New purchase, former owner questions.

[DMCJosh85]

Greetings all. I've come to seek the collective input of the community in helping me with the ease of settling my mind on various issues of purchasing a OCT 81 DMC-12. First my background: I am a former owner of 04463 which was a painted white DMC-12 when I bought it at age 19. I was a young kid that put all his money into buying a painted car and the first thing I did was paint strip it. Various other improvements were made over my 5 years of ownership but being a young kid I eventually ran out of money and life called for other things such as a house insurance and so on... you know adult stuff. Anyways I sold 04463 and over a series of transactions it wound up in London. Anyways ill cut to the chase. Here I am 10 years later and I have a house, a garage and money to start over again. Not too far away from me I found another DMC-12 for sale...a painted DMC-12. Its a Ferrari red dealership painted car with having been with the same owner since the late 80s. He treated it gently and drove it just to work and back mostly. Over the years it only got up to 37K on mileage. I've looked it over and drove it and she gets up and goes but this is where you all can come in and help me out. Over my years of absence from the DeLorean ownership scene I've not really kept up on the community knowledge and so on, so here are my questions and concerns....

1. Binnacles? its been 10 years... where are they? Whats the best cover options for cracked binnacles? are there fiberglass options out there?

2. On the drivers side trim panel the armrest has fallen off. How repairable are these to reattach (under normal circumstances)

3. The original catalytic converter was taken off and some common garage replaced it with another. is it possible to remove this and replace it with a DMC specific catalytic converter? (DMC website doesnt seem to have it for sale) does this hurt the originality of the car much?

4. I plan to remove the red paint. Ive removed the paint form a DeLorean before and in the end it looked great. But what are the odds with cars out there that had the dealership use something like an orbital sander and ruin the stainless for the painting process? I'm worried Ill chemically remove the paint and find severely scratched up panel that not even a regraining will fix. This is really a no go for me on the purchase and I wont truly know until I spend big money to find out whats under the paint. But what stories are out there about this?

The car is a project but by no means a bad DeLorean, it drives, cools, brakes and work just fine. I can get it for a high 20K price range which makes it such a tempting offer. especially since the cost of DeLoreans seems to have gone up on average over 10 years. Thanks all.

[BladeBronson]

Wow, your story is very similar to mine. I bought my first DeLorean at 21 and daily drove it for 5 years. 10 years after I sold it, I bought another one. :)

The end of your post is the most telling:


I'm worried Ill chemically remove the paint and find severely scratched up panel that not even a regraining will fix. This is really a no go for me on the purchase

If that's really true, then you should not buy this car.

[Michael]

If you know anyone in the paint/used car buiz you can borrow a coating thickness gauge. I have one for work. It has both ferrous and non ferrous probes so I can gauge how much paint I have left when I'm color sanding and buffing. Spotting filler with one of those is as easy as throwing a rock in a lake.

[DMC-Ron]

If you know anyone in the paint/used car buiz you can borrow a coating thickness gauge. I have one for work. It has both ferrous and non ferrous probes so I can gauge how much paint I have left when I'm color sanding and buffing. Spotting filler with one of those is as easy as throwing a rock in a lake.

Michael is spot on. Painting often hides damage. In the case of DeLoreans, it hides dents and damage to the stainless panels. Take Michael's advice and probe for Bondo. You may have gotten lucky on your previous car and below the paint were perfect stainless panels. They may not be so perfect here, and it would be bad to find this out after buying the car.

Ron

[David T]

Even if you don't find Bondo the chances are very high you will have to regrain the car once the paint is removed. Not impossible to do yourself once you teach yourself the skill. It can be done by hand but a powered tool is the way to go.

Binnacles are expensive. A dash mat is a cheap alternative at least temporarily

The armrest should be repairable.

In some States you must use the specific convertor that was approved on the car. Unless that is the case for you or you want originality leave the one you have alone if it works. The exhaust pipes may have been chopped up to put the convertor in so you may have to replace more than "just" the convertor.

Sounds like you found yourself a nice project. Consider leaving it red. I say use it for a while as it is (fix the armrest) and see how you like it and if there are any other issues before you go tearing it apart.

[Hill Valley PD]

Stainless steel is one of the things that sets apart the DeLorean from other cars. Paint is what sets a DeLorean apart from the rest. While they go for less money, it is cool to see them because they are unique. Red looks good on these too. I'd leave it alone as David T said at least at first to address other things, OR if your heart is set on stainless, I'd personally just buy one that is not painted because as you said, you never know what's underneath.

[DMCJosh85]

...I'd personally just buy one that is not painted because as you said, you never know what's underneath.
Very true, Im certain I wont find any bondo work as its been treated gently over its 37000 miles and is a garage kept car. With the exception to 1 small pressed in ding that's center on the passenger door the stainless isn't damaged. Perhaps it would be best to leave a painted DeLorean painted but for 27K this seems like a good price that I should be all over.

