Engine Dilemma

[LEVY]

I know or a guy in Amarillo, TX who used to have a junk yard. He have many engines inside a barn, one of those is a volvo engine, been there for many years, I assume is a good engine, he is asking $500.00 I believe.

That is an option.


LEVY

[elfking]

If I was in your position id see if I can source a used one (cheap) Volvo / something close .. or maybe a 3.0 Eagle Premiere motor but if that can't be had for cheap.. which from a bit of what I have read you can swap some 3.0 parts with the D's engine. Maybe it was you could take the intake manifold and a few other items from your current engine and swap it over to use it somewhat as a donor engine? --Still retaining the K-Jet... Don't quote me on that I have only dabbled in it a bit myself while browsing around...

When I blow mine up I am very likely hunting out something with EFI and maybe some boost. I certainly wont be buying a replacement engine for that price!

Of course engine swaps are ALOT of labor in any car. Nick has put a bunch of work into his (and it shows). I have done a few myself (not into a D) and lots of unexpected things if its not a common swap that is done. So brace yourself for alot of downtime doing a swap.

Good Luck!

[Morpheus]

Man I feel for you. Sounds like you're at a crossroads here. I can see why you'd want to evaluate and exhaust all paths before making a decision.

I'd probably throw in looking for a donor car w/ a known good drivetrain. I'd think you could get one for less than $9k and make a little on the side over time parting it back out... at least the stuff you don't need.

Out of curiosity, what lead to the engine issues that you're currently facing? Did you have an overheating issue or was it simply due to age and miles?

At some point we may all be faced with a similar choice... It is pretty crazy that the cost to rebuild the original PRV is basically half of what a good running condition car is worth. Have you considered buying a donor project car and swapping in the PRV from that car? Or using it as a source to scavenge parts like your crankshaft or heads?

Also, you could try car-part.com and search for parts. It's a listing of all the salvage yard inventory across the country.

The car ran for 20 minutes when I bought it and died as I was getting on the highway. Once home, I sourced the issue to a fuel problem. Upon further inspection, I realized my frame was a mess and decided on a full frame off restoration. Took the motor apart to rebuild it, since it had a very bad oil leak and the PO used incorrect sized bolts everywhere he could. Long story short, my car had the worst type of PO you could ever imagine.

$9K is way out of the budget right now, so finding a donor car isn't a viable option. If I did have $9K, I'd probably be purchasing a new crate motor from Josh instead of another whole car. (The wife would certainly kill me if I did that.)

I'm kinda in the same boat after tearing down the engine for the last out of the 3 we had got a while ago. I found a low mileage engine from a Volvo Bertone for $800. Tore it down and is in perfect shape. I replaced the pieces from the DMC block over to the Volvo and all is well. Runs perfect, just have to dial in the mixture. Give me ring and we can talk it over if you want. I might be in Orlando next week for a meeting for work if all falls in correctly, so maybe i'll pop over and say hello!

You know you are always welcome!

Brandon,

How many miles are on your engine? What symptoms led you to realize this news?

Personally, I'd spend some time looking for a donor PRV. There was a complete engine on eBay last month that sold for $255! It belonged to Mike in Ontario IIRC and was in perfect working order minus some exterior components. PRV's are out there and would be the easiest replacement route, possibly the cheapest. I'd scour the scrap yards and do some homework. How about a Renault Alpine twin turbo PRV? These things exist and I've learned if you look hard enough you can find almost anything.

On the other hand if this presents you with the opportunity to put in your dream engine I say go for it. I'd (personally) exhaust the PRV route first.

My car has 17K on the odometer. I know that it had been sitting for a while, so I assumed it was close to correct. However, the engine was not taken care of AT ALL, (and the motor has been taken apart at least once already) and possibly could have 117K on it.

I know or a guy in Amarillo, TX who used to have a junk yard. He have many engines inside a barn, one of those is a volvo engine, been there for many years, I assume is a good engine, he is asking $500.00 I believe.

That is an option.


LEVY

Can you PM me his contact info?

[NightFlyer]

So, let me see if I've got this straight.

