DMCH Making new vehicles

[Exolis]

So you may have seen articles popping up about DMCH making new cars. (http://www.click2houston.com/news/deloreans-to-go-back-to-the-future-and-into-production).

I'm a little confused by this... I had thought they were already doing this? Or was I just mistaken for taking existing VIN and restoring the vehicle to brand new condition? If so, I assume this means new VINs will be issued?

Also, anyone know the legal reasons why they couldn't do this before and what changed in this Federal bill to allow it?

Last question, in the last sentence Mr. Wynne states something about freshening up areas they see fit (in the future), is this implying possibility of engineering new parts for the vehicle?

[ccurzio]

I'm pretty sure this is the Low Volume Motor Vehicle Manufacturers Act of 2015 bubbling back to the surface.

As much as I like and support the DMCH guys and their franchises, I'm against this. I understand the need for a company to enter new vertical markets, but DMCH is already relatively successful and I'd much rather the parts went to keeping the existing DMC-12s on the road.

[OverlandMan]

Read these articles: http://www.autoblog.com/2015/06/11/congress-low-volume-turn-key-replica-bill/

http://jalopnik.com/new-low-volume-car-bill-is-almost-great-save-for-one-bi-1712399892

[DMCVegas]

I'm pretty sure this is the Low Volume Motor Vehicle Manufacturers Act of 2015 bubbling back to the surface.

As much as I like and support the DMCH guys and their franchises, I'm against this. I understand the need for a company to enter new vertical markets, but DMCH is already relatively successful and I'd much rather the parts went to keeping the existing DMC-12s on the road.

It absolutely is in relation to that act. And it's been pretty well covered here before: http://dmctalk.org/showthread.php?12891-New-Deloreans-with-over-300hp-coming&highlight=replica

Espy though said that it should be closer to about 500 cars, and that they will be equipped with 3.7L 360hp engines.

As for the parts inventory draining for our cars, I'm not worried about it in the least. I seriously doubt that it will hamper availability for anything we need. Hell, who knows if it doesn't just open up some possibilities for us if we can get engine swap kits from DMCH?

[Trstno1]

I'm thinking this could be a good thing. I highly doubt that the building of the new cars would completely drain the parts pool for our cars. If they actually run out of something they now have the incentive to re-engineer the part thus keeping the parts flow going. Also, at 100k each it's bound to raise the value of the originals. It's a win win!

[AugustneverEnds]

I'm pretty sure this is the Low Volume Motor Vehicle Manufacturers Act of 2015 bubbling back to the surface.

As much as I like and support the DMCH guys and their franchises, I'm against this. I understand the need for a company to enter new vertical markets, but DMCH is already relatively successful and I'd much rather the parts went to keeping the existing DMC-12s on the road.

I agree. The other reasons I am not keen on this idea is that is a DeLorean DMC-12 really a DeLorean DMC-12 when it hasn't been assembled in Dunmurry, Northern Ireland in 1981 or '82 and sold to dealerships by a company controlled by JZD himself? And without a PRV engine and drivetrain? To me the car represents JZD, Bill Collins, Colins Chapman and Spooner, Ital Design, dozens of other engineers, the several hundred other companies that supplied parts and services, the thousands of workers at Dunmurry and the QACs, and a very specific time and world then it was built. Just taking some old factory parts with some new parts and an alien engine doesn't equal a DeLorean to me. Part of the thrill and mystique of getting a DeLorean is knowing its been around for 30+ years and there can only be a finite number in existence. It's historical and you can't remanufacture history.

On an impassionate note, I really wonder if there is much of a market for a new DeLorean especially at $100,000 :jawdrop: That's even more adjusted for inflation than the first go around!

[Jimmyvonviggle]

Funny I was watching Chicago news today and a piece came on about this. I doubt there will be much interest in any new DeLoreans at that price.

[john 05141]

Man, this is a total deja vue. How many times has this been announced?

In case it would be true.. it wil ruin the rich history of the Delorean.
What is the best way to use your sleeping existing inventory and raise the price of declining number of hard to get parts???? Right, use them in vehicles and put it al on the road.
I have an almost prestine Delorean but my car becomes more valuable in just some parts, I will have someone take it apart and I will sell the car.

I hear some brands are relaunching succesful models like Volkswagen did with the beetle, or Fiat with the 500.It is obvious a hyper modern car with a blink to that car's history with every safety feature. Can we expect a Delorean with ABS, airbags, a bunch of sensors,
I'd rather see new maufactured parts....

Jan

[JRNY13]

Do they really have 300 left front fenders laying around?

[Delorean3610]

Do they really have 300 left front fenders laying around?


Probably not, but now they may try and stamp a good volume of them for new and original cars.

[lindbergh]

Check out - http://www.msn.com/en-us/tv/story/delorean-cars-are-coming-back/vp-BBoMerD and http://www.wral.com/delorean-goes-back-to-the-future-into-production/15280933/

Any takers for 100K. I think they plan on building 300 of them.

[cpistocco]

Check out - http://www.msn.com/en-us/tv/story/delorean-cars-are-coming-back/vp-BBoMerD and http://www.wral.com/delorean-goes-back-to-the-future-into-production/15280933/

Any takers for 100K. I think they plan on building 300 of them.

Maybe that crazy-high price will bring up values for the original cars... We have been stuck at 25k for a while!

[ssdelorean]

Man, this is a total deja vue. How many times has this been announced?


Jan


39384
3938539386

[Henrik]

Everyone here at work have forwarded this news to me all day long today - but - DMCH have offered new cars based on NOS for as long as I can remember, so what new opportunities has this law brought with respect to DMCH? Just curious...

[opethmike]

Folks, it's been 10+ years and they still haven't produced a binnacle. So why do people even begin to believe that they can build a "new" car that legally requires a modern engine?

[lindbergh]

Everyone here at work have forwarded this news to me all day long today - but - DMCH have offered new cars based on NOS for as long as I can remember, so what new opportunities has this law brought with respect to DMCH? Just curious...

To my knowledge DMC has never built a car from NOS or anything else without a VIN plate from the original vehicle. That will change now and new VIN's will be issued. A few weeks ago a never registered vehicle was in their showroom for 54k, but it was not new and had an old VIN.

[sdg3205]

Whether it happens or not it's blowing up. I must have had 10 people in 6 hours tell me about it. Even had a request for a news piece. It's tough because above and beyond all the typical misinformation we have to correct it's so much work to explain that this isn't really new information.

[Bitsyncmaster]

My face book feed is filled about 70% with this info.

[SoCalDMC12]

Probably not, but now they may try and stamp a good volume of them for new and original cars.

.... or 3d print. The tech has come a long way in just the last couple of years. Great for low volume production.

[Peripatetic]

Probably not, but now they may try and stamp a good volume of them for new and original cars.
This is why I see this as good news. All of the out of stock pieces will be remade. Unless they found a secret stash of front left fenders and cubby covers.

At one new $100,000 DeLorean a week it would take over seven years to run through all of the remaining pieces so to keep it going they'll have to reproduce all of everything. The alternative is to have the cars slowly disappear as they crash, break and then abandon, left in old mine shafts, or sit in garages until the owner dies. Not knowing the specifics, I would imagine that they might have fewer drivable cars every year that they can sell services and parts to.

[WNY1983]

Ok let's review. Over the years DMC Houston has made a few claims. 1. The production of DeLorean wine. I'm sure that was a real seller? 2. The proposal of manufacturing the Saturn Sky and the Pontiac Solstice, That did not happen. Oh and lets not forget the DeLorean Luggage. I never thought of buying that. And last but not least. The electric DeLorean DMC-12. I heard they made just one. So now they want to make Back to the Future cars with old stock. Cost about $100,00.00. Well if they make a profit I will be amazed. I'll just sit back with the pop corn, and see what happens. I would not bet the farm on this one.

[cpistocco]

To my knowledge DMC has never built a car from NOS or anything else without a VIN plate from the original vehicle. That will change now and new VIN's will be issued. A few weeks ago a never registered vehicle was in their showroom for 54k, but it was not new and had an old VIN.

I wonder if they are going to use up a lot of rare parts????

[Rob Greenhaw]

I wonder if they are going to use up a lot of rare parts????

That's my fear, too that they will use up parts needed for current cars, thus driving the price even higher due to increased scarcity.

At this point, you'd think 3-D printing would alleviate the pains of unavailable parts these days.

[Nicholas R]

Honestly, the thing that keeps getting me is the 1 car per week figure that is mentioned everywhere. Is this really possible? Is DMCH opening a new production location with an assembly line? If so then thats great for them, it's just something I've heard nothing about.

We've had multiple "follow the process of my new build DMC" threads on here in the past and they take months to build (if not years). Check out Mario's DMCH electric delorean thread, which is currently ongoing, and has been for over a year (http://dmctalk.org/showthread.php?11244-Electric-DeLorean&highlight=electric+delorean), and DMCH isn't even doing the drivetrain. How do we go from building 75% of a car in a year, to one car a week? Were 52 other cars from scratch (refurbs) built last year from the time Mario placed his order and started his thread, up to today? I'm really curious how they're going to ramp up production so much.

Aside from that, I'm just curious about demand. Is there really a demand for $100,000 DeLoreans? I mean heck, there's not THAT big of a demand for $25-40,000 DeLoreans. Are there 52 people every year ready to buy a "new" 100k DMC?

EDIT: According to one article, they currently make one car per month. Not sure if this is credible or not but I figured it was worth sharing. If this is true, a 400% increase in production is pretty huge.

[RamblinDMC]

Ok let's review. Over the years DMC Houston has made a few claims. 1. The production of DeLorean wine. I'm sure that was a real seller? 2. The proposal of manufacturing the Saturn Sky and the Pontiac Solstice, That did not happen. Oh and lets not forget the DeLorean Luggage. I never thought of buying that. And last but not least. The electric DeLorean DMC-12. I heard they made just one. So now they want to make Back to the Future cars with old stock. Cost about $100,00.00. Well if they make a profit I will be amazed. I'll just sit back with the pop corn, and see what happens. I would not bet the farm on this one.

What's the Sky/Solstice story?

