The Ulster Transport Museum Cars

[DMCNI]

I managed to view the 50000 mile car at the Ulster Transport Museum in Cultra recently. My visit to this section was fleeting due to time constraints and I didn't get reading the info plaques on the display stands, therefore they could have answered the questions I am about to ask.

Does anyone know how the museum acquired the 50000 mile car, was it on display in the Museum prior to the factory closing and the same question applies to Giugiaro's wooden mock up, how did the museum manage to obtain it?

[DMCNI]

Robert Lamrock of the DOA provided me with this answer on Delorean Owners Club UK website....


John Moore, the former Keeper of Transport at the UFTM bought some of the DeLorean items that are currently on display from the Receiver when the factory closed at knock down prices. Other items are held in trust.

Robert Lamrock
DeLorean Owners Association

[Dangermouse]

John Moore, author of "Motor Makers in Ireland"

http://www.entermyworld.com/images/111t.jpg

[DMCNI]

Ahhhh I've seen that book for sale as well....didnt twig I'd heard the name before!

I want Stainless Steel Illusion, but its wild dear....ebay had it at £75.00

[Domi]

Thanks for that information ;)
About the book, you can find it on Ed's site at DeLorean Europe at 46€ = 39.23£
http://www.delorean.eu/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=151001

[DMCNI]

Thanks for that information ;)
About the book, you can find it on Ed's site at DeLorean Europe at 46€ = 39.23£
http://www.delorean.eu/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=151001

Thanks for that Domi...the price seems much more reasonable :)

[DMCNI]

Stumbled upon a bit of youtube footage of the 50k car at the Ulster Folk & Transport Museum...



http://youtu.be/2J6OPUmsVZo

[Domi]

Nice video, thanks for sharing ;)

[MML]

It's in a sorry state... lots of bits missing!

[Jonathan]

Pardon my ignorance, but what is a "50,000 mile car?"

[Rich W]

Pardon my ignorance, but what is a "50,000 mile car?"

Quick Answer: This was one of the cars used for the (early) 50K Mile Endurance Testing.

Most of the details can be found in the Unique DeLoreans section of the PJ Grady UK website:

http://www.pjgrady.co.uk//GenericContent.aspx?PageType=Unique_Deloreans&ShowContent=50k_Delorean.html

Most of the details provided by Dave Howarth from the UK DMC Owners Club.

[nick sutton]

Pardon my ignorance, but what is a "50,000 mile car?"

Read the book!

Nick

[Jonathan]

Read the book!

Nick

Haha, already did!! The section in your book with this 50,000 mile car in it I must have gotten distr

[DMCVegas]

It's in a sorry state... lots of bits missing!

It wasn't a production car so it didn't need all little bits installed and didn't have them to begin with. All things considered, it's actually been preserved rather well.

http://www.pjgrady.co.uk/General/Images/P241.jpg

[MML]

It wasn't a production car so it didn't need all little bits installed and didn't have them to begin with. All things considered, it's actually been preserved rather well.

http://www.pjgrady.co.uk/General/Images/P241.jpg

Ahh, that's true enough.
I've heard from several people in the past that the car was never cordoned off until recently, leading to kids etc. climbing into it and fiddling with it, I wouldn't have been surprised if some "souvenirs" had been taken over the years!

[DMCNI]

I thought I imagined it when recalling it not being closed off on one of my previous trips...but I didnt clamber into the car out of respect.

It was mentioned on the DOC UK that the other test car was crashed and ended up on its roof. However I read on another DeLorean forum (DMChelp perhaps??) that the other car crashed into a tree...cant find the thread I read it on :(

More pics of the test car...

http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/09/04/ge7a2upu.jpg

http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/09/04/yga6aneh.jpg

[Andy]

http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/09/04/ge7a2upu.jpg

http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/09/04/yga6aneh.jpg

"RIA 7123" is Pilot 24 ( D24 ) and I read somewhere that it was indeed crashed into a tree at some point, but was repaired. So what happened to it afterwards?

More pictures here : http://www.pjgrady.co.uk//GenericContent.aspx?PageType=500_Chronology&ShowContent=Test_Cars.html

[DMCNI]

Thanks Andy :)

Slowly we are building up a bit of a picture of the 50k cars.

