How DeLoreans Were Originally Built, Stainless Panel Discussion

[Pags44]

I would like to open a discussion regarding how the cars were generally put together.
*
When the cars were originally built, were the door panels (and other stainless panels) packaged together for a specific car so all the stainless grooves match throughout the car?* Or were any available stainless panels taken and put onto the car?* Were there certain production runs of stainless panels made for certain cars or groups of cars?
*
My car’s driver’s side door has my VIN # written on the inside of the door in what seems to be black marker.* I understand “cave drawings” and builders’ signatures were sometimes written on the car parts by the workers as they were putting the cars together.* Is my VIN # being written on the inside of the door a common practice to identify the door to the car with that specific VIN #...or something a worker randomly wrote on the underside/inside of it (on the stainless behind the vinyl interior panels)?* The inside of my passenger side front fender also has a signature.
*
What happened if panels were damaged on the carrier before the cars were delivered to the dealerships or customers?* What replacements were used?* What is the process if any stainless panels ever get damaged and need to be replaced…can the panels (and their grooves in the stainless) be matched to the rest of the car…either by matching replacement panels, doors, or regraining the entire stainless on the car?
*
Thought this would be a good discussion...

[content22207]

The entire assembly sequence was changed to put doors on the underbodies first, not last. Two doors were matched to a specific underbody along the outside wall of the assembly building, then the body was transferred to a Tellus for the rest of assembly:
4577

The BBC documentary has a brief shot of cars getting fenders fitted *AFTER* their doors are already in place.

Bill Robertson
#5939

[DMC5180]

My car’s driver’s side door has my VIN # written on the inside of the door in what seems to be black marker.* I understand “cave drawings” and builders’ signatures were sometimes written on the car parts by the workers as they were putting the cars together.* Is my VIN # being written on the inside of the door a common practice to identify the door to the car with that specific VIN #...or something a worker randomly wrote on the underside/inside of it (on the stainless behind the vinyl interior panels)?* The inside of my passenger side front fender also has a signature.

It was standard procedure to write the VIN and the door lock cylinder key code on the doors.

Body panels were not matched to create a full set too travel with the underbody. Unlike, coordinating panels for a painted car.

All of the cars got a certain amount of post assembly re-graining or blending done to them as needed.

Many cars did get damaged during transport in the ships or other circumstances. Those panels would either be repaired (if minor) or replaced at the QAC's as required. regraining as needed.

[David T]

Matching panels to the car is no big deal. The graining matches up well but you are right, if you put a new or repaired panel on a car all of the other panels may need to be done so everything looks even. After graining all of the oxide is removed and the panel looks shinier. That's why it is hard to "fix" one panel. You always have to do the one next to it and then the next one till you have gone around the whole car. It takes a while for the shine to dull down.

If a car was damaged in shipping the QAC would repair (usually replace) the panel. Little regard was made for vin so early parts were replaced with later ones. For instance if a grooved hood with a flap was damaged they used what replacement part was available and it was not a grooved hood with a flap since they were no longer in production. Same for windscreens. The QAC also did not keep records of what was done (at least they are no longer available if they ever were).

As for "groups of panels", most likely even if a directive came for vin changes they used up what they had until they had to use the "new" parts.
David Teitelbaum

[content22207]

The QAC also did not keep records of what was done (at least they are no longer available if they ever were).

Actually there is a QAC notebook you can look through in the DeLorean Museum at DCS. It does not include every single VIN, but you might get lucky and find yours in it.

Bill Robertson
#5939

[DMC5180]

Actually there is a QAC notebook you can look through in the DeLorean Museum at DCS. It does not include every single VIN, but you might get lucky and find yours in it.

Bill Robertson
#5939

Yup. I recall one of the speakers talk about it at DCS-10 he worked out of the Detroit QAC.

[Pags44]

Good info guys...may i ask where you learned all of this? I'd like to read about it as well to get to know the car and it's history more. Do you know if there's a web accessible copy of that manual you were discussing above?

So if replacement panels were put on then or are ever put on in the future, the groove patterns wouldn't match to the rest of the car. So regraining would match up everything? I was under the impression regraining just took out light scratches and oxidation of the stainless, but you're saying that all the stainless grooves would match after a regrain?

I'm assuming that cars with different panels aren't worth less if it was properly regrained or ever is in the future? I guess I get confused with antique car values. I assume the barrett Jackson cars don't all have the original body parts on them but as long as it is professionally refinished to match the car I guess it's all the same?

How come alot of the cars were damaged when shipped? Kinda wonder if that's still the case today with cars on carriers and such although I'm sure they've come a long way since 81.