[Mario]

At this point, you'd think 3-D printing would alleviate the pains of unavailable parts these days.

3D printing isn't really the solution for things like this. There's a couple problems with 3D printing parts for, say, a DeLorean:
- Making large parts is very expensive. Anything over, say, a foot in any dimension is going to cost a lot of money.
- 3D printed parts can be made pretty strongly depending on the technology used, but they're never as strong as properly machined, cast, or injection-molded parts. Printing, say, a valve cover would cost WAY more than it would cost to cast it, and wouldn't even be as strong.
- Cosmetic parts still need to be sanded and/or painted to get a good finish. The printing process leaves visible layers and other visual artifacts.
- You can print transparent plastics, but they are cloudy or have bad finish.

3D printing IS good for small, non-cosmetic, low-strength parts. It'd be perfect for the back half of the clock module housing, for example. The fuse block might actually be a suitable part to 3D print. But if you want to make a whole lot of them, injection molding is still the best way to go.

3D printing is often used for fast prototyping of products, since it's much faster than machining and lower-cost than injection molding or machining (for small quantities).

[Peripatetic]

That's my fear, too that they will use up parts needed for current cars, thus driving the price even higher due to increased scarcity.

At this point, you'd think 3-D printing would alleviate the pains of unavailable parts these days.
Driving up the prices of the rare parts would backfire on them as it would make the cost of the new cars even more expensive. Most likely theyll need to reproduce all of the missing parts which would bring the cost of parts down or remain flat. Having a DeLorean made of all original parts would be harder, though. I'm not sure how important that is.

[DMCVegas]

What's the Sky/Solstice story?

When GM went bankrupt and had to shut down divisions, the Wilmington Delaware plant where the Solstice and Sky were manufactured went onto the chopping block. Then GM was looking to unload both the entire factory as well as the full Kappa platform. DMCH made it publicly known that they were looking to be the buyer for everything, and wanted to take over Wilmington Assembly to keep the entire plant open to keep cranking out cars... but they would be rebadged as DeLoreans, and this was the proposed rendering of the rebadged Kappa in DMC skin:

http://image.motortrend.com/f/we-hear/delorean-solstice-company-dreaming-about-a-kappa-revival-tour/25403432+w527+st0/new-delorean-kappa-solstice.jpg

For whatever reason, GM pretty much refused to even acknowledge the offer and instead sold the plant off to Fisker... who went bankrupt. So not only did Wilmington loose a significant manufacturing plant, but Delaware and the Federal government took huge losses for Fisker's subsidies that never paid off.



Honestly, the thing that keeps getting me is the 1 car per week figure that is mentioned everywhere. Is this really possible? Is DMCH opening a new production location with an assembly line? If so then thats great for them, it's just something I've heard nothing about.

You know what's hilarious about that? I have a coworker who on Tuesday was arguing with me that somewhere up north of Houston off the freeway, he saw a large building with a DeLorean Motor Company sign. I'm pretty sure that he was confused about the Humble location, but if he ever figures it out, I might just take a drive for the hell of it.

Come to think of it, while Fisker got the plant, I don't remember who the Kappa platform was sold to, if at all... Pure coincidence at this point, but a fun "what-if" story none the less.


Aside from that, I'm just curious about demand. Is there really a demand for $100,000 DeLoreans? I mean heck, there's not THAT big of a demand for $25-40,000 DeLoreans. Are there 52 people every year ready to buy a "new" 100k DMC?

If this car is any indication about what *might* be coming our way based upon a potential drivetrain choice, then yes, there is a damn good chance there is a solid demand for DMCH's new car.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pawmdwhBQDQ

It's funny to me, because everyone as of right now is up in arms because it's not a "real" DeLorean given it isn't made by the old DeLorean Motor Company, and therefore isn't as good. But the irony may just be that if we finally see a production car that has modern performance to finally match the looks with this proposed program, we may just find that it will be the Replicas that garner more respect than our old cars.

You've got legions of people who hate the DMC-12 because hating it is the cool thing to do. But if there is a "new" car the proves them "wrong" by showing off what was always the car's true potential, BUT also has a new, separate provenance as an excuse to still dislike our old cars while gushing over the new ones? Well, we might yet find ourselves on the short end of the stick thanks to a new little cousin that literally runs circles around us. Be prepared.

[toyotafreak88]

This is amazing news! And sad news for people like me who could not afford a good original, let alone a new one.

I wonder how it will look with the new wheels they say it will have? I'm also excited to see what they bring to the table for redesigning the drivetrain and mass producing that. They could also sell conversion kits to refit older cars, theoretically. .. If they don't already.

I saw a video where someone had a single piece main transmission shaft (I think that was the part) made for his ls1 swap, I wonder what DMC will change in the transmission?

[81dmc]

Maybe now DMCH will finally start reproducing many parts that are NLA. (Interior panels, shift linkages, etc.)

[valdez]

I think this is more dreaming and drumming up attention rather than reality

[Dangermouse]

So, say the engine is the Toyota 3.5-liter 2GR-FSE V6 (based on an educated guess in the Jalopnik (http://jalopnik.com/the-delorean-is-coming-back-thanks-to-this-new-law-1755528406) article), basically the Camry engine used by Lotus and also in the Lexus IS - seems as plausible as anything.

Where would you get it serviced? Will all the DMC locations be qualified to service/troubleshoot it, particularly if it is mated to a non-Toyota transaxle? Or wil it be just DMCH? Are you going to take your $100k retro-classic car to the Toyota dealership? To your neighborhood Lotus dealer? (same issue with other vendors/suppliers - perhaps they can call on Will.i.am for his Chrysler connections)

I assume it will come with a warranty? (Imagine, a DeLorean with a warranty :), I mean longer than the 6 months I think they give their re-builds). Lexus offer a 4 year/48000 mile drivetrain warranty; Lotus is 3 years/36000. What will DMC offer

Now, no doubt these are the sorts of things DMCH are presently thrashing out in preparation for a 2017 launch. I'm sure there will be subsequent news releases when a supplier is sourced etc.

[iflights]

In Michigan they would not be able to be purchased directly by the Manufacturer. Michigan law requires a dealership, and there's a set of definitions to accompany what a dealership must have. A clear defensive move against Tesla selling direct sponsored by dealers.

[Dangermouse]

I assume you mean

"In Michigan they would not be able to be purchased directly from the Manufacturer"

[iflights]

I assume you mean

"In Michigan they would not be able to be purchased directly from the Manufacturer"

Precisely!

[David T]

The biggest problem I see is what will they do for motors and transmissions? They can use up their stock of NOS, they can acquire used ones and rebuild them, OR they can try to find something that can replace it (the most expensive option). All of the other individual parts can be reproduced one way or another. 300 motors and transmissions is a LOT of stock and expense and they will not be able to get enough old, used ones and they don't have that many NOS ones.

[Mark D]

How many times has DMCH fooled the public with some type of "New" DeLorean? First the restoration builds were called new, then the whole Solstice thing, then the electric DeLoreans... I know I'm not the first to say it, but at this point I'm convinced this is just another publicity stunt to get the DMC name out in the news and drum up business.

http://dmctalk.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=39390&d=1453993338

[81dmc]

To my knowledge, they are supposed to be using newer EPA engines with 300+ HP. As for the transmissions, I have no clue.

[Timebender]

- 3D printed parts can be made pretty strongly depending on the technology used, but they're never as strong as properly machined, cast, or injection-molded parts. Printing, say, a valve cover would cost WAY more than it would cost to cast it, and wouldn't even be as strong.

SpaceX's rocket engines are all 3D printed vs cast and welded. They end up being stronger, lighter, and less prone to manufacturing defects (where weld joints can split, etc.).

But they are expensive, as is all 3D printing for now.

[Timebender]

To my knowledge, they are supposed to be using newer EPA engines with 300+ HP. As for the transmissions, I have no clue.

That's what the news said. I'd bet it's going to be something like the Ford 6 cylinder EcoBoost like in the new Mustangs.

From the Ford Mustang page: 2.3L EcoBoost®
The 2.3L EcoBoost engine delivers 310hp* and 320 lb.-ft.* An optimally sized twin-scroll turbocharger separates the exhaust runners in two chambers that run all the way to the turbine. This transfers high-pulse energy to the turbine wheel, resulting in ultrafast time-to-torque. If all this sounds too technical, simply give ‘er the gas and enjoy the quick response.

[Timebender]

I saw a video where someone had a single piece main transmission shaft (I think that was the part) made for his ls1 swap, I wonder what DMC will change in the transmission?

That was Nick Roedl's car. He designed the shaft, 3D printed it, cast it, then had it made.

[Dangermouse]

Presumably the new car will be called the DMC-100.

[cpistocco]

Isn't there already a shortage on front fenders? Are they going to tool-up and start stamping out more stainless? What will they use for binnacles?

[Bruce Johnson]

Presumably the new car will be called the DMC-100.

...and 25, 35, 45

[steel-and-fire]

The Delorean is one of the cars lucky enough to have its own dealer and parts factory. Unless its a muscle car or popular fifties car, parts can get hard to find. Moreso when you consider this doesn't share many parts of other divisions like the Big Three do, and is primarily European.

I don't see the "New Builds Round Two" as that big of a deal. It reminds me of what they did to make the Jensen Interceptor R; an old Jensen was stuffed with a modern engine, drivetrain, and brakes while still looking 70s stock. Even it it was a Toyota V6 as a replacement powerplant, there would still be a prospective buyer. Even as a non-owner, I can see this as a boast for creating new parts that might be scarce from the shelves. It'd be funny if this entire venture was just an excuse to purchase the manufacturing abilities to produce left fenders (3D Printer plus Stamping machine and order of Stainless; not cheap)

Admittedly though, if I was spending in the area of 100K on a Delorean, I'd want it with one of these from DPI:
http://cdn6.bigcommerce.com/s-xpmvynv/products/1185/images/762/twin_turbo_ariel__29646.1420863629.800.600.jpg?c=2

[iflights]

Presumably the new car will be called the DMC-100.

I see what you did there.

