29gph (I believe). Is this the same or has int increased. Just wondering if it's increased. I'm sure it's possible. This pump for instance is capable of 43gph at 85psi: http://www.speedwaymotors.com/MSD-In-Line-Hi-Pressure-Fuel-Pump,31226.html?parentDisplayId=41792

Since the inlet and outlet hoses are the same size I don't think the volume pumped could change without an increase in PSI. You would have to measure pressure before the distributor because the primary pressure regulator will keep it at 5.2 bar from then on. The rest gets sent back to the tank. I will see if I can measure this but not sure if I have the right fittings for my CIS tester to check before the distributor.

[dmcpom]

Just a quick question off the phone so Iv not read the complete thread but if the pump fails I'n this unit is it replaceable or is it a complete new unit again ??

[DMCMW Dave]

Just a quick question off the phone so Iv not read the complete thread but if the pump fails I'n this unit is it replaceable or is it a complete new unit again ??

Whole unit. This is how that style is always sold (it's a special-purpose modified GM design).

[opethmike]

Whole unit. This is how that style is always sold (it's a special-purpose modified GM design).

Ah, so it IS GM! I thought it looked awfully familiar!

[Delorean Industries]

Ah, so it IS GM! I thought it looked awfully familiar!

I give it three months before Hervey has this reverse engineered.

[82DMC12]

I give it three months before Hervey has this reverse engineered.

I doubt it. He's so pissed off it exists he will just badmouth it for the next 5 years.

[82DMC12]

Just a couple quick updates. This weekend I got the car running and everything is working great. I only drove it far enough to get to the gas station so I could fill the tank up with fresh gas, then went straight home. Almost as soon as I got back to my garage I put the car up on jack stands so I could do a total brake overhaul which might take up to 2 weeks to complete since I'm having DMCMW plate the calipers.

The low fuel light came on as I was driving to the station and I added about 11.5 gallons fuel, so the low fuel light comes on at around 2 gallons remaining.

When I got home with a full tank, I jumped the RPM relay to see what the pump sound like, and it's so quiet that I could hear the fuel rushing through the lines on the engine louder than I could hear the pump.

More updates once I get to do a full shake-down of the car!

Andy

[Bitsyncmaster]

Just a couple quick updates. This weekend I got the car running and everything is working great. I only drove it far enough to get to the gas station so I could fill the tank up with fresh gas, then went straight home. Almost as soon as I got back to my garage I put the car up on jack stands so I could do a total brake overhaul which might take up to 2 weeks to complete since I'm having DMCMW plate the calipers.

The low fuel light came on as I was driving to the station and I added about 11.5 gallons fuel, so the low fuel light comes on at around 2 gallons remaining.

When I got home with a full tank, I jumped the RPM relay to see what the pump sound like, and it's so quiet that I could hear the fuel rushing through the lines on the engine louder than I could hear the pump.

More updates once I get to do a full shake-down of the car!

Andy

That's a good sign. Did you get a chance to check the pump current yet?

[82DMC12]

Oops, forgot. I will either tonight or tomorrow. Should I measure the amps with a meter directly on the pump with the rpm relay jumped, or is there a better way for an accurate comparison?

[Bitsyncmaster]

Oops, forgot. I will either tonight or tomorrow. Should I measure the amps with a meter directly on the pump with the rpm relay jumped, or is there a better way for an accurate comparison?

You want to pull the fuse and measure the current across the two fuse socket terminals. You will need to jumper the RPM relay for this test.

DON'T put a current meter across the pump or you will blow the fuel pump fuse and or your meter fuse.

[82DMC12]

Using Dave's method I measured exactly 7 amps. Key off, rpm relay jumped, measuring across fuse 7 terminals.

How does that compare to OEM?

Edit: Derp! My car is stock. Just measured 6.2 amps using same method with stock setup.

Andy

[Bitsyncmaster]

Using Dave's method I measured exactly 7 amps. Key off, rpm relay jumped, measuring across fuse 7 terminals.

How does that compare to OEM?

Edit: Derp! My car is stock. Just measured 6.2 amps using same method with stock setup.

Andy

7 to 8 amps is normal. It will draw a little more when the engine is running and the battery voltage is 14 volts. You also get a little difference depending on how your primary pressure is calibrated.

[outatym2001]

What's the main reasons to getting the new fuel sender unit? I'm out of the loop on this one

There are no original unused Fuel Sending Units available. At delorean.com they sell a new metal one to replace the original plastic one but some people have complained over many years that the new metal one hits the gas tank bottom and doesn’t fit quite right. The gas tank is plastic and is some what flexible thus making the distance from bottom to top slightly different in some cases.
Other people have had the fine wires inside the original Fuel Sending Unit break and some one like John Hervey (http://specialtauto.com) offers to fix it.
My original still works but I’m some what annoyed when the gas tank is low the fuel sloshes around and gas gage goes down to 0 and back up to 1/4 and back to 0 and back up to 1/4.
I have to wonder with this new combined unit will the gas gage still go up and down and up and down when the gas is low in the tank?

[82DMC12]

According to the thread in vendor announcements, there are electronics in the new one to prevent exactly that.

[LEVY]

And how long before you offer this but 100 % stainless? :)


I give it three months before Hervey has this reverse engineered.

[TTait]

I give it three months before Hervey has this reverse engineered.

So... Four months then till he starts telling people he has "shipped hundreds of units all over the world with no complaints", and that Steven's pump is junk?

[Steven]

I wonder if this will be officially announced at the car show next month?

[David_NYS]

Even with my limited experiance with all things mechanical, the whole process was a breeze! Very quite, no issues, and now my fuel gauge works!

As an added bonus, my ego is bigger now that I have proven I can do something with my own two hands! :wrenchin:

Thanks Dave & Julee! Y'all are great!

[Grover]

10959

One of the easiest part installations I have come across. A very nice kit with very clear instructions. I haven't used it yet, but it's all ready for fuel when I finish my engine project and try to fire it up.

[ccurzio]

Mine should be here in a few days.

I never thought I'd ever be excited about a goddamn fuel pump.

[Grover]

It seriously is a really nice setup. When I installed it I laughed, because I thought to myself, " If I ever have to remove this, it is going to be so easy". No assembly in the tank, no disassembly in the tank, no rubber boots to worry about, no fighting with the fuel tank sender to sit right in the tank... :)

[DMCMW Dave]

I wonder if this will be officially announced at the car show next month?

I just found out I get to give a speech about it at the show. . . .

[Steven]

Mine should be here in a few days.

Where did you order it from?

[ccurzio]

Where did you order it from?

Houston. I'd ordered it a week prior though.

Last I saw I think they got 30 more in stock.

[Steven]

Houston. I'd ordered it a week prior though.

Last I saw I think they got 30 more in stock.

I'm searching the site but can't find it. Can you please send me a link?

[ccurzio]

I'm searching the site but can't find it. Can you please send me a link?

It's not on the site. You have to call.

[ccurzio]

So I finally got this thing installed.

When I got back into town yesterday I immediately went to work on my basketcase fuel system. I pulled off my temporary aluminum foil pump hole cover and drained the fuel tank. Once I got all of the gas out of the tank I removed the old components from the bottom of the tank and inspected its condition. I was completely and utterly amazed at how clean the base of the tank was. It was incredibly spotless with no gunk or goo in sight, just a clean and dry fuel tank.

So I cleaned it anyway. I didn't drain the thing just to stare at it in amazement.

By the time I was through with the acetone, that fuel tank must have been about as close as you can get to having a factory-fresh unused tank. After letting it air out I began the installation of the new pump.

It was fairly straightforward, except the instructions didn't really make it too terribly clear on how exactly to vertically position the clamp. Once I figured that out and tightened everything down, I put in a couple of gallons of fresh gas, reconnected the battery, and tried starting the car.

Started up immediately, just like it did when I first got the car. I was very happy.

I cut the engine off, inspected the pump area for leaks, and then took it out for a 45 minute or so road test. The car ran perfectly the entire time. Brought it back to the house, reassembled everything (including reinstalling my passenger carpet and seat from another project) and then took it for a longer drive later in the evening to hang out with some friends. Once again it ran as smooth as silk, both going and coming home.

Big thanks to DMCH for making this part available. I'm very happy with it. (Except for that warranty though. Six months isn't exactly inspiring total confidence in the unit. Though I will say if it continues operating as well as it seems to be, I'll keep being pleased.)

http://i.imgur.com/KFh6X.jpg

[Ozzie]

Nice write up.
Is it louder or about the same as the stock unit?
Also, how does your fuel gauge behave now that its signal is integrated into the pump? Does the needle go to "Full" on a fill up? Does it fluctuate with dynamic conditions such as hills or turns?

