Ready to take out entire front end suspension. Need pointers

[1batt4u]

Hi all,

I am about to take out entire front suspension. Gonna replace with new pars and paint what ever needs to be painted.

What do you guys suggest when removing all these parts, from removing parts to re installing everything.

I am gonna lift the front end up and support it with stands. I am gonna rent a coil spring compressor, kinda scared thinking of removing the springs, just in case one pops out in my face.

Thank you!

[Tillsy]

Use the best spring compressors you can find - the ones I used caused me all end of dangerous complications :(

[SIMid]

Use the best spring compressors you can find

Heard of horror stories of springs flying across garages, punching through inner guards and also close calls to the head.

[sdg3205]

lubricate the threads on the spring compressors.

[jmettee]

I recommend the AutoCraft AC838 that you can get from Advanced Auto Parts for about $35. It worked well for me & was the 3rd or 4th one I tried on the DMC. Problem is the first ones I tried are to big to fit in the close space on the DMC. Note that these will still scrape the spring perches, so you will need to protect with duct tape/cardboard...or simply touch up when done. What I like about this set is you can tighten the U-bolts around the spring & they fit securely & won't slip.
31015

The free length of the springs is about 14" & you need to basically coil-bind the springs (to about 7"-8") to get them out of the DMC frame/LCA area. It is kind of freaky, especially if you never compressed springs before.

Oh, & to see the power in a spring, go to 10:19 in this video

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dLVvS6CuNlQ

[Chris4099]

I saved this doc from the old .com site and used it when I replaced the springs in my D. Hopefully the original author is fine with me posting it again:
31016

This doc is meant if you plan to just replace the springs and shocks. In your case, you can make life a little easier and once you disconnect the upper control arm and caliper, you can then separate the lower ball joint and take the whole steering knuckle and upper control arm out as an assembly. This would leave you with lots of space to work with getting the springs out.

For a compressor, I used the Auto Zone rental that comes in a pair and attaches to the outside ($99 deposit you get back when you return it). Keep the threaded part pointing down as directed in the doc and you'll have clearance needed to compress the spring. Lube up the threads too will help as well.

[Bitsyncmaster]

I used an internal type spring compressor (remove the shock). I ended up making a new lower arm for the compressor so it would pivot and not slide on the LCR. You do need to compress that spring quite a bit to install them back in.

[DMC-81]

I removed the upper CA and the wheel hub, leaving only the LCA and the spring. I borrowed an external spring compressor from Auto Zone (free), and threaded thick rope through the spring and tied it to the frame as a safety measure to prevent a missile. Do be careful to even out the tension on either side of the spring as you compress it, if your compressor tool is a pair. I agree that it is a good idea to protect the spring perch on the frame.

By doing this operation, I realized that the stock spring is clearly too tall for the design of the front suspension, and despite compressing it as much as possible, I had to wiggle it a little to get it completely out. Other than that, it was pretty straightforward.

The springs in the lowering kit seem to be a better match to the design in terms of height. I am trying to leave my car as original as possible, except for correcting some of the flaws. In my opinion, I include the front stock springs in that list.

Good luck and be safe.

[Nicholas R]

lubricate the threads on the spring compressors.

This is by far one of the most important, yet forgotten aspects of using a spring compressor. Seriously; take ball joint/cv joint/axle/suspension grease, and smear it on the threads. I had an external spring compressor break because I was trying to compress a spring dry. Luckily it was a dual compressor so when it broke, the other half of the compressor caught the spring. Still wasn't a good thing though.

[1batt4u]

Thank you all for the pointers!!! Sorry, been busy with other things, gonna hopefully start removing things in the morning.

What size sockets will I need for the bigger size nuts on the wheel hubs?

Thank you!

[Tillsy]

What size sockets will I need for the bigger size nuts on the wheel hubs?

Believe it or not there were two different sizes during production. Mine were 36mm - I believe the other size on some cars is 34mm (but don't quote me on that).

[Elvis]

spring compressor example for inside the spring:

http://www.google.de/imgres?imgurl=http://www.hk-auto.de/grafik/Reparatur/Fahrwerk/FedernC180/Federspanner_Gebrauch.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.hk-auto.de/Fahrwerk.html&h=768&w=1024&tbnid=DqPWpgngto5maM:&zoom=1&tbnh=95&tbnw=126&usg=__dInahsLUDFQ9uGdfIxvFHoqs2Tc=&docid=nB86HNXmravfTM&client=firefox-a&sa=X&ei=eNpMVNf9FMjjO-rEgYAB&ved=0CFMQ9QEwBA&dur=428




Mercedes used them

cheap version:

http://www.ebay.de/itm/like/361088255109?lpid=106&_configDebug=ViewItemDictionary.ENABLE_PAYMENTS_IN _HLP:true&hlpht=true&ops=true&viphx=1

[TTait]

I'm about to start replacing upper and lower ball joints - I have new uppers and NOS lowers in apparently perfect condition. Have not inspected the old ones yet but while doing the rack I feel its time (feel compelled to talk me out of it?).

Should I remove the boots on the NOS uppers and replace the grease?

Should I do any modifications to the NOS upper units? Drill and tap for a zerk fitting? Where?

Do I need a nut splitter as outlined in the shop manual to remove the uppers, or is there another method?

I did ball joints on an explorer years ago - so I get the basics. Anything to keep in mind that is not in the manual?

With previous lowers there were problems and it was critical to install them with an exact rotation before pressing them in - that is not the fact with the current units - right?