[Ikeaboy1]

Admittedly though, if I was spending in the area of 100K on a Delorean, I'd want it with one of these from DPI:
http://cdn6.bigcommerce.com/s-xpmvynv/products/1185/images/762/twin_turbo_ariel__29646.1420863629.800.600.jpg?c=2

This x1000.

For $100,000, a better than new and fast as shit option has already existed. Holding a registration with a 2017 model year just isn't necessary.

Great news coverage. But nothing will come of this. No more than the electric Delorean vaporware.

[DMCVegas]

How many times has DMCH fooled the public with some type of "New" DeLorean? First the restoration builds were called new, then the whole Solstice thing, then the electric DeLoreans... I know I'm not the first to say it, but at this point I'm convinced this is just another publicity stunt to get the DMC name out in the news and drum up business.

http://41.media.tumblr.com/2da97c1053a9ca3cd2836d8685b693e6/tumblr_mv6sqlF4yM1r3yxp8o1_500.jpg

How exactly was anyone "fooled"? Yeah, the utilization of the word "New" for that "New Build Program" was a poor choice to say the least. Especially when it didn't get the proper documented follow-up, or at least one that no one paid enough attention to where you could see how you could have a DMC-12 restored and then "built" back up with your choice of more modern options and whatnot. But they built that EV, and apparently did indeed want to buy the Wilmington plant and Kappa platform. Along with all of this, we've now seen lighter underbodies that they've developed, and some new & improved new parts that have come about for us. And now this. It's one thing to simply go ahead and put press releases out there. It's an entirely different thing when you actually build new parts and entirely redesigned interiors, and then your congressman down the road literally submits and receives approval of a bill that changes an entire nation's laws so that you have a clear path to build a new car.

If anything I suppose that a lack of communication with the DeLorean community directly is probably DMCH's biggest problem. But also, I don't blame them! If James Espy, or Steven or Cameron Wynne, or anyone else popped up here or elsewhere on the internet, they'd get their asses flamed so hard by everyone that DMCH would look like another Texas barbecue shack on the side of the road.

B-b-but what about the Binnacles? Which is what everyone harps on and on about... If DMCH put those things on sale right now, today, how many of you would actually buy them? Because I can tell you for a fact that I would NOT. I'm already on my second NOS Binnacle, and it cracked years ago. I'd rather get it recovered in leather or vinyl to stop that from happening AGAIN. And how many others would do the same, or already have?

I'm just curious here, because it seems like there is lots of just disdain for a new car that I don't see a reasoning for. If they build it, great. If not, that's ok too. It doesn't impact my ownership, so I don't care.

[opethmike]

http://41.media.tumblr.com/2da97c1053a9ca3cd2836d8685b693e6/tumblr_mv6sqlF4yM1r3yxp8o1_500.jpg

How exactly was anyone "fooled"? Yeah, the utilization of the word "New" for that "New Build Program" was a poor choice to say the least. Especially when it didn't get the proper documented follow-up, or at least one that no one paid enough attention to where you could see how you could have a DMC-12 restored and then "built" back up with your choice of more modern options and whatnot. But they built that EV, and apparently did indeed want to buy the Wilmington plant and Kappa platform. Along with all of this, we've now seen lighter underbodies that they've developed, and some new & improved new parts that have come about for us. And now this. It's one thing to simply go ahead and put press releases out there. It's an entirely different thing when you actually build new parts and entirely redesigned interiors, and then your congressman down the road literally submits and receives approval of a bill that changes an entire nation's laws so that you have a clear path to build a new car.

If anything I suppose that a lack of communication with the DeLorean community directly is probably DMCH's biggest problem. But also, I don't blame them! If James Espy, or Steven or Cameron Wynne, or anyone else popped up here or elsewhere on the internet, they'd get their asses flamed so hard by everyone that DMCH would look like another Texas barbecue shack on the side of the road.

B-b-but what about the Binnacles? Which is what everyone harps on and on about... If DMCH put those things on sale right now, today, how many of you would actually buy them? Because I can tell you for a fact that I would NOT. I'm already on my second NOS Binnacle, and it cracked years ago. I'd rather get it recovered in leather or vinyl to stop that from happening AGAIN. And how many others would do the same, or already have?

I'm just curious here, because it seems like there is lots of just disdain for a new car that I don't see a reasoning for. If they build it, great. If not, that's ok too. It doesn't impact my ownership, so I don't care.



Mmmmmmm, barbecued ass.

[burch]

B-b-but what about the Binnacles? Which is what everyone harps on and on about... If DMCH put those things on sale right now, today, how many of you would actually buy them? Because I can tell you for a fact that I would NOT. I'm already on my second NOS Binnacle, and it cracked years ago. I'd rather get it recovered in leather or vinyl to stop that from happening AGAIN. And how many others would do the same, or already have?


Specifically on that point, I would not buy a NOS binnacle. Especially here in AZ. The same problem would crop up very soon. A different core would make all the difference, assuming no heat warpage.

[DMCVegas]

And here we go. You can throw out a random press releases, but United States Congressmen do not cavalierly toss out them out on your behalf. Especially not when they're bragging about job creation that their opponents can use against them in the future if DMCH fails to deliver.

https://www.facebook.com/RepGeneGreen/

https://green.house.gov/media-center/press-releases/green-bill-puts-delorean-back-production-creates-least-40-jobs-29th

[Project Vixen]

Three words: Public Relations Stunt. They will sell just as many new cars as they sold of the 'new' electric model they introduced a few years back... or of the other 'new' DMC they introduced a few years before that.

James is great at getting the name DeLorean out there in the press -- he's a truly great marketing guy -- but don't hold your breath waiting for a new DMC.

Love ya', James -- but I'll likely see the gullwings on a flying pig before I see a 'new' DMC. =-)

[Josh]

So, say the engine is the Toyota 3.5-liter 2GR-FSE V6 (based on an educated guess in the Jalopnik (http://jalopnik.com/the-delorean-is-coming-back-thanks-to-this-new-law-1755528406) article), basically the Camry engine used by Lotus and also in the Lexus IS - seems as plausible as anything.

Where would you get it serviced? Will all the DMC locations be qualified to service/troubleshoot it, particularly if it is mated to a non-Toyota transaxle? Or wil it be just DMCH? Are you going to take your $100k retro-classic car to the Toyota dealership? To your neighborhood Lotus dealer? (same issue with other vendors/suppliers - perhaps they can call on Will.i.am for his Chrysler connections)

I assume it will come with a warranty? (Imagine, a DeLorean with a warranty :), I mean longer than the 6 months I think they give their re-builds). Lexus offer a 4 year/48000 mile drivetrain warranty; Lotus is 3 years/36000. What will DMC offer

Now, no doubt these are the sorts of things DMCH are presently thrashing out in preparation for a 2017 launch. I'm sure there will be subsequent news releases when a supplier is sourced etc.

From a design aspect I have severe doubts. How are they planning on mating the engine to the transaxle? It is not an easy process, not to mention all the mounts and integration into the existing vehicle systems. The wiring harness would need to be entirely re-vamped. Major engineering time and costs. This is not a one-off, this is a production run.

I would hope that they dont use the Renault tansaxle at all. Feeding 300+ ftlbs to it would make it a ticking timebomb.

I am highly doubtful we will ever see a "new" delorean, in consensus with the rest of this thread... Very frustrating to see all these articles putting the cart before the horse.

[Rich]

Moderators:
Recommending a merge of this thread 13126 with Thread 13123 - both on same subject, DMCH's announcement this week.
Thank you.

[delgato]

If anything I suppose that a lack of communication with the DeLorean community directly is probably DMCH's biggest problem. But also, I don't blame them! If James Espy, or Steven or Cameron Wynne, or anyone else popped up here or elsewhere on the internet, they'd get their asses flamed so hard by everyone that DMCH would look like another Texas barbecue shack on the side of the road.


Why is it that DMCH does not post up any info here? They do not seem to post much of anything on this forum.

If I were a prospective buyer for a NEW Delorean, I would surely be researching on line and would end up on this forum in this thread. All I have read is that there are a bunch of parts nla, they do not seem equipped to go into mass production and build time can take over a year or more. Not very encouraging for 100K decision.

Hey, yo! DMCH what's happening? What to chime in over here?

If not I guess that is cool, your choice.

We will all just continue on with a lot of speculation and conjecture.

[DMCVegas]

From a design aspect I have severe doubts. How are they planning on mating the engine to the transaxle? It is not an easy process, not to mention all the mounts and integration into the existing vehicle systems. The wiring harness would need to be entirely re-vamped. Major engineering time and costs. This is not a one-off, this is a production run.

I would hope that they dont use the Renault tansaxle at all. Feeding 300+ ftlbs to it would make it a ticking timebomb.

I am highly doubtful we will ever see a "new" delorean, in consensus with the rest of this thread... Very frustrating to see all these articles putting the cart before the horse.

I've seen plenty of amateur people perform successful engine swaps over the years in DeLoreans, as well as other cars. I can't imagine that DMCH is going to have all that much difficulty doing it with their vastly larger resources. As for the wiring harness, I've honestly no idea what you're talking about. A large part of this rule is that the new engines must be OBD-II compliant. Which MANY engines come with full kits that include compliant ECUs as well as engine wiring harness kits. So save for a some simple fabrication, the engines are going to be literal plug & play.

As for the transaxle, man, there are so many more options available out there than just an orphaned Renault. I've no idea what direction they'd be going in, but Quaife comes to mind as my best guess. Specifically the QBE72G.

It still stands to be seen, but I really do think that this is going to happen. Not because of wishful thinking, but because just too many things here click. And I think that we're going to see new cars with drivetrains similar to what the Ginetta G60 or the Radical RXC use. I think that this sub $100,000 price tag is probably less about markup, and more about these new drivetrain components and the in-house manufacturing.



Why is it that DMCH does not post up any info here? They do not seem to post much of anything on this forum.

Truthfully, this isn't anything different than any other vehicle that comes about from major manufacturers. It's just that you have tons more people doing what I'm doing: Substituting opinions in place of actual information, which keeps you from realizing the difference.

Aside from that, DAMN! Y'all been seriously-ass negative about this. Complaining about parts availability, and provenance, and now about how DMCH doesn't want to share more information. Honestly, why would they ever want to engage any of us here one-on-one with how negative, if not a bit hostile towards them?