[ccurzio]

Nice write up.
Is it louder or about the same as the stock unit?
Also, how does your fuel gauge behave now that its signal is integrated into the pump? Does the needle go to "Full" on a fill up? Does it fluctuate with dynamic conditions such as hills or turns?

I went to a gas station on my way to the city yesterday to fill the tank. The needle does indeed go to "Full" but it does seem to top out on the gauge a hair lower than the old sender. Not really a big deal.

The pump itself is actually noticeably quieter than the old pump.

It's also important to note that since the pump and sender are integrated into a single unit, the power to transmit the sender signal to the fuel gauge relies on the power being sent to the fuel pump. Long story short, that means you won't get any fuel level reading on the fuel gauge unless the engine is running. A minor point and not really a big deal, but still something important to keep in mind.

Fluctuations in the gauge reading while navigating hills simply did not happen at all. That was a nice change of pace.

[Bitsyncmaster]

I saw the cut away tank and this unit at DCS. It looks like the bottom pickup line self-adjusts to sit on the bottom of the tank. That is a great idea. My only concern is the plastic flex hose holding 75 PSI (or higher if your PPR is stuck). It's probably fine but I've never tested that type of hose in high pressure applications.

[stevedmc]

My main complaint about the new pump/sender unit is it doesn't come with a can of tuna. I looked all over in that tank and couldn't find a single thing to snack on.

[DMCMW Dave]

My main complaint about the new pump/sender unit is it doesn't come with a can of tuna. I looked all over in that tank and couldn't find a single thing to snack on.

Ask for it to be shipped in the new foam peanuts. They are biodegradable i.e. edible.

[jawn101]

Ask for it to be shipped in the new foam peanuts. They are biodegradable i.e. edible.

Funny you mention that Dave. They're not just edible, they're quite tasty!! :) Now I get parts and a free snack at the same time.

Hope you guys pack my parts with clean hands... lol

[AdmiralSenn]

Wait, the fuel gauge power comes from the pump circuit now?

That's AWESOME. Think about it. If you have a sudden no start issue and you can't figure it out, you can check the fuel pump circuit just by switching the key to ON - if it has power and ground, the gauge will read.

That by itself makes this worth buying, in my opinion.

[dmc6960]

Wha? Unless the electronic unit goes full high or low upon poweroff, the fuel gauge will read where it left off after power was cut. The gauge itself is internally dampened and holds its own position when power is cut.

[ccurzio]

Wait, the fuel gauge power comes from the pump circuit now?

That's AWESOME. Think about it. If you have a sudden no start issue and you can't figure it out, you can check the fuel pump circuit just by switching the key to ON - if it has power and ground, the gauge will read.

Downside: You can't tell how much gas is in the tank without starting the car. Again a minor point, but still important to remember.


Unless the electronic unit goes full high or low upon poweroff

It does.

[Citizen]

So I finally got this thing installed.

[SNIP]


Were you able to change the fuel filter without any problems? Not trying to be nosey, just that I had some problems with mine.

Thomas

[ccurzio]

Were you able to change the fuel filter without any problems? Not trying to be nosey, just that I had some problems with mine.

Thomas

The only problem I ran into was that it's kind of a pain in the ass to get at the nut for the clamp that holds the filter in place. Other than that, no. No problems.

[Chris 16409]

I'll be helping a friend install one of these shortly. I'm interested to see how it all works out.

[Tillsy]

The only problem I ran into was that it's kind of a pain in the ass to get at the nut for the clamp that holds the filter in place. Other than that, no. No problems.
I gave up on that nightmare and just removed the entire clamp assembly, uninstalled the old filter, pre-installed the new filter to it, and then re-mounted it.

[DMCMW Dave]

I gave up on that nightmare and just removed the entire clamp assembly, uninstalled the old filter, pre-installed the new filter to it, and then re-mounted it.

That's how we do it, and it seemed so obvious that I didn't realize people were changing the filter without taking the clamp off the frame.

[ccurzio]

What are some reasons I would start smelling gas after driving for an extended (1+ hour) drive after replacing the old pump with this new one?

[DMCMW Dave]

Check the other fittings, i.e. the rollover valve. I've seen the factory install of the upper cover crush the vent hose, which will cause the tank to pressurize. The pressure has to go somewhere so it either burps out the fill cap, sender, etc wherever it can get out. Make sure someone has not capped off the hose to the carbon cannister - same problem. The delay you see implies to me that the tank is pressurizing or trying to.

[ccurzio]

Check the other fittings, i.e. the rollover valve. I've seen the factory install of the upper cover crush the vent hose, which will cause the tank to pressurize.

This is an interesting theory. Immediately after the initial installation of the pump I went out for a fairly long test run (45 minutes or so) and I don't recall smelling gas. If I did, it was slight and I'd probably assumed it to be the result of having been screwing around the tank for half a day.

The interesting part is, I went for said drive with the fuel pump access cover not installed. (I assume this is what you were referring to by "upper cover"?)

Also, what's the best way to get at the fittings for the rollover valve? I have to wonder if any of these other things are the case since I didn't have this problem until after I replaced the fuel pump.


The pressure has to go somewhere so it either burps out the fill cap, sender, etc wherever it can get out. Make sure someone has not capped off the hose to the carbon cannister - same problem. The delay you see implies to me that the tank is pressurizing or trying to.

I do think it's a pressure issue of some kind, because everything you said here makes sense. When I got home and checked the fill cap, I pulled it off and the fill tube "coughed" at me, expelling some vapor. I guess it's just a matter of figuring out where/why the system is building pressure. :(

[DMCMW Dave]

The upper cover is the odd-shaped cover that covers the filler tube and rollover valve. There is a small hose in there that goes to the rollover valve and sometimes it gets positioned so that the cover crushes it.

[ccurzio]

The upper cover is the odd-shaped cover that covers the filler tube and rollover valve. There is a small hose in there that goes to the rollover valve and sometimes it gets positioned so that the cover crushes it.

Ah! Now I know exactly what you're talking about. Part number 106002 - the cover that takes some work to figure out how to properly fit its gasket. ;)

But yeah, that also makes sense since I didn't have that cover completely secured either when I took my test drive. After I got home I wanted to put everything back together properly and those covers were both missing nearly ALL of the screws when I first got the car, so I took this opportunity to secure it correctly with a screw in every hole - on both the pump access panel as well as the upper cover. (By the way, what's the part number for the correct screws to use on these panels?)

I pulled it off and it looked like the hoses MAY have been in a somewhat-kinked position, but they were definitely in a position where things were tight. I'm going to play around with their orientation and hopefully that'll do the trick.

Once again, thank you Dave. :) Let's hope this works.

[DMCMW Dave]

. (By the way, what's the part number for the correct screws to use on these panels?)

.

SP10663 are repro screws in the correct length with phillips heads.

SP10660 is longer but has the OE head style, (not phillips). Way cheaper too. Just be sure to use antiseize on them!

Common hardware store (shiny plated) screw size is M5 x 15.

[DeloreanJoshQ]

Has anyone run these in high temps, like the last week for example?
My pump never sounded louder and scarier than the other night while driving in 100 + temps with lower fuel level.
I was just curious how these are holding up in the heat and if they make their presence known....

[82DMC12]

Yup, I drove up here and it was over 90 and humid. Didn't detect any change in pump sound. So far it's working great.

[Bitsyncmaster]

Yup, I drove up here and it was over 90 and humid. Didn't detect any change in pump sound. So far it's working great.

That's what I like to hear. Keep the comments posted of your high temp long drives. Also note how low you let the tank get.

[DCUK Martin]

SP10660 is longer but has the OE head style, (not phillips)

Are you referring to Pozidrive as opposed to Phillips?

[DMCMW Dave]

Are you referring to Pozidrive as opposed to Phillips?

I wasn't sure that DMC used Pozidrive as opposed to some more obscure phillips-like head, but yes, that's what I meant.

[DCUK Martin]

Wait.... there are more?!?!?! :eek5:

I buy stainless M5 x 16mm pan-pozidrive screws for the under bonnet area.

[DMCH James]

Good news...this part is now available for online ordering:

http://store.delorean.com/p-10569-fuel-pumpsender-module.aspx

Bad news...we're sold out IN TEXAS at the moment and will not be re-stocked until the last week of July.

Contact your local dealer - many of them may still have this item on their shelves for immediate delivery.

James

[jawn101]

Good news...this part is now available for online ordering:

http://store.delorean.com/p-10569-fuel-pumpsender-module.aspx

Bad news...we're sold out IN TEXAS at the moment and will not be re-stocked until the last week of July.

Contact your local dealer - many of them may still have this item on their shelves for immediate delivery.