Overall I plan on replacing:
Steering bushing
Steering rack
tie rod ends
front shocks (DMCEU)
upper and lower ball joints
Sway bar bushings

All brake work, angle drive, and bearings were done an few years ago.

Any other must/should do items I may not have considered? Can't afford any other major upgrades, but if now is the time to do something...

[DMC5180]

What size sockets will I need for the bigger size nuts on the wheel hubs?

32 MM

Unless you are replacing wheel bearings you shouldn't need to mess with those nuts.

[DMC-81]

One other tip if you use the external compressors...., be sure to support the lower control arm once you have disconnected the knuckle/hub, and the shock. I found that the LCA is not strong enough to hold a spring by itself. I used several pieces of wood underneath it until I had connected the knuckle/ UCA and the shock again.

Best of luck with the job.

[1batt4u]

Hi all!!!

Its has been awhile since I've been on here. Took some time off from things due to some health/personal issues, nothing major. Everything is ok now.

I just removed entire front end. I'm happy!!! :thumbup: Now to remove paint on parts, POR-15 parts and re-install with all new components.

I am stuck though, how do I remove the old upper control arm ball joints?? The new ones I got from Ed in Europe came with stainless steel bolts. The the ones currently on, I don't think have bolts and nuts on them. Any ideas?? I'm puzzled.

Thank you!!

[DMCMW Dave]

Grind them off

[chris williams]

lubricate the threads on the spring compressors.
Very good point, I can second this one! When I'm replacing front springs on a DeLorean (and I have done lots) I always leave the front shock in place, with just one nut loose at the top and the bolt loose through the bottom so it can be removed quickly when your ready. That way if things go wrong at least the spring is contained and cant go anywhere!
Chris

[Bitsyncmaster]

The OEM upper ball joints are pop riveted into place. I used a 1/4" "die grinder" to remove them but your Dremal with a cut off wheel would also work.

[1batt4u]

Thank you for the info!!

[1batt4u]

So I will paint parts and install them back on with new components.

I have a few questions I am puzzled with, if you guys can really help.

1. PJ Grady front lowering springs to the Left, and stock springs to the right. The height difference is barely 1 inch. Will it actually go lower than I would think?? The stock springs sit high and hate it. Hope PJ's go even lower, maybe they compress more? Also what to do with stock front springs, you guys recommend switching them to the rear or not?
http://i62.tinypic.com/2cooeom.jpg

2. Upper arm ball joints. I bought these from Ed in europe. He sent along 8 Stainless steel bolts with nylon lock nuts. I am thinking is it ok to use stainless steel bolts and nuts since this is going to be used for suspension? Also, the bolts are 6mm, and the holes on the ball joints are 8mm wide. Is it corret or did Ed send wrong bolts? He said it was ok, but I am not sure.
One of the rubbers on the ball joints has a small tear on it, Ed said it was ok. What do you guys think? Leave it as is or use some kind of glue or something?
http://i61.tinypic.com/ehyqsj.jpg

3. Steering rack and pinion, I bought new one from DMCH. I removed the old one with the wheels being straight. Compared to the new one, driver side sticks out more and passenger side goes in a little on the new DMCH. is there a certain distance, measurement, the 2 ends should be at?
http://i61.tinypic.com/zkim54.jpg
http://i61.tinypic.com/6zxxle.jpg

Thank you all again!!
-Billy

[DMC5180]

The Grady spring are known to have a settling period. But once they have settled in they should look just right.

You need bolts that fill both holes. the control arm and ball joint. If you have not removed the ball joints yet it may be that the control arm holes are only 6 mm. I've never personally replaced the uppers though.

Steering rack: measure the center to center ball joint distance of the old rack. Transfer that measurement to the new rack while maintaining an equal amount of exposed threads on each side. Install the rack and attach the rod ends. Position the wheels straight (as possible) then reinstall the steering shaft ( steering wheel centered). Take it in for toe-in alignment. Make sure they center the steering wheel during the alignment process.

[Bitsyncmaster]

I don't think there is much force on the bolts for the upper ball joints since OEM used pop rivets. I can't remember what size I used on mine but if an 8 mm bolt would have fit, I would have used 8 mm. I did use stainless and nyloc nuts. Did Ed send you used upper ball joints?

[1batt4u]

I don't think there is much force on the bolts for the upper ball joints since OEM used pop rivets. I can't remember what size I used on mine but if an 8 mm bolt would have fit, I would have used 8 mm. I did use stainless and nyloc nuts. Did Ed send you used upper ball joints?

They are new, but seem like they were sitting awhile on self.

What about the little tear one of the boots have? Should I use some kind of glue in it or something to patch it?

[DMC5180]

You can probable get a replacement boot ( generic auto part store stuff ) or your favorite DMC vendor.

[Bitsyncmaster]

They are new, but seem like they were sitting awhile on self.

What about the little tear one of the boots have? Should I use some kind of glue in it or something to patch it?

My new ones showed a little rust also. Not sure what to patch a boot with. Most RTV does not like grease, oil or gas but it may work.

[DMCMW Dave]

You can probable get a replacement boot ( generic auto part store stuff ) or your favorite DMC vendor.

http://store.delorean.com/p-7317-upper-ball-joint-boot.aspx Available separately.

[1batt4u]

I killed myself today removing parts from parts.

I could not remove these from both the upper and lower control arms. Any trick to them? I used a 3 ton arbor press that I had. Both me and my brother turned it, but no budge.

I drilled the rubber off one of them and still no budge, weird.