[Lou and "Boo"]

And here we go. You can throw out a random press releases, but United States Congressmen do not cavalierly toss out them out on your behalf. Especially not when they're bragging about job creation that their opponents can use against them in the future if DMCH fails to deliver.

https://www.facebook.com/RepGeneGreen/

https://green.house.gov/media-center/press-releases/green-bill-puts-delorean-back-production-creates-least-40-jobs-29th


Back in 2008, I recall a certain prominent politician who promised millions of "shovel-ready jobs," only to later joke after the $1T in taxpayer's money was gone "shovel-ready wasn't as shovel-ready as we expected." I'm pretty sure that he managed to get re-elected, but I can't remember. Anyone know who I'm talking about here?

Thankfully, he cannot be re-elected for another term. That is, unless he ends term limits with another 'executive order'.

[DMCVegas]

Back in 2008, I recall a certain prominent politician who promised millions of "shovel-ready jobs," only to later joke after the $1T in taxpayer's money was gone "shovel-ready wasn't as shovel-ready as we expected." I'm pretty sure that he managed to get re-elected, but I can't remember. Anyone know who I'm talking about here?

Thankfully, he cannot be re-elected for another term. That is, unless he ends term limits with another 'executive order'.

And that is a very fair statement to be sure. You're right. I would however say that with a far more controversial subject, specifically the DeLorean, there's a lot more risk for a lower-ranking politician to endorse such a project, as they would have a whole lot more to lose.

[Henrik]

Three words: Public Relations Stunt. They will sell just as many new cars as they sold of the 'new' electric model they introduced a few years back... or of the other 'new' DMC they introduced a few years before that.

James is great at getting the name DeLorean out there in the press -- he's a truly great marketing guy -- but don't hold your breath waiting for a new DMC.

Love ya', James -- but I'll likely see the gullwings on a flying pig before I see a 'new' DMC. =-)

I'm kinda thinking the same thing. Coming back to my post #3 and the reply in #4. The big impedance to selling new cars in the past has likely not been b/c they have had to use existing VIN numbers. Instead, I would think the price has been and remains the biggest hurdle.

[Josh]

I've seen plenty of amateur people perform successful engine swaps over the years in DeLoreans, as well as other cars. I can't imagine that DMCH is going to have all that much difficulty doing it with their vastly larger resources. As for the wiring harness, I've honestly no idea what you're talking about. A large part of this rule is that the new engines must be OBD-II compliant. Which MANY engines come with full kits that include compliant ECUs as well as engine wiring harness kits. So save for a some simple fabrication, the engines are going to be literal plug & play.

As for the transaxle, man, there are so many more options available out there than just an orphaned Renault. I've no idea what direction they'd be going in, but Quaife comes to mind as my best guess. Specifically the QBE72G.

It still stands to be seen, but I really do think that this is going to happen. Not because of wishful thinking, but because just too many things here click. And I think that we're going to see new cars with drivetrains similar to what the Ginetta G60 or the Radical RXC use. I think that this sub $100,000 price tag is probably less about markup, and more about these new drivetrain components and the in-house manufacturing.


Stick to what you know.
Plug and play? are you kidding me?
I dont know why you are bringing up a sequential shifting box with no overdrive. Hardly useful for a road-going vehicle.

I am one of those "amateurs" that have preformed engine swaps. I am also an industrial engineer by trade, currently working as a manufacturing engineer. There is a lot of hurdles behind the scenes needed to make this happen.

[DMCVegas]

There is a lot of hurdles behind the scenes needed to make this happen.

True. But who is to say they haven't already been made months, or even years ago?

My bad on that transaxle number too. Pasted the wrong one. But there ARE many, many other options out there such as this as an example:

http://quaife.co.uk/quaife-zf-tranxaxle-back-popular-demand/

[Josh]

True. But who is to say they haven't already been made months, or even years ago?

My bad on that transaxle number too. Pasted the wrong one. But there ARE many, many other options out there such as this as an example:

http://quaife.co.uk/quaife-zf-tranxaxle-back-popular-demand/

Not really. There are many options for mid-engined gearboxes, but not so much for rear-engined setups. You can flip the diff in the ZF tansaxle, but not most transaxles. Something else to consider is these Quaife transaxles are retailing for 1/5 of the $100,000 new build cost. That does not add up if you are trying to turn a profit.

[Morpheus]

Three words: Public Relations Stunt. They will sell just as many new cars as they sold of the 'new' electric model they introduced a few years back... or of the other 'new' DMC they introduced a few years before that.

James is great at getting the name DeLorean out there in the press -- he's a truly great marketing guy -- but don't hold your breath waiting for a new DMC.

Love ya', James -- but I'll likely see the gullwings on a flying pig before I see a 'new' DMC. =-)

Completely agree with Dave on this one.

Remember kids, this is the same company that has been working on Binnacles for what is it now, 7 years? Every few months there's a new story about "New" DeLoreans, and every few months my FB feed is filled with excitement from people who know I own one. Honestly, I'll believe it when I see it.

Don't get me wrong, I really do appreciate the effort to increase the value of my "real" "Irish Built" DeLorean.

[DMCVegas]

Many transaxles are quite expensive, true. But that doesn't mean that they don't exist, nor never will for the DeLorean application. Who knows how that can be accomplished either. Some you can flip the entire unit, and others you could probably just flip the internal differential with a new casing or bellhousing to accommodate it's new position. Just like the Renault UN-Series we currently use. Who knows.

And as for price, the majority of the car's parts have already been paid for, so manufacturing is a whole lot cheaper here than it would be for other manufacturers too.

[Lou and "Boo"]

Stick to what you know.
Plug and play? are you kidding me?
I dont know why you are bringing up a sequential shifting box with no overdrive. Hardly useful for a road-going vehicle.

I am one of those "amateurs" that have preformed engine swaps. I am also an industrial engineer by trade, currently working as a manufacturing engineer. There is a lot of hurdles behind the scenes needed to make this happen.

+1

I did the most 'plug and play' engine swap in my Fiero (A gm 3800supercharged v6 3.8) and it was by no means 'plug and play'.

[Mark D]

How exactly was anyone "fooled"?

In terms of fooling people DMCH has been pretty skillful in getting a handful of news media outlets to run stories on their company and provide free advertising. It seems to be the same formula every 2 years or so:

"Hey guess what?! In 20XX we're planning on building ̶N̶E̶W̶ ̶D̶e̶L̶o̶r̶e̶a̶n̶s,̶ ̶P̶o̶n̶t̶i̶a̶c̶ ̶S̶o̶l̶s̶t̶i̶c̶e̶ ̶D̶e̶L̶o̶r̶e̶a̶n̶s,̶ ̶E̶l̶e̶c̶t̶r̶i̶c̶ ̶D̶e̶l̶o̶r̶e̶a̶n̶s, NEW new 2017 DeLoreans! The price will only be $100,000.000. Oh and by the way, just in case you can't wait that long, or don't want to spend 2x what a normal DeLorean is worth, you can buy a refurbished original DeLorean for $49,999.95. Visit our website for information blah blah blah"

DMCH doesn't have to actually produce anything and the internet blows up for a few days with everyone talking about the return of the DeLorean.

[Mark D]

three words: Public relations stunt. They will sell just as many new cars as they sold of the 'new' electric model they introduced a few years back... Or of the other 'new' dmc they introduced a few years before that.

James is great at getting the name delorean out there in the press -- he's a truly great marketing guy -- but don't hold your breath waiting for a new dmc.

Love ya', james -- but i'll likely see the gullwings on a flying pig before i see a 'new' dmc. =-)

100% agree

[Some guy]

The thing that held back all the other "New" Deloreans, was that they were the same as the original. They were forced to keep the same driving dynamics.

If you ask yourself what would a 100,00 dollar car have.

400 horse power
electric power steering
Full roll down windows.
i Pad style radio and AC controls
If they can improve the corning at high speeds.
sensors and cameras


If they improve the car to the point where it can keep up with a mid range Camero. I think then you have a car with the right value over the original.

[Dangermouse]

I asked this the last time we talked about it, but it was never really answered:

What's to stop someone going to DMC today and asking for a re-manufactured car with a (insert engine type here) engine? I mean legally, not physically. If I call James up and say; "I really want a re-man car with a VR6 (which fits fine), DIN stereo, upgraded wheels etc" could he not give me a quote on one?

If so, how is that different from these "new cars" apart from it having a 1981 VIN?

[DMCVegas]

I asked this the last time we talked about it, but it was never really answered:

What's to stop someone going to DMC today and asking for a re-manufactured car with a (insert engine type here) engine? I mean legally, not physically. If I call James up and say; "I really want a re-man car with a VR6 (which fits fine), DIN stereo, upgraded wheels etc" could he not give me a quote on one?

http://dmctalk.org/showthread.php?12891-New-Deloreans-with-over-300hp-coming&p=185969&viewfull=1#post185969


If so, how is that different from these "new cars" apart from it having a 1981 VIN?

The Replica law unlocks the restriction of paring an engine it's emissions controls to a specific platform, because it allows for an entirely NEW platform/powerplant combination for each vehicle.

[Dangermouse]

Oops, well I guess it did.

It was a busy Christmas time, what can I say.

[cpistocco]

Just so I have this straight- You guys are saying that they are not actually going to build 300 of these cars. Just as many as they sell? With the SELL part coming first :)

[Nicholas R]

That was Nick Roedl's car. He designed the shaft, 3D printed it, cast it, then had it made.

To be clear, the 3D printed parts I made were only to validate that I had the right normal and transverse module, pressure angle, helix angle, and pitch diameter, etc. of the gears themselves. 3D printing was not used in the manufacturing of the shaft itself. The shafts are not a casting. They are machined from forged 4340 barstock that is heat treated after machining.




I would hope that they dont use the Renault tansaxle at all. Feeding 300+ ftlbs to it would make it a ticking timebomb.
I would be interested to know if they would do some legitimate fatigue testing on this.


True. But who is to say they haven't already been made months, or even years ago?

