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Thread: No spark

  1. #81
    Senior Member Bullitt's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ron View Post
    To be sure- Most schematics show a W/Y wire (feed) and a Y wire (condenser). Others show a W (feed) and a Y (condenser) wire, which I have seen on a couple of cars.
    Assuming you meant the "W/Y and Y wire", it is acting exactly as it should so far...

    It sounds like you were triggering it from the wrong side again- Instead of "+ connected (w/y and w wire) while grounding - side...", it should be, the ground connected while connecting-disconnecting (w/y wire) + side.

    Remember, when you connect a coil's (+) and (-), it charges up. When you disconnect it, by removing the (+) OR (-), is when it fires, to the nearest ground it can reach. Normally this "triggering" is done on the (-) side. It will fire ONCE only, each time the circuit is broke (normally triggered via the ICU).

    If I follow you correctly- When you removed the ground from the (-) side, breaking the feed circuit, you removed the only ground that the spark could reach! (Now, if you had a wire in the main terminal close enough to another ground source (block, cap, etc) instead, it should have sparked to it. But that is not the test...)

    Follow the test in the last post closely. Ground the (-) side (not with the W/S wire) THEN connect the W/Y wire to (+) side THEN disconnect (or switch off) the W/Y wire looking for spark from the main terminal to (-) or ground .
    [IF everything is correct, this is the similar to removing the spade connector feeding the resistors and why it gave the big blue spark from the main terminal, as it should...but also not the test.]

    I agree with Dave about the hot resistors and sparks in the vid. But you would have the cart before the horse using using the W/S wire at this point...

    PM sent
    Hehe!

    Okay! I guess it works fine then, but will do as you say after work today and test with a switch on + side with - grounded.
    Electrical is not my strong side. I am an autobody guy.......
    Svein Apeland

    1981 DMC DeLorean DMC-12, VIN: 01598. Gas flap hood, manual transmission, black interior, wide stripe, galvanized frame, Spax and UK club exhaust.
    x1979 Pontiac Firebird Trans Am
    x1975 Chevrolet El Camino
    x1974 Plymouth Satellite Sebring
    x1966 Lincoln Continental
    x1983 Porsche 944
    x1982 Porsche 944

  2. #82
    Senior Member Bullitt's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ron View Post
    Either coil should spark according to those readings....try the test I posted above to confirm if the below doesn't help.

    If the battery will crank the engine over ok by itself, it is hot enough for spark.

    Sparking only when you shut the ignition off suggests that the coils trigger circuit is always grounded. (It would fire whichever plug the rotor happened to be pointed at when the key was turned to OFF.) But if that were the case, the ignition tester (and tach) shouldn't be indicating continuous spark while you crank it over.
    So, the only thing I can think of that may fit is a cap with its coil terminal shorted to the plug terminal feeding the only plug you are seeing fire...

    =====

    No. The ignition doesn't need the RPM relay.
    If there are no shorted wires etc. between them it doesn't matter WRT no spark. The relay uses the tach signal to know it is ok to supply power to the fuel pump and CPR.

    P.S. Your Facebook links require an account....
    Hi!
    Just read this again:

    Sparking only when you shut the ignition off suggests that the coils trigger circuit is always grounded. (It would fire whichever plug the rotor happened to be pointed at when the key was turned to OFF.) But if that were the case, the ignition tester (and tach) shouldn't be indicating continuous spark while you crank it over.
    So, the only thing I can think of that may fit is a cap with its coil terminal shorted to the plug terminal feeding the only plug you are seeing fire...

    I am not sure I follow: "a cap with its coil terminal shorted to the plug terminal"
    How would this be possible?
    Svein Apeland

    1981 DMC DeLorean DMC-12, VIN: 01598. Gas flap hood, manual transmission, black interior, wide stripe, galvanized frame, Spax and UK club exhaust.
    x1979 Pontiac Firebird Trans Am
    x1975 Chevrolet El Camino
    x1974 Plymouth Satellite Sebring
    x1966 Lincoln Continental
    x1983 Porsche 944
    x1982 Porsche 944

  3. #83
    Administrator Ron's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bullitt View Post
    Hehe!

    Okay! I guess it works fine then, but will do as you say after work today and test with a switch on + side with - grounded.
    Electrical is not my strong side. I am an autobody guy.......
    Yes, double check on + side!
    LOL- I can guarantee you that my bodywork skills are worse than your electrical skills. I can shoot one but when it comes to the last bit of prep resurfacing, I totally suck...too low/high>over correct>too high/low>get POed>take a break>repeat>>>call my painter and contribute to his retirement fund.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bullitt View Post
    I am not sure I follow: "a cap with its coil terminal shorted to the plug terminal"
    How would this be possible?
    The most likely way would be a carbon trace in the cap.

    When the spark jumps from the rotor to the plug wire terminals inside the cap, carbon particles are created. Cracks in the cap help the particles collect/build up, offering an alternate path for the spark to follow. (Moisture or any other foreign material can help carbon collect...or offer alternate paths themselves.) If the path goes to the wrong plug terminal, you get a crossfire. You may not be able to see the cracks or traces.
    [If the rotor has carbon buildup, it can go to the shaft (ground) and you get a misfire. If there is carbon or moisture etc. throughout the cap, the spark will follow the path offering the least resistance, which would be along the shortest plug wire (assuming the wires are of the same material, plug gaps are the same, etc....)]

