Upper control arm install

[dn010]

I'm trying to install my upper control arms, but upon inspection they don't seem to be symmetrical. Is there a specific arm for a specific side or?

Also, both of my frames had the small "snub washer" jammed between the upper arm's bushing and the frame, 2 washers on the back side bushing/frame and one on the front side/bushing. I look at the book and it says it is supposed to be the large washer on either side of the bushing. I can't fit 2 large washers between them, one on each side there is not enough clearance, does it mean my arms are bent in due to having the snub washers?

I'm just trying to do it right. Thanks in advance.

Cheers,
Dan B.

[DMC-81]

Hi Dan,

Here are pics of my Left (masked for painting) and Right (painted) UCA's if that helps any. I took one side off at a time so I didn't compare them. As for the washers, the large washers go on the outside, next to the head of the bolt and the nut, and the small snub washers go inside between the inner bushing and the frame. On my car, there was only 1 snub washer on each side. I don't know if they are supposed to act like a shim? If so, maybe that's why yours has 2 in the back?

3280132802

[DMCMW Dave]

The two arms are the same. There is only one part number. Any chance you dropped one?

[dn010]

Dana - thanks for the pictures, that is a great help. Now, do the arms get 2 stub washers per bushing/frame connection or 1 each?

Dave - I personally have not dropped the arms, but they have a long history. They are early arms, from frame #308, attached to vin #712. I knew they had the same part number but I still thought I should ask. The difference in question is that tab of steel on the inside portions, one tab is longer than the other. Picture to indicate what I mean:

32803

[DMC-81]

On my car, there was only 1 snub washer on each side (front and back, so 2 per arm). I don't know if they are supposed to act like a shim? If so, maybe that's why yours has 2 in the back?

[DMCMW Dave]

Dana - thanks for the pictures, that is a great help. Now, do the arms get 2 stub washers per bushing/frame connection or 1 each?

Dave - I personally have not dropped the arms, but they have a long history. They are early arms, from frame #308, attached to vin #712. I knew they had the same part number but I still thought I should ask. The difference in question is that tab of steel on the inside portions, one tab is longer than the other. Picture to indicate what I mean:

32803

Hard to tell from a photo but I'll bet that arm is bent.

[dn010]

Both my arms look like this, with one side the tab being longer than the other side's tab of steel sticking out so unless they are both bent the same together, it seems like they were made this way... I'll post a few more pictures of it tonight. In case it isn't clear, I am talking about that piece of metal that is bent out in the picture right where the arrows are pointing, not the actual arm lengths themselves.

[DMCMW Dave]

NOS arms are symmetrical. Side by side and one over the other. Those flanges probably don't matter but the arms should not be bent or asymmetrical in any way:

32807

32808


Probably a production variance, but be sure that you can lay one over the other centered at the mount bolt and have the ball joint mount in the same relationship. Or your caster will be off.

[hippieman9]

I have had the same question about the snub washers. When I took my Upper control arm off I had 2 snub washers on either side of the control arm. Looking at the parts manual it looks as if you’re suppose to have the large flat washer on the outside, snub washer, control arm, snub washer, frame, snub washer, control arm, snub washer , large washer, nut.
Mine was large washer, control arm, 2 snub washers, frame, 2 snub washers, control arm, large washer, nut.
So what is right?

[axh174]

I'll throw another data point into the mix. I just swapped out my original upper control arms for a set of new old-stock arms from DMCH. My old upper arms have the asymmetric interior metal tabs, just like Dan's. There was 1 snub washer on either side of the pivot bolt bushing (on both the front and back) on both the passenger and driver sides.

So on 2234, the setup was large washer, snub washer, control arm, snub washer, frame, snub washer, control arm, snub washer, large washer.

-Kevin
VIN2234

[DMC-81]

Looking at the parts diagram on DMC's website it says that 4 are required per side, so I agree that it should be:

- large flat washer on the outside, snub washer, control arm, snub washer, frame, snub washer, control arm, snub washer , large washer, nut.

The snub washers prevent binding/ chafing.

[hippieman9]

Yeah I am going to put it back together with one snub washer in each position. Per the manual.i agree they are for anti binding purposes. Just funny how different vins seem to be assembled differently. But then again a Previous Owner couldnif taken it apart and reassembled it different.

[PJ Grady Inc.]

Yeah I am going to put it back together with one snub washer in each position. Per the manual.i agree they are for anti binding purposes. Just funny how different vins seem to be assembled differently. But then again a Previous Owner couldnif taken it apart and reassembled it different.
Every car I worked on for the first 10 or 15 years after production ceased had two snubwashers (#100480) on each inner side of the upper bushing and one large OD washer (#SP10505). I think some 500/600 VIN cars had the setup as seen in the parts illustration but all later cars used the double shim approach. On cars that have been taken apart however it is not uncommon for for this to change due to carelessness or conversly someone taking the original drawing as the way to go. The illustration in the manual is incorrect. The quantity listed on the DMCH site is correct at 8 per car however. It would be desirable if they cleaned up both front and rear suspension illustrations to correct the inaccuracies of the original drawings but it would take some talent and time. If you're using the correct original snubwashers I would definately advise using two at each inner bsg to frame mount. The other way to go is use a single washer that is double the thickness as the originals and your tolerance would be the same.
On a side note tte snubwashers are not for an antibinding purpose per se as the bushing inner collar does not rotate with suspension travel but remains stationary as the wheels travel through thier arc.
Rob

[DMC-81]