[David T]

Since there were 2 QAC's finding one notebook is of very limited value for the general population but it could be useful for the few cars mentioned in it. If you can find the pictures of the cars getting damaged in the ships you would understand what the QAC centers had to deal with. If one car got loose it would bash into the other cars around it. The QAC centers were not originally intended to deal with shipping damage but it was one of the obvious uses for them. It was learned very early on that the first cars off the production lines needed a LOT of TLC and the Dealer network was not up to speed enough that they could handle all of the work necessary to get the cars into saleable condition. It was a masterful strategic decision to spend what it took to open the QAC's and get the cars fixed up. If they didn't do that one can only imagine how bad the reputation would have been of the cars in the beginning. As it was, even with the QAC's, things did not go very well for the early production cars. I know of no other manufacturer EVER doing this kind of thing. It took a lot of guts to do it but we can be glad they did!
David Teitelbaum

[content22207]

Whatever utility the QAC book in the DeLorean Museum may or may not be does not alter the fact that it does exist -- I have looked through it myself (and found neither of my cars in it). That is why I said:


... It does not include every single VIN, but you might get lucky and find yours in it.

Your statement:


... The QAC also did not keep records of what was done (at least they are no longer available if they ever were).

is simply incorrect.

Bill Robertson
#5939

[content22207]

The entire assembly sequence was changed to put doors on the underbodies first, not last.

Here's another picture of cars on the assembly line with doors fitted before any other body panels (rear glass doesn't appear to be in place either). Interiors are missing, so windshields haven't been fitted yet -- probably why they came up with the roof support jig:

5127

Bill Robertson
#5939

[john 05141]

Here is a picture with the mold for the bonnet.

John

[Kenny_Z]

In the factory where my father works they do forming for aluminum and stainless sheets like that. Most of the forms are for lawn mowers but they've also built jet engine shipping containers and some other cool stuff. I keep telling him to let his company know they could make a fortune if they could recreate the left fenders.

That reminds me, I need to ask him for some scrap stainless to tinker with.

[content22207]

Here is a picture with the mold for the bonnet.

For newbies' benefit: stainless panels were not made at the Dunmurry plant, but were stamped at a Laepple facility in Carlow Ireland. Stainless sheets were already grained when they went into the presses (one of the pilot cars has a panel accidentally oriented 90 degrees off in the press -- grain runs vertically):
5132 5131

Regarding hoods in particular: there is a myth that gas flap hoods were eliminated due to stamping problems, but in actuality they were eliminated simply because Chuck Bennington didn't like them (Dick Brown may have told employees stateside that the idea to get rid of them was his).

Bill Robertson
#5939

[dmcjohn]

Hi Bill,

On the dmctalk.com forum before the crash, we chatted about this before. Unfortunately it's all gone now.

Anyway, not to get into a big debate on this, but the gas-flap cutout did cause issues for Lapple, and was most likely part of the decision (along with other factors, including possibly your point about Chuck Bennington) to get rid of it.

[nick sutton]

The Gas flap was deleted by Chuck Bennington because the design was Mickey Mouse and looked feeble. It was not done for cost reduction or ease of stamping reasons.

Nick Sutton

[dmcjohn]

Ok Nick, fair enough!

[content22207]

The quarter panels are much more complex stampings/cutouts than the hood.

Bill Robertson
#5939

[Rich W]

QAC in Troy, MI...Parts Notebook Details...For Reference...

A huge thanks to Chris Duvall (Parts POG) for allowing Tony Swann and myself
(and a few other typing volunteers) to enter all of the Parts data from the QAC
Notebook from the QAC in Troy, MI, into spreadsheet and database formats.

There will be a future website that will have a search function to allow anyone
to search the Parts Database, to see if their DeLorean was ever at the Troy QAC
and had parts replaced, while Chris Duvall was in charge of the Parts Inventory.

A few statistics (for now): Chris Duvall was over-seeing the QAC Parts Inventory
in Troy, MI from 08/19/1981 through 03/01/1982, and during that time, nearly
6,200 parts were used on the DeLoreans that passed through the Troy QAC.

More details and statistics to follow.

Thanks,
Rich W.

[David T]

I was always under the impression there were only 2 QAC's. One in California and one in New Jersey. It is news to me about MI. Were there any others? It made sense about one on each coast since most of the cars came in to the US by ship.
David Teitelbaum

[content22207]

Didn't the POG's at DCS'10 say there were 5 QAC's altogether, but never more than 3 at any one time?

Bill Robertson
#5939

[Kerichbe]

I liked your comment Nick, about the flap looking Mickey Mouse. Dad loved that expression, I think I could actually hear him saying that!