What in the world do I do?

http://i57.tinypic.com/ne0zm.jpg

http://i58.tinypic.com/k31xc1.jpg

http://i60.tinypic.com/2u5ardj.jpg

[SS Spoiler]

Maybe a bad idea, burn them out?

[1batt4u]

Maybe a bad idea, burn them out?

I don't think it is a good idea.

[DMC-81]

Perhaps this thread will help?

http://dmctalk.org/showthread.php?7923-How-do-you-remove-an-old-bushing-***Continued-From-How-TO-s***

[1batt4u]

Perhaps this thread will help?

http://dmctalk.org/showthread.php?7923-How-do-you-remove-an-old-bushing-***Continued-From-How-TO-s***

That definitely helps! Thank you!!! :thumbup:

[DMCMW Dave]

The upper ones are very difficult to get in and out without bending the arm. It's typically moot as it's hard to find replacements other than poly anyway. The need to be pressed from the inside out which is hard to do with a hydraulic press. You can drill or burn out the rubber but the metal shell will still be there.

The large inner bushing on the lower arm will come out with a press as well. It must be supported correctly or you'll be replacing those arms too as they bend very easily.

[DMC5180]

When all else fails there is this option.

http://store.delorean.com/p-7313-control-arm-assy-upr.aspx

[Farrar]

Does the DMC vendor replacement come with rubber bushings or polyurethane?

[Mark D]

The upper control arms from DMCH are NOS with rubber bushings. I think the original intent of stocking the upper arms with bushings preinstalled was that if you wore out the bushings you would just replace the whole arm.

I've replaced my UCA bushings with poly, and I don't think it was worth the trouble. The original rubber bushings don't tend to go bad as fast like the lower ones since they don't see a lot of flex.

I was set on powder coating all my suspension parts so that was the only reason I removed the original rubber ones. They would have burnt up during the powder coat baking process. I don't think rubber bushings were available at that time, so I went with poly since I could just buy the bushings and not the whole arm. It would have made even less sense to buy a new arm, remove the bushings, and then reinstall them in my powder coated arms.

This thread has a few pictures that show the process if you decide to go with the poly bushings. I custom fabricated some spacers to prevent the upper arm from crushing in while I pressed in the new bushings.

http://dmctalk.org/showthread.php?5470-Polyurethane-Bushings&p=78192&viewfull=1#post78192

[jwrayth]

I recently removed the UCA bushings in part of my own front suspension renewal. I used some threaded bar, washers and fittings from my press (though old sockets would be a substitute) something akin to this;

https://robrobinette.com/images/S2000/Bushings/Ball_Joint_Press.jpg

It's important that you fill the cavity around where the bushing sits otherwise as you apply pressure you'll bend the arm rather than remove the bushing. In my case I cut to size some metal box sections and inserted them as support.

Came out nice and easy;

34035

[1batt4u]

+1 On the sockets. I am actually doing that on the press machine.

Question on upper arms. I do have Ed's bushing kit on stand by. http://www.delorean.eu/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=19_28_95&products_id=95046&osCsid=ukmi2l270pq8c1tjjlgqbmmje6

I just realized, the metal in between also comes out? I thought just the rubber. I press it out? I thought the metal in the middle was part of the upper arm.

[SS Spoiler]

Thats not a DE upper arm? Lotus? Seems the A-arm is backwards? The wide part should be toward the car?
Jus' wondering.....

[1batt4u]

I just finished removing upper control arm bushings. Was kind of easy.

[DMCMW Dave]

The other problem with replacing the upper bushings is that after the old ones have been pressed out the new ones don't fit quite as tight where they are pressed. I suspect that's why they were sold as a whole-arm replacement.

[Mark D]

I just finished removing upper control arm bushings. Was kind of easy.

Getting the old bushings out it is not the difficult part...if you bend the arms a little you can just bend them back into shape without the bushing in there.

The tough part is getting the new bushings pressed in without flattening out the arm. You have to use a spacer between the U shape ends of the arm, but that spacer also has to be able to collapse slightly once the bushing is pressed in. Otherwise your spacer will get compressed in there and you won't be able to get it out. Or you'll be able to get the spacer out but you'll bend the arm in the process, and/or wreck your new paint job prying the spacer out.

Dave makes a good point too about the new bushings not fitting quite as tight when you press them back in. A hole in a piece of sheet metal doesn't retain its tight press fit tolerance like a sleeve or a collar does. You maybe get one more shot at pressing in the new bushing before the holes enlarge and will no longer hold the bushing as tight as it needs to be.

Whether it's on purpose or by accident I measured the outer diameter of the poly bushing sleeves just a fuzz larger than the stock bushings sleeves... perhaps the manufacturer did this on purpose to ensure they would press in tight.

[jwrayth]

Thats not a DE upper arm? Lotus? Seems the A-arm is backwards? The wide part should be toward the car?
Jus' wondering.....

It's a photo I grabbed off of google similar to the procedure I used but on a different car :) My phone got smashed over Christmas so I don't have all the photos from my suspension rebuild.

[1batt4u]

So I have a question on the upper ball joints again. I bought these from Ed in Europe. He emailed me saying they are from DMCH. The holes on my stock upper ball joints are 7mm, the holes on the upper control arm are 7mm also.

New upper ball joints have 8mm holes, upper control arm holes are 7mm and the Stainless Steel bolts Ed sent me are 6mm wide. He said it is fine to install he does it to all his car. Is it really ok to do that? Or should I buy 8mm bolts and open holes up on upper control arm?