The car shows 17k on the odometer and is believed to have sat for a considerable amount of time (years). However, you question whether the displayed mileage is accurate - why? What does a vehicle history report show? Any documentation/records that you received from the PO? You state that the frame was a mess. However, one wouldn't expect a 17k mile car to have major frame issues unless it was stored improperly (outdoors on a soft surface and in a moisture/salt rich environment). What's the condition of the rest of the car - one of 17k miles, or one of 100k+ miles?

After purchasing the car, it was running well enough for you to feel safe taking it onto the expressway. On the on-ramp, the car dies and refuses to restart due to a fuel delivery problem. The car is presumably towed home. At home, the fuel delivery problem is traced and resolved.

Did you drive the car or run the engine at all since sorting the fuel delivery problem and before tearing down the engine? How many miles have you put on the car since purchasing it?

If the engine appeared to be running well/normally before, then I don't see why you believe it has such major issues now requiring the replacement of the crank, heads, pistons, liners - virtually everything expect the block/sump, intake, and mixture unit. How exactly did you determine that the crank was bad and that the heads were warped so bad that they can't be salvaged?

If it was running well/normally before tear down, then I don't see why it can't be put back together and be reliable with regular maintenance.

[deloumis]

So, let me see if I've got this straight.

The car shows 17k on the odometer and is believed to have sat for a considerable amount of time (years). However, you question whether the displayed mileage is accurate - why? What does a vehicle history report show? Any documentation/records that you received from the PO? You state that the frame was a mess. However, one wouldn't expect a 17k mile car to have major frame issues unless it was stored improperly (outdoors on a soft surface and in a moisture/salt rich environment). What's the condition of the rest of the car - one of 17k miles, or one of 100k+ miles?

After purchasing the car, it was running well enough for you to feel safe taking it onto the expressway. On the on-ramp, the car dies and refuses to restart due to a fuel delivery problem. The car is presumably towed home. At home, the fuel delivery problem is traced and resolved.

Did you drive the car or run the engine at all since sorting the fuel delivery problem and before tearing down the engine? How many miles have you put on the car since purchasing it?

If the engine appeared to be running well/normally before, then I don't see why you believe it has such major issues now requiring the replacement of the crank, heads, pistons, liners - virtually everything expect the block/sump, intake, and mixture unit. How exactly did you determine that the crank was bad and that the heads were warped so bad that they can't be salvaged?

If it was running well/normally before tear down, then I don't see why it can't be put back together and be reliable with regular maintenance.

The crank isn't something that can be eyeballed so I'm assuming he took it in to a machine shop to get checked. And having the engine at such condition I would too suspect 117k, not 17k

[David T]

You might try getting custom made oversize bearings. The heads may be savable by surfacing. Even the liners may be machinable with oversize pistons and rings. It could be expensive but you have a long way to go before you hit $9K! The more obvious choice is to find a good used donor motor, preferable out of a Delorean. Try Sheriff Bob. Even if you do find one it should be tested and bench run at least or you would want to pull the crankcase and heads to make sure it is healthy. Even with over 100K miles the motor should not be in such a bad condition unless it was abused. Doing an engine swap has all kinds of hidden problems and can be as expensive as getting a crate motor (maybe even more!). Just because you can get the motor cheap, you will need all kinds of custom made parts.
David Teitelbaum

[TTait]

Eagle-CO94 is currently parting out a car about an hour from you... I'd check in with him.

[Morpheus]

So, let me see if I've got this straight.

The car shows 17k on the odometer and is believed to have sat for a considerable amount of time (years). However, you question whether the displayed mileage is accurate - why? What does a vehicle history report show? Any documentation/records that you received from the PO? You state that the frame was a mess. However, one wouldn't expect a 17k mile car to have major frame issues unless it was stored improperly (outdoors on a soft surface and in a moisture/salt rich environment). What's the condition of the rest of the car - one of 17k miles, or one of 100k+ miles?

After purchasing the car, it was running well enough for you to feel safe taking it onto the expressway. On the on-ramp, the car dies and refuses to restart due to a fuel delivery problem. The car is presumably towed home. At home, the fuel delivery problem is traced and resolved.

