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Thread: Team Time Car Delorean catches fire!!

  1. #31
    Senior Member DMCVegas's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by louielouie2000 View Post
    This broaches another question, though: is engine compartment heat a culprit? I tend to think engine compartment heat in stock DeLoreans is a serious issue as-is;
    I don't believe that heat within the engine compartment is an issue at all. Traditional vehicles which have their engines mounted in the front have sealed engine compartments to prevent heat from escaping on purpose. This is of course because if you hit a puddle, you would immediately be blinded by all of the steam that would block your vision. So, it gets trapped inside. Liquid cooled Engines are cooled from the inside out, not the outside in. Many other rear and mid-engined cars exist and still do not have these concerns. That's why I'd say it's a non-issue that no one needs to worry about. Just keep your cooling system in good shape and you're fine.

    I do think that it's fair to state that belt replacement is more important on a DeLorean because of the proximity of the muffler to the belts. That is an unusual circumstance. We do have an open engine bay to help, but it's still a good idea.

    Now personally, my concern with a BTTF conversion isn't so much that all of the props on the back are trapping heat in. My concern rather is that we've got all of this additional flammable plastics in proximity to the exhaust system that pose more of a danger. Especially with this car where we have a those large exhaust tips. Those are closing the gap between the rear fascia and the hot exhaust pipes. Whose to say that the closer proximity might not have played a part in this if garbage flew up and got stuck between the pipe and the fascia and caught fire? Looking at this car, this doesn't look like an engine compartment fire. It looks like it started down by those tips.

    Are BTTF Conversion owners more neglectful of maintenance? Boy, that is going to be a can of worms to be sure. But I do think that's a very valid concern. Over the years we've all seen where someone gets excited, buys a DeLorean, and then complains because it has problems. Not because the DeLorean is a bad car, but because they bought a decades-old used car that needs work!


    Quote Originally Posted by 88KPH View Post
    The amount of heat shimmer (I've a feeling there's a word for that but it escapes me) in the rear mirror can sometimes be quite amazing.
    It's a mirage. That's where the hot air starts bending the light waves and it looks like shimmering water. The heat rising is called the Stack Effect (also know as the chimney effect). That is where heat generated by a source warms the air up, and then it rises up. As it does this it creates a air pressure differential (vacuum) where cooler air down below is forced in to take it's place. As this happens and the cool air rises, it heats up to rise on it's own and repeats the cycle. But here's the thing: As the air warms up, it actually absorbs heat from the source. That means that it is facilitating it's own cooling process. Hence with the DeLorean where the radiator is mounted remotely where the displaced heat cannot come back into contact with the engine, that means our cars actually have a cooler engine compartment. It only seems hotter because it's open. But the next time you go out on a summer day with the A/C blasting, try immediately popping your hood to lean over it and feel how hot your modern car is. That should give a good reference point.
    Robert

    People they come together, people they fall apart...

  2. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mark D View Post
    The cause of the fire was obviously from the flame trails once the car hit 88mph.
    Exactly what I was going to say. Pretty obvious what caused this.
    http://www.johnlund.com/Images/10000300089.JPG
    Go faster next time to keep the flames from catching up to you.

  3. #33
    Senior Member skill's Avatar
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    I'm a member on VW Air Cooled users group on Fb and I stumbled upon a post about a product... Not a bad investment for our DeLoreans. I'm planning on getting my VW ready for cruisin so for a 6 foot fire safety hose to help suppress the worst case scenario, $99 is peace of mind! Here's Blaze Cut! http://jogrusa.com/products/blazecut...ression-system

    VWs are too easy targets when it comes to fuel troubles..
    Last edited by skill; 02-15-2016 at 11:29 PM.
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  4. #34
    Senior Member DMCVegas's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by skill View Post
    I'm a member on VW Air Cooled users group on Fb and I stumbled upon a post about a product... Not a bad investment for our DeLoreans. I'm planning on getting my VW ready for cruisin so for a 6 foot fire safety hose to help suppress the worst case scenario, $99 is peace of mind! Here's Blaze Cut! http://jogrusa.com/products/blazecut...ression-system

    VWs are too easy targets when it comes to fuel troubles..
    But while that is quick to extinguish a small fire, what about when fuel lines continue to spray gasoline and eventually hit the manifolds that are still hot...and thus create a second fire?
    Robert

    People they come together, people they fall apart...