[Mark D]

I used 1/4"-20 yellow zinc plated grade 8 hardware for installing new upper ball joints on my car. 1/4" is .35mm larger than 6mm hardware and fits in the standard 7mm holes. Drilling out to M8 might cause issues with the bolt heads being too large to fit without interference issues. I'm not sure if stainless would be the best choice for fasteners in this application since they basically rank somewhere between grade 2 and grade 5. I'd personally use a high strength bolt and hardened washer/nyloc nut.

Then again, the original ball joints are held on by rivets so it's probably debatable what strength hardware would be "good enough". I usually err on the side of caution when it comes to suspension hardware.

[1batt4u]

I used 1/4"-20 yellow zinc plated grade 8 hardware for installing new upper ball joints on my car. 1/4" is .35mm larger than 6mm hardware and fits in the standard 7mm holes. Drilling out to M8 might cause issues with the bolt heads being too large to fit without interference issues. I'm not sure if stainless would be the best choice for fasteners in this application since they basically rank somewhere between grade 2 and grade 5. I'd personally use a high strength bolt and hardened washer/nyloc nut.

Then again, the original ball joints are held on by rivets so it's probably debatable what strength hardware would be "good enough". I usually err on the side of caution when it comes to suspension hardware.

Cool! Thank you!

[1batt4u]

Stuck with something else. How to remove SPEEDO RH ANGLE DRIVE 106130 http://store.delorean.com/p-7325-speedo-rh-angle-drive.aspx

[Mark D]

Good info on the angle drive here:
http://deloreantech.wikia.com/wiki/Angle_Drive

This video should also be helpful:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ITPF5SDM0Z0

You'll need a 32mm open end wrench. It's kind of an odd size to find...I got mine at Northern Tool for around 10 bucks, but they should have that size at your local hardware store, home depot, etc.

http://www.homedepot.com/p/Husky-32-mm-FP-Metric-12-Point-Combination-Wrench-HCW32MM/202916178

If you can't find 32mm 1 1/4 is almost exactly the same size and will also work.

Once you have the angle drive removed you need to separate it from the nut by removing a C clip on the inside of the nut. See photo below (Credit Specialtauto.com)
34092

[1batt4u]

Thank you again!! :thumbup2:

[1batt4u]

Parts painted, gonna start putting new parts on painted car parts, and install whole front on Wednesday.

Any tips, pointers?

One question I have so far is:

The lower control arm ball joints. Tried to get them in lower control arm but boot is in the way. Do I have to remove boots prior to install? Also, how flat does the boot become when installing on to the "knuckle" http://store.delorean.com/p-9079-strg-knuckle-lh.aspx

Thank you!

[DMC5180]

I believe you remove the boot and reinstall after balljoint is installed.

General tip: Do not tighten any of the control arm bushing bolts until you have weight on the wheels. If you don't have access to a 4 post lift and are just using jack stands. Jack up each corner of the suspension until it is off the nearest jack stand then tighten accordingly. Ideally the full weight of the car should be on the wheels. Which is why a 4 post lift works best.

[1batt4u]

I believe you remove the boot and reinstall after balljoint is installed.

General tip: Do not tighten any of the control arm bushing bolts until have weight on the wheels. If you don't have access to a 4 post lift and are just using jack stands. Jack up each corner of the suspension until it is off the nearest jack stand then tighten accordingly. Ideally the full weight of the car should be on the wheels. Which is why a 4 post lift works best.

Thank you! The whole front end is in the air at the moment, sitting on 2 jack stands. Should I at least tighten the nuts till they are close enough but still loose before dropping it? Is this just for bushings or applies to ball joints, bottom bolts of shocks as well?

[DMC5180]

Yes to both. Except balljoint. You tighten that before putting the car on the ground.

[1batt4u]

Yes to both. Except balljoint. You tighten that before putting the car on the ground.

Thank you very much again!

Is there a page that says what to torque everything on the front end? I think top of shock is the only place a socket wrench won't fit, will have to use regular wrench.

[DMC5180]

Torque specs should be in the suspension section of the manual. There is also a service bulletin that gives various component torques.

[David T]

Torque specs should be in the suspension section of the manual. There is also a service bulletin that gives various component torques.

Refer to A:03:01 to :05 in the Workshop Manual and ST-09-7/81 in the Service Bulletins for torques on critical fasteners The correct way to torque any rubber bushing such as is in the Control Arms is with the weight of the vehicle being supported by the wheels so the bushing is not twisted up but is "neutral" at standing height. Shocks too. On castellated nuts you tighten to torque and then turn till you can put the cotter pin in. On joints with tapers (ball joints and tie rod ends) you may have to press them tightly together so the parts don't turn as you tighten them. For all suspension parts, if you disturbed any adjustments (toe mainly) you should have the car's alignment checked after you finish. The tires should wear evenly, the steering wheel should be centered when going straight, and the car should not wander or lean to either side. Make sure you have the correct tire pressures first and the road you are driving on is not crowned. If you have vibrations that is NOT alignment. That is either a bad tire or one that is out-of-balance or possibly bent. Make sure you torqued the lug nuts to the correct torque AND in an alternating order. Finally you should lubricate the front end. Spray silicone on all of the bushings, including the steering bushing, spray WD-40 on the U-Joints, and grease the ball joints and tie rod ends. If the joints do not have a grease fitting use a needle to get under the boot. Don't forget the rear suspension. Check the TAB's for bent ones, missing shims, and torque.

[1batt4u]

No castle nuts, just nyloc nuts.

New parts adding that car did not have before, Front End Recall from Josh DPI, and FRONT LOWER ARM Control Support from Ed in Europe as well as his poly bushings.