James

Awesome James! But more bad news - the link on the product page to download the instructions is broken. I really wanted to read it :)

[DMCH James]

Reload and try again. Works here...

James

[jawn101]

Reload and try again. Works here...

James

Yep, there it goes. Thanks! :)

[DMCMW Julee]

Good news...this part is now available for online ordering:

http://store.delorean.com/p-10569-fuel-pumpsender-module.aspx

Bad news...we're sold out IN TEXAS at the moment and will not be re-stocked until the last week of July.

Contact your local dealer - many of them may still have this item on their shelves for immediate delivery.

James

In stock at DMC Midwest! :wave2:

[xbrules]

had a tech session over the weekend here in Adelaide, South Australia and fitted one of these units to my car (02065) with the help of Blackie and another owner.

http://i445.photobucket.com/albums/qq180/xbrules/Various%20photos/2012-08-19_14-32-12_831.jpg

Installation was an absolute breeze thankfully due to the fact my tank had been cleaned out in recent times by the previous owner... no sludge, varnish or any grit in the tank at all.

the new unit is very well put together and went in really nicely.

http://i445.photobucket.com/albums/qq180/xbrules/Various%20photos/2012-08-19_12-57-49_263.jpg

turns out my car had a Tankzilla fitted that I was unaware of... but what was interesting was driving around with an indicated 1/4 tank and the needle plummeting each time I took off, I still pumped 18 litres/ 4.7 gallons out of the tank... fuel I wasn't using as I would chicken out at a 1/4 and fill up...

with the new unit in, I put 3.5 gallons back into the tank and got a much better reading on the gauge... the rest of the day was spent doing the accumulator and filter... after 10 hours exposure to petrol fumes... we were all a bit foggy to say the least.

drove my car home and had for the first time ever my low fuel light come on. I put 6.5 gallons in the tank and got a reading of a bit over half... the needle remains dead steady and doesn't fluctuate at all when encountering hills... very happy with the end result...

if you have the spare coin... spend the money on one of these units... they are brilliant

[121GWATT]

SP10663 are repro screws in the correct length with phillips heads.

SP10660 is longer but has the OE head style, (not phillips). Way cheaper too. Just be sure to use antiseize on them!

Common hardware store (shiny plated) screw size is M5 x 15.


What about replacing the metal "bases" the screws screw into on the cover panel? Is it possible to do this? Most of mine have been ripped out.

[DCUK Martin]

Yes but use jack nuts rather than riv nuts. Much better for damaged and soft holes.

[opethmike]

Huhuhuhuh, 'soft holes'

[Delorean Industries]

Huhuhuhuh, 'soft holes'

hahhahaha.

[DMC3165]

This is such a nice setup. I wish i'd have payed more attention to the boards lately. I would've and picked one up recently when I had my pump and baffle out.

The one thing I'm confused about is, without the baffle and pickup hose where does it pickup fuel from? Does it just float on the fuel and pickup from the bottom of the unit? Also no screen on the bottom of the pickup? I'd also like to know how it contends with hot fuel. I'd be happy spending the money and put this unit in my car so i can dump the rubber flap. Either way when my chinese pump dies this is definetly on my list!

[DCUK Martin]

Huhuhuhuh, 'soft holes'

I was thinking of the rear fascia when I wrote that. Riv nuts just stretch the urethane and fall out

[dmc6960]

I was thinking of the rear

Gigity!

[Dracula]

Having just installed this piece, with some assistance, at the Tech Session yesterday, I then proceeded to put 75 miles on it and I must say, I was amazed at how novice-level of an install it is. My initial reason for wanting to install it was that my fuel gauge had stopped at the 1/4 mark and would only slightly fluctuate; a feat I attributed to a faulty sender, turned out to be another issue was a slightly disappointing moment, but it's a job that I would comfortably be able to add to my repertoire of roadside work I feel comfortable performing on the DeLorean.

On a storage-related note, it leaves the old sending unit location as a prime spot to siphon the gas from the tank for long-term storage.

[kings1527]

Having just installed this piece, with some assistance, at the Tech Session yesterday, I then proceeded to put 75 miles on it and I must say, I was amazed at how novice-level of an install it is. My initial reason for wanting to install it was that my fuel gauge had stopped at the 1/4 mark and would only slightly fluctuate; a feat I attributed to a faulty sender, turned out to be another issue was a slightly disappointing moment, but it's a job that I would comfortably be able to add to my repertoire of roadside work I feel comfortable performing on the DeLorean.

On a storage-related note, it leaves the old sending unit location as a prime spot to siphon the gas from the tank for long-term storage.

I'm having a similar problem with my fuel sending unit. What did the "other" issue turn out to be? Grounding problem? I ordered Hervey's double-grounding wire and I'm hoping that solves my volt meter and maybe even my fuel gauge woes.

Alex
6575

[Ryan S.]

Has anyone experience fuel leak with this new pump unit? I keep getting fuel leak, especially when i do the hard braking or sharp cornering. I start smelling fuel so I open hood to find a small fuel leak around the fitting. I reinstall this unit multiple times. Carefully inspect rubber gasket, metal clamp and clean both fittings and gas tank opening. Press down pump (hard) while I tighten the clamp. It doesn't matter how much I tighten or lose, it still leaks every time. What am I doing wrong??? or do I have a defective unit? uggggg... I was thinking that $400 pump should be trouble free.


http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8252/8483210853_35fae1f37e.jpg http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8390/8483212339_e0a3f8f39c.jpg

[DMCMW Dave]

Has anyone experience fuel leak with this new pump unit? I keep getting fuel leak, especially when i do the hard braking or sharp cornering. I start smelling fuel so I open hood to find a small fuel leak around the fitting. I reinstall this unit multiple times. Carefully inspect rubber gasket, metal clamp and clean both fittings and gas tank opening. Press down pump (hard) while I tighten the clamp. It doesn't matter how much I tighten or lose, it still leaks every time. What am I doing wrong??? or do I have a defective unit? uggggg... I was thinking that $400 pump should be trouble free.

You don't have it installed correctly. The top of the clamp should be ABOVE the white plastic to hold the unit down against the lip of the tank. The way you have it, it should leak like crazy! When installed correctly you should not be able to see the rubber seal at all.

PS - Dracula's problem 3 posts up turned out to be a defective shunt resistor on the fuel gauge itself.

[Jimmyvonviggle]

Everything Dave said. I found this part of sitting the pump and clamping it correctly a little tricky. Take your time and push that pump down and then clamp it.

Crappy picture but hope it helps.

[Ryan S.]

Dave and Jimmy,
Thanks so much. It didn't leak like crazy but drove me crazy for several weeks. I feel so stupid now. Does this look right? After I reinstall clamp, I drove for about 30 miles including hard stops and sharp turns. I didn't see any leaks around the unit. I did smell a bit of fuel when I open the hood, but it could be from this morning. Oh, by the way, I can even close the cover now.
Thanks again.

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8506/8485122000_31ec0feb40.jpg

[JMLaux]

Whole unit. This is how that style is always sold (it's a special-purpose modified GM design).

I could have sworn it was an ACDelco/GM-esque style unit back when I first saw it in 2011 :P

I'm sure it was pretty easy installing this type in a Delorean, with their access hole in the trunk. Just recently had to replace one of these in my blazer. Wasn't fun to drop the gas tank out on the street, TWICE :/ Guess I din't clean out the gas tank good enough the first time and the pump failed after a month. So close to cutting a hole in the floorboard!

16707

[Exolis]

Wow, that is awesome! I just learned about this today. Granted my Fuel Pump and Sender work. Even replaced the pump/boot probably 3 years ago? And I'm pretty sure I'm going to get this ASAP. Wonder what vehicle this is from or if DMCH had a supplier build it. This is pretty exciting!

[Jack]

Anyone that has installed this have an original sender unit they'd be willing to part with?
My car came with the first "improved" one and I cant stand how it never reads full , stays at between half full and half empty forever, then drops 1/4 to almost empty.

[MML]

New integrated pump sender combo have a good term for using. Additionally, this is really interesting to learn more about this, so that I could apply this in my business.

Looks like we have another bot...

[1batt4u]

How does everyone who purchased their new Integrated Fuel Pump/Sender units like them??

So far so good?

[andy blackmon]

I have this unit in 03513 for over a year and since I do not hear it or have trouble with it, i think it is great. This is a Delorean and anything that does not cause trouble------ is great.
Andy B 03513

[DMCflux]

I've driven about 500mi. With my upgrade and have had 0 problems. Low fuel light comes on when its supposed to. very accurate! One of the best upgrades I've purchased for my car.

[DMCMW Julee]

In stock at DMC Midwest. :)

[Tillsy]

Kind of like comparing Blu-ray to a VHS tape... The new combined unit kicks ass :)

[cybercusp]

Several thousand miles on mine and running it since August '12...no problems.