My bad on that transaxle number too. Pasted the wrong one. But there ARE many, many other options out there such as this as an example:

http://quaife.co.uk/quaife-zf-tranxaxle-back-popular-demand/

I dont think there are quite as many transaxles available as you think; at least not ones that are realistic. I have done a lot of research on the different transaxle options, and because of our spacial limitations, we're pretty limited. Even the Porsche 915 and G50 are difficult to fit due to their size. Yes there are Hewlands, Mendoleas, Quaife, etc. that are special built for racing teams (most of which would require modifying the frame to accomodate the size), but as Josh said one transaxle can cost you $15,000+.

Personally, I do not see that as a viable option; especially considering that DMCH's goal with this is to use up the parts they have that they cant sell. I'd bet transmissions is one of them. Maybe they'll do what Lotus did with the V8 and just detune the engine to a level that the transmission can handle.

[opethmike]

Personally, I do not see that as a viable option; especially considering that DMCH's goal with this is to use up the parts they have that they cant sell. I'd bet transmissions is one of them. Maybe they'll do what Lotus did with the V8 and just detune the engine to a level that the transmission can handle.

I've been around A LOT of Lotus V8s. The engine was not detuned enough, trust me. They go kaboom quite often.

[Nicholas R]

I've been around A LOT of Lotus V8s. The engine was not detuned enough, trust me. They go kaboom quite often.

Thats good to know; I'll keep that in mind. I haven't been around enough of them to know for sure.

[opethmike]

Thats good to know; I'll keep that in mind. I haven't been around enough of them to know for sure.

I think a good portion of it has to do with people abusing the box with 1st gear launches, and not down shifting from 5th when going to pass, but still...

[rdarlington]

I'm thinking this could be a good thing. I highly doubt that the building of the new cars would completely drain the parts pool for our cars. If they actually run out of something they now have the incentive to re-engineer the part thus keeping the parts flow going. Also, at 100k each it's bound to raise the value of the originals. It's a win win!

Yeah, I made the mistake of saying something to this effect on FB and James Espey chimed in (last night/today). Is he always an asshole? He basically told me to f$@! off, the parts are his, etc. WTF? Maybe he doesn't realize the object in that sentence is *supply* and not *parts*. He just lost my business over this and my car is officially for sale. Let somebody else deal with him.

-Bobhttp://www.nerdhouse.org/espey.png

39447

[opethmike]

Yeah, I made the mistake of saying something to this effect on FB and James Espey chimed in (last night/today). Is he always an asshole? He basically told me to f$@! off, the parts are his, etc. WTF? Maybe he doesn't realize the object in that sentence is *supply* and not *parts*. He just lost my business over this and my car is officially for sale. Let somebody else deal with him.

-Bobhttp://www.nerdhouse.org/espey.png

39447

Wow. Just wow. That's some serious assholery there.

[81dmc]

Yeah, I made the mistake of saying something to this effect on FB and James Espey chimed in (last night/today). Is he always an asshole? He basically told me to f$@! off, the parts are his, etc. WTF? Maybe he doesn't realize the object in that sentence is *supply* and not *parts*. He just lost my business over this and my car is officially for sale. Let somebody else deal with him.

-Bobhttp://www.nerdhouse.org/espey.png

39447

...

So, Espey basically told ALL Delorean owners to F off? Well, if it wasn't for us owners, DMCH would be just a dusty, locked storage facility.

[Patrick C]

I am one who is optimistic about this new venture, but we've seen a similar announcement 3 times in the past 10 years with no results.

We had this in 2005:
http://dmctalk.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=39454&d=1454276549

This in 2009:
http://dmctalk.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=39457&d=1454276674

This in 2011:
http://dmctalk.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=39458&d=1454276967

And now this in 2016:
http://dmctalk.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=39459&d=1454277114

I want to be optimistic about this venture, but we have been let down before.

[Nicholas R]

*photos removed for post sizing*

I am one who is optimistic about this new venture, but we've seen a similar announcement 3 times in the past 10 years with no results.

We had this in 2005:
This in 2009:
This in 2011:
And now this in 2016:

I want to be optimistic about this venture, but we have been let down before.

I agree, I want to be optimistic about it too; its just difficult having all this behind us. This list doesn't even include the smaller projects that never really took off, like the new rims, stainless frames, new under-bodies, updated interior, the b-word (binnacles), and even Stage III seems to have fallen to the wayside (at least we rarely hear about it). I think the most successful thing they've ever launched was the stage II engine, however; if I recall correctly, didn't DMCH buy the performance cams that Don Steger had already designed and sell them with a new exhaust and ignition system? (dont quote me on this as I'm not completely sure). I'm always happy to be surprised though! If this venture leads to new innovations with the car, I will be happy about it and support it. :burnout:

Still, I do believe that despite having to constantly explain that my car is not a "new" DeLorean, or listen to someone explain their version of DMCH, having the DeLorean be in the news every few years does keep it in the public's eye (much more so than any other car with a DeLorean style history). I think a constant public awareness of the cars existence is not a bad thing, and ultimately, helps maintain the value of the car. I currently also own an Opel GT. You know how many people I run into know what an Opel is? Its not even a small fraction compared to those that know what a DeLorean is. Maybe if Opel GT Source made announcements about new Opels every few years, my car would be worth more, haha! :wink:

Also, to add to the previous announcements above^; I specifically remember a large "new build program" announcement in July/August of 2007. I remember because it happened while I was a co-op student at a company that I only worked at for one summer, and everyone was talking about it. It was when the $57,000 cars with stainless frames were announced. Is this different than the 2005 announcement? This was when they were supposedly going to be new VINs but built as kit cars, on the same principle as a Shelby Cobra kit car. Does anyone else remember this? :confused:

EDIT: I found it; here is an article from August of 2007, about a new build program: http://www.foxnews.com/story/2007/08/21/texas-entrepreneur-set-to-start-building-delorean-cars.html


Enhancements to the new cars will include an improved stainless-steel frame, a stronger but lighter fiberglass underbody and electronics upgraded from the disastrous systems in the early DeLoreans.

The base price of a new DeLorean is expected to be $57,500

[DMCVegas]

Yeah, I made the mistake of saying something to this effect on FB and James Espey chimed in (last night/today). Is he always an asshole? He basically told me to f$@! off, the parts are his, etc. WTF? Maybe he doesn't realize the object in that sentence is *supply* and not *parts*. He just lost my business over this and my car is officially for sale. Let somebody else deal with him.

-Bobhttp://www.nerdhouse.org/espey.png

39447

I'm not seeing any of what you said at all. He is correct in as the "parts supply" that you can buy from them for your car is not yours at all. That would be like Espy claiming that you modifying your car would be akin to ruining "his" car. Your property is yours, and DMCH's is theirs.

Was he an asshole? Well, that is clearly an objective viewpoint. From my perspective, he was merely factual with you, and to the point. Perhaps because he didn't bother to kiss your ass in the process of stating his point, you view that as him telling you to " f$@! off" as you put it. In all honestly, your statement was indeed a pretty asshole thing to begin with, with you claiming DMCH's inventory as "your parts". As if he, DMCH, or anyone else on the face of this planet owes you a damn thing because you own a DeLorean. That's how I read that.

I mean, honest question here: If someone walks out of an AutoZone, or a dealerships parts counter with so much as a headlight or a screw, do YOU go and chastise the guy at the register for selling someone else "your parts"? Why is it different from DMCH?

Having worked many customer service jobs in my younger days, especially through internet tech support with the factor of anonymity compounding people's rudeness to outright inhumanity, I can certainly tell you that the customer is not always right. You absolutely have the right to feel the way that you do, but that in no way shape or form validates your reasons for feeling such. No offense to you and everyone else who agrees with you, but ditching that sense of entitlement would do to serve you all very well.

Now you may not like DMCH, or even Espy himself. That's fine. The fact that unlike some other vendors you can shit talk either one, and they'll still sell you parts and not try and "punish" you, that should speak volumes here to you, and everyone else. Likewise, just because you don't like them, nor what they're doing, that's no reason to start bandwagon attacking them.

What kills me most about this is how everyone has been giddy with their dreams over the past few decades about a new DeLorean being made from the left over parts. And now that it's here, everyone hates it. I post a bit over on Jalopnik, and there are still quite a few DeLorean owners that respond or message me that refuse to participate on online forums and discussions because of the attacks and misrepresentations like this. But I'm going to share one of my last posts over there where instead of just bashing DMCH, people actually were interested in talking about this:

That’s the whole ironic part of this whole thing. For years we’ve wanted a new DeLorean, and have just gone on and on about how great it would be to build a “new” DeLorean out of the spare parts that are lying around.

And now DMCH is poised to do just that, and even announces it. Now suddenly everyone is down on their ass, and just chocks it up to a “publicity stunt”, or just ridicule the cars we wanted for so long as not being “real” since they didn’t come from the original DMCL in Dunmurry.

Now don’t get me wrong, I’m not arguing with you on this, I’m just talking about what has been the prevailing attitude on DMCTalk the past couple of months. People keep calling DMC out as being liars, and that this is a publicity stunt. Which I don’t believe it is. I think that we’ll see the first car get built, and then people will accuse DMCH as saving face. Then when the second one gets built, it’ll be just a single eccentric person that’ll get made fun of for “overpaying” for a “fake” DeLorean.

But you watch. By the time the 3rd car comes out, and especially once the press gets ahold of them and declares them as superior to the originals based off of power and modern convenience, people will start attacking the cars out of jealousy.

Do I believe that Houston will be building new DeLorean cars? Yes I do. Because with each of these newly proposed cars that you've seen in the past, there have been advances here and there to make that proposition a reality. I think that they've been chomping at the bit to do this. Would I buy one? If I had the money, absolutely. And I can tell you right now that short of me performing a complete engine swap on my existing DeLorean, their take on this will be a far superior vehicle than what we have. And just like some people have said in the past that if you want a muscle car, you shouldn't buy a DeLorean, I would fully say that if you're someone focused on originality and numbers matching, you shouldn't buy a DeLorean either.

[opethmike]

Blah blah blah blah blah blah blah

There's that word vomiting, condescending Robert I've missed!