The good thing is, I do have ramps which I can drop the car on. That way it will be sitting on its wheels and I will have room to work under to tighten.

So far this is what I think I should tighten with correct torque first before the car is dropped. Correct if I am wrong.

1. Upper, Lower ball joints, as well as steering ball joints.
2. Steering rack mounting brackets.
3. Top of shocks?

These I tighten to torque after the car is sitting on its wheels.

1. All poly bushings, upper and lower control arms.
2. Bottom of shocks, Ed's control arms will be connected to them.
3. Sway bar bushings on control arms.
4. Front sway bar bushings.

I guess that it, missing anything on list?

Do I grease ball joints before mounting on? I never greased before, do I pump till it gets hard to pump??

[Bitsyncmaster]

I grease the ball joints till I see the rubber seal expanding. You don't have to worry much about torquing bolts in poly bushings. Poly bushings will rotate in the sleeve where as the OEM rubber does not.

[1batt4u]

I grease the ball joints till I see the rubber seal expanding. You don't have to worry much about torquing bolts in poly bushings. Poly bushings will rotate in the sleeve where as the OEM rubber does not.

So I inatall parts on, tighten nuts on ball joints then grease them?

[Bitsyncmaster]

So I inatall parts on, tighten nuts on ball joints then grease them?

Yes, add the grease after they are installed. You also grease every few years after your initial install.

[1batt4u]

Yes, add the grease after they are installed. You also grease every few years after your initial install.

Cool! Thank you very much!!

I Just want ro make sure, everything I wrote above about tightening first and tightening after car is on wheels is correct? Plus what u menrioned on polt bushings, not torque required, just tighten as much.

Also I want to make sure on the shocks, I tighten top of shocks to proper torque before I loosen springs??

[Bitsyncmaster]

Cool! Thank you very much!!

I Just want ro make sure, everything I wrote above about tightening first and tightening after car is on wheels is correct? Plus what u menrioned on polt bushings, not torque required, just tighten as much.

Also I want to make sure on the shocks, I tighten top of shocks to proper torque before I loosen springs??

You still need to properly torque bolts with poly bushings. Just don't have to worry about torquing them with them sitting on the wheels.

[1batt4u]

Sorry to drive everyone crazy! lol, so much going on in my head and first time doing this kind of work.

The front sway bar bushings after weight of car is on wheel and bolts tightened on front sway bar bushings I grease then?

Also, I have PJ Grady's front lowering springs, does everyone put back the rubber pad on springs?

[Bitsyncmaster]

Sorry to drive everyone crazy! lol, so much going on in my head and first time doing this kind of work.

The front sway bar bushings after weight of car is on wheel and bolts tightened on front sway bar bushings I grease then?

Also, I have PJ Grady's front lowering springs, does everyone put back the rubber pad on springs?

I greased all my poly bushing (outside of the sleeve where it should rotate). Also greased my poly sway bar bushings where the bar sits in the bushing. Yes I put back the rubber pad on the springs.

[1batt4u]

I greased all my poly bushing (outside of the sleeve where it should rotate). Also greased my poly sway bar bushings where the bar sits in the bushing. Yes I put back the rubber pad on the springs.

Thank you very much Dave! I appreciate it!!! :thumbup:

[1batt4u]

Starting to get things together slowly.

One thing I noticed, my new shocks, Protech, are a little shorter, over an inch, than the old shocks. Do I have to release, extend them??

[1batt4u]

Anyone?? I stopped work, waiting on a reply.

Thank you!!

[Flash66]

Basically what ever you need to do to get them in. Just extend them to mount and you should be fine. What's the part number on those protechs?

[1batt4u]

Basically what ever you need to do to get them in. Just extend them to mount and you should be fine. What's the part number on those protechs?
How do I extend them? Lol I have no clue

[Bitsyncmaster]

How do I extend them? Lol I have no clue

Most shocks sit fully extended (gas shocks) but the others you just pull with your hands while holding the bottom with your feet. Just put the top mounting nut on just to the end of the threads. Then you compress the spring enough to get the bottom bolt installed. Don't forget to tighten that top nut and install the second lock nut over it.

[1batt4u]

Most shocks sit fully extended (gas shocks) but the others you just pull with your hands while holding the bottom with your feet. Just put the top mounting nut on just to the end of the threads. Then you compress the spring enough to get the bottom bolt installed. Don't forget to tighten that top nut and install the second lock nut over it.

My Protech shocks came with only one nut, nyloc nut

[Bitsyncmaster]

My Protech shocks came with only one nut, nyloc nut

Most shocks don't use those because it's a pain to install the nut without the shock shaft from turning. I guess if you can install a nyloc it would suffice. But look at the recall on the sway bar nut. It removed a nylock and installed a double nut with loctite. So you will have to decide which it better.

[1batt4u]

Most shocks don't use those because it's a pain to install the nut without the shock shaft from turning. I guess if you can install a nyloc it would suffice. But look at the recall on the sway bar nut. It removed a nylock and installed a double nut with loctite. So you will have to decide which it better.

For the sway bar bushings and recall kit, Josh DPI sent me just 4 bolts and 4 washers that support the bushing/brackets along with recall brakcets? I'm supposed to have nuts with it??

[Bitsyncmaster]

For the sway bar bushings and recall kit, Josh DPI sent me just 4 bolts and 4 washers that support the bushing/brackets along with recall brakcets? I'm supposed to have nuts with it??

The nuts go on the ends of the sway bar where they attach to the LCRs. The recall brackets are a different recall.

