Can you siphon the tank empty?

[Lenny]

My car won't start and I want to start with the simplest thing first, Other than plugs wires, etc.

I was laying in bed trying to go to sleep and thought why not just siphon the tank empty and fill it with non ethanol gas. Can I do that? If I don't have to removed the spare, remove the panel, removed the cover, etc, etc.

It seems to me there are a lot of twists and turns from the filler to the tank.

[krs09]

Thats just what I did before my tank clean out - you can buy a cheap one on amazon. I went old school and used a rubber hose. Clean the tank and filter real good "while your in there"

[ccurzio]

Remember to use something nice and strong (like acetone) to clean the tank.

And wear a respirator!

[Rich]

My car won't start and I want to start with the simplest thing first, Other than plugs wires, etc.

Good idea - starting with simplest thing, that is.

With all respect, replacing the fuel with non-ethanol gas is not the most simple thing. And ethanol gas is an unlikely root cause of a non-start unless it is stale or gummy gas. Is there a special reason or some data suggesting the car has a fuel quality problem?

It takes 5-10 minutes to do the factory-recommended spark test AND a basic fuel pressure test (metering plate). Alternative to the fuel pressure test is starting fluid.

Within 10 minutes and with no more than a 10mm wrench you will be 90% sure whether you have an electrical problem or an upstream fuel supply problem.

[PJ Grady Inc.]

My car won't start and I want to start with the simplest thing first, Other than plugs wires, etc.

I was laying in bed trying to go to sleep and thought why not just siphon the tank empty and fill it with non ethanol gas. Can I do that? If I don't have to removed the spare, remove the panel, removed the cover, etc, etc.

It seems to me there are a lot of twists and turns from the filler to the tank.

The tank can not be properly cleaned of all contamination (assuming it is contaminated) by siphoning it unless you then clean the insides by hand with acetone or a similiar solvent.

And don't ever try to start the syphoning process with your mouth unless you enjoy visits to the local hospitol to get your stomach pumped out. It's not a job for the "casual" Sunday DYI'er.

Rob Grady

[David T]

The tank can not be properly cleaned of all contamination (assuming it is contaminated) by siphoning it unless you then clean the insides by hand with acetone or a similiar solvent.

And don't ever try to start the syphoning process with your mouth unless you enjoy visits to the local hospitol to get your stomach pumped out. It's not a job for the "casual" Sunday DYI'er.

Rob Grady

You can't get the hose in through the fill. The way I do it is to remove the access cover, loosen the cover boot, lift and move the pump over and insert the hose. You can buy a short piece of hose with a check valve attached. You shake it till you get the siphon going. Or a hand pump. Be careful not to overfill the can you are siphoning into and do it in an area of adequate ventilation. Better yet never handle gas inside a structure. If things go bad you don't want to lose the garage and house too. Using your mouth to start a siphon with modern gas is just plain dumb. Unless the gas is old and stale, removing it won't get the motor going, something else is wrong. You will know immediately from the smell if the gas is bad.

[Lenny]

I've owned my car for 4 years now. It has always started on the first key turn Hot or Cold. I took it down for a service and then drove to a high school football game. I filled it with gas High Test Ethanol. I usually us non-ethanol.

I parked the car for about 3 hours so it cooled off. It wouldn't start I cranked for 10 minutes or so walked away and tried it again. I then went and found my daughter and was getting ready to call AAA. I tried it one more time and it started to fire. I waited a few seconds and tried it again and it started but ran really rough.

I stuck it in gear and headed 2 hours home. After a few blocks it smoothed out.

The only thing that changed was the service and gas.

I tried to start it last week and quit after 5 minutes.

[DMCMW Dave]

You can't get the hose in through the fill. The way I do it is to remove the access cover, loosen the cover boot, lift and move the pump over and insert the hose. .

Going in through the fuel sender is handier.

[Rich]

I've owned my car for 4 years now. It has always started on the first key turn Hot or Cold. I took it down for a service and then drove to a high school football game. I filled it with gas High Test Ethanol. I usually us non-ethanol.

The only thing that changed was the service and gas.

I tried to start it last week and quit after 5 minutes.

Care to tell us what "the service" was?

Seems as if "the gas" is getting all your attention so far. Guessing it was something you think cannot be related to the problem, but who knows?

[David T]

Going in through the fuel sender is handier.

Yes it is but you can't do a proper inspection through it. Typically when you siphon the fuel out you are preparing to do some kind of service and that usually means removing the pump. I also hesitate to disturb the sender unless I have to. If you are not careful, when you tighten it back up, the gasket can slip out-of-place and you get leaks and smells.

[DMCMW Dave]

Yes it is but you can't do a proper inspection through it. Typically when you siphon the fuel out you are preparing to do some kind of service and that usually means removing the pump. I also hesitate to disturb the sender unless I have to. If you are not careful, when you tighten it back up, the gasket can slip out-of-place and you get leaks and smells.

He didn't mention that, he just wanted to drain it.

The fastest, least obtrusive way is to take the feel line off the fuel distributor, aim it into a gas can, and turn on the pump.

[82DMC12]

He didn't mention that, he just wanted to drain it.

The fastest, least obtrusive way is to take the feel line off the fuel distributor, aim it into a gas can, and turn on the pump.

This is what I did last fall. Much easier considering I never seem to get a siphon pump to work continuously.