[congerz83]

I'm not seeing any of what you said at all. He is correct in as the "parts supply" that you can buy from them for your car is not yours at all. That would be like Espy claiming that you modifying your car would be akin to ruining "his" car. Your property is yours, and DMCH's is theirs.

Was he an asshole? Well, that is clearly an objective viewpoint. From my perspective, he was merely factual with you, and to the point. Perhaps because he didn't bother to kiss your ass in the process of stating his point, you view that as him telling you to " f$@! off" as you put it. In all honestly, your statement was indeed a pretty asshole thing to begin with, with you claiming DMCH's inventory as "your parts". As if he, DMCH, or anyone else on the face of this planet owes you a damn thing because you own a DeLorean. That's how I read that.

I mean, honest question here: If someone walks out of an AutoZone, or a dealerships parts counter with so much as a headlight or a screw, do YOU go and chastise the guy at the register for selling someone else "your parts"? Why is it different from DMCH?

Having worked many customer service jobs in my younger days, especially through internet tech support with the factor of anonymity compounding people's rudeness to outright inhumanity, I can certainly tell you that the customer is not always right. You absolutely have the right to feel the way that you do, but that in no way shape or form validates your reasons for feeling such. No offense to you and everyone else who agrees with you, but ditching that sense of entitlement would do to serve you all very well.

Now you may not like DMCH, or even Espy himself. That's fine. The fact that unlike some other vendors you can shit talk either one, and they'll still sell you parts and not try and "punish" you, that should speak volumes here to you, and everyone else. Likewise, just because you don't like them, nor what they're doing, that's no reason to start bandwagon attacking them.

What kills me most about this is how everyone has been giddy with their dreams over the past few decades about a new DeLorean being made from the left over parts. And now that it's here, everyone hates it. I post a bit over on Jalopnik, and there are still quite a few DeLorean owners that respond or message me that refuse to participate on online forums and discussions because of the attacks and misrepresentations like this. But I'm going to share one of my last posts over there where instead of just bashing DMCH, people actually were interested in talking about this:

That’s the whole ironic part of this whole thing. For years we’ve wanted a new DeLorean, and have just gone on and on about how great it would be to build a “new” DeLorean out of the spare parts that are lying around.

And now DMCH is poised to do just that, and even announces it. Now suddenly everyone is down on their ass, and just chocks it up to a “publicity stunt”, or just ridicule the cars we wanted for so long as not being “real” since they didn’t come from the original DMCL in Dunmurry.

Now don’t get me wrong, I’m not arguing with you on this, I’m just talking about what has been the prevailing attitude on DMCTalk the past couple of months. People keep calling DMC out as being liars, and that this is a publicity stunt. Which I don’t believe it is. I think that we’ll see the first car get built, and then people will accuse DMCH as saving face. Then when the second one gets built, it’ll be just a single eccentric person that’ll get made fun of for “overpaying” for a “fake” DeLorean.

But you watch. By the time the 3rd car comes out, and especially once the press gets ahold of them and declares them as superior to the originals based off of power and modern convenience, people will start attacking the cars out of jealousy.

Do I believe that Houston will be building new DeLorean cars? Yes I do. Because with each of these newly proposed cars that you've seen in the past, there have been advances here and there to make that proposition a reality. I think that they've been chomping at the bit to do this. Would I buy one? If I had the money, absolutely. And I can tell you right now that short of me performing a complete engine swap on my existing DeLorean, their take on this will be a far superior vehicle than what we have. And just like some people have said in the past that if you want a muscle car, you shouldn't buy a DeLorean, I would fully say that if you're someone focused on originality and numbers matching, you shouldn't buy a DeLorean either.

Keep drinking the kool-aid, sir...

[Jonathan]

Zippity-fuckin'-do-da....... and then we all get along great and be friendly and laugh and enjoy all things DeLorean again while at DCS '16 together (and pretend we weren't being assholes to each other).

It's the Internet. Who gives a shit? Ponder, speculate, guess all you want. Until something you can see and touch actually happens for REAL, this is just another ugly "comments section" discussion like you find on every other website on every other topic.

[DMCVegas]

Keep drinking the kool-aid, sir...

If that is the best counter-argument you can offer, then I'm quite happy with that. It just proves my point.

This anti-DMCH thing is just another mob mentality that feeds upon emotion to justify itself rather than facts.

[Michael]

There will most definitely be at least one car built, vined, and titled. This will be the show pony. When Stephen said 300 cars I believe he meant that's how many they estimate they will sell. In reality they will probably be built to order. Someone lays down the payment, we will build a car. I would say if they do build the first, then there will be at least some demand.

I think where we are all coming from with outlr duobts is that we remember the past 8 years and how many times we have been fooled by the cry of "Wolf Wolf!"

If these new cars do take off that would be spectacular for everyone as it will no doubt raise the value of our own all original cars.

[Tillsy]

"A number of hurdles exist before production can begin, and we're still early on in this process of determining the feasibility of moving forward"

e.g. this will turn out the same as all the previous new DeLoreans.

The only companies that have successfully created new build DeLoreans in all the years DMCH have said they would are LEGO, Hallmark, etc.

[Nicholas R]

There will most definitely be at least one car built, vined, and titled. This will be the show pony. When Stephen said 300 cars I believe he meant that's how many they estimate they will sell. In reality they will probably be built to order. Someone lays down the payment, we will build a car. I would say if they do build the first, then there will be at least some demand.

This is a very good point. The way this is being marketed, it is portrayed as though they will have an assembly line setup and be rolling new cars out, that you can buy off the lot. In reality, it seems most likely that it will still be a built to order system; at least looking at how DMCH has always operated in the past (at least with rebuilds, EVs, and Stage IIIs).

[aotmfilms]

Yeah, I made the mistake of saying something to this effect on FB and James Espey chimed in (last night/today). Is he always an asshole? He basically told me to f$@! off, the parts are his, etc. WTF? Maybe he doesn't realize the object in that sentence is *supply* and not *parts*. He just lost my business over this and my car is officially for sale. Let somebody else deal with him.

-Bobhttp://www.nerdhouse.org/espey.png

39447

Actually I was in on that conversation and Espey was not trying to be a "butthead" per se. People were trying to tell him what to do with those parts as if they were "theirs" and you became his target on FB. Granted he did not use the best of words and I would have said things differently but, the gist is that you cannot tell me what to do with my parts and I have no right to tell you what to do with yours.

So he was correct but to actually say that to a Customer is not the coolest thing to do. :wow:

[aotmfilms]

I'm not seeing any of what you said at all. He is correct in as the "parts supply" that you can buy from them for your car is not yours at all. That would be like Espy claiming that you modifying your car would be akin to ruining "his" car. Your property is yours, and DMCH's is theirs.

Was he an asshole? Well, that is clearly an objective viewpoint. From my perspective, he was merely factual with you, and to the point. Perhaps because he didn't bother to kiss your ass in the process of stating his point, you view that as him telling you to " f$@! off" as you put it. In all honestly, your statement was indeed a pretty asshole thing to begin with, with you claiming DMCH's inventory as "your parts". As if he, DMCH, or anyone else on the face of this planet owes you a damn thing because you own a DeLorean. That's how I read that.

I mean, honest question here: If someone walks out of an AutoZone, or a dealerships parts counter with so much as a headlight or a screw, do YOU go and chastise the guy at the register for selling someone else "your parts"? Why is it different from DMCH?

Having worked many customer service jobs in my younger days, especially through internet tech support with the factor of anonymity compounding people's rudeness to outright inhumanity, I can certainly tell you that the customer is not always right. You absolutely have the right to feel the way that you do, but that in no way shape or form validates your reasons for feeling such. No offense to you and everyone else who agrees with you, but ditching that sense of entitlement would do to serve you all very well.

Now you may not like DMCH, or even Espy himself. That's fine. The fact that unlike some other vendors you can shit talk either one, and they'll still sell you parts and not try and "punish" you, that should speak volumes here to you, and everyone else. Likewise, just because you don't like them, nor what they're doing, that's no reason to start bandwagon attacking them.

What kills me most about this is how everyone has been giddy with their dreams over the past few decades about a new DeLorean being made from the left over parts. And now that it's here, everyone hates it. I post a bit over on Jalopnik, and there are still quite a few DeLorean owners that respond or message me that refuse to participate on online forums and discussions because of the attacks and misrepresentations like this. But I'm going to share one of my last posts over there where instead of just bashing DMCH, people actually were interested in talking about this:

That’s the whole ironic part of this whole thing. For years we’ve wanted a new DeLorean, and have just gone on and on about how great it would be to build a “new” DeLorean out of the spare parts that are lying around.

And now DMCH is poised to do just that, and even announces it. Now suddenly everyone is down on their ass, and just chocks it up to a “publicity stunt”, or just ridicule the cars we wanted for so long as not being “real” since they didn’t come from the original DMCL in Dunmurry.

Now don’t get me wrong, I’m not arguing with you on this, I’m just talking about what has been the prevailing attitude on DMCTalk the past couple of months. People keep calling DMC out as being liars, and that this is a publicity stunt. Which I don’t believe it is. I think that we’ll see the first car get built, and then people will accuse DMCH as saving face. Then when the second one gets built, it’ll be just a single eccentric person that’ll get made fun of for “overpaying” for a “fake” DeLorean.

But you watch. By the time the 3rd car comes out, and especially once the press gets ahold of them and declares them as superior to the originals based off of power and modern convenience, people will start attacking the cars out of jealousy.

Do I believe that Houston will be building new DeLorean cars? Yes I do. Because with each of these newly proposed cars that you've seen in the past, there have been advances here and there to make that proposition a reality. I think that they've been chomping at the bit to do this. Would I buy one? If I had the money, absolutely. And I can tell you right now that short of me performing a complete engine swap on my existing DeLorean, their take on this will be a far superior vehicle than what we have. And just like some people have said in the past that if you want a muscle car, you shouldn't buy a DeLorean, I would fully say that if you're someone focused on originality and numbers matching, you shouldn't buy a DeLorean either.