[Nuclearbacon]

Here's a quandary for everyone that's right on par with this thread. My car had a BRAND new fuel pump installed in 2010, since then, the car went about 1500 miles. The tank was also professionally cleaned down in Garden Grove, Ca and new rubber throughout.

This is a "what would you do?" situation. Fuel pump works great. My fuel sender unit has given out. I read 1/4 tank when totally full, and I've tested my gauge. I know its the sender. I'm going to be spending $150 on a new sender. for an extra $250, do I get the combo, and put my fuel pump on the shelf justincase?

Is the 110085A Fuel pump (mine that was installed in 2010) good enough, and the sender unit is good enough, and I shouldn't spend the $$? Orrrrrr...

Discuss :)

[DavidProehl]

The stand alone DMC fuel senders that are for sale work, but not perfectly. They display about a 1/4 less than what you have. When full it shows 3/4 and when at 1/4, it shows empty. I have one that I only used for a couple hundred miles over the course of 2 months, I'll sell it to you for half of what Houston charges (plus shipping) if you are interested. It bothered me that it read low, so I had my OEM sender rebuilt by Hervey and haven't had trouble since.

As for the fuel pumps, the stand alone pumps DMC sells are solid. I have one in my car for 5 years and have had zero problems with it.

[Delorean Industries]

I'm chiming in on this with a different view point. This like everything in the past is a band aid for a poor original design. It's time to think outside of the box and replace the complete fuel cell and pump configuration entirely.

[jawn101]

Here's a quandary for everyone that's right on par with this thread. My car had a BRAND new fuel pump installed in 2010, since then, the car went about 1500 miles. The tank was also professionally cleaned down in Garden Grove, Ca and new rubber throughout.

This is a "what would you do?" situation. Fuel pump works great. My fuel sender unit has given out. I read 1/4 tank when totally full, and I've tested my gauge. I know its the sender. I'm going to be spending $150 on a new sender. for an extra $250, do I get the combo, and put my fuel pump on the shelf justincase?

Is the 110085A Fuel pump (mine that was installed in 2010) good enough, and the sender unit is good enough, and I shouldn't spend the $$? Orrrrrr...

Discuss :)

I'm in a similar boat. I promised myself the next time anything went wrong with my pump setup I would just replace the whole thing with this new kit. But now I'm faced with actually doing it and find myself hesitating to drop $400 when all I really need is a new boot cover, some fuel hose and to shut up and accept the crappiness of the "improved" Houston sender. Still haven't made up my mind.


I'm chiming in on this with a different view point. This like everything in the past is a band aid for a poor original design. It's time to think outside of the box and replace the complete fuel cell and pump configuration entirely.

If there was ever a contest for the post that most needed a "Stay tuned..." at the end, this would be a contender.

[Tillsy]

I'm chiming in on this with a different view point. This like everything in the past is a band aid for a poor original design. It's time to think outside of the box and replace the complete fuel cell and pump configuration entirely.

Mr Fusion only powered the time circuits and flux capacitor...

[Delorean Industries]

Mr Fusion only powered the time circuits and flux capacitor...

If I had that at my disposal I wouldn't be playing with deloreans.

Finally finish my iron man suit.....

[Conundrum]

Got the new setup installed in my DeLorean a few nights ago. I have to say, it is very quiet. I first filled it up with 5 gallons and let the car idle for a bit. Yesterday, I finally drove to a gas station and filled up. It took roughly 9.3 gallons but the gauge won't go higher than a few hairs above 1/2 tank.

[DMCMW Dave]

Got the new setup installed in my DeLorean a few nights ago. I have to say, it is very quiet. I first filled it up with 5 gallons and let the car idle for a bit. Yesterday, I finally drove to a gas station and filled up. It took roughly 9.3 gallons but the gauge won't go higher than a few hairs above 1/2 tank.

Untangle the static line from the sender float. 😋

[Conundrum]

Untangle the static line from the sender float. 
That would help. :biggrin:

[awildermode]

Is there an easy way to adjust when the fuel light comes on?

I have filled my tank twice since the install. My fill ups have been 12.93 and 12.46 gallons. If the tank is suppose to hold 13.2 gallons, that only leaves about 3-5% fuel in the tank. I would like it to be more in the 10-15% area or at least a gallon left in the tank before the light goes on.

[DMC5180]

Is there an easy way to adjust when the fuel light comes on?

I have filled my tank twice since the install. My fill ups have been 12.93 and 12.46 gallons. If the tank is suppose to hold 13.2 gallons, that only leaves about 3-5% fuel in the tank. I would like it to be more in the 10-15% area or at least a gallon left in the tank before the light goes on.

I don't know if the there is an adjustment trim pot or not. Those numbers are cutting it close to the margin. 13.2 is the published number I don't know if includes MAX filling up the filler tube ( which your not supposed to do) But I always do. That's how I know where true FULL really is. BTW I only do that when I'm planning on driving several miles to burn it down before parking. Pump nozzles can range quite a bit if you base fuel level on the first click.

[DMCMW Dave]

I don't know if the there is an adjustment trim pot or not. .

Bend the float arm. Of course this will change the gauge calibration a bit too, but if you want to fool yourself that the tank is emtpy when it isn't, go for it. (Kind of like setting your watch 5 minutes fast IMO, if you know it's fast what's the point?).

[Rich W]

Bend the float arm. Of course this will change the gauge calibration a bit too, but if you want to fool yourself that the tank is emtpy when it isn't, go for it. (Kind of like setting your watch 5 minutes fast IMO, if you know it's fast what's the point?).

I think the point being made is for a better indication of when the tank is LOW on Fuel, not when it is EMPTY. Low on fuel implies a reserve (at least a gallon),
while EMPTY implies the tank is empty or very near empty (much less than a gallon). Given the history of the previous incarnations of the DMC fuel sensor,
when the FUEL light goes on, there could be anywhere from fumes to a few gallons left, so a new "standard" may be deemed suspect until proven consistent.

However, I would also agree that when the needle is on E, the tank should be at or near Empty (not quite the same as a Low Fuel Warning Light).

[jawn101]

I got mine low enough for the light to come on today, for the first time since I installed the kit. I really think the tank is just about empty already when the light comes on. I've never run the trip odometer so far before - I normally got gas around 150 miles to be safe, I'm just crossing 310 now.

I did notice (or was it my imagination?) a little sputter/buck feeling just as I was getting home. Wonder if the tank might be a little *too* low. Next stop, gas station.

Overall, so far so good with this kit. Very pleased.

[Ryan S.]

Last week, I had to empty out the gas tank using the DMC fuel pump after fuel light came on. I was able to pump out approx 0.8 gallon.

[DMCflux]

I installed mine right out of the box. Low fuel light comes on with approx. 2.5 gal left.

[cybercusp]

I installed mine right out of the box. Low fuel light comes on with approx. 2.5 gal left.

+1. Right between 2 and 2.5

[refugeefromcalif]

Since mine was installed, Low Fuel light came on 1 time, (I pushed it), and put 12.1 gals. in the tank.
I'd rather mine did come on around 2-2.5 gals remaining.

At least it's better than my old Stock one. It started flickering around 2/3 tank, (Going up my driveway, quick accelerations), and was on continuously just below 1/2 tank.

George

[jawn101]

Yeah, I put in about 11.5ish gallons this morning, so that sounds about right. I gotta say, I love seeing the gas gauge all the way at full! Only seen it twice now since I've owned the car.

[DeloreanJoshQ]

Video of my experience and installation of the DMC Fuel Pump Sender Combo Install here:

http://youtu.be/S4WLZAo7XZY

[Silverbullet]

Ah... You need to do it over... you did not put the Fuel pump clamp on right... Did you see how the fuel pump lifted up and you said you had to tighten... The clamp NEEDS to go around the outer White flange of the pump... Then it will be lower, and the closing plastic will fit, without having to put you foot on it...

Craig

[jawn101]

Ah... You need to do it over... you did not put the Fuel pump clamp on right... Did you see how the fuel pump lifted up and you said you had to tighten... The clamp NEEDS to go around the outer White flange of the pump... Then it will be lower, and the closing plastic will fit, without having to put you foot on it...

Craig

A local owner had this happen and was complaining of poor fit and a constant fuel smell. Putting the clamp back on correctly fixed both of those issues.

Edit: Actually I forgot Ryan posted about that, right in this very thread. See post #83 (http://dmctalk.org/showthread.php?3824-NEW-Integrated-pump-sender-combo!&p=91010&viewfull=1#post91010) with Dave S' followup right after it.