Is the gas flap missing from the test car? Or are my eyes playing tricks?

Looking at the photos makes me think how surreal it must have been in Northern Ireland at the time...inbetween the malestorm of violence, something positive was happening.

Seeing a DeLorean on the local roads must have been something else, and created quite the stir.

[Rich W]

Seeing a DeLorean on the local roads must have been something else, and created quite the stir.

Nick Sutton has some great stories about the early "challenges" of driving DeLoreans in Northern Ireland.

As some of the younger crowd may not be aware, something as "simple" as getting Unleaded Petrol for driving the DeLorean
was actually something that had to be planned carefully, to make sure you did not run out of fuel where you were not able to
re-fuel the car. This is when you would want a very accurate fuel gauge and a couple of spare cans of fuel while driving 24/7.

I remember one story told by Nick about trying to get all the "test cars" properly filled up the day before all the car magazine
writers arrived to do the initial test drives and articles about the DeLorean. That was one extremely hectic time at the factory.

[DMCNI]

Hi Rich, I recall reading Nick's story about unleaded fuel fiasco which worked out in the end, a very different world to the one we all live in today.

I can remember when unleaded fuel was phased into the petrol stations of Northern Ireland and we had the option of Four Star (leaded) and Unleaded Petrol, it must have confused the rioters at the time...Here Jimmy, what burns better four star or unleaded??? ;)

You wouldnt have got a scene like this in 1980 in Belfast or the surrounding areas. (Picture came from the Delorean Eurotec forum)

http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/09/05/u2ysyzu4.jpg

[Jonathan]

Interesting how there are many pieces left off the 50k car and it sounds like some that were never installed in the first place. If they are testing endurance, you can make the case for not needing these parts (glovebox lid for example), however, when you see testing methods nowadays, it seems the emphasis is on making the test as real world accurate as possible. So you would think you would test the car in the same exact condition as customers would buy them? Not possible perhaps given the state of the company early on.

Like these car polish or paint sealant commercials where they run it through 52 car washes in a row... yea, I get that it is supposed to mimic washing your car all year long, but it's not quite the same IMO.

[Rich W]

Like these car polish or paint sealant commercials where they run it through 52 car washes in a row... yea, I get that it is supposed to mimic washing your car all year long, but it's not quite the same IMO.

The latest series of these product endurance test commercials seem to be a bit suspect, especially when they separate half the car with blue masking tape.

It seems a bit odd that the temporary masking tape does not appear any worse for wear after the 52 car washes, so how is the washing considered "wear".

I know the tape is there to separate the areas with and without product applied, but having the masking tape look great after 52 washes, hmmm...

[Domi]

I wonder what kind of device is this on the dashboard, a radio system to communicate with others cars?

[Dangermouse]

That's a CB radio, quite popular at the time (CB -Citizens Band)

[Domi]

All right, I see.
I still have one in my daily driver :biggrin:

[nick sutton]

The car in the Ulster Museum was the third 50K mile car - only two were required but three were allocated to the programme. Good job really because one caught fire because of incorrect wiring routing. Paul Fricker the engine man from Lotus told me the story how he was frog marched from one side of the Dunmurry site to the other to witness the results of his work. The car is VIN 535 and looks quite sad in the museum. As many have said - no doubt every now and again another part of the car is liberated either for a collector or ends up for sale on ebay.

Nick

[Domi]

Someone on the UK forum said the test car of the museum is VIN 514?
So, which one is good, 514 or 535? Just curious.

[DMCNI]

I wonder what the range was on the CB?

Did the test pilots use them to stay in touch with each others cars or were they used to communicate with Dunmurry?

[nick sutton]

Is the car in the Ulster Museum Auto or manual?

[Domi]

Is the car in the Ulster Museum Auto or manual?

Looks like it is a manual.

[DMCNI]

Its a manual, but someone has made off with the gear knob...grrrr

http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/09/05/e9ematu7.jpg

[nick sutton]

Then it is 514 - VIN 535 was an Auto - after it caught fire at Dunmurry it must have been destroyed.

