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Thread: OFFICIAL Re-graining Stainless Thread

  1. #1
    Ryan > Ruben Ryan King's Avatar
    Join Date:  May 2011

    Location:  Fresno, CA

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    My VIN:    3997

    OFFICIAL Re-graining Stainless Thread

    Okay...I really want to know the full scoop on doing a full body re-grain. I would like this thread to be about past experiences with trying to do so, for not only myself, but for others in the future that want to take on the task. (Thus the "Official" title.)

    I have heard from our fellow forum member, tgraham, that the "Wolfhead" wheel seems to be the best way to go about doing a full re-grain. Allow me to quote him from a previous thread -

    Link to Discussion -
    http://dmctalk.org/showthread.php?36...light=Wolfhead

    And another link from tgraham's personal Restoration Website -
    http://www.noroads.com/delorean/3281/?content=20091018
    (Photos on this thread courtesy of his site as well)

    And another link from tgraham's personal Restoration Website -
    http://www.noroads.com/delorean/3281/?content=20100110

    Quote Originally Posted by tgraham View Post
    That's me I bought a previously-painted RF fender and re-grained it with a "factory-like" setup to get all of the scoring out.

    The factory tooling was a modified ARO (now Ingersoll Rand) inline air grinder and a "Vonnegut wheel" on the end of it. You can buy the modern version of the Vonnegut wheel from the same manufacturer, which is called a "Wolfhead wheel". This is a high-quality industrial tool, not some crappy/cheap attachment that you can buy at the local hardware warehouse. I've seen those, and the thought of one of those things spinning around and coming anywhere near one of my cars makes me cringe... maybe that's just me, though.

    To do it right, you'll need that Wolfhead wheel and plenty of aluminum oxide abrasive loadings, some form of air tool (probably a drill) that will spin it ~800-1000 RPM, and a big compressor with the capacity to run it constantly. However, that RPM range is pretty slow for a drill, so your options are limited to those intended for manufacturing use. Inline is probably a little ergonomically-better, but I have a pistol grip and it's fine. The Wolfhead is heavy, so make sure the tool has enough power to spin it!

    After you have the equipment in hand, it's down to practice and skill. As David said, having a beater panel on hand to sharpen your skills is handy and probably worth the cost to purchase one (a damaged RF fender with an antenna holes is about as cheap as it gets). The Wolfhead will get you most of the way there, but you'll still want to go over everything with a pad by hand afterwards - that makes all of the difference. But as you can see from the two attachments, it is very effective - I made some pretty nasty scratches in that panel - MUCH worse than the ones that were on my to-be-restored panel.

    Also, I used 3M Safest Stripper to remove the remains of the paint on my replacement panel - I just left it sitting there for a week, then the paint scraped right off. This particular stripper takes time to do its job, but I've never had it damage anything underneath the paint and I use this stuff a LOT on cars.

    Good luck.

    Travis
    Wolf2.jpg
    Wolf4.jpg
    Wolf1.jpg
    Wolf3.jpg

    I would like to look into purchasing one for myself. But before I do so, I would like to make sure it is the best option for me... (Where to buy? How much does one cost?)

    The reason being that I want to take this on is at one point in my college days, my car was keyed in a parking lot and no matter how much I try, I cannot get the scratch out. I have spent over an hour with elbow grease and a pad trying to do so to no avail.

    Anyways. Let the discussions begin. Thoughts, Concerns, Questions and Answers. GO!
    Last edited by Ryan King; 08-16-2011 at 03:27 AM.
    Living The Dream Since 2005 - VIN#3997

  2. #2
    Ryan > Ruben Ryan King's Avatar
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    Also for Reference -

    John Hevey claims to have an Original Factory used graining tool. You can find the reference photo on his website here -
    http://www.specialtauto.com/delorean...cessories.html
    (Very bottom of the page)

    Quoted from the "Yahoo Groups" website -

    Travis,
    When I buy stainless in sheets like 4 x 8 it was bought already grained.
    Then the tool was to be used to clean up any scars or marks that was made
    during the processing or making the car.
    I have an original air operated tool and head. Also have a few extra 80 grit
    1 1/2" wide small belts to go on the wheel. There is a picture on my web
    site accessory page at the bottom.
    Hope this helps.
    John
    www.specialtauto.com
    JohnHerveyTool.jpg

    I have also seen that DMC-CA has these tools as well. Is this the best regraining method out there?
    Living The Dream Since 2005 - VIN#3997

  3. #3
    Ryan > Ruben Ryan King's Avatar
    Join Date:  May 2011

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    Yet another Reference -
    http://dmctalk.org/showthread.php?36...tainless/page4

    Quote Originally Posted by Dangermouse View Post
    Took me a while to find it, but the guy was in Slovakia, not Hungary - hence the confusion , although he is a member of the Delorean club of Hungary.