[Silverbullet]

Here is how it should look
http://i116.photobucket.com/albums/o19/AtHomeSoda/FuelClamp_zpsfbafae88.jpg (http://s116.photobucket.com/user/AtHomeSoda/media/FuelClamp_zpsfbafae88.jpg.html)

[DeloreanJoshQ]

Yep, I fell into the same trap. I even called Dave Swingle after seeing the post above and still didn't learn...then I made a video on top of that (which I have since deleted, have to re-do)......hopefully it helped raise awareness.....

I read the instructions 3 times and didn't get it. Hopefully for future purchasers, DMC adds a detailed photo and instructions on the clamp install....

Back in I go....:blush:

[jawn101]

So for the second time since I put the new combo in, I started getting low on fuel and noticed the car doing the buck/shudder dance that I was used to with a collapsing pickup hose. Today the gauge showed about 1/8th tank, I got on the freeway, it started shuddering under heavy load, and then the fuel light came on immediately. If I go a little easier on the throttle it was OK. I assume it was sucking air.

Anything I can do to solve this? Did I do something wrong somewhere? It works flawlessly otherwise, this is the only issue I've seen.

[Silverbullet]

I read the instructions 3 times and didn't get it. Hopefully for future purchasers, DMC adds a detailed photo and instructions on the clamp install....

Back in I go....:blush:

The pic WAS from the instructions I got with it... hummmmmmmmm

[Josh]

Yep, I fell into the same trap. I even called Dave Swingle after seeing the post above and still didn't learn...then I made a video on top of that (which I have since deleted, have to re-do)......hopefully it helped raise awareness.....

I read the instructions 3 times and didn't get it. Hopefully for future purchasers, DMC adds a detailed photo and instructions on the clamp install....

Back in I go....:blush:

I do appreciate you making a video. It takes alot of effort to put one together and take the time to upload it!

[Conundrum]

We need more videos like this.

[kings1527]

I didn't get to see the video, Josh. Hopefully you put it back up. I'm working on a write-up on my installation experience right now.

[DeloreanJoshQ]

Version 2 of the fuel pump/sender install with all of the corrections made:

http://youtu.be/W2vaigaomog

[NightFlyer]

Highly recommended unit - can't say enough good things about it! Mine was sourced from Dave and Julee at DMC-Midwest, my preferred vendor :thumbup:

21237

[djdogbone]

This set up looks great!

[DMC3165]

The overall reviews seem to be pretty positive. I'm going to call DMCH tomorrow and place an order for this. Now that they've been out for a while has anyone had any serious issues? Has anyone needed to put the old setup back in? I'm not a big fan of modifying things from stock. But my pump/boot area has been a constant problem area for the last few years.

[NightFlyer]

The overall reviews seem to be pretty positive. I'm going to call DMCH tomorrow and place an order for this. Now that they've been out for a while has anyone had any serious issues? Has anyone needed to put the old setup back in? I'm not a big fan of modifying things from stock. But my pump/boot area has been a constant problem area for the last few years.

The only functionality problems that have been reported with the unit itself have been with the pump's internal check valve failing after a relatively short period of time/use. To remedy this, DMCH now ships the unit with an included external inline check valve that you install inline on the included rubber hose that connects the pump's feed line to the car's steel feed line. There are also a few reports that the electrical connector that plugs into the pump doesn't 'lock' on as it should. They suggest repositioning and oiling the rubber gasket in the connector, however, if that doesn't work, you can always use a zip tie, electrical tape, etc to hold the plug/connector together.

Other than that, the only other known/wide-spread issue is that it's an extremely tight fit reinstalling the access panel once you have the pump properly installed, but it is possible.

Enjoy the new unit - it really is a nice product :thumbup:

[DMCH James]

The overall reviews seem to be pretty positive. I'm going to call DMCH tomorrow and place an order for this. Now that they've been out for a while has anyone had any serious issues? Has anyone needed to put the old setup back in? I'm not a big fan of modifying things from stock. But my pump/boot area has been a constant problem area for the last few years.

Still the biggest issue is keeping these in stock - TX is out of stock until mid-May, not sure about the rest of the dealers.


The only functionality problems that have been reported with the unit itself have been with the pump's internal check valve failing after a relatively short period of time/use. To remedy this, DMCH now ships the unit with an included external inline check valve that you install inline on the included rubber hose that connects the pump's feed line to the car's steel feed line. There are also a few reports that the electrical connector that plugs into the pump doesn't 'lock' on as it should. They suggest repositioning and oiling the rubber gasket in the connector, however, if that doesn't work, you can always use a zip tie, electrical tape, etc to hold the plug/connector together.

Other than that, the only other known/wide-spread issue is that it's an extremely tight fit reinstalling the access panel once you have the pump properly installed, but it is possible.

Enjoy the new unit - it really is a nice product :thumbup:

The check valve and snap-on fitting are now pre-assembled in order to make sure they are installed properly.

[kings1527]

I love my unit. I've had it installed for about 9 months and haven't had any issues other than the check valve problem. I picked up an aftermarket brass check valve, installed it in 10 minutes, and everything's been perfect ever since. The fuel sender component is very reliable and overall, I'm extremely happy with the entire setup. Getting rid of the pickup tube was very welcome. I only ran into one instance where it was heated up and collapsed on me and I'm glad I won't have to go through that again. Extremely quiet unit.

[DMC3165]

Still the biggest issue is keeping these in stock - TX is out of stock until mid-May, not sure about the rest of the dealers.


This is a super hot item! I had to work the phone a little. But I was able to place an order with DMCCA. No one else within 1500 miles from me had it. However DMCFL called me back just a little while ago and said they may have one or two still in stock.

[DeLorean03]

So, I wanted to give a good thumbs up on this as well.

This unit is running with the VR6 DeLorean, and so far, there have been ZERO problems with this unit working with the new engine.

[DMCMW Dave]

So, I wanted to give a good thumbs up on this as well.

This unit is running with the VR6 DeLorean, and so far, there have been ZERO problems with this unit working with the new engine.

I know of one running an LS1 DeLorean in Australia as well.

[jawn101]

I'll bump this again with another update on my combo - since figuring out the problem with my kinked accumulator hose, I have had zero issues and am still loving the silent operation and accurate fuel gauge. It's true what they say, quality remains long after price is forgotten....

[DMC3165]

Just wanted to put my 2 cents in. After 2 weeks of use the unit has performed flawlessly. My only issue was I partially kinked the return line during the installation. But after I figured that out it's been perfect! Everything works as it should including my gas light which hasn't worked in over 10 years.

Thanks again to Cameron and the guys over at DMC-CA. They were very helpful and shipped my pump out on Monday and it made it to my front door on Long Island by 5 pm Friday. Not bad.

[DeloreanJoshQ]

Video of my experience and installation of the DMC Fuel Pump Sender Combo Install here:

http://youtu.be/S4WLZAo7XZY

Well, my internal check valve apparently failed. The last month it increasingly took longer and longer to start when warm. I added the external "patch up" valve from us plastics and the last week of driving it has started immediately every time....

[NightFlyer]

Well, my internal check valve apparently failed. The last month it increasingly took longer and longer to start when warm. I added the external "patch up" valve from us plastics and the last week of driving it has started immediately every time....

Actually, I'm surprised that the internal check valve lasted as long as it did on your unit, as the one on mine lasted all of two weeks before failing.

[ccurzio]

Mine lasted a lot longer than two weeks but they all seem to die at some point.

The in-line "fix" valve does a really good job of resolving the issue, and is pretty easy to get installed. No complaints.

[Chris 16409]

Actually, I'm surprised that the internal check valve lasted as long as it did on your unit, as the one on mine lasted all of two weeks before failing.

This is a silly question/remark but I'll ask anyway. The internal check valves on these plumps are failing in the open positions correct.

[NightFlyer]

This is a silly question/remark but I'll ask anyway. The internal check valves on these plumps are failing in the open positions correct.

Yes and no.

While I admittedly haven't done an autopsy on a failed pump's internal check valve to find out for certain, what I believe is happening when a failure occurs is that the valve is in fact closing, but because the valve isn't rated to sustain the kind of back-pressure that's placed upon it by the force of the accumulator spring acting upon the fluid pressure of the fuel that's in the line when the pump is disengaged, the valve is not fully seating in the closed position as it should, and thus is slightly open which allows the bleeding off of fuel/pressure back into the tank from the feed line, as opposed to holding it in that line as it's supposed to.

The external inline check valve that I recommended (and DMCH is now shipping with every unit sold) is rated to sustain a back-pressure of up to 500psi, which is more than enough for our systems and provides ample headroom to assure a long trouble free life of the check valve.

[Patrick C]

Does anyone else have issues with their gas gauge not moving past 3/4 of a tank with this new unit?