[1batt4u]

The nuts go on the ends of the sway bar where they attach to the LCRs. The recall brackets are a different recall.


Any pictures possible? My brain is not thinking anymore

[Bitsyncmaster]

Any pictures possible? My brain is not thinking anymore

Here is another thread on the end bushings.

http://dmctalk.org/showthread.php?9649-Sway-Bar-End-bushings&highlight=sway+recall

[1batt4u]

Here is another thread on the end bushings.

http://dmctalk.org/showthread.php?9649-Sway-Bar-End-bushings&highlight=sway+recall

Ok gottcha!! My brain wasn't processing. Thank you!

[1batt4u]

How screwed am I??

I had the spring compressors a little less than opposite than each other. I know that if they are exactly opposite it will not fit.

Spring almost went in, it just needed a tad more to go in. I noticed the compressors were in the way, so I tried to wiggle one of them a tad to just get the spring fully in, and the compressor just came into the middle.

What in the world do I do??? I cleaned up everything gonna try again tomorrow.


http://i59.tinypic.com/v4apv8.jpg

http://i58.tinypic.com/1oozde.jpg

http://i59.tinypic.com/35bfdc5.jpg

[1batt4u]

I just thought, jack the lower control arm up slowly??

[DMCMW Dave]

Just be really careful now. A loose spring can kill you.


That lower are is not supposed to be unsupported resting on the frame. It bends the arm, the frame, and is an amazing amount of excess force on the inner bushing.

I'd get a floor jack under that lower arm, lift it slightly and start carefully unscrewing the spring compressor. Those particular springs tend to be a b***ch to install.

[Tillsy]

How you going Billy? Hope you're okay - I know all too well how stressful it is when those springs start flexing in ways you don't want them to, even more scary if the compressors slip around the spring snd expose an entire side.

[Bitsyncmaster]

Like others have said, get a jack under that LCR to compress the spring and then remove the compressors. I used an internal type spring compressor so I think I had the jack positioned so I could remove the compressor and install the shock to hold things together.

[dn010]

Those look like PJ Grady's early lowering springs. I bought a set and during the install I wished I would have paid more for the "updated" lowering springs he now offers. Real bitch to install, my usual strut compressors were too large to use-I couldn't get the compressor between the coils, so I had to use a set of my really cheap (and scary!) spring compressors similar to what you're using.

When I did mine I had to do it with the LCA out, put the compressed spring in the tower with the rubber pad, bolt the LCA to frame then the shock to LCA&frame to keep the thing from resting on the frame (Unless you have Hervey's front shocks which will let the LCA rest on the frame) all while hoping the compressors didn't explode then I was finally able to remove the compressors. Jack up the LCA and then slowly loosen the compressor that slipped, you may be able to reposition it. And those compressor safety pins, those may get wedged between coils, I couldn't use them due to that issue.

Now that all is said and done, I really like those springs. But getting those springs in was an experience. I hope I never, ever have to remove them...

[1batt4u]

Those look like PJ Grady's early lowering springs. I bought a set and during the install I wished I would have paid more for the "updated" lowering springs he now offers. Real bitch to install, my usual strut compressors were too large to use-I couldn't get the compressor between the coils, so I had to use a set of my really cheap (and scary!) spring compressors similar to what you're using.

When I did mine I had to do it with the LCA out, put the compressed spring in the tower with the rubber pad, bolt the LCA to frame then the shock to LCA&frame to keep the thing from resting on the frame (Unless you have Hervey's front shocks which will let the LCA rest on the frame) all while hoping the compressors didn't explode then I was finally able to remove the compressors. Jack up the LCA and then slowly loosen the compressor that slipped, you may be able to reposition it. And those compressor safety pins, those may get wedged between coils, I couldn't use them due to that issue.

Now that all is said and done, I really like those springs. But getting those springs in was an experience. I hope I never, ever have to remove them...

Yes those are PJ Grady front lowering springs. I just bought them 2-3 years afo. How long ago sid u buy urs and he got updated ones?

I guess my best bet is to jack up LCA and do my best. I have Protech shocks.

[chris williams]

I have just installed the Protech shocks as well as Ed's lowering springs. The shocks do extend but you need to pull really hard on them to do so. Looking at your pictures I would try and get a shock re-installed as soon as possible to try and contain the spring should things go wrong.
Chris

[dn010]

I bought the springs pretty recently but they were left overs that Rob had. He had the updated ones available but I opted for these.


Yes those are PJ Grady front lowering springs. I just bought them 2-3 years afo. How long ago sid u buy urs and he got updated ones?

I guess my best bet is to jack up LCA and do my best. I have Protech shocks.

[PJ Grady Inc.]

The only difference between the new style and the old is that we had the pitch (spacing) between the coils increased to allow for easier installation. Some compressors work fine with the early springs and some are very tight to remove. This is the only difference as the overwelming majority of purchasers liked all other aspects of the earlier springs.
Rob Grady



Yes those are PJ Grady front lowering springs. I just bought them 2-3 years afo. How long ago sid u buy urs and he got updated ones?

I guess my best bet is to jack up LCA and do my best. I have Protech shocks.

[Flash66]

Anyone care to share the Protech part number? Good luck Billy!! You'll get it done.

[chris williams]

Not sure there are actual part numbers but there is some info and pictures hear: http://www.deloreans.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?f=20&t=4747&hilit=shocking+shockers

Chris

[1batt4u]

Thank you all for the help!! Springs along with LCAs and shocks all went in good!

One problem I just came into though. I was putting new steering rack and pinion from DMCH, but not going in. Apparently LCA control arm support is in the way, would have to removed, but impossible since I put everything together.