  5. #35
    Aussie Member Tillsy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DMCVegas View Post
    But while that is quick to extinguish a small fire, what about when fuel lines continue to spray gasoline and eventually hit the manifolds that are still hot...and thus create a second fire?
    There is always a "what if". What if I wait for the next model, the model after that, etc. what if it could automatically dial emergency services. What if it could extinguish the heat from an alien's laser beam igniting the engine bay.

    Ultimately doing something is still better than nothing. Although conceivably if you have a system that can kick in and react, then it could also cut power to the fuel pump and isolate any further fuel like the inertia switch does in a crash...
    Chris

  6. #36
    Senior Member Bitsyncmaster's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tillsy View Post
    There is always a "what if". What if I wait for the next model, the model after that, etc. what if it could automatically dial emergency services. What if it could extinguish the heat from an alien's laser beam igniting the engine bay.

    Ultimately doing something is still better than nothing. Although conceivably if you have a system that can kick in and react, then it could also cut power to the fuel pump and isolate any further fuel like the inertia switch does in a crash...
    I would assume the engine was turned off or shut off itself. That would turn off the fuel pump via the RPM relay and you should only have a few ounces of fuel under pressure by the accumulator.
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  7. #37
    Senior Member Timebender's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DMCVegas View Post
    But while that is quick to extinguish a small fire, what about when fuel lines continue to spray gasoline and eventually hit the manifolds that are still hot...and thus create a second fire?
    I actually had it happen on my 63 Deluxe, where the fan belt broke loose, and thus knocked the fuel line loose, and that caused tons of gas to pour out, OVER the manifold and out the back as I was driving, lost acceleration and could smell fuel. As soon as I pulled off the freeway I shut off the power, got out, saw gas pouring out the back, and there was no fire at all.

    Gas isn't flammable per se, but since it kept pouring out, it kept it from turning into a BBQ.

    Or I'm just super lucky.

    A lot.

  8. #38
    Senior Member Dangermouse's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by skill View Post
    I'm a member on VW Air Cooled users group on Fb and I stumbled upon a post about a product... Not a bad investment for our DeLoreans. I'm planning on getting my VW ready for cruisin so for a 6 foot fire safety hose to help suppress the worst case scenario, $99 is peace of mind! Here's Blaze Cut! http://jogrusa.com/products/blazecut...ression-system

    VWs are too easy targets when it comes to fuel troubles..
    I have used a variation of that in industrial electrical equipment and it works best in an enclosure. It is effective because when the heat has gotten high enough to melt the tubing, it has also caused an electrical short which trips the circuit. The pressurized inert gas extinguished the flame and there is no new energy source to start it again.

    The engine bay of D is just too open for it to work effectively, IMHO
    Dermot
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  9. #39
    Senior Member DMCVegas's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tillsy View Post
    There is always a "what if". What if I wait for the next model, the model after that, etc. what if it could automatically dial emergency services. What if it could extinguish the heat from an alien's laser beam igniting the engine bay.

    Ultimately doing something is still better than nothing. Although conceivably if you have a system that can kick in and react, then it could also cut power to the fuel pump and isolate any further fuel like the inertia switch does in a crash...
    I'm not going to say that being apathetic is the solution at all. What I am saying however is merely to have the right tool for the job. Which in all fairness, this may not be. Even killing the fuel is a terrible idea. I've had a blowout in my F150 where the tread slammed into the wheel well and triggered the inertia switch. Suddenly being without power in the middle of the Interstate is pretty damn terrifying in itself. I love my cars and trucks, but I can buy another. I'd rather coast safely to the side of the road and let the car burn, than get stranded in the center and get into a collision...where I am now crippled...and possibly burning to death.