I think if DMCH pulls this off it will be a good thing for DeLorean owners as how we will have more options (better engines, touchscreens, maybe airbags at some point and better braking (I hope)). I don't know about you guys but I plan on keeping mine until 2045 when I can no longer drive it (75 years old), and hey if someone wants to pay 100k? Fine. It does two things. It makes ours more valuable as a collectors item (so what if it was "yesteryears model" and it drives some new stuff for our cars. Really we are in a win win here.

Just my thoughts.

--Doug

MY FIRST SUGGESTION....CAN WE PLEEEAAAASSSSSEEEEE GET A CUPHOLDER OR TWO?????? I'm glad my AC is working but if it wasn't it would be like inside of a coke can. It would be gooooodddd to have a cupholder.

[Timebender]

A good example is when the new Mustangs or Challengers or Camaros came out. For the most part they looked like their classic counterparts, but offered more power, better handling, safety features, and so forth. Did this cause the originals they were based on to lose public interest or values to go down? Nope. A 1970 Mustang GT fastback in crappy condition (not running, rusty, project car)goes for around $10,000 and can get $40-50k restored. Same goes for all the others, and that's not including Shelby Mustangs. I think our values will go up and serious collectors will seek out the originals vs. plunking down $100,000 for a "new" one.

[DannonWeb]

As someone in the market for a D, would you recommend still pursuing one before the supposed release of new vehicles, or would you put if off to see how the dust settles next year? In other words, do you see prices going up or down?

[gullwingD]

Seems like values are going up, especially with Stephen Wynn on national television every 30 seconds talking about how he's building new cars. Whether or not it really happens... who knows.. but sometimes perception is more important than reality.



As someone in the market for a D, would you recommend still pursuing one before the supposed release of new vehicles, or would you put if off to see how the dust settles next year? In other words, do you see prices going up or down?

[opethmike]

Two LOLs:

1. People still thinking this is going to happen
2. If it does happen, thinking that the cars will have any quality. Look at how well assembled the re-manufactured cars were.

[gullwingD]

They really are milking the publicity though... TV stations love to talk about DeLoreans... Here's another feature just today, on news that's about a month old...

http://www.today.com/video/back-to-the-future-delorean-back-in-production-after-34-years-625364547559


Two LOLs:

1. People still thinking this is going to happen
2. If it does happen, thinking that the cars will have any quality. Look at how well assembled the re-manufactured cars were.

[opethmike]

More fuel for the morons that approach me about my car to hurt my brain. Ol' Bessie may be spending a lot of time in the garage this year.

[Dangermouse]

As someone in the market for a D, would you recommend still pursuing one before the supposed release of new vehicles, or would you put if off to see how the dust settles next year? In other words, do you see prices going up or down?

I can't imagine prices going down, assuming that they find 300 takers for these theroetical-as-yet new cars. The demographic for the buyer of a $100 grand replica (plus upgrades no doubt) is greatly different from your standard $20-35k car. Do prices for classic Porsche 911s change when the latest model year 911's come out - doubt it. They trend independently.

If you buy a standard DeLorean today for $25k, you can be fairly sure you will get at least $25k for it in a couple of years, assuming the condition remains the same (how much you will have spent on it is another matter). If you buy a zero-mile 2017 DeLorean Series II (to use the old British nomenclature) for $100k, I would predict that it will depreciate just like any other "new car"; so in 2018 it may be worth $90k and in 2019 perhaps $80k (why spend $100k on a used 2017 Series II with 12000 miles when you can get a new 2018 one for that price). Presumably the resale price of these Series II cars will stabilize at some level but who knows what that will be - it would have to be above the $57k that DMCH currently charge for a re-manufactured Series I, I would think. All this is assuming that there are no "gotchas" in implementing new drivetrains, electronics etc.

[opethmike]

Considering I have seen several "new build" cars that surged idle, had numerous leaks, ill fitting doors, immediately out of the gate and on delivery, yeah, there will be massive issues with the unicorn cars.

[Jonathan]

More fuel for the morons that approach me about my car to hurt my brain. Ol' Bessie may be spending a lot of time in the garage this year.

^this.

We may never see any new DeLoreans (or care), but we certainly are already seeing lots of new neighbourhood idiots taking notice of what you're up to in the garage. For a car that is already hard enough to enjoy because you can't seem to ever be left alone, this recent publicity just kacked it up even worse.

EDIT: Oh, and when the driving season does start again in the Spring, imagine how many times you are going to get the "is this one of the new ones?" ice breaker question. I'll bet this will finally overtake the "where's the flux capacitor? question for most commonly asked. Better edit my CAR SHOW BINGO card...

[DannonWeb]

Perhaps they're thinking the new line will go the way the Ford GT went upon its re-introduction in 2005. It sold then for $110-140k and has only climbed every year since. You'd have to spend $250-300k to get one of those now. But who knows!

[gullwingD]

I wonder what John DeLorean would say....

[Jonathan]

Perhaps they're thinking the new line will go the way the Ford GT went upon its re-introduction in 2005. It sold then for $110-140k and has only climbed every year since. You'd have to spend $250-300k to get one of those now. But who knows!

You let me know when this kinda car comes with a DMC badge and I'll be interested... was at the Toronto Auto Show this week. As Borat would say... IZ NICE!!!!

398353983639837

[opethmike]

^this.

We may never see any new DeLoreans (or care), but we certainly are already seeing lots of new neighbourhood idiots taking notice of what you're up to in the garage. For a car that is already hard enough to enjoy because you can't seem to ever be left alone, this recent publicity just kacked it up even worse.

EDIT: Oh, and when the driving season does start again in the Spring, imagine how many times you are going to get the "is this one of the new ones?" ice breaker question. I'll bet this will finally overtake the "where's the flux capacitor? question for most commonly asked. Better edit my CAR SHOW BINGO card...

The number one first question I get is some mouth breather asking what I paid for it, without even introducing themselves. 75% of the time this is followed up with them knocking on the stainless, or trying to open the doors.

I'm going to give it one more year, and if this new car bullshit continues, my car will be up for the taking to the first person that brings me $25,000.

[opethmike]

I wonder what John DeLorean would say....

His daughter Kathryn has been very active on Facebook expressing his displeasure at this whole fiasco.

[gullwingD]

Is there a thread somewhere on the history of the new DMC? Did they have to pay anyone anything for the rights to the name?

[opethmike]

Is there a thread somewhere on the history of the new DMC? Did they have to pay anyone anything for the rights to the name?

That's a whole huge debacle where basically own one version of the trademark, and like to talk as if they are an actual continuation of the real DeLorean Motor Cars Limited.

[DMCVegas]

That's a whole huge debacle where basically own one version of the trademark, and like to talk as if they are an actual continuation of the real DeLorean Motor Cars Limited.

http://i0.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/000/558/387/cdf.jpg

[opethmike]

http://i0.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/000/558/387/cdf.jpg

39892

[DMCVegas]

I'm just saying that with the news reports and what not it has been said that the DeLorean is back, not the former company, or any of it's corporate subsidiaries. Just the car. Likewise, I've not seen anyone from DMCH say anything to where they are restarting the old company. They may be restarting a limited production of the vehicle, but that is totally different than what you're saying.

[opethmike]

So you've paid literally no attention to how DMC-H (especially Espey) has portrayed themselves over the years, how they've put no effort into educating the public that they aren't the original company, and have on numerous occasions pissed off Kathryn. Okay. Got it.

Now stop talking and come buy my car. It runs nice.

[Michael]

I never really figured out what KDS's problem was with DMCH and refurbs/new builds. Maybe she doesn't know what a refurb/new build is (which is essentially a frame off restoration with dozens of upgraded parts that were known to fail). She is always quick to rebuke them but I wonder if she realizes the original car was no prize here. If anything a refurb is everything the original should have been to begin with.

If it was not for DMCH and their commitment to the car...and before you start getting all self righteous, I am aware they do this for money and a living, but it takes a certain passion for the marque as well. We should all be so lucky to have such passion for our jobs, but to get to my point, if it were not for another risk taker (Mr. Wynn and his investors), the DeLorean would be nothing more than a small club of barely running cars with it's owners scrambling for hulks to scavenge for parts to keep the precious few running. What would the DeLorean community look like it if Ed B. were still the only man with all the parts? Does Mrs. Seymour not see this? Does she not see that the reason there is a DeLorean presence today is not just the owner's passion for the cars but that they have someone to run to when those cars fail to run?

If she was indeed so worried about the legacy, maybe she should see that JZD's legacy is not the car nor was it ever, it was jobs for people and guess what...thanks to Mr. Wynn and Mr. Espey(and dozens others) it still is. How many people are employeed at the DMC franchises? I would venture around 100. Is that so bad Mrs. Seymour? Does this piece of plastic, fiberglass and metal really outweigh the livelyhood of dozens and dozens of families? Not only does his legacy live in that aspect but it lives in the community that has developed because there are so many running driving cars left and little children and adults alike contunue to light up when they see these cars still driving around...thanks in no small part to DMCH and the satellite campuses.

In short...give it a rest. It's getting tiresome.

[Rich_NYS]

Zippity-fuckin'-do-da....... and then we all get along great and be friendly and laugh and enjoy all things DeLorean again while at DCS '16 together (and pretend we weren't being assholes to each other).

It's the Internet. Who gives a shit? Ponder, speculate, guess all you want. Until something you can see and touch actually happens for REAL, this is just another ugly "comments section" discussion like you find on every other website on every other topic.

+1

[DMCVegas]

So you've paid literally no attention to how DMC-H (especially Espey) has portrayed themselves over the years, how they've put no effort into educating the public that they aren't the original company, and have on numerous occasions pissed off Kathryn. Okay. Got it.

Now stop talking and come buy my car. It runs nice.

Maybe it's because at times I get to be as critical as I am literal. I've just never seen a specific example of them doing that. Of the articles that I have seen, they do use the word "original" very liberally to create a demarcation between the original car specifications and especially the two companies, to show that Wynne has since not only acquired the parts independently, but also use of the DMC name(s), which clearly implies that this is a different company using the trademarks of another. With legal permission of course

http://www.autobytel.com/auto-news/features/unique-cars/feature-delorean-reborn-6244/

I also don't know how Houston has pissed Kathryn off either, and haven't heard any examples of that. I'm not saying that they don't exist, but I've just never seen one.