Any idea??

One idea I had was to take the nut off from the other side, push the bolt in, then take another bolt I have just as long and same size, start pushing it through so the current bolt can come out and the temporary bolt will still support everything. Once though, can push support arm up, oput of way to pass steering rack and pinion in, and redo everything.

How does that sound?? Unless someone has a better idea.


http://i58.tinypic.com/2yvo4z6.jpg

[Mark D]

I also had to install the steering rack first.... It would not fit with the LCA supports installed. It might be possible for the rack to fit somehow with the supports on there, but I didn't want to scratch the hell out of my freshly powder coated steering rack or freshly painted frame trying to make it work. I was only test fitting the LCA supports and noticed it early in the assembly process that the rack needed to go in first.

If you've already got everything assembled, the fix you described will work....

-If the head of the LCA pivot bolt is currently on the forward side of the control arm you just need a bolt of the same length to install from the opposite end. Same thing for the shock bolt.

-Use new temporary bolts (LCA pivot bolt and shock mount bolt) to tap out currently installed bolts so everything remains installed and in alignment.

-With the new temporary bolts installed remove the forward LCA support.

-Install your steering rack.

-Reinstall forward LCA support.

-Tap in originally installed bolts to push out temporary bolts.

-Reinstall nuts and torque to spec.

-Drink beer in celebration.


I think the original instructions that someone posted for installing the LCA supports used a similar method so you didn't have to completely remove the LCA to install the supports. You should have no problem using this method to get the front suppport off to install the steering rack.

When I installed the steering rack I went in from the driver's side...I'm not sure but you may also be able to work from the passenger side.

[1batt4u]

Thank you! I feel for confident now!

I was thinking of just doing the one bokt on LCA, and just lift up the support bracket and slup in steering rack.

Bt any chance do u have the torque numbers for Ed's support brackets along with poly bushings? If you also have torque numbers for rest, ball joints front sway, rear sway on LCAs.

[Mark D]

I used all the torque values in the service manual. If you don't have a copy you can view it online here:
http://www.europartsinc.com/images/dmc/pdf/DMC_Workshop_Manual.pdf

Note that some of the torque specs were later revised, see service bulletin here:
http://www.dmcnews.com/bulletins/ST-09-7.81.pdf

There was also an error in the above service bulletin for the ball joint torque which was corrected here:
http://www.dmcnews.com/bulletins/ST-24-10.81.pdf

For the full list of service bulletins they're all online here:
http://www.dmcnews.com/bulletins/index.html

[1batt4u]

Thank you again!!!

It looks like though I lost/misplaced my sway bar to LCA 4 big washers and 4 nuts.

I want to get everything on and push my car about 5 feet back, because it has been in middle of driveway. There will be no problem pushing the car without a sway bar on??

[1batt4u]

Anyone??

[DMCMW Dave]

Anyone??

It won't hurt, just don't drive it that way.

[1batt4u]

Thank you!! :thumbup:

[1batt4u]

So I just realized I destroyed my new hub bearings. smh

I used a 35mm socket on its reverse side, when I used my 20 ton press machine to press in the bearing. All looked good till I was about to install the last parts, hubs and spindle. Then I noticed inner bearing seals were loose and coming off.

I was told I needed to use a socket the size of the outer bearing, but not as big so it won't get stuck.

:angry_whip:

[1batt4u]

Does anyone know exact size of bearing?? I am in real need. I wanna see which auto parts store have them.

I would drive to PJ Grady, but I think he is out of town in Ireland.

[DMC5180]

Does anyone know exact size of bearing?? I am in real need. I wanna see which auto parts store have them.

I would drive to PJ Grady, but I think he is out of town in Ireland.

Front bearing SKF: GRW120 Any auto parts store should be able to cross reference it to something. Whether or not they have it in stock is another story, but most have distribution warehouses that can deliver same day if you go to the store early in the day.

Width 1.4567 (37.00018 MM) Nominal 37 MM
O.D. 2.3622 (59.99988 MM) Nominal 60 MM
I.D. 1.1811 (45.99940 MM) Nominal 46 MM

[1batt4u]

Thank you very much!!

[1batt4u]

Guys, this is the last question I think I will have about the front end suspension. The front sway bar brackets, they are sticking out too much and the radiator support brackets will not sit well.

Please note that I still have the upper/lower control arms and bottom shock bolts loose till I have all the stuff re-installed back on for the original weight, as well as all the sway bar bolts and nuts are not full tightened.

Do you think once the back sway bar nuts are full tightened then it will pull the bracket back and make room to put the radiator support bracket on??

http://i62.tinypic.com/wb991t.jpg

http://i62.tinypic.com/14kitd5.jpg

[Flash66]

Once you have the car on the ground and the sway bar tightened up to the LCA, that and the load should pull everything together. Speaking from the same exact experience with those aftermarket fsb brackets.

[1batt4u]

Once you have the car on the ground and the sway bar tightened up to the LCA, that and the load should pull everything together. Speaking from the same exact experience with those aftermarket fsb brackets.


Thank you very much!!! :thumbup:

[Morpheus]

Guys, this is the last question I think I will have about the front end suspension. The front sway bar brackets, they are sticking out too much and the radiator support brackets will not sit well.

Please note that I still have the upper/lower control arms and bottom shock bolts loose till I have all the stuff re-installed back on for the original weight, as well as all the sway bar bolts and nuts are not full tightened.