[jawn101]

Does anyone else have issues with their gas gauge not moving past 3/4 of a tank with this new unit?

On the new one? No. That was pretty much the de facto issue with the original and first gen repro senders. If your new combo unit is doing that, either your gauge is stuck or your float is tangled on the anti-static wire in the tank.

[Grover]

Does anyone else have issues with their gas gauge not moving past 3/4 of a tank with this new unit?

Mine was moving a 1/4 tank higher than full. Replaced the pump, then tried the float, then finally got a new logic box. That fixed it.

I had one of the first units shipped out, the newer boxes are sealed better. I am guessing corrosion inside the case.

Reach out to the vendor you bought it from and troubleshoot with them.


Before that though, make sure that when you install it you positioned it correctly. I was told that some get caught up on the static line in the tank, preventing the float from raising fully.

[Tillsy]

Does anyone else have issues with their gas gauge not moving past 3/4 of a tank with this new unit?

Yep, mine started doing that about six months ago - it never goes past 3/4 anymore.

I've not bothered to report it given DMCH's extensive care factor :(

[DL4567]

The modern DMCH pump seems to be popular in all sorts of cars. I was recently watching "How It's Made: Dream Cars" and they were showing the assembly of a Caterham 7 in England.

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-dcAz_egIGXU/VAp7ekiN_VI/AAAAAAAABJ8/FgIrTxQ6q1I/w800-h450-no/20140904_232602.jpg

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-X42tjGApnos/VAp7d470Q2I/AAAAAAAABJg/rge_8mYjsDc/w800-h450-no/20140904_232626.jpg

https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-gq-AKKivVKg/VAp7d9_2QsI/AAAAAAAABJ4/QvRskf-I9b8/w800-h450-no/20140904_232751.jpg

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-kZGBevKILMg/VAp7eZ9Do9I/AAAAAAAABJw/wgGhzFki6Tw/w800-h450-no/20140904_232844.jpg

https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-1GGzsmgcdII/VAp7eyzmOYI/AAAAAAAABJ0/8SE8hEN3Lqc/w800-h450-no/20140904_232941.jpg

[Morpheus]

Anyone that has installed this have an original sender unit they'd be willing to part with?
My car came with the first "improved" one and I cant stand how it never reads full , stays at between half full and half empty forever, then drops 1/4 to almost empty.

Mine is doing the exact same thing.

Were you able to find a solution? If so, what was it?

[Josh]

Had my integrated fuel pump die on my car yesterday.

Made it 3 years / 22000 miles.

Seems a little too soon, not very impressed.

It may be a reasonable assumption that the LS engine was more taxing on the fuel pump. However the fact of the matter is the LS gets similar mileage to the PRV (volume) and it runs 25psi lower than the stock K-jet system.
Furthermore, this pump is sourced from a v8 gm vehicle so it is certainly up to the task.

[jawn101]

Had my integrated fuel pump die on my car yesterday.

Made it 3 years / 22000 miles.

Seems a little too soon, not very impressed.

It may be a reasonable assumption that the LS engine was more taxing on the fuel pump. However the fact of the matter is the LS gets similar mileage to the PRV (volume) and it runs 25psi lower than the stock K-jet system.
Furthermore, this pump is sourced from a v8 gm vehicle so it is certainly up to the task.

Mine did the same thing a few weeks ago. It lasted about 1.5 years/less than 1000 miles. Sitting in traffic and the engine just shut off and would not restart. Pulled the unit and sent it to DMCMW, who said the pump itself had just fried (had a burned spot on it)

Unmodified PRV here. Also not terribly impressed - a lot of advantages design-wise, but the overall quality of the pump itself seems to be rather poor.

[DMCH James]

Had my integrated fuel pump die on my car yesterday.

Made it 3 years / 22000 miles.

Seems a little too soon, not very impressed.

It may be a reasonable assumption that the LS engine was more taxing on the fuel pump. However the fact of the matter is the LS gets similar mileage to the PRV (volume) and it runs 25psi lower than the stock K-jet system.
Furthermore, this pump is sourced from a v8 gm vehicle so it is certainly up to the task.

I can assure you that the pump is not sourced from a V8. Can you be any more specific about the manner of failure? What is the serial number of your unit? It's located on the controller box.

FWIW, the pump itself is replaceable, as is the "sock" filter attached to it. I'd be interested to see what the filter on yours looks like after 22K miles/3 years.

I presume that you bought it from DMCMW or DMCNW, correct? Have you tried reaching out to either of them on this for some input?

[Josh]

I can assure you that the pump is not sourced from a V8. Can you be any more specific about the manner of failure? What is the serial number of your unit? It's located on the controller box.

FWIW, the pump itself is replaceable, as is the "sock" filter attached to it. I'd be interested to see what the filter on yours looks like after 22K miles/3 years.

I presume that you bought it from DMCMW or DMCNW, correct? Have you tried reaching out to either of them on this for some input?

Mine is a later unit. I can get a serial number later. Car just died and i have a trip planned in two days so I am a bit frustrated to be honest. This pump is really hyped up.
If the pump itself is replaceable can I get a source on that? I just see the numbers 24137 on the pump.

In the meantime to get me up and going I am dropping in a 98 4dr tahoe fuel pump. Pressures and volume more than handle the needs of my engine and the sender resistance values are identical to my current failed unit so the logic box will work.
Also a fraction of the cost of a new pump...

[jawn101]

It seems like Josh and I are not alone.. others chimed in on my thread here: http://dmctalk.org/showthread.php?13860-New-pump-sender-combo-failed-How-to-test

[Josh]

Mine did the same thing a few weeks ago. It lasted about 1.5 years/less than 1000 miles. Sitting in traffic and the engine just shut off and would not restart. Pulled the unit and sent it to DMCMW, who said the pump itself had just fried (had a burned spot on it)

Unmodified PRV here. Also not terribly impressed - a lot of advantages design-wise, but the overall quality of the pump itself seems to be rather poor.

Well doesn't really look like I can complain... 1000miles, thats nothing!

[DMCH James]

It seems like Josh and I are not alone.. others chimed in on my thread here: http://dmctalk.org/showthread.php?13860-New-pump-sender-combo-failed-How-to-test

I've spoken to Mike at DMCMW about yours and asked him to return it to us so I can return it to our supplier for evaluation. Wasn't there some issue with a kinked accumulator line on your car causing abnormally high pressures or something like that?

[jawn101]

In the meantime to get me up and going I am dropping in a 98 4dr tahoe fuel pump. Pressures and volume more than handle the needs of my engine and the sender resistance values are identical to my current failed unit so the logic box will work.
Also a fraction of the cost of a new pump...

Well, I'll be. That surely does look familiar.


http://dmctalk.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=45444&d=1471448077

[jawn101]

I've spoken to Mike at DMCMW about yours and asked him to return it to us so I can return it to our supplier for evaluation. Wasn't there some issue with a kinked accumulator line on your car causing abnormally high pressures or something like that?

That was the first pump, and yes that's exactly what happened. Good memory! :)

Dave at Midwest got me a new unit back in January of 2014 (wow, time flies. Guess it was 2.5 years, but still only about 1000 miles - I need to drive more) and I replaced the kinked accumulator line, which was the only remaining original fuel hose on the car.

The one that fried electrically was the replacement pump. Mike suggested that it was high ambient temperatures coupled with only having about 1/4 tank of gas at the time - but both of those were very short-lived environmental conditions and should not have been a problem....

[DMCH James]

Mine is a later unit. I can get a serial number later. Car just died and i have a trip planned in two days so I am a bit frustrated to be honest. This pump is really hyped up.
If the pump itself is replaceable can I get a source on that? I just see the numbers 24137 on the pump.

In the meantime to get me up and going I am dropping in a 98 4dr tahoe fuel pump. Pressures and volume more than handle the needs of my engine and the sender resistance values are identical to my current failed unit so the logic box will work.
Also a fraction of the cost of a new pump...

I could ship a replacement pump. filter, hoses and tool to you today, but if you're up against a deadline and with shipping/customs to Canada, for your unique application that may be the path of least resistance for you.

[Josh]

I could ship a replacement pump. filter, hoses and tool to you today, but if you're up against a deadline and with shipping/customs to Canada, for your unique application that may be the path of least resistance for you.

I would still be interested so I could rebuild my pump and use it for a spare.
is there a picture of what is included in this kit?

[DMCH James]

I would still be interested so I could rebuild my pump and use it for a spare.
is there a picture of what is included in this kit?

It's a not a kit per se, but it would come as shown here with a new pump, two new hoses (you'll cut the old ones off), a new in-tank filter (while you're in there) and a loaner set of pliers to get the hoses on. We don't have any written instructions for this. but it's pretty straightforward and we can walk you through it easy enough.