You're relatively new to the forum, so I'll help you out. I created a restoration thread with the entire story, you can read it here:

http://dmctalk.org/showthread.php?55...on-of-VIN-4363

You can see a video of the car (not running perfectly, by the way) dying on the highway here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qMVMF1-91N4

Did you drive the car or run the engine at all since sorting the fuel delivery problem and before tearing down the engine? How many miles have you put on the car since purchasing it?

No, I didn't. Once i dug a little deeper, I discovered more disturbing PO "mods", and then saw the frame issues. I decided right then that the peace of mind was worth a frame-off restoration. Look at that thread and you will see what I mean. The only miles I put on the car were the few I was able to drive before it died on the highway.

If the engine appeared to be running well/normally before, then I don't see why you believe it has such major issues now requiring the replacement of the crank, heads, pistons, liners - virtually everything expect the block/sump, intake, and mixture unit. How exactly did you determine that the crank was bad and that the heads were warped so bad that they can't be salvaged?

If it was running well/normally before tear down, then I don't see why it can't be put back together and be reliable with regular maintenance.

I took the disassembled engine bits to a machine shop for cleaning and measuring. All specs were retrieved from the Volvo B28F Engine reconditioning manual, and the shop performed all the measurements accordingly. It is worth noting that the car did not run well from the get go. While the car may have originally looked like it only had 17K miles on it, and the autocheck does back up that info, the insides of the motor has the looks of one with 117K very hard miles on it. Was it foolish of me to attempt to drive the car home from DMCFL? Absolutely. Am I willing to slap this engine back together as-is and throw caution to the wind? Absolutely not.

[Nicholas R]

Man its a shame you didn't find this out last summer because I'd have sold you my original PRV. Ran perfectly when I pulled it out. I cannot believe how much this engine has gone up in price. I always remembered a Stage II motor being in the neighborhood of $7000 but now I cant even find it on the website. $9000 really does seem ridiculous. Have you considered junkyards? About 2 years ago I stripped a ton of parts out of a Volvo 760 from a local yard. Pretty much from the valley up, and they charged me $75 for everything. If I had a whole day I could have taken the entire engine for $250. I know there are several yards in Orlando; might be worth a call to see. Otherwise, I would start considering the 3.0L. I'm sure the lower block from your engine is salvageable and thats the only part you need.

Monetarily, engine swaps like the LS1 can be done cost effectively, but the trade off is all the work, and stress. You may or may not be spending money, but you'll be spending more time than you could imagine. Nothing fits, nothing bolts up, the offsets are wrong, and if you cant make it yourself you'll have to pay someone to make it, and then the cost goes way up very fast. I made everything myself. If it wasn't off the shelf, I turned it, milled it, cut it, welded it, etc, because paying someone would have been exponentially more expensive. At the time, despite requiring a lot of it, my time was free. Not that I'm advocating for or against swaps, but keep in mind that $9000 for a DeLorean engine is $9000 and a few days or weeks for install till you're running, with no stress or problem solving. $9000 for any other engine is $9000 and a few months or years for install till you're running, with a lot more stress than you can imagine requiring time and resources. Not to mention, for that price the swap would certainly be using a used engine that should get a rebuild in addition to all the other work. Just dont under estimate it. It can definitely be done, and the pay off is great, just be sure you know what you're getting into and explore all the options. Haste makes waste, and one should never waste a DeLorean!!!

I will be heading to Florida pretty soon but my car wont come down for a while. I certainly want to meet back up with all the FL owners and whenever that happens, engine swaps can certainly be discussed. There are a lot of cool options out there. Its tough because I know so many engines I'd love to experiment with but its important that the engine matches the owner or is something the owner is knowledgeable about. Also keep in mind, that if you do a swap, that car is yours forever. I mean, yea you can sell it, but the market is going to be a lot more slim. I've tried to document things like wiring on my car, but still, if I ever had to sell it, I would feel really bad for the next owner having to figure the car out, lol.

[sdg3205]

There is a parts car with an engine on eBay as we speak.