    There are thousands of DeLoreans left in the world, and millions of other cars. But there is only one me. I can get another car, but not a second chance at life. And that is something that applies to all of us.


    Quote Originally Posted by Bitsyncmaster View Post
    I would assume the engine was turned off or shut off itself. That would turn off the fuel pump via the RPM relay and you should only have a few ounces of fuel under pressure by the accumulator.
    I would refer back to my previous comment about the inertia switch. But look at the vehicle we're testing this in. It's rear-engined, and in this case is also hidden well below the floor of the van. There is absolutely no way in the world that you're going to know that there was a fire that got put out, let alone if it starts up again. How many DeLorean owners who have gone through fires actually noticed smoke before odors or flames? It's a whole lot different when you've got a front-engined car where you see and smell smoke immediately.

    Again, I would refer back to having the correct tool for the job. Everyone should be driving around with an easily accessible fire extinguisher in their car. That doesn't mean the trunk, that doesn't mean the rear cubby. That means mounted on the parcel shelf, or in between your seats and the door sills. Like the time machine car we saw here, I'd be willing to bet dollars to donuts that a fire extinguisher is precisely what saved this car. Chances are that with a properly maintained vehicle, YOU might not ever need the fire extinguisher. But others may, and you can help them. Especially in a parking lot where your own car might be at risk, or someone might be trapped inside.

    I'm not going to say that this product doesn't work as advertised, but I absolutely would say that until there is testing to prove otherwise, I wouldn't trust it to be the end-all, be-all, last line of defense that is going to save your car. Because while it is helpful, I don't believe that it's going to be 100% effective. Simply put, it doesn't appear to work in the way that everyone really wants it to.



    Quote Originally Posted by Timebender View Post
    I actually had it happen on my 63 Deluxe, where the fan belt broke loose, and thus knocked the fuel line loose, and that caused tons of gas to pour out, OVER the manifold and out the back as I was driving, lost acceleration and could smell fuel. As soon as I pulled off the freeway I shut off the power, got out, saw gas pouring out the back, and there was no fire at all.

    Gas isn't flammable per se, but since it kept pouring out, it kept it from turning into a BBQ.

    Or I'm just super lucky.

    A lot.
    No, you got lucky. Gasoline is actually hellaciously flammable. It has an autoignition temperature of 530°F, whereas your manifolds right below your fuel source (injector or carb) are running at a minimum of 900°F

    https://www.conncoll.edu/media/websi..._All_Types.pdf

    There tends to be confusion about this because of the old match test in a can of gasoline that science teachers use. But that is just in terms of proving variable levels of flammability (ie a 4" cube of coal has 96in² of surface area that can catch fire. Split the cube in half parallel to an edge and you have the exact same volume of coal, but now you have an additional 28in² of exposed surface area to catch fire. Thus why coal dust is more dangerous than a nugget) in order to prove an increase danger of vapor to condensed liquid gasoline. But both are highly flammable. I don't know what happened in your case because I don't know the factors involved. But gasoline is NOT something you want to mess around with, and you were very lucky indeed.
    Robert

    People they come together, people they fall apart...

  10. #40
    Senior Member skill's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DMCVegas View Post
    I'm not going to say that being apathetic is the solution at all. What I am saying however is merely to have the right tool for the job. Which in all fairness, this may not be. Even killing the fuel is a terrible idea. I've had a blowout in my F150 where the tread slammed into the wheel well and triggered the inertia switch. Suddenly being without power in the middle of the Interstate is pretty damn terrifying in itself. I love my cars and trucks, but I can buy another. I'd rather coast safely to the side of the road and let the car burn, than get stranded in the center and get into a collision...where I am now crippled...and possibly burning to death.

    There are thousands of DeLoreans left in the world, and millions of other cars. But there is only one me. I can get another car, but not a second chance at life. And that is something that applies to all of us.