    EXAMPLES


    The new cap and rotor should eliminate all of this, if the distributor is clean.

  4. #84
    Senior Member Bullitt's Avatar
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    https://youtu.be/jdwpAG6AB18

    Watch video.

    I have everything connected as usual, but with a switch on +side of coil and a plugwire from coil with a plug to ground.
    Then all is good? Or is it too weak spark?
    Last edited by Bullitt; 03-07-2018 at 01:33 PM.
    Svein Apeland

    1981 DMC DeLorean DMC-12, VIN: 01598. Gas flap hood, manual transmission, black interior, wide stripe, galvanized frame, Spax and UK club exhaust.
    x1979 Pontiac Firebird Trans Am
    x1975 Chevrolet El Camino
    x1974 Plymouth Satellite Sebring
    x1966 Lincoln Continental
    x1983 Porsche 944
    x1982 Porsche 944

  5. #85
    Senior Member Bullitt's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bullitt View Post
    https://youtu.be/jdwpAG6AB18

    Watch video.

    I have everything connected as usual, but with a switch on +side of coil and a plugwire from coil with a plug to ground.
    Then all is good? Or is it too weak spark?
    With everything connected and checking for sparl on cylinder 3. Only sparks when I turn of ignition.

    https://youtu.be/mxRb8VGTPuU
    Svein Apeland

    1981 DMC DeLorean DMC-12, VIN: 01598. Gas flap hood, manual transmission, black interior, wide stripe, galvanized frame, Spax and UK club exhaust.
    x1979 Pontiac Firebird Trans Am
    x1975 Chevrolet El Camino
    x1974 Plymouth Satellite Sebring
    x1966 Lincoln Continental
    x1983 Porsche 944
    x1982 Porsche 944

  6. #86
    Senior Member Bullitt's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bullitt View Post
    https://youtu.be/jdwpAG6AB18

    Watch video.

    I have everything connected as usual, but with a switch on +side of coil and a plugwire from coil with a plug to ground.
    Then all is good? Or is it too weak spark?
    When putting the switch on the - side to trigger it, there is no spark on plug...
    Svein Apeland

    1981 DMC DeLorean DMC-12, VIN: 01598. Gas flap hood, manual transmission, black interior, wide stripe, galvanized frame, Spax and UK club exhaust.
    x1979 Pontiac Firebird Trans Am
    x1975 Chevrolet El Camino
    x1974 Plymouth Satellite Sebring
    x1966 Lincoln Continental
    x1983 Porsche 944
    x1982 Porsche 944

  7. #87
    Senior Member Bullitt's Avatar
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    With everything connected, I put an extra wire from pin 16 on ecu (w/s) and up to minus side on coil. Did not help..
    Svein Apeland

    1981 DMC DeLorean DMC-12, VIN: 01598. Gas flap hood, manual transmission, black interior, wide stripe, galvanized frame, Spax and UK club exhaust.
    x1979 Pontiac Firebird Trans Am
    x1975 Chevrolet El Camino
    x1974 Plymouth Satellite Sebring
    x1966 Lincoln Continental
    x1983 Porsche 944
    x1982 Porsche 944

  8. #88
    Senior Member Bullitt's Avatar
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    Okay guys! I got the car started!!

    I put on the old coil and it fired right up!

    So... The main problem was the distributor cap and rotor.
    Why my new coil does not work I have no clue...
    Can I have fried it somehow?

    And by the way, thanks for all your help!!
    Svein Apeland

    1981 DMC DeLorean DMC-12, VIN: 01598. Gas flap hood, manual transmission, black interior, wide stripe, galvanized frame, Spax and UK club exhaust.
    x1979 Pontiac Firebird Trans Am
    x1975 Chevrolet El Camino
    x1974 Plymouth Satellite Sebring
    x1966 Lincoln Continental
    x1983 Porsche 944
    x1982 Porsche 944

  9. #89
    Senior Member Bitsyncmaster's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bullitt View Post
    Okay guys! I got the car started!!

    I put on the old coil and it fired right up!

    So... The main problem was the distributor cap and rotor.
    Why my new coil does not work I have no clue...
    Can I have fried it somehow?

    And by the way, thanks for all your help!!
    Yea......

    Is your new coil the same as OEM? I would not think you could have damaged the coil.
    Dave M vin 03572
    http://dm-eng.weebly.com/

  10. #90
    Senior Member Bullitt's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bitsyncmaster View Post
    Yea......

    Is your new coil the same as OEM? I would not think you could have damaged the coil.
    The new coil that does not work is the Chrome Bosch unit that Deloreango sells. My old working one is a black one. (Bosch i guess)
    Svein Apeland

    1981 DMC DeLorean DMC-12, VIN: 01598. Gas flap hood, manual transmission, black interior, wide stripe, galvanized frame, Spax and UK club exhaust.
    x1979 Pontiac Firebird Trans Am
    x1975 Chevrolet El Camino
    x1974 Plymouth Satellite Sebring
    x1966 Lincoln Continental
    x1983 Porsche 944
    x1982 Porsche 944

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