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Thread: The Dummy's Guide to Robertson Carbing

  1. #21
    Member
    Join Date:  Aug 2015

    Posts:    41

    Any update?

  2. #22
    Senior Member DMCVegas's Avatar
    Join Date:  Oct 2011

    Location:  Las Vegas

    Posts:    2,404

    My VIN:    6585

    Club(s):   (DOA) (DCUK)

    Give Dave a call. I've heard a rumor that he's manufacturing his own manifolds in preparation for a DIY kit.

    http://www.bauerleautomotive.com/
    Robert

    Board Member, DeLorean Owners Association



    Recording Secretary

  3. #23
    Member
    Join Date:  May 2015

    Posts:    79

    My VIN:    2784

    Club(s):   (DMA)

    Day 3

    Okay ... sorry its been a really long time since I updated this. I had a bunch of other calamities come up that I had to deal with :) Now I'm back on this project.

    Today, I worked on setting up the fuel pump. All my parts came in, and this seems like the easiest thing I can do right now. My Delorean is currently in a spot where I can't jack it up right now, maybe this weekend I will get to move it so I can finish the water pump.

    I had a baffleless fuel pump from Special-T, so I lacked the original boot and whatnot. I ordered new parts from DMCH. Here's links to the parts in case you need them yourself:

    The boot:
    http://store.delorean.com/p-6555-fue...ring-boot.aspx

    And, if you want to do the same as I did, the boot cap:
    http://store.delorean.com/p-9083-fue...over-seal.aspx

    I chose to get the boot cap to keep water out -- you could also do Bill's suggestion of using a raincoat sleeve. I will probably do both in the end, just to make it super tidy and dry.

    Finally, if you're lazy and don't want to find a cheaper source, the clamp:
    http://store.delorean.com/p-6553-hose-clip.aspx

    So, the barbed bolt you get that comes in the baggie with the fuel stuff goes in the side hole in the boot. Since my boot was new, I needed to stretch that hole a bit -- I stuck some needle-nose in and opened them, working the rubber in different directions til it was loose enough to put the tip of the bolt in, then I put a little oil in so that I could work the bolt in. Holding the bolt with the needle-nose and sort of twisting it while pushing it in worked well for me.

    I put a little oil on the bottom half of the boot and spread it around because I figured I'd have the same problem getting the pump in. I thread the 14-foot 1/4" fuel line through one of the ports on the boot-cap and then I thread it through the boot as well. I attached the fuel line to the barbed connector at one end of the pump, and used one of the fuel line clamps provided in Bill's kit to secure it.

    Finally, I shoved the pump into the boot and got it seated flush with where the pump body widens out. Here's pictures of what it looked like.

    20161103_194322.jpg
    20161103_194329.jpg
    20161103_194329.jpg
    20161103_194338.jpg

    The lip of the boot has 2 notches in it; you can use those 2 notches to route the wire. Or if you prefer, you can route the wire through the second hole in the boot lid. I'm going to use a spare bolt to plug the second hole of my boot lid -- be sure to do that!

    Wiggle the lid back into place, being careful not to push the pump out of the boot while you're doing it. When you're done, it should look like this.

    20161103_195721.jpg
    20161103_195728.jpg

    I haven't plugged the second hole yet in that picture -- I think one of the larger banjo bolts should fit in the hole. So long as its a tight fit, it should be fine.

    Next -- pull the old fuel pump, and put the new one in. I ran short on time tonight so I stopped here for now. Next installment coming soon!

  4. #24
    Member
    Join Date:  May 2015

    Posts:    79

    My VIN:    2784

    Club(s):   (DMA)

    Day 4

    So today I put in the new fuel pump. I'll admit, I've been slacking on this one -- I hate dealing with the fuel tank. Its always going to be messy. This time around, I managed to minimize mess just by being very careful.

    I apologize in advance -- I didn't take many pictures. I'm doing this myself and I didn't really want to get gas on my camera.

    So, I opened up the hood and removed the plate over the fuel pump. Then I climbed into the trunk, which I find is usually the easiest way to work on this stuff. I undid the clamp around the base of the old pump first, and removed it to get it out of the way. I also disconnected the electrical wires.

    I've got some disposable black trays 'left over' from Chinese takeout, and I took one of those and held it under the 2 existing fuel lines in roughly the middle of them. Then I cut them both with wire cutters. You could choose a less destructive method if you wanted, but my priority was to minimize mess and I didn't care about keeping the old fuel lines.

    I let them drain for a bit into the take out tray which was the perfect size to fit. In my case, there wasn't really a lot of gas. There's still going to be spillage no matter what you do, so if you want, pack the area with paper towels. Either that, or be prepared to clean up afterwards.

    I had a thick contractor bag ready to receive the old parts, so I pulled the old pump out and bagged it. I had Special-T's baffleless pump, so I did not have a baffle to contend with. I went ahead and removed the other half of the fuel lines that were connected to the barbed fuel connectors for the K-Jet fuel system. More gas leaked when I took those lines off, but not much. I capped the barbed connectors with some caps I got from Home Depot.