    I would refer back to my previous comment about the inertia switch. But look at the vehicle we're testing this in. It's rear-engined, and in this case is also hidden well below the floor of the van. There is absolutely no way in the world that you're going to know that there was a fire that got put out, let alone if it starts up again. How many DeLorean owners who have gone through fires actually noticed smoke before odors or flames? It's a whole lot different when you've got a front-engined car where you see and smell smoke immediately.

    Again, I would refer back to having the correct tool for the job. Everyone should be driving around with an easily accessible fire extinguisher in their car. That doesn't mean the trunk, that doesn't mean the rear cubby. That means mounted on the parcel shelf, or in between your seats and the door sills. Like the time machine car we saw here, I'd be willing to bet dollars to donuts that a fire extinguisher is precisely what saved this car. Chances are that with a properly maintained vehicle, YOU might not ever need the fire extinguisher. But others may, and you can help them. Especially in a parking lot where your own car might be at risk, or someone might be trapped inside.

    I'm not going to say that this product doesn't work as advertised, but I absolutely would say that until there is testing to prove otherwise, I wouldn't trust it to be the end-all, be-all, last line of defense that is going to save your car. Because while it is helpful, I don't believe that it's going to be 100% effective. Simply put, it doesn't appear to work in the way that everyone really wants it to.





    No, you got lucky. Gasoline is actually hellaciously flammable. It has an autoignition temperature of 530°F, whereas your manifolds right below your fuel source (injector or carb) are running at a minimum of 900°F

    https://www.conncoll.edu/media/websi..._All_Types.pdf

    There tends to be confusion about this because of the old match test in a can of gasoline that science teachers use. But that is just in terms of proving variable levels of flammability (ie a 4" cube of coal has 96in² of surface area that can catch fire. Split the cube in half parallel to an edge and you have the exact same volume of coal, but now you have an additional 28in² of exposed surface area to catch fire. Thus why coal dust is more dangerous than a nugget) in order to prove an increase danger of vapor to condensed liquid gasoline. But both are highly flammable. I don't know what happened in your case because I don't know the factors involved. But gasoline is NOT something you want to mess around with, and you were very lucky indeed.
    I agree with you Robert on many of the points you've made. Absolutely, the right tool for the job always because bottom line it's what gets the job done right. In this case put out a fire! Owner's, I do think a 35 year old car comes with a liability. Some sooner than most. I know this might sound way out and far fetched... yet, redundant in many ways. I'm really happy with with the DeLorean and are humble about having one. When I open my garage it's a slap in the face reminder damn, I own a dream. Simply said, as a former IT guy, redundancy is good. Backing up files on multiple drives is right (i.e., RAID array). In this case, ways to avoid a catastrophic event occur to your Dream, redundancy is okay to save it before you wake up.

    Here's my 2 cents.

    An extinguisher on the shelf that is accessible as mentioned by Robert.
    A fuel shut off valve somewhere before the pump and fuel sent to the injectors. Kill the fuel feed line!
    A kill switch at battery (of course shut off your car).
    and as back up BlazeCut or whatever similar product both over the engine bay and over the battery.
    A live feed camera over your engine bay (a screen on your dash baby!) - real-time video! You can have this installed in your pride of joy for peanut$! How could you not now?



    P.S. Don't call your insurance guy, for what? We don't need any more salvaged titles. Value is in clear titled DeLoreans. Save the Dream.
    Last edited by skill; 02-16-2016 at 07:07 PM.
    ¬°¬°¬°¬°¬°¬°¬°¬°¬°¬°¬°¬°¬°¬°¬°¬°¬°¬°¬°¬°¬°¬°¬°¬
    2014 La Jolla Concours D'Elegance Volunteer
    1998 Online Gamer; Everquest, AOE, R6, WOW, SOF
    1981 DeLorean, Grey, Automatic, Flap, 12k preserved miles
    1960 Volkswagen Beetle
    1961 Cadillac Coupe DeVille - *Restoration in Progress*

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