45445

[Josh]

It's a not a kit per se, but it would come as shown here with a new pump, two new hoses (you'll cut the old ones off), a new in-tank filter (while you're in there) and a loaner set of pliers to get the hoses on. We don't have any written instructions for this. but it's pretty straightforward and we can walk you through it easy enough.

45445

Well having already disassembled the pump last night its not too bad and those are the three parts I identified I needed. Just removing those hoses can be a bit of a pain.
Can you send me an email so we can get shipping and stuff figured out. Thanks James

[email protected]

[DMC5180]

Are those pliers for unlocking the Feed/Return quick couplers on top of the assembly?


Dennis

[DMCH James]

Well having already disassembled the pump last night its not too bad and those are the three parts I identified I needed. Just removing those hoses can be a bit of a pain.
Can you send me an email so we can get shipping and stuff figured out. Thanks James

[email protected]

Sent.

[Josh]

As a follow up James has put together the parts and will be shipping them shortly. Seems this is resolved. Thanks James.

Without the deposit charge for the pliers, it is about $80 in parts which is not too bad.

Ill still run the alternative pump but rebuild my existing one for a backup which will give some extra piece of mind on road trips.

[Morpheus]

It's a not a kit per se, but it would come as shown here with a new pump, two new hoses (you'll cut the old ones off), a new in-tank filter (while you're in there) and a loaner set of pliers to get the hoses on. We don't have any written instructions for this. but it's pretty straightforward and we can walk you through it easy enough.

45445

When my fuel pump died suddenly a couple of months ago, James hooked me up with the replacement parts above and the car has been running fine since. The new hoses are kind of a pain to put on with the pliers, but a little bearing grease helps in that regard. I would add that it's a great time to drain and re-wipe out your fuel tank when installing, especially if your pickup filter is as bad as mine was.
45446

James, thanks once again for your help with that!

[Malevy]

I see Josh mentioned his pump had the numbers "24137" on them. Has anyone found an alternate source for this pump that is more reliable?

[DMCH James]

I see Josh mentioned his pump had the numbers "24137" on them. Has anyone found an alternate source for this pump that is more reliable?

Marc, if you (or anyone else for that matter) are reliability issues with the pump that comes with the 107000, please let me know and I will help.

We've sold over 1500 of these units since 2012 and we've installed more of these than anyone else at our locations. If there are widespread failures of the pump itself, I *really* want to hear about it because we're not seeing it. Between 2014 and now, we have sold 14 replacement pumps (less than 1% of overall sales). Of the pumps/in-tank filter screens that we have been able to get back from customers who got replacements, all but two were due to debris in the fuel system causing pump failure. My supplier is very eager to see any failures, and we are, as well.

BTW, I'll be coming to the Spring Social in a few weeks, and I'm happy to talk with you about it there.

[Malevy]

It is possible a better quality pump (and/or screen) will not be as fragile. Quite possible the failures I have seen are due to debris too, but "seat of the pants" non-scientific observation leads me to believe that other pumps may be more reliable (even if that means less prone to damage from debris). I have installed lots of fuel pumps in DeLoreans, and Non-DeLoreans..

Ignoring the check valve issues (resolved by adding an external one), I have seen 2 pumps that have failed where they still pump but the pressure is too low for the fuel system to operate properly. Even out of the box, they seem to produce less pressure than a well worn OEM Bosch pump.

I suspect a "performance" replacement pump could be found from companies like Walbro that could overcome the shortcomings I believe the current pump has while maintaining all of it's advantages over the original design. Pumps of this style can be found with insane (high) pressure and flow specifications, but 107000 has a unique filter screen with integrated clips- something I have not seen on any other pump.

Based on my experience, I have been re-thinking my preference for the DMCH fuel pump. My effort to find a source for replacement pumps to install in the assembly from someplace other than DMCH may push me to opt for the Tahoe (or similar) X-Ref others have used with good results. With those assemblies, I can easily replace (or upgrade) the internal pump.

Looking forward to seeing you at the DeLorean Mid-Atlantic event in NJ later this month.. And assume I will also see you at the movie premier on 4/30?

[Malevy]

Spending hours looking at photos of fuel pumps and pickup strainers, I spotted this:
https://herko.com/productinfo.php?inv=2010#

I recognized it as the pickup in the DMCH pump.. Researching it further on the Herko website, I found it is included in their kit K9125 which is a replacement pump for a 2004-2005 Chevy Colorado (Also sold as GMC Canyon and Isuzu D-MAX).

https://herko.com/productinfo.php?inv=3755
https://herko.com/Retail/herko-high-performance-fuel-pump-k9125-for-gm-2004-2005.html
https://www.amazon.com/Herko-Fuel-Module-Repair-K9125/dp/B074VBFN5C

$28 is a great deal for what DMCH sells for $80+ (to buy all 3 parts).
How about $18 if you want to gamble?
https://www.ebay.com/p/2004-2005-Chevrolet-Colorado-Fuel-Pump-E3614m/6004585645
Or $14
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/OSIAS-Brand-new-aluminium-E3614M-PREMIUM-HIGH-PERFORMANCE-FUEL-PUMP-STRAINER-KIT-GM-VEHICLES-VARIOUS/32835317305.html
(AliExpress link has a list of other vehicles they claim this pump was used in).

What a coincidence when I noticed this part also from Herko;
https://herko.com/productinfo.php?inv=3809
https://herko.com/Retail/new-herko-fuel-pump-k9178-for-delorean-dmc12-1981-1983-flow-280-liter-hour.html

Felt like a real fool when I also see it right there on EBAY!
https://www.ebay.com/itm/New-Herko-Fuel-Pump-K9178-for-Delorean-DMC12-1981-1983-/381792485378
And WALMART!
https://www.walmart.com/ip/New-Herko-Fuel-Pump-K9178-for-Delorean-DMC12-1981-1983-Flow-280-Liter-Hour/381512406

I wonder if the two kits are actually the same? they look the same. No specifications are published on the K9125 kit.

Seems likely that Herko is the source that DMCH uses for this pump. As I am writing all this, a PM comes in casually saying "430 dollars for a Herko pump feels like I'm being robbed", confirming in fact- I am a fool!!

This is apparently all old news;
http://dmctalk.org/showthread.php?10705-Has-anyone-installed-the-Power-Pump-fuel-pump&p=196076&viewfull=1#post196076

After looking at so many pumps, I believe the top part as custom matched to the bottom (from the 2004 Colorado) for the DMCH special order. Likely because the alternate top will fit better under the fuel pump access cover. I see pumps that match the top of the DMCH pump, and bottom of the DMCH pump, and the float assembly... but so far- only one they are combine is from DMCH. Pontiac GTP (and similar models) looks close too, but not exact.

The next question is- Can a "better" pump be found for this application? Herko only says their pump is "Flow @ 5 BAR- 140 Lts/Hr; OPEN FLOW= 283 Lts/Hr" which in theory should be an acceptable replacement for the original BOSCH 0 580 254 98. While the Bosh specifications also say it has an OPERATING pressure of 5 BAR, it has a maxim pressure of 11 BAR. I suspect this is where some of the problems I have seen originate. Most noted, the need to reset the mixture after installing the DMCH fuel pump. The DMC factory service manual says that primary pressure should be 5.2 BAR and circulated 29 gallons (110 liters) per hour. So, I should be looking for 2004 Chevy Colorado "performance" pumps (or others listed in the AliExpress link).

Found this, "Lifetime Warranty", but no specifications:
https://www.highflowfuel.com/i-23905222-quantum-intank-efi-fuel-pump-chevrolet-colorado-2004-2009.html
Same pump is also used in Harley Davidson and Can-Am. Useless trivia.

May need to keep looking..

Point is, all of this information explains the issues I have seen with the DMCH pumps, even the ones that have not "failed". I'd like to find an alternative to install in the DMCH assembly mostly because I have a sense of guilt for all of the people I have recommended (or installed) this pump to/for. Reality may be it is not worth it, probably be better off just using an entire new assembly that already comes with a better pump. The "converter" box can likely be reused, or get the one Dave sells.

Or, is there another option? I think there may be..... As soon as I figure it out, I will discover someone else has already done it.. LOL

[Bitsyncmaster]

Remember with the DMCH pump your getting the pump, check valve, fuel gauge ECU, fuel sender cap and plug and play wiring. So it's not just $430 for a $50 pump.

I did test my GM pump and got a flow rate of a little less then 2 quarts at 75 PSI every 60 seconds. That test is really easy to do. Just pull the return line off the pump and jumper the RPM relay and measure the amount of fuel from the return line in 60 seconds. Note my primary pressure has been adjusted with shims to 75 PSI. I did not test max pressure thinking that value is not worth putting stress on the pump, fuel hoses, etc. If you want to do that test, just put a pressure gauge on the return line.