    20161105_211944.jpg

    These caps actually fit perfectly on the barbed connectors. You can get them from the section where they sell wire in-closet shelving systems and they're meant to cap the ends of those wire shelving units.

    With that taken care of, it was time to put the new pump in. Bill provides what's essentially a baffle, but it's the bottom of a tin can with holes drilled in it. I put mine in the gas tank hole and ...... it wouldn't go in. It fit perfectly in the hole, and got stuck. I couldn't tap it in or anything. Looking closer, I saw there was a lip on the edge of the can and that lip was catching the gas tank opening. I wound up squeezing the can so it took on more of an oval shape, pushing it into the tank, and bending it back into a circle once it was inside.

    My tank only had a couple gallons of gas in it, so I was lucky and didn't have to go swimming much to put this on. There's a hole in the bottom of the can, and it fits on the baffle bolt that's in the gas tank. The baffle bolt is straight down from the engine-side of the access opening (The "Top" of it, if you're sitting in the trunk facing the windshield like I was). Use the washer and bolt provided by Bill to fix the can to the bottom of the tank, being careful to keep the can from twisting around. You want the can to be basically aligned with the tank's access hole when you are done.

    I'd already prepped my pump and boot. I added a stainless steel clamp to the bottom of my boot to make sure it stayed secure on the pump -- I don't really want to mess around with this leaking or otherwise failing and hope this is the last time I'll be in my gas tank for the foreseeable future. So I slid the pump/boot into place, and made sure the lip of the gas tank was secure under the rubber lip of the boot.

    I then used a clamp to hold the whole mess in place, and in the end, it looked like this.

    20161105_211934.jpg

    I need to route the fuel line and do the wiring still, but the messy / dreadful part is done. I spent the rest of my time cleaning up the old pump mess and tending to some minor gas spills that are pretty much inevitable with this sort of work. However, this went a lot cleaner than the last time I had my gas tank open -- doing the extra prep work and anticipating where things are going to drip / drain / leak is critical.

    See you next time!

  5. #25
    Member
    Join Date:  May 2015

    Posts:    79

    My VIN:    2784

    Club(s):   (DMA)

    Day 5

    Okay, so I didn't get to do much because there's stuff in the way and I can't jack the car up right yet. I SHOULD be able to jack it up tomorrow Fingers crossed.

    I went ahead and got rid of the charcoal canister and related hoses. There's a vent pipe that goes from the gas tank to the charcoal canister. Here's a picture; it's on the drivers side, forward corner. It's got a pipe that goes from here to the driver's side pontoon (or at least I think that's what you call the fiberglass body on the side of the engine compartment over the wheel!)

    20161111_183712.jpg

    I had great difficulty taking the pipe off; with some careful cutting I was able to loosen it up enough to pull it off. I found it interesting that the tube wasn't barbed like the fuel lines; it just has a lip, as you can see here.

    20161111_190455.jpg

    I used one of my shelving caps to cover up the tube. It didn't really want to go on there; I think this pipe has a larger diameter than the fuel lines. But with some twisting and coaxing, I got it on there.

    20161111_190752.jpg

    Finally, I unbolted the plate that holds in the charcoal canister. It took some maneuvering to get it out of the pontoon, as the canister is quite large. Three rubber tubes go to it; the line from the fuel, and 2 others I already disconnected in the course of the carb conversion. Mine was filthy after 30 years in the pontoon; I also had several nests of various wasps (mud wasps and paper wasps have at different times lived in there). If you're doing this in summer, be careful about that :P

    20161111_183645.jpg
    20161111_183746.jpg

    I cut the rubber tubes to make it easier to liberate the plate, and added the plate and mounting bracket for the canister to my pile of K-Jet parts I don't need. The tubing and canister are going in the trash.

    I also went through and fixed my "fuel injectors", getting them properly clipped in. And now I've done everything I can do without jacking up the car :P

  6. #26
    Member
    Join Date:  May 2015

    Posts:    79

    My VIN:    2784

    Club(s):   (DMA)

    Day 6

    So I cleared out the area around the D well enough that I could jack it up, and I started working on the water pump. My apologies for no pictures; this was all messy work and honestly its stuff you can find elsewhere. I'll start documenting with pictures again when I get to the interesting parts.

    I drained the oil which went easy enough, and took off the oil filter. Then I had a conundrum; how to drain the engine block coolant without making a huge mess. I decided to start with the passenger side because that seemed easier.

    If you're on your back, with your head pointed towards the passenger rear wheel, looking up, you'll see the hole where the oil filter was. Up and to the left (further "aft" on the engine) you'll see one of those funny square bolts. Its the same as the oil and transmission pan plugs. I figured I'd try to be smart and hold a funnel to catch as much of the coolant as possible. I put down a drip tray and I had a huge oil pan that was clean and who's purpose is for this kind of thing as opposed to engine oil.

    The bolt came off pretty easy -- some people report its stuck, some people report it as fused in place. Mine came off with just a little bit of extra muscle, and after that initial push it was easy to remove by hand. I had my funnel ready and I unbolted the thing ...