Every car I worked on for the first 10 or 15 years after production ceased had two snubwashers (#100480) on each inner side of the upper bushing and one large OD washer (#SP10505). I think some 500/600 VIN cars had the setup as seen in the parts illustration but all later cars used the double shim approach. On cars that have been taken apart however it is not uncommon for for this to change due to carelessness or conversly someone taking the original drawing as the way to go. The illustration in the manual is incorrect. The quantity listed on the DMCH site is correct at 8 per car however. It would be desirable if they cleaned up both front and rear suspension illustrations to correct the inaccuracies of the original drawings but it would take some talent and time. If you're using the correct original snubwashers I would definately advise using two at each inner bsg to frame mount. The other way to go is use a single washer that is double the thickness as the originals and your tolerance would be the same.
On a side note tte snubwashers are not for an antibinding purpose per se as the bushing inner collar does not rotate with suspension travel but remains stationary as the wheels travel through thier arc.
Rob

Thanks Rob for your insight and experience...it's always appreciated. I noticed the part numbers were perhaps reversed on the parts diagram. (44 and 45)

I agree with your purpose of the snub washer. I found a more precise description of what I meant by "binding/chafing"... "The use of snubbing washers is required to ensure proper static and dynamic loading of the isolator and retention of suspended equipment under severe shock environments."
From:
http://www.vlier.com/hutchinson/pdfs/bcdi_prod_bonded_22005.pdf


:wrenchin:

[hippieman9]

Every car I worked on for the first 10 or 15 years after production ceased had two snubwashers (#100480) on each inner side of the upper bushing and one large OD washer (#SP10505). I think some 500/600 VIN cars had the setup as seen in the parts illustration but all later cars used the double shim approach. On cars that have been taken apart however it is not uncommon for for this to change due to carelessness or conversly someone taking the original drawing as the way to go. The illustration in the manual is incorrect. The quantity listed on the DMCH site is correct at 8 per car however. It would be desirable if they cleaned up both front and rear suspension illustrations to correct the inaccuracies of the original drawings but it would take some talent and time. If you're using the correct original snubwashers I would definately advise using two at each inner bsg to frame mount. The other way to go is use a single washer that is double the thickness as the originals and your tolerance would be the same.
On a side note tte snubwashers are not for an antibinding purpose per se as the bushing inner collar does not rotate with suspension travel but remains stationary as the wheels travel through thier arc.
Rob

Rob,
This is great information. Thank you.

[Drive Stainless]

. If you're using the correct original snubwashers I would definately advise using two at each inner bsg to frame mount. The other way to go is use a single washer that is double the thickness as the originals and your tolerance would be the same.

Rob


When you say "two at each inner to frame mount," you mean one snub washer on each side of the frame mount? Or do you mean [B]two snub washers stacked together on each side of the inner bushing frame mount?

The reason I ask is because when you say, "use a single washer that is double the thickness as the originals," it would seem to apply where there are two snub washers stacked together, but where would this be? In other words, would the replaced single washer go in the inside of the control arm or on the outside of the control arm adjacent to the bolthead/nut?

[PJ Grady Inc.]

When you say "two at each inner to frame mount," you mean one snub washer on each side of the frame mount? Or do you mean [B]two snub washers stacked together on each side of the inner bushing frame mount?

The reason I ask is because when you say, "use a single washer that is double the thickness as the originals," it would seem to apply where there are two snub washers stacked together, but where would this be? In other words, would the replaced single washer go in the inside of the control arm or on the outside of the control arm adjacent to the bolthead/nut?

Yes two snub washers stacked on each inner bushing to frame mount if using NOS #100480 which I believe are NLA. They are about about .043" so you double that for the original factory shimstack thickness.
Rob

[hippieman9]

Yes two snub washers stacked on each inner bushing to frame mount if using NOS #100480 which I believe are NLA. They are about about .043" so you double that for the original factory shimstack thickness.
Rob

So I reinstalled the snub washers as a stacked pair one pair on each side of the shock mount tower. It makes more sense because you can see the gap is about as wide as the two washers. I assume if it only has one washer in there it could put some extra tension on the UCA, maybe even bind it a little.

[er1c]

Glad I found this thread as I was beginning to lose the plot re-assembling my Upper control arm setup with what came off.

https://store.delorean.com/parts/suspension-steering/5-1-0-front-suspension.html

The current DMCH says below.

BOLT HEAD - SNUB WASHER -- Large Washer -- Contol arm -- Large Washer-- Frame-- Large Washer -- Control Arm -- Large Washer-- Snub Washer-- Nut

Is there a reason the above link is so thoroughly misleading ? It references 4 large 1/2 washers on re-assembly which just don't fit and snub washers on the outside.

For total clarity are we following Robs advice now saying

NUT --- Large Washer -- CONTROL ARM --- 2 snub washers --- FRAME -- 2 snub washers -- CONTROL ARM -- Large Washer -- Bolt head.

[82DMC12]

Glad I found this thread. I think er1c is explaining it pretty well. I'm about to put my front suspension back onto the car and was double-checking that I had all the hardware and found myself extremely confused regarding parts 44 and 45 in the illustration. It seems the descriptions are backwards and the illustration needs to show a total of QTY 4 "45's" between the upper arm bushings.

Speaking of weird drawing, I'm totally lost regarding SNUB WASHERS as it pertains to the anti roll bar. This is item #20 in the same diagram. It says QTY 12 required? What's going on here? The illustration looks like they are stacking washers on top of each other? How do you know how many snub washers are needed in the front and rear of the LCA attachment point if you are assembling from scratch? Do you install the LCA, ball joints, upper wishbone, and knuckle first so they are in alignment, and then try fitting the ARB - and if there's so much slack that it would pull the LCA forward once you tighten it down, that means you need more snub washers in the front?