    He is a gentleman (I presume) with the handle "Bopat" - I think he was on the old forum also. He stripped a red car as part of an ambitious restoration of vin 701. Thanks to him for the following pics from his blog.

    The rig:



    Stripped of paint, but swirls clearly visible



    After:



    And his blog with his other substantial resto work on this car

    http://dmc701.blogspot.com/

    And even a short video:

    Living The Dream Since 2005 - VIN#3997

  4. #4
    Ryan > Ruben Ryan King's Avatar
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    Yet ANOTHER good detailed reference from Ben Ferguson with the Arizona DeLorean Club. He wrote a very good detailed method of where to obtain and what to buy when it comes to regraining stainless on the DeLorean .

    http://www.projectvixen.com/DMCNews-.../msg64467.html

    First, I would like to apologize for not posting this a few months
    ago, after the de-paneling event at my house. I have been so busy
    that I haven't done much of anything DeLorean wise. My write-up was
    going to be much more eloquent, but time to write is rare. So here is
    the stripped-down cliff notes version of what I had originally
    planned to write. Please consider this my technical write-up for
    those who may be interested.

    "Here's what I did." - Stainless Steel Regraining, by Ben Ferguson
    (Captain Hydrogen), Arizona DeLorean Club (www.az-d.org).

    1. Learned how to regrain stainless steel under the direct
    guidance of Don Steger (www.deloreanmotorcenter.com) (about eight
    hours spread across two sessions).

    2. Got further regraining tool and technique information from
    Rob Grady (www.pjgrady.com), Stephen Wynne (www.delorean.com), and
    Chris Nicholson
    (http://www.deloreans.co.uk/gallery/m...nicholson.html
    and www.pjgrady.co.uk). Found that other types of wheels including
    the Sand-O-Flex, are "crap" when it comes to regraining the
    DeLorean's stainless steel and also to use Aluminum Oxide abrasive to
    prevent any corrosion from the abrasive material. Found that the
    optimum range for regraining is 800 - 1000 RPM, any faster will
    polish the stainless, any slower and you will grow old and die before
    you finish regraining your car.

    3. Researched original air tool used for regraining (ARO Corp.
    (an Ingersoll Rand division), Model Number: 8067-E1S, which is a
    Model: 8067-E1 that has been regeared from 4500 to 1000 RPM) and
    found that it is still available for about $950 and requires a high
    capacity air compressor to run at a consistent 1000 rpm for long
    periods of time.

    4. Spent about 30 - 45 minutes with a high-speed internet
    connection and found Grinding & Polishing Machinery Co.
    (www.gandpmachinery.com), the original manufacturer of the Vonnegut
    Wheel and found that the product is now called "Wolf Head Wheel", but
    still based on the original design patent (2,194,577 March 1940
    Vonnegut).

    5. Telephoned Grinding & Polishing Machinery Co., 2801 Tobey
    Dr., Indianapolis, Indiana, 46219, Phone: 317-898-0750 Fax: 317-899-
    1627, and asked questions and placed order with Larry Hardin
    (President).

    6. Ordered a 2" wide, 12 brush, Wolf Head Wheel with a 3/8"
    mandrel (about $155). I know the one that the original ones that a
    few lucky DeLorean owners and shops have use a 1/2" mandrel, but at
    the time of my order, I wasn't sure if the air or electric tool that
    I would end up using would have a 1/2" chuck or not, so I got a 3/8"
    mandrel to be more versatile. I also ordered two sets of 2" wide 1/8"
    cut Aluminum Oxide abrasive strip loads for the Wolf Head Wheel
    (about $12 each) because right when you run out of the first load is
    when you will need a second load. Total order was for the Vonnegut /
    Wolf Head Wheel and two loads of abrasive strips, about $179 +
    shipping.

    7. Decided to use an electric drill rather than an air tool,
    mainly because I don't have an air compressor and for the fact that
    electricity is much more widely available than compressed air if I
    were to regrain in any location. Also, a corded electric drill
    doesn't slow down if you run it for an hour at a time like a high CFM
    air tool does. I bought a RIDGID R7100 1/2 Inch Drill ($125 at Home
    Depot) (www.ridgid.com/Tools/R7100-Half-Inch-Drill). It has several
    features that I like: such as two speed ranges High 0-3,000 RPM / Low
    Speed 0-1,000 RPM (1,000 RPM is exactly what you want when regraining
    your DeLorean), Lock-on Button for continuous drilling so your
    fingers don't get tired pulling the trigger, the front handle that I
    swivel to the opposite side of the drill when regraining is very nice
    for support when regraining, and the 3,000 RPM setting is great with
    the smaller 3" diameter x 1.5" wide 60 - 80 grit flap wheels for
    getting rid of die grinder swirls from bad body filler repairs, deep
    gouges, and paint/primer removal before regraining. Also, this
    electric drill is noticeably lighter than the original air tool.