Do you think once the back sway bar nuts are full tightened then it will pull the bracket back and make room to put the radiator support bracket on??

http://i62.tinypic.com/wb991t.jpg

http://i62.tinypic.com/14kitd5.jpg

Are those Toby's brackets or Josh's?

[Drive Stainless]

Thank you very much!!! :thumbup:

Something else to remember: If you go to take your car for an alignment, and the technician says your front caster is way off, you might think at first "Crap, is the frame bent? Are my control arms bent?" These swaybar brackets have some adjustability and affect the caster. You can adjust it using the slotted holes. You might advise the technician to try to do so once the car is on the lift to see if you can't bring the caster within spec.

[David T]

Something else to remember: If you go to take your car for an alignment, and the technician says your front caster is way off, you might think at first "Crap, is the frame bent? Are my control arms bent?" These swaybar brackets have some adjustability and affect the caster. You can adjust it using the slotted holes. You might advise the technician to try to do so once the car is on the lift to see if you can't bring the caster within spec.

While it is possible to make minor adjustments to castor and camber, it is considered non-adjustable. If you need any more than a minor adjustment something is probably bent. Lowering the car can also put some of your alignment adjustments out of spec.

[Drive Stainless]

While it is possible to make minor adjustments to castor and camber, it is considered non-adjustable. If you need any more than a minor adjustment something is probably bent. Lowering the car can also put some of your alignment adjustments out of spec.

How could you make minor adjustments to camber?

[FABombjoy]

How could you make minor adjustments to camber?
Friend U can add negative camber just hit upper control arm with big pin punch and sledge hammer works most of the time

[Drive Stainless]

Friend U can add negative camber just hit upper control arm with big pin punch and sledge hammer works most of the time

Ah yes, and if memory serves, a 5 lb sledge should add 1 degree per "whack."

LOL.

[iflights]

I plan on dropping the sway bar so I can do a fan replacement. Any words of advice? I'm concerned that alignment will be impacted.

Thanks
Steve

[DMC5180]

Very minimal at best. If you are concerned, make witness marks with a an ultra-fine sharpie marker before you remove the bushing brackets.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Drive Stainless]

Very minimal at best. If you are concerned, make witness marks with a an ultra-fine sharpie marker before you remove the bushing brackets.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I agree with the above and would just add the following:

In my experience, the brackets tend to get installed too far forward and you will end up with too much positive caster. Try to install the brackets where the bolts are in the center of the slots at minimum. That should get you close.

[Bitsyncmaster]

I agree with the above and would just add the following:

In my experience, the brackets tend to get installed too far forward and you will end up with too much positive caster. Try to install the brackets where the bolts are in the center of the slots at minimum. That should get you close.

I don't remember both sides of the clamp having slots but maybe I missed that.

[David T]

I don't remember both sides of the clamp having slots but maybe I missed that.

The only real way to affect alignment is to mess with the tie rod ends. Even if you do change the alignment slightly it probably won't be any further off one way or the other than it previously was. In fact, if you are replacing old, worn-out parts, it should be better than it was. If you are going through the trouble and expense of replacing worn out parts and "upgrading" the suspension, an alignment is part of the job anyway after you are all done. Shouldn't cost more than $200 and is probably closer to $150. Depends on your area. Be sure that the shop does a 4 wheel alignment and you should have extra shims for the trailing arm bolts and a copy of the specs just in case the machine doesn't have them in it's database. They can enter them as "custom" manually. The sway bar brackets don't have slots, just enlarged holes, so you can move the brackets a little bit if necessary.

[Drive Stainless]

I don't remember both sides of the clamp having slots but maybe I missed that.

Dave,

What I'm talking about applies only to the style of bracket shown here:

https://www.aftermarketsuspensionparts.com/prodimages/energy-suspension/9.5156/360/energy-suspension-9.5156-360-giant-01-01.jpg

The slots allow you to move the swaybar forward and back, which in turn, moves the lower control arm forward and back. It moves enough to have a measurable effect on alignment.

[iflights]

Thanks guys. I don't have those brackets installed on the car.

But to David T's point, I just had an alignment performed when DMCMW put in the lowering kits with shocks and springs. So I feel I'm fine there.

Should have had them just do the fans when they replaced the radiator and hoses! But live and learn.

Appreciate the feedback, it will be helpful when I get under the car. I'm getting a membership to this local place as they have a lift.

http://www.thevillageworkshop.com/equipment-list.html


Steve

[DMC5180]

Should have had them just do the fans when they replaced the radiator and hoses! But live and learn.


Steve

With radiator replacement the labor to replace the fans would have been virtually free. Or, 0.2 labor hour.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[iflights]

Ya, I know...

It just never came up in my quotation, or in general conversation as a preemptive measure. Now, I just need to get my hands dirty. I don't expect much swearing as it looks like all the radiator and shroud mounting hardware is brand new.

Steve

[David T]

Dave,

What I'm talking about applies only to the style of bracket shown here:



The slots allow you to move the swaybar forward and back, which in turn, moves the lower control arm forward and back. It moves enough to have a measurable effect on alignment.

Those slots are BIG!. Having such slots can allow for a lot of adjustment but on the other hand if a bolt loosens it can allow the alignment to move a LOT. It weakens the bracket too. You should not need all of that adjustment anyway. It's just me but I don't like that bracket. Looks like a universal fit kind of part. Fits everything but nothing well. I also don't like the grease fittings. If those bushings are to be lubricated they should be lubed with silicone. Most greases are oil based and will break down rubber bushings. With grease fittings it is too tempting to stick a grease gun onto them. Even if those bushings are poly, a grease fitting isn't necessary.