Running a DeLorean on Ford Ignition

[DCUK Martin]

Well done, Bill, you've "fixed" it be replacing everything. There's nothing like the brute force approach to problem solving

FWIW I've been fitting NGK plugs for some time now. I found the generic Bosch HT leads to be a bit "cheap".

[ramblinmike]

Bosch, obviously.

Uh-oh. Flame on!

On a serious note, I remember reading somewhere that increasing spark plug gap can cause spark arcing in the distributor cap. That is why later HEI distributors used larger caps when used with larger plug gaps. I'm wondering if the original plug gap had more to do with the need for the small space between contacts on the odd-fire distributor cap than any deficiencies with the Bosch ignition.

[content22207]

Well done, Bill, you've "fixed" it be replacing everything.

No, we fixed it first by replacing the module. Anyone who says Bosch ignition modules never go bad is delusional at best (why should Bosch be different from any other manufacturer's ignition modules, which do fail from time to time...). The difference now is Byrne has an adapter that will allow him to replace his Duraspark module with another one free of charge at any Autozone nationwide. Duraspark modules are stock items at all parts houses. Bosch ignition modules are not.

The remainder of his ignition upgrade was simply done to bring his DeLorean up to 21st century standards.

It never ceases to amaze me that the same people who champion upgrading DeLorean fuel delivery to later standards (EFI) persist hiding their heads in the sand about ignition.

DeLorean ignition was outdated when new. We looked up the plug gaps on various 1981 Ford products -- .05". Since Byrne is now running Ford plugs and a Ford ignition module, and real wire spark plug wires and a high winding coil, why shouldn't he run a Ford plug gap?

Bill Robertson
#5939

[content22207]

On a serious note, I remember reading somewhere that increasing spark plug gap can cause spark arcing in the distributor cap. That is why later HEI distributors used larger caps when used with larger plug gaps.

Nonsense. In Ford's case at least, taller distributor caps are an illusion -- the cap itself is the same height -- there's an adapter ring between it and the distributor body to house the magnetic pickup. Diameter of course was unchanged (a 1969 breaker point cap is the same diameter as a 1979 breakerless cap for the same engine).

GM HEI caps look so tall because they also house the ignition module and a capacitive coil.

Bill Robertson
#5939

[content22207]

So do you know what was the faulty component?

Engine started when we plugged in the Duraspark module. Engine did not start when then plugged the Bosch module back in. Since simply swapping out the module fixed his no start problem (timing light did not flash on the distributor lead wire with the Bosch module either), we surmised that the module was bad.

Why are people so convinced that Bosch ignition modules never fail? That is ignorant at best. What makes the ignition module any different from other Bosch components that fail? What makes the ignition module any different from other manufacturer's ignition modules that fail? What makes the ignition module any different from any other electronic device that fails (television, computer, DVD player, etc)?

I think you all are just pissed off because Byrne told European engineering to jump off a cliff and went American instead (his Pertronix coil and MSD plug wires are both Made in USA, BTW).

I have the Byrne's old module. I am going to cut off it's edge connector to make my own Bosch to Duraspark adapter. You are more than welcome to autopsy the rest of it if you want.

Duraspark modules only cost $25-$28, are stock items at all parts houses, and come with lifetime warranties if necessary -- I see no reason to mess with Byne's old module any further than to cut off the one component that does have utility for me.

Bill Robertson
#5939

[DCUK Martin]

Bill, will you ever "get it"?

Anyone who says Bosch ignition modules never go bad is delusional at best (why should Bosch be different from any other manufacturer's ignition modules, which do fail from time to time...).

I don't think anyone ever said "they never fail". I've supplied a DeLorean module for use in a GTA because theirs live in the engine compartment and get much hotter. The fact remains it's a very rare failure.

The difference now is Byrne has an adapter that will allow him to replace his Duraspark module with another one free of charge at any Autozone nationwide. Duraspark modules are stock items at all parts houses. Bosch ignition modules are not.

Given he is in the n'th fraction of a percent of owners whose ignition module has failed, it's a very, very slight selling point (and you were offered a working spare direct-swap Bosch unit...)

The remainder of his ignition upgrade was simply done to bring his DeLorean up to 21st century standards.

It never ceases to amaze me that the same people who champion upgrading DeLorean fuel delivery to later standards (EFI) persist hiding their heads in the sand about ignition.

So you upgraded him to coil-on-plug and fully mapped ignition did you? No, you fitted equally old technology and changed things based on your own erroneous beliefs about plug gaps.

DeLorean ignition was outdated when new. We looked up the plug gaps on various 1981 Ford products -- .05".

PLEASE, explain to everyone why a plug gap has anything at all to do with the "age" of the technology?

[DCUK Martin]

I think you all are just pissed off because Byrne told European engineering to jump off a cliff and went American instead (his Pertronix coil and MSD plug wires are both Made in USA, BTW).

Speaking for myself, it's your "selling" of this as a "better" solution. I'm sure you'll continue to crow about it and rabbit on about plug gaps whatever is said here but let's get it on the record: The stock ignition system, when working properly is very reliable and powerful enough to light up the spark on my turbo engines running over 14psi of boost (using NGK BP7EFVS turbo plugs).

[content22207]

... your own erroneous beliefs about plug gaps.

SAE_1.jpg SAE_2.jpg SAE_3.jpg SAE_4.jpg SAE_5.jpg SAE_6.jpg SAE_7.jpg SAE_8.jpg SAE_9.jpg SAE_10.jpg SAE_11.jpg SAE_12.jpg SAE_13.jpg SAE_14.jpg SAE_15.jpg SAE_16.jpg SAE_17.jpg SAE_18.jpg SAE_19.jpg

Bill Robertson
#5939

[content22207]

Speaking for myself....

Speaking for myself, the stock ignition system is crap.

In my opinion.

Bill Robertson
#5939

[content22207]

Just so there is no confusion: only putting a high winding coil on a DeLorean alone may not be sufficient to jump a .05" plug gap. Ford ran 10.5 volts into its inductive coils. Secondary voltage is of course a multiple of primary voltage -- more primary voltage produces more secondary voltage. A stock DeLorean resistor grid only produces 6-8 volts into the coil, IIRC. I have wired mine in parallel, which produces 12.5 volts when the alternator is charging:
IgnitionCircuit.jpg

BTW: did anyone notice that SAE paper found increased combustion efficiency from increased secondary voltage (Pages 6-7) as well as increased plug gap?

Bill Robertson
#5939