[Domi]

Thanks for the information :)

[DMCNI]

Thanks for the info Nick :)

[Andy]

PJ Grady's site says that Pilot 14 (D14) and Pilot 15 (D15) were used for the 50,000 mile durability testing ... Is this correct then?

[Dangermouse]

So, in summary there were maybe five 50,000mile test cars?

Pilot 24 - RIA 7123 - Manual - Location Unknown - possibly crashed
VIN 514 - reg unknown - manual - On display at UFATM
VIN 535 - reg unknown - auto - destroyed in fire in 1981 (Per Nick S.)
Pilot 14 & 15 - regs unknown, autos, locations unknown (per Grady)

Seem right?

I have only ever seen (on-the-road) photos of RIA 7123. Anyone got any pictures of the others, or even better, two or more together?

[Rich W]

So, in summary there were maybe five 50,000mile test cars?

Pilot 24 - RIA 7123 - Manual - Location Unknown - possibly crashed
VIN 514 - reg unknown - manual - On display at UFATM
VIN 535 - reg unknown - auto - destroyed in fire in 1981 (Per Nick S.)
Pilot 14 & 15 - regs unknown, autos, locations unknown (per Grady)

Seem right?

I have only ever seen (on-the-road) photos of RIA 7123. Anyone got any pictures of the others, or even better, two or more together?


The 50K Mile Car List may need to be updated.

I have a number of photos (photos of photos) that I took of the 50K Mile Cars display in the DCS Museum at DCS 2008.

From at least a few photos, it appears appears that Pilot 24 - RIA 7123 - Manual - may be the car with the engine fire.

Attaching a couple photos of RIA 7123 in the lot, parked outside of the factory, including one photo of the engine area.

21789

21790

The original photos are part of the Matt Sommer Collection that was displayed at the DCS Museum at DCS 2008.

[Domi]

Nice pic!

[Rich W]

Well, according to the DMC Ltd. records that I saw at the DCS Museum at DCS 2008...

VIN...514 was driven 50K miles (in Northern Ireland) in 76 days, 10 hours, 44 minutes.

This was being done as quickly as possible (24/7), with VIN...514 having three drivers
rotating the driving duties, from January 25, 1981 through April 12, 1981.

The condition of the original DeLorean Motor Company Ltd. document is not in great shape, near the top of the paper,
but you can still see "The 1st. 50,000 miles in N. Ireland" on the first line of this paper, with the rest of the text on the
page in much better shape. The three drivers even signed the document at the bottom: Chris, David and Des? (maybe?)
Maybe it's Les (with a circle around the L). Sorry if you were the third driver and I got the third name wrong.

21794

The above original document is part of the Matt Sommer Collection that was displayed at the DCS Museum at DCS 2008.

[Domi]

How lucky Matt Sommer is to own such an historic document.
I wonder how he was able to find it? When the factory closed?

[Dangermouse]

Fantastic document.

Almost certainly the third name is Des - a very popular name there at the time.

So this is 514, now at the museum. Anyone got a vin plate photo of it? (I checked Shannons database, and nothing)

[nick sutton]

The signatures are Chris Bradley Foreman of the development work shop , David Winnington who worked for Chris and unfortunately I don't know the full name of Des who also signed the document.

[DMCNI]

Dessie Murray is the full name of the last test driver...stumbled upon copies of an internal employee magazine called "The Steering Column" which had a brief mention of Vin 514 and road testing in Northern Ireland Chris, David and Dessie get a wee mention. I found the images below on the deloreanclubuk webpage....

http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/09/22/original/a8amumed.jpg

http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/09/22/original/by6yqepy.jpg



http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/09/22/original/yrasu6e2.jpg

http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/09/22/original/zemu7ejy.jpg

[chris brennan]

It wasn't a production car so it didn't need all little bits installed and didn't have them to begin with. All things considered, it's actually been preserved rather well.

http://www.pjgrady.co.uk/General/Images/P241.jpg


The car's interior was intact when I seen it in 1994 apart from the glove box lid missing of course.According to the museum the car has been intentionally damaged and security stepped up around the car afew years ago. I wish they had kept the doors closed like they did in 94.

indicator stalks are broken off, steering wheel damaged, buttons missing, gear stick knob gone and just more general wear inside since I last seen it (I was down there last week) pretty sickening given the cars history.