    8. Additional items to get: a small or large diameter flap wheel
    (3" - 6" diameter x 1.5" wide 60 - 80 grit about $5 at Home Depot
    example: www.abrasiveproducts.net/Kasco/flap1.htm), 3M Scotch-Brite
    7446 Blending Hand Pad (Buyer's Part Number: 7446, 3M Id: 61-5001-
    2322-1), 3M Scotch-Brite Microfiber Cloth, and Stainless Steel Polish
    (your preference).

    9. The rest of stainless steel regraining is knowledge and
    technique. Anyone can learn to do this, but there is only one Chris
    Nicholson.

    I hope the above information helps a lot of DeLorean owners.

    When visiting Arizona, contact the AZ-D for an impromptu event.

    Good Luck,
    Ben Ferguson (Captain Hydrogen)
    Arizona DeLorean Club (www.az-d.org), Car Cruise Director - VIN
    10365, CAPT H2
    American Hydrogen Association (www.clean-air.org) - Board of
    Directors, 1996 - present
    Living The Dream Since 2005 - VIN#3997

  5. #5
    Senior Member tgraham's Avatar
    Join Date:  May 2011

    Location:  Nashville, TN

    Posts:    163

    My VIN:    3281, 6344

    Just a couple of pointers (my opinions only). Some of this is repeated elsewhere, I think...

    1) It helps to keep the abrasive trimmed to extend only ~1/2" beyond the brushes. Any more than that and whatever is left just flaps around and can introduce cross scratches more frequently.

    2) The width of tool you get is personal preference. Narrower = more control around the curves, wider = less time. I've used a 2" and it's fine.

    3) I like the results of 60 grit abrasive. Just make sure it's aluminum oxide.

    4) Expect to do the whole car by hand with a pad afterwards - the Wolfhead gets the big stuff out (like scratches from previously-painted fenders) quickly, but you'll want to refine it.

    5) The tool you use is also personal preference, but it must turn at a rate of ~800-1000 RPM. The factory tool is an inline grip. I used a pistol grip simply because I found a deal that I could not refuse. You'll need a BIG compressor or else you'll have to take breaks to let the air build back up. Ideally, think about a big 80 gallon/220v one that will cost some $$$$, but will run everything you'd want it to. I've used a 30-gal and it gets annoying. This is one reason to go for an electric tool, but pneumatic will give you longer life.

    6) A little practice makes perfect. And nothing beats practicing on a panel that you don't care about before you offer a spinning sander up to a real panel.

    7) Easy does it. There's no need to jam the tool down as you're sanding - just let the brushes gently touch the surface and the tool will do the rest.

    That's all that comes to mind. Sure, it's an expensive tool for something that most people won't use too frequently. But, you'll use it more than you think (like taking the marks out from behind those awful early-style black locks - it takes about 5 seconds to get that done.)

    Good luck!
    Travis

  6. #6
    02378 Since 1981 Delorean02378's Avatar
    Join Date:  May 2011

    Location:  New Boston, MI

    Posts:    391

    My VIN:    02378 & 15500 - Previous owner of 4363, 5319, 5692, 10246, 01924, 04389, 03133, 11408, 10989

    Club(s):   (LINY-DMC) (DCUK)

    Travis I sure am glad you live 20 minutes from me. 04389 needs some regraining.


    Kirk

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    Senior Member
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  8. #8
    LS1 DMC Nicholas R's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DeloreanJoshQ View Post
    That drill should be fine. The biggest issue I had when I first bought mine was finding a drill in my house with a big enough chuck. Luckily I did have one that went up to .5"

    The shaft on the wheel is .375". That drill goes up to .5" so it should work.
    Flap Wheel.jpg

    If I recall correctly, when I bought mine a few years ago, I bought I bought it directly from wolf head, but I had to actually call them up and order it out of a catalog. I remember it being around $100.

  9. #9
    Ryan > Ruben Ryan King's Avatar
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    Can anyone produce a link to the page where you can buy the wheels for future reference?

    A link to the online catalog?

    So far I have heard about 100 dollars approximately for a wolf head wheel that will get the job done?
    Living The Dream Since 2005 - VIN#3997

  10. #10
    Senior Member
    Join Date:  May 2011

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    Post

    Quote Originally Posted by Ryan King View Post
    Can anyone produce a link to the page where you can buy the wheels for future reference?

    A link to the online catalog?

    So far I have heard about 100 dollars approximately for a wolf head wheel that will get the job done?
    http://www.gandpmachinery.com/wolfheadwheels.html

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