BTW, I had an engine misfire-like symptom and the problem was old 87 ethanol gas. I drained the tank like above, and refilled with fresh gas and within a block of driving it totally cleared up. The gas was 9, maybe up to 12 months old. Now I go to a Quick Trip a couple miles away that actually has non-ethanol 87, and then add Stabil if I think the car will be sitting more than a month. The non-ethanol is about $0.50 more per gallon but probably worth it on these cars.

Andy

[DMCMW Dave]

This is what I did last fall. Much easier considering I never seem to get a siphon pump to work continuously.

BTW, I had an engine misfire-like symptom and the problem was old 87 ethanol gas. I drained the tank like above, and refilled with fresh gas and within a block of driving it totally cleared up. The gas was 9, maybe up to 12 months old. Now I go to a Quick Trip a couple miles away that actually has non-ethanol 87, and then add Stabil if I think the car will be sitting more than a month. The non-ethanol is about $0.50 more per gallon but probably worth it on these cars.

Andy

We see that all the time. Once the gas is a year old it runs bad (maybe as early as nine months old). At a year and a half it may not even start without some assistance and will run horribly. Modern Gas just sucks.

[David T]

We see that all the time. Once the gas is a year old it runs bad (maybe as early as nine months old). At a year and a half it may not even start without some assistance and will run horribly. Modern Gas just sucks.

They tell you now if it is over 1 MONTH it is old! Modern gas adsorbs moisture from the air because of all of the alcohol in it. At a certain point it phases out and causes all of the damage. In many States you just can't buy non-Ethanol fuel, New Jersey is one of them. Just storing the car over the winter is too long and you should drain the fuel. That way when you start it up again in the Spring you have fresh fuel in it. Should also remove the battery and keep it in a warm place.

[JRNY13]

They tell you now if it is over 1 MONTH it is old! Modern gas adsorbs moisture from the air because of all of the alcohol in it. At a certain point it phases out and causes all of the damage. In many States you just can't buy non-Ethanol fuel, New Jersey is one of them. Just storing the car over the winter is too long and you should drain the fuel. That way when you start it up again in the Spring you have fresh fuel in it. Should also remove the battery and keep it in a warm place.

I stored mine last winter from Nov-April. Full tank of ethanol gas with Stabil and it was fine in the spring.

[David T]

I stored mine last winter from Nov-April. Full tank of ethanol gas with Stabil and it was fine in the spring.

Maybe it was the Stabil. Maybe it was the climate and temperatures and humidity. Maybe you were on the verge of having problems. Point is, the fuel you buy today has a very short shelf life and can cause problems quickly. BTW products like Stabil make the fuel less volatile so it stores better. Is that really what you want, less volatile fuel? IMHO it is better to remove the fuel and fill with fresh when you take it out of storage. The other BIG point I want to make is all too often we see a car that was "only" stored for the winter and many years later after being "stored" with a full tank of fuel now has a 1/2 tank of cr-p. This happens with Ethanol and non-Ethanol fuel so it really doesn't matter.

[DMC5180]

My car starts right up every spring after the typical 5 month sitting with standard 87 ethanol blend gas. No stabil. 20 yrs running so far. The only issue I have is injector leak down after extended periods of non-use. So I have to go start it a few times on the CSV fuel before all the injector come back on line. Starting the engine on a regular basis and everything is normal.

[dn010]

My regular, daily driver is a 2007.. I've owned it for 5 years, never missed a beat, no issues, etc. One day I get gas at a station near my house, but it isn't one I usually use, just one that I happened to be passing. I fill the truck up, get in and begin my journey home.

First thing I notice was the fuel gauge was still just below the 1/4 tank mark and the message center still displayed XX miles until empty - this has never happened before, gauge usually shoots right up and the message goes to 300 (or so) miles till empty. I get home and the gauge is now maybe on the 1/4 mark so it is obviously going up slowly. I get out, shake the truck to see if maybe the sender is stuck and that didn't do anything. Every time I drove the gauge would slowly creep up until it finally stopped and indicated where the correct fuel level was.

I noticed that this tank of fuel was going extremely fast, and when this particular tank of fuel got down to the 1/4 mark, on my way home from work that day my truck started to misfire and run like crap. It got to the point of only running on a few cylinders and shaking terribly! I'm freaking out because my truck is not that old and it is my only reliable, daily vehicle (D is going thru a frame swap). I limp the truck home, shut it of and curse at it for a bit. Go inside, change into some work clothes so that I can crawl around the engine bay and see if anything came loose etc. I go back out, fire it up and it is running normal!

It was only that time I had an issue, and with all the peculiarities during that one specific tank of fuel, I am sure it was the gas I got. I refueled with my usual station and everything went back to normal.

Sorry for this whole long, useless story; but I would agree to drain the fuel and clean out the tank, perhaps you too got a bad dose of fuel.

And yes, If I have anything that I know will sit for a while, either run the tank out or drain it. You'll thank yourself for it if you've ever NOT done it and dealt with sludge, especially in a boat!




I've owned my car for 4 years now. It has always started on the first key turn Hot or Cold. I took it down for a service and then drove to a high school football game. I filled it with gas High Test Ethanol. I usually us non-ethanol.

I parked the car for about 3 hours so it cooled off. It wouldn't start I cranked for 10 minutes or so walked away and tried it again. I then went and found my daughter and was getting ready to call AAA. I tried it one more time and it started to fire. I waited a few seconds and tried it again and it started but ran really rough.

I stuck it in gear and headed 2 hours home. After a few blocks it smoothed out.

The only thing that changed was the service and gas.

I tried to start it last week and quit after 5 minutes.