The number one first question I get is some mouth breather asking what I paid for it, without even introducing themselves. 75% of the time this is followed up with them knocking on the stainless, or trying to open the doors.

With all due respect, it *is* a DeLorean. That attention comes as part of the deal of owning one of these cars.



I'm going to give it one more year, and if this new car bullshit continues, my car will be up for the taking to the first person that brings me $25,000.

Well I cannot comprehend the reasoning behind something such as that, but it I guess you're not alone...
https://houston.craigslist.org/cto/5454702548.html



I never really figured out what KDS's problem was with DMCH and refurbs/new builds.

Like I said previously, I'm not aware of her having any beef with DMCH. Now she might not like the DMC-12 itself, and given the excerpts from JZD's autobiography, De Lorean about how Kathryn and Zachary were affected by the arrest, I can see how something like that might be possible. But I don't know her. I've never met her, nor corresponded with her, so I won't presume to know anything about how she currently feels about anything without it being a verified statement from her.

[refugeefromcalif]

Well I cannot comprehend the reasoning behind something such as that, but it I guess you're not alone...
https://houston.craigslist.org/cto/5454702548.html

I like that ad. :rofl:

George

[Jonathan]

With all due respect, it *is* a DeLorean. That attention comes as part of the deal of owning one of these cars.

I refuse to accept this.

There is no "deal" any of us accepted when getting one of these cars.

This comment that we hear that goes "well, didn't you expect that?" as a response to some typical example of people's idiocy is BS, plain and simple.

For owning a pop culture icon, yes, there is attention to be expected. The guy at the next gas pump over is of course going to ask you about the car. You'll see people checking it out as you come back to the parking lot from the restaurant. You'll have the most people around it at just about any cruise night or car show.

What is not "expected" or acceptable is the crap we all have experienced with the guy that follows you home and strolls right into your garage 'cause "he just had to see your car," or tries to open the door and get in, or runs a magnet down the side of it testing the magnetic properties of stainless, or asks you at a car show if "all of these cars were pieces of shit?"

Telling any of us that own these cars, or even repeating to outsiders, that this behaviour is acceptable or expected, is a cop-out, and only tells me that we as a society now are too PC and lack the balls to tell people they need to smarten the fuck up when they're out of line.

Do we see that though?

No, not typically. And what's the result? The owner who politely, or not politely, asks/tells the guy that came walking right up into the garage like he owns the place to "get the hell out of my garage, please" is now somehow the bad guy. Going on while pretending this bullshit is ok is only making it worse and then the owner becomes the "wow, what a dick" when he finally stands up for himself.

This is not some exclusive car club that you can only be a member of if "thick skinned" and "not introverted." In no other circumstance would any of the "DeLorean unique" experiences be even close to acceptable or tolerated. If you own one of these cars, you get it. If you don't own one, or haven't had yours driveable in a decade, then please shut your pie hole and save your wisdom for someone else, because preaching to a DeLorean owner how they should just suck it up and get over it is a little out of touch.

[DMCVegas]

I refuse to accept this.

There is no "deal" any of us accepted when getting one of these cars.

This comment that we hear that goes "well, didn't you expect that?" as a response to some typical example of people's idiocy is BS, plain and simple.

For owning a pop culture icon, yes, there is attention to be expected. The guy at the next gas pump over is of course going to ask you about the car. You'll see people checking it out as you come back to the parking lot from the restaurant. You'll have the most people around it at just about any cruise night or car show.

http://cdn.meme.am/instances/400x/65085601.jpg

As confusing and full of mixed signals as this sounds, I absolutely agree with you!

I've been waiting years for the community to turn around on this! And it sounds like enough of us are finally pissed off about this to bring about a change!

Ok, so let me explain here. Yes, I totally agree with you and everything that you've just said! The DeLorean IS a pop-culture icon. Also, it's just a strange-looking car. There is NOTHING else on the road which looks like it at all. From that, there is absolutely attention that is to be expected, yes. I think that we can all safely agree on that.

But there is no reason in the WORLD that we should ever have to put up with the rudeness. I have a whole host of bad experiences with other people in my car. I've had the jumping in without permission. I've had the comments like how I don't deserve to own my car. And yes, someone who actually called my car a piece of shit. To my face. I've dealt with the endless inaccuracies, and I've dealt with the never-ending stream of cocaine jokes. And frankly, I'm tired of it. In fact, I've been tired about it for years now.

Now what is interesting is that any time that I've ever brought this up, especially when I talk about developing common, friendly retorts, is that I actually have caught hell from other DeLorean owners about that. Told me things over the years that I was a bad ambassador to the marque for confronting people instead of just smiling and shrugging it off. No. I say fuck that. If some jackass wants to come up and start with something like that, you need to be armed with wit in order to shut them down and correct them. Start friendly, and escalate from there. Making us all into pushovers is what poorly represents the entire marque, and ruins it for the rest of us. That I am a firm believer of.

Now I know this is super confusing. How in the hell did I just say one thing, and now I'm saying something completely different? Easy. I actually agree with you. and have all along. I was so pissed off that a community which was so supportive in every other way would turn it's back on me when it came time to deal with all the jerks. That hurt. Problem people are just as bad as anything else you can encounter with your car that needs fixing. Because it's terrible to invest so much time, money, effort, and above all love into your car for some simpleton shithead to try and tear it all down.

So for years now I've just been throwing it all back up into everyone's face, but in a more blunt and irritating way. I wanted everyone to see how many people were being hurt by this "just deal with it" attitude. I think that instead we should prepare ourselves on how to deal with such things. Not that we're going to get into physical fights or violence, but we need some snappy comebacks to neutralize the attacks. Can we stop the entire world from saying stupid or hurtful things to us? Of course not. But you know what we can do? We can initiate a Chilling Effect to make people think twice before saying anything ever again. Either through empowerment of imparting knowledge, or if we just embarrass these morons. We can accomplish the same task either way.

[Jonathan]

http://cdn.meme.am/instances/400x/65085601.jpg

As confusing and full of mixed signals as this sounds, I absolutely agree with you!

I've been waiting years for the community to turn around on this! And it sounds like enough of us are finally pissed off about this to bring about a change!

Ok, so let me explain here. Yes, I totally agree with you and everything that you've just said! The DeLorean IS a pop-culture icon. Also, it's just a strange-looking car. There is NOTHING else on the road which looks like it at all. From that, there is absolutely attention that is to be expected, yes. I think that we can all safely agree on that.

But there is no reason in the WORLD that we should ever have to put up with the rudeness. I have a whole host of bad experiences with other people in my car. I've had the jumping in without permission. I've had the comments like how I don't deserve to own my car. And yes, someone who actually called my car a piece of shit. To my face. I've dealt with the endless inaccuracies, and I've dealt with the never-ending stream of cocaine jokes. And frankly, I'm tired of it. In fact, I've been tired about it for years now.

Now what is interesting is that any time that I've ever brought this up, especially when I talk about developing common, friendly retorts, is that I actually have caught hell from other DeLorean owners about that. Told me things over the years that I was a bad ambassador to the marque for confronting people instead of just smiling and shrugging it off. No. I say fuck that. If some jackass wants to come up and start with something like that, you need to be armed with wit in order to shut them down and correct them. Start friendly, and escalate from there. Making us all into pushovers is what poorly represents the entire marque, and ruins it for the rest of us. That I am a firm believer of.

Now I know this is super confusing. How in the hell did I just say one thing, and now I'm saying something completely different? Easy. I actually agree with you. and have all along. I was so pissed off that a community which was so supportive in every other way would turn it's back on me when it came time to deal with all the jerks. That hurt. Problem people are just as bad as anything else you can encounter with your car that needs fixing. Because it's terrible to invest so much time, money, effort, and above all love into your car for some simpleton shithead to try and tear it all down.

So for years now I've just been throwing it all back up into everyone's face, but in a more blunt and irritating way. I wanted everyone to see how many people were being hurt by this "just deal with it" attitude. I think that instead we should prepare ourselves on how to deal with such things. Not that we're going to get into physical fights or violence, but we need some snappy comebacks to neutralize the attacks. Can we stop the entire world from saying stupid or hurtful things to us? Of course not. But you know what we can do? We can initiate a Chilling Effect to make people think twice before saying anything ever again. Either through empowerment of imparting knowledge, or if we just embarrass these morons. We can accomplish the same task either way.

I'm glad to hear this, Robert.

I'm relieved to know you (and others) have had enough of this nonsense. I also owe you an apology for wording my reply too strongly. If there are reasons why I've, at times, hated owning this car in the past 8+ years, it has rarely been because of another owner, but it has often been related to one of these people that got the better of me (and my frustration). So I'm sorry if that came off sounding like it was directed at you.

I would have no problem approaching the 2016 season as one in which to take a stand. Like you said, not violent, just respectful and witty, to begin with, and escalated according to the situation.

A Stephen King book I was reading recently had a character explain that in life, if you allow yourself to "eat shit" a little too often, it can become a regular part of your diet. I think taking an "eat no shit" approach to DeLorean ownership is just fine with me.

[Jonathan]

One other thing I forgot to mention...

Adding to my own confusion was promoting this "exotic car owners code of conduct" idea. I copy pasted it more than a few times thinking this was good stuff to follow. It had a blurb or two on keeping your car clean and well maintained, don't speed wildly, and, knowing how lucky you are to own something so rare, don't be a jerk to people that are just excited to see it.

Most of that I am okay with. Yet, because of the simplicity of the list, it doesn't expand on what it means for someone to be "just excited to see your car," and that's where the confusion comes. Excited isn't the same as this other stuff we see. So I too have been guilty of going along with all of that, brushing it off as ok when it isn't.

[Rob_In_Houston]

Wow. I'm new here and just read through all of this. I hope to get a De Lorean soon. I'm going to try to get one this summer because of this.

[rdarlington]

Wow. I'm new here and just read through all of this. I hope to get a De Lorean soon. I'm going to try to get one this summer because of this.

First $25k takes mine. C'mon out to NM. 5400 miles on the odometer, 2k miles on the tires. Original tires are here too.

-Bob