[DMC-81]

Remember with the DMCH pump your getting the pump, check valve, fuel gauge ECU, fuel sender cap and plug and play wiring. So it's not just $430 for a $50 pump.

Exactly, and by supporting a vendor, you are helping to ensure ongoing product innovations (like the subject fuel module) and reproductions for a 38 year old orphan car.


It is possible a better quality pump (and/or screen) will not be as fragile. Quite possible the failures I have seen are due to debris too, but "seat of the pants" non-scientific observation leads me to believe that other pumps may be more reliable (even if that means less prone to damage from debris). I have installed lots of fuel pumps in DeLoreans, and Non-DeLoreans..

Ignoring the check valve issues (resolved by adding an external one), I have seen 2 pumps that have failed where they still pump but the pressure is too low for the fuel system to operate properly. Even out of the box, they seem to produce less pressure than a well worn OEM Bosch pump.


I think if you are seeing failures that you suspect are due to debris, you should perhaps look at their installation procedures. Installing any pump regardless of price point in a clean environment is important. Because the fuel returns to the tank, it is of course important to surgically clean the tank, but remember that dirty components downstream that can return contaminated fuel to your clean tank.

Failures right out of the box are not that rare in today's mass production world. That said, I have had great service after the sale from DMC when I have had any problems with a product ( the same can be said for several other vendors too ).

I am completing 7 years in-service with my DMCH all in one fuel module without a hitch. To me, that's reliable. But, I also went through the entire fuel system during my restoration as well.

Cheers,

[Malevy]

Exactly, and by supporting a vendor, you are helping to ensure ongoing product innovations (like the subject fuel module) and reproductions for a 38 year old orphan car.

So, having 25+ years of ownership under my belt and having worked on a few dozen DeLoreans, I can confirm that it is important to "support our vendors". But, don't do it blindly. When they can do better, it is up to us to demand better. This is why I try to support ALL DeLorean vendors, competition keeps them striving to be better.

Would you like the list of things I have lived through with DMCH, and still continue to support them??

I am confident they could still have made a nice profit on these pumps if they ordered them with better specifications. Lots of GM pumps run at 100+ PSI. There are better choices to more closely match what the DMC fuel system needs. Hopefully this discussion will encourage an improved model for the future. I'd love to continue recommending the DMCH pump to people, but as it stands now- I can't.

[DMC-81]

So, having 25+ years of ownership under my belt and having worked on a few dozen DeLoreans, I can confirm that it is important to "support our vendors". But, don't do it blindly. When they can do better, it is up to us to demand better. This is why I try to support ALL DeLorean vendors, competition keeps them striving to be better.

Would you like the list of things I have lived through with DMCH, and still continue to support them??

I am confident they could still have made a nice profit on these pumps if they ordered them with better specifications. Lots of GM pumps run at 100+ PSI. There are better choices to more closely match what the DMC fuel system needs. Hopefully this discussion will encourage an improved model for the future. I'd love to continue recommending the DMCH pump to people, but as it stands now- I can't.

Marc, Congrats on many years of ownership and supporting other vendors. I do the same. I was not calling into question your experience. My point with the fuel module is checking to see whether any failure is caused by our car's common issue of contamination, or by inferior quality parts/components. Yes, competition is a good thing, and hopefully your seat of the pants hunch / research delivers a better mousetrap. By James' post above, it seems that they are already investigating any failures to help their supplier continuously improve the product.

What hasn't worked for me is buying inexpensive parts and expecting quality and durability.

[Malevy]

What hasn't worked for me is buying inexpensive parts and expecting quality and durability.

The $30 part is exactly the same part DMCH sells for $90. Paying more for the same thing does not make it better.

My premise here is that a $400+ fuel pump assembly should be higher quality.

[DMC-81]

The $30 part is exactly the same part DMCH sells for $90. Paying more for the same thing does not make it better.

My premise here is that a $400+ fuel pump assembly should be higher quality.

Fair enough. I don’t like paying any more than I have to, but I don’t expect a relatively small business to compete with prices from my favorite e-tailer, nor any of the local brick and mortar stores I frequent. Hey, if you find a cheaper price for replacement parts, then great.

As for the price of the $400 fuel pump, I know that sounds excessive, but as you can imagine, these other costs must be included in the price to recoup expenses of developing a new product (over and above the per unit part cost of the whole module):
- the total Research and Development costs
- costs of commissioning proprietary parts
- Returns
- Warranty costs
- Part Waste
- General Administration (overhead)
- Etc.
All divided by a limited volume.

I applaud anyone who develops a new or reproduction part for our cars.

Maybe it’s just me, but I don’t find a problem with the quality of my pump.

[Malevy]

As for the price of the $400 fuel pump, I know that sounds excessive, but as you can imagine, these other costs must be included in the price to recoup expenses of developing a new product (over and above the per unit part cost of the whole module)

I am aware of how it all works.. Not sure why you feel the need to defend DMCH against one person's opinion (mine), but so be it..

Just like other less than flattering opinions I have had over the years about DMCH products and business practices, I will continue to direct people to them (and their franchises) for parts I feel they are the best option for. Until recently, the fuel pump was one of those parts. Clearly, not any more.

[Josh]

Fair enough. I don’t like paying any more than I have to, but I don’t expect a relatively small business to compete with prices from my favorite e-tailer, nor any of the local brick and mortar stores I frequent. Hey, if you find a cheaper price for replacement parts, then great.

As for the price of the $400 fuel pump, I know that sounds excessive, but as you can imagine, these other costs must be included in the price to recoup expenses of developing a new product (over and above the per unit part cost of the whole module):
- the total Research and Development costs
- costs of commissioning proprietary parts
- Returns
- Warranty costs
- Part Waste
- General Administration (overhead)
- Etc.
All divided by a limited volume.

I applaud anyone who develops a new or reproduction part for our cars.

Maybe it’s just me, but I don’t find a problem with the quality of my pump.

I would take warranty out of that list.
I had a pump prematurely die (and i am not the only one) and the best DMCH could do is try and sell me more parts.

It was cheaper to go to the local parts store and replace it with a 2000 Tahoe pump.

Not to mention the whole check valve situation. The fuel pump should have an internal check valve, having to install an external one is a sign of a cheap product.

[DMC-81]

I would take warranty out of that list.
I had a pump prematurely die (and i am not the only one) and the best DMCH could do is try and sell me more parts.

It was cheaper to go to the local parts store and replace it with a 2000 Tahoe pump.

Not to mention the whole check valve situation. The fuel pump should have an internal check valve, having to install an external one is a sign of a cheap product.

Hi Josh,

Hmm, I think it depends on the situation, and the circumstances. From posts 151 and 152 in this same thread it seems you exceeded the 6? month warranty by 6 times, (i.e. 3 years), and used it in an application that it was not designed for (V8 versus V6). What would you think any other car warranty company would say? In my experience they would say no, and offer to sell you a new unit for $400, maybe at a discount if you were really nice and/or a high volume customer.

But, in post 158, James offered to send you the necessary repair parts for $80 (20% of the cost of a whole new unit) which you stated that you were satisfied with in post 164.

On the check valve, based on my reading, I think after a few were sold and used, it was discovered that the internal check valve was not strong enough over time to counteract the pressure of the fuel accumulator in our cars, so the external one was added. That's just my layman's guess. DMC was up front in post 17 that it was a special purpose modified GM design). As a general rule, new car part designs are updated over time and with experience. Nothing new here.

All along this thread, DMC has been listening and offering what I think is a reasonable solution. How many car part vendors are so directly connected to their customers?

I think we need to cut them some slack.



I am aware of how it all works.. Not sure why you feel the need to defend DMCH against one person's opinion (mine), but so be it..


Marc, 2 reasons.

1. One of the reasons I bought this car is because of the excellent parts availability, both NOS and improved. It benefits all of us to have DMC and other vendors actively engaged in producing parts for our cars.

2. In my experience, all of the people at DMC are connected to us, their customers, and try to do the right thing.

I worry that sometimes it's hard to continue on those 2 paths when you see unfair/unbalanced reviews.

So, when I see what is possibly an unfair assessment based on my experience with the part and company, I add my experience (if I have one), to hopefully give the reader a balanced perspective as they make their assessment. I know that I did a LOT of reading when I was a new owner, and fair product reviews were very important to me in my attempt to decide among part /vendor options.

I buy from other vendors and I provide positive reviews whenever possible for them as well. Chief among them are Rob Grady of PJ Grady, and Arran of DeLoreanGo. When I get great customer service from any company, I tend to become an advocate. That's all.