    And it was a TORRENT of fluid! I mean it was a waterfall of fetid coolant-water pouring down. My funnel was woefully inadequate, and while it did direct some of it, I was expecting like ... the oil pan level of liquid. No, this was a crazy rush of liquid. It got all over me, all over the floor, all over pretty much everything. To my credit, the majority of the fluid wound up in the pan and the pan was large enough to take it all. BUT ... it still splattered everywhere and it drenched me pretty good, too.

    I think the funnel idea had merit and it actually did work to some degree, but I needed a funnel with a wider mouth. I used the more delicate funnel that I use to fill the transmission, rather than a srs bidnis high flow funnel. Also, goggles and a mask for the mouth would be a good idea. I wear glasses so I managed to avoid direct eye contact, but it did get on my face and was pretty nasty.

    The cleanup took the rest of my available time for the night. I have no idea how I'm going to do the driver's side; I can reach the bolt, but I don't know how I'll direct and contain the fluid. I'll ask in the more busy thread how others have done it

  7. #27
    Member
    Join Date:  May 2015

    Posts:    79

    My VIN:    2784

    Club(s):   (DMA)

    Day 6

    So last night I went through and finished disassembling the engine portion of the water pump / cooling system.

    I asked around and got some advise as to how to open up the driver's side engine block coolant drain without making a mess and got some tips.

    Really, what I probably should have done is open the cooling system from the pipes under the car and drained it in the middle before draining the block. But, it's too late to lament that -- what I wound up doing was taking one of the large ziplock-style bags that Bill used to bag part of the carb kit, and I cut the bottom of it. I made a plastic sleeve/channel that I held up to the drain plug as I was undoing it. I got most of the coolant down the sleeve (and my plug wasn't at all seized up, thankfully!) and into a bucket I had under the car.

    There was a LOT less coolant this time, so I'm thankful for that.

    The next step is to remove all the coolant pipes coming out of the water pump. I had found that the previous owner had replaced all the "easy to reach" tubing -- the main tubes that go to/from the radiator and the passenger side tube that connects the pump to the block were all relatively new, as I could tell because the rubber still felt good and the pipe clamps were all brand-new looking stainless steel.

    All the "hard to reach" tubes were original; the short driver side tube that goes from the water pump to the block, and the two rubber tubes that connect to the pipes in the valley, were all original. The clamps on these were clearly ancient and quite cruddy, and the tube material was incredibly brittle and was crumbling even as I was pulling them off. I was able to easily push my screwdriver through the tubing with practically no resistance, then twist the screw driver to pull the tubes off.

    I took a lot of pictures but most of them were for me to remember how things go back together. Not many are very interesting, but here's one of the old tubing and what it looked like after I pulled it off the water pump (at the top of the pic).

    20161116_192849.jpg

    Compare to new tubing on the passenger side....

    20161116_192855.jpg

    The 'Y' pipe and the heater pipe you can see here:

    20161116_195540.jpg

    Again, you can see the old style pipe connector there at the bottom. Anyway, the 4 bolts that hold the 'Y' pipe in are notoriously bad about breaking off. I'm overly pleased with myself because I managed to get mine out without breaking them -- I got my socket secure on the bolt, then hit the socket with a rubber mallet to loosen them. Getting the angle right to do this was really tricky, but it paid off. Credit goes to Bill for teaching me that technique.

    Those three rubber tubes are vacuum hoses. Two of them went to something I removed earlier -- part of the manifold, I think -- and the third went to a little junction. I took a lot of bad, blurry photos but this photo shows (kinda) the one vacuum line that was still attached to something.

    20161116_200522.jpg

    The hose easily came off at the black piece end (the hoses would NOT come off the Y-pipe end easily), and my Y-pipe was in reasonably good condition otherwise.

    My heater pipe, however, was trashed. As I was pulling it out, rusty gross water was coming out of it. I'm pretty sure that was the source of my coolant leaks in the Valley. I have a new stainless one from Special-T that I will replace it with, so I added that to my metal scrap pile.

    After all that, my water pump was ready to go. The thermostat on top of it unbolts with 2 little bolts. I think I need the thermostat and the back plate for my new kit, so I went ahead and took them off. I'll clean them tonight. The water pump comes off with 3 bolts you can get off with a Metric 13 wrench. I used the wrench-and-mallet technique for all 3 bolts to make sure they came off clean. The bolts are to the left and right of the pump, and then there's a third a few inches under the belt pulley.

    There's a lot of other bolts that "look like" they belong to the pump, but do not - the pump has exactly 3. If you have to pull out your metric 11 wrench, you're doing it wrong. I accidentally unbolted this guy before I realized it wasn't holding on the pump -- I put it back on, and torqued it to 11 ft/lbs which I think is the right torque. I'm awful tempted to make a map of every bolt on the engine and what its torque value is cause the delorean service manual can be a little haphazard with the info :P

    Here's a picture with the bolt circled that I took off by accident. if anyone knows the proper torque on this guy, let me know, it's the bolt RIGHT next to the water pump bolt.

    20161116_211204.jpg

    And then I was done for the night -- my valley is completely exposed! I did some cleanup. Tonight, I'm going to really scrub the crap out of my valley (literally!) and then if I have time I'll work on flushing the rest of the coolant system.

    20161116_205459.jpg

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