[chris brennan]

Fantastic document.

Almost certainly the third name is Des - a very popular name there at the time.

So this is 514, now at the museum. Anyone got a vin plate photo of it? (I checked Shannons database, and nothing)


HERES A VIN PICTURE OF THE TRANSPORT MUSEUM CAR http://www.flickr.com/photos/christopherbrennan/10844219115/

[Rich W]

HERES A VIN PICTURE OF THE TRANSPORT MUSEUM CAR http://www.flickr.com/photos/christopherbrennan/10844219115/

Thanks for the photo link Chris. The photo answers several questions, all at once.

- confirms the VIN itself (VIN...514)
- confirms the type of dash plate (early style, painted over - paint is slightly worn)
- confirms the dash plate was glued onto the dash (not riveted in place)

[Dangermouse]

Great stuff!

How did you get such a clear shot through the glass?

[chris brennan]

Just held my hand up to get rid of reflections..I asked permission to get close to the car and had a good discussion with the curator, He told me they had some trouble with one individual who was pulling parts off the car and tried to sell them in Belfast but the museum was immediately told about it...apparently its not the only car that's suffered!!:what_the:

[DMCNI]

Job well done fella :)

I wonder why they blacked out the vin plate?

And why did the vin plates change from the made in Belfast N Ireland to the other style?

[Rich W]

Job well done fella :)

I wonder why they blacked out the vin plate?

And why did the vin plates change from the made in Belfast N Ireland to the other style?

The early VIN dash plates were a polished stainless steel finish, which can be rather distracting when driving into the sun,
due to the angle of the dash and the position of the VIN plate in relation to the driver's view out of the windshield.

I have first hand experience driving VIN...520 several thousand miles since the paint was removed from the dash plate.
Yes, it can be a bit distracting, but I enjoy the distraction, since this type of tag is so rare, it makes early cars unique.

When the paint was added to the early VIN dash plates, a decision was made to replace later plates with aluminum tags
that were painted. In the right light, most of the early tags can be checked for lettering, even if the paint is left on.

[chris brennan]

Great info there--I'll see if I can get the reg next week (:0)~~


Sent from my iPod touch using Tapatalk (http://tapatalk.com/m?id=1)

[DMCNI]

The early VIN dash plates were a polished stainless steel finish, which can be rather distracting when driving into the sun,
due to the angle of the dash and the position of the VIN plate in relation to the driver's view out of the windshield.

I have first hand experience driving VIN...520 several thousand miles since the paint was removed from the dash plate.
Yes, it can be a bit distracting, but I enjoy the distraction, since this type of tag is so rare, it makes early cars unique.

When the paint was added to the early VIN dash plates, a decision was made to replace later plates with aluminum tags
that were painted. In the right light, most of the early tags can be checked for lettering, even if the paint is left on.

Thanks for the info Rich :)

I think I could live with the distraction too! The made in Belfast plates are great looking!

[chris brennan]

Well it turns out vin 514 is in fact ria7123 and ria7122 was the other car which was an automatic.. Great now I can sleep at night lol

[Dangermouse]

Well it turns out vin 514 is in fact ria7123 and ria7122 was the other car which was an automatic.. Great now I can sleep at night lol

I can't!!!

So are you saying that the UFTM car, Vin 514, is RIA7123 and was the manual transmission 50k car in all the pictures? Makes sense, but where did you get this revelation?

And what about the above notes on D24 being RIA7123? Is/was D24 revinned as 514?

And are you saying that 535, the auto 50k car that caught fire was RIA7122?

[chris brennan]

Yeah that's the car, I mean it looks identical to those old pix anyway! I read it in celebratin the impossible book this mornin, the automatic car ended on its roof, banter via brendan Montgomery who drove the manual 514

[Dangermouse]

aha, you've gotten a head start on me. I won't get my copy for a few weeks.

[chris brennan]

You'll love the vin chronology at the end!!