[Hill Valley PD]

Very true, Im certain I wont find any bondo work as its been treated gently over its 37000 miles and is a garage kept car. With the exception to 1 small pressed in ding that's center on the passenger door the stainless isn't damaged. Perhaps it would be best to leave a painted DeLorean painted but for 27K this seems like a good price that I should be all over.


Yeah, you MIGHT get lucky and strip the paint and find beautiful stainless under it. However, I'd at least plan on having the stainless regrained, and you'll have to paint the front and rear fascias over too, so you'll be at 30K before you know it, minus any other cosmetic or mechanical things you decide to tackle along the way. 37K is low mileage but not especially low for a DeLorean. In the collector car hobby it is almost always better to get the best car you can afford and one that is "done" and let someone else take the loss on a restoration. That is how I came to buy my 70 Mach 1. Unless you do most of the work yourself, a restoration is almost always a money loser when you sell it later. I have been looking to purchase a DeLorean for about a year now but only starting to get really serious. Thus, I have been watching prices a lot lately. It seems like anything under 30K these days is a project car needing a good amount of work/updates or some junk being peddled by the Beverly Hills Car Club. It's hard to find a truly nice one for under 30K. Prices have definitely risen the last few years but selling prices do not reflect some of the high asking prices, mostly by clueless dealers or owners that are trying to recoup their own restoration costs. I am fully expecting to pay upper 30s or higher for a car when I finally pull the trigger. I'd imagine you won't be far off that price when you are finished fixing up the red one.

[Gregadeth]

Greetings all. I've come to seek the collective input of the community in helping me with the ease of settling my mind on various issues of purchasing a OCT 81 DMC-12. First my background: I am a former owner of 04463 which was a painted white DMC-12 when I bought it at age 19.4463 was one of the cars I got to test drive a few years ago when I was looking to purchase a car. You did a hell of a job removing the paint, as when I saw the car I had no idea it had ever been a painted car.

[DMC-81]

Greetings. Welcome back to the community.

On question # 3, other franchise locations or other vendors may have new or used stock. Plus, here is a gently used OEM 1982 catalytic converter currently for sale here:
http://dmctalk.org/showthread.php?16405-1982-Catalytic-Converter

I am not sure if the different year complies with your state's emissions laws, so that bears investigation.

On question # 4, I agree with others that if you want an unpainted car, I'd buy an unpainted one. Even with gentle use and proper storage, a 37 year old car will have a few to many things that need addressing to begin with. Of course you can prioritize that list, but for me, I couldn't imagine acquiring a car, getting it up to par, AND having to strip the paint on panels where the condition is unknown. Of course you have already done the stripping job, so you know what you are in for in terms of effort, cost and uncertainty.

Good luck with your decision and or continued search.

[Jonathan]

1. Binnacles? its been 10 years... where are they? Whats the best cover options for cracked binnacles? are there fiberglass options out there?

Justin at Wells Auto fixes binnacles. Give him a call or email and tell him what condition yours is in and he can tell you what your options might be.

http://wellsauto.ca/restoration.html

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[DMCJosh85]

4463 was one of the cars I got to test drive a few years ago when I was looking to purchase a car. You did a hell of a job removing the paint, as when I saw the car I had no idea it had ever been a painted car.

Thank you, I did it all in the month of July, outside, in Bakersfield, CA (every day well over 100 degrees). The stainless didn't get its grain back until it went over to sea to its new home in London 2 owners later and it looks flawless now which gives me reason to believe that I could do it again and the end result would be that you could look at it and never know that it was painted.
I have been reviewing another famous thread on the forums here of 4534 that was paint stripped chemically of its dealership red and returned flawlessly back to original: http://dmctalk.org/showthread.php?6182-Time-to-say-good-bye-to-the-red&highlight=paint+removal

I need to make my mind up soon on if I'm going to go forward with this red DeLorean I've got lined up. Ill say for sure that if I do I'll document the process as well as Kenny_Z did on his for everyone.

[Hill Valley PD]

It sounds like you are ready to pull the trigger on it. I didn't mean to sound harsh, and my opinion probably means little since I do not own a DeLorean currently, ha. I'd say if you get lucky with the stainless under the paint, and you strip it yourself, it'd be a good deal. If it is damaged underneath, then I'd say not. Get that paint depth meter and check it before you buy it as others have said. Do you have any pictures?

Here's a red one that might not be far from you as reference point with 27K that they are asking 37K for unless this is it and the numbers are flip flopped. It looks really cool in red IMO.

https://palmsprings.craigslist.org/cto/d/back-to-the-future-in-red/6561970815.html

[Jonathan]

FWIW, if the car was indeed painted by the original dealership, then I would not expect to find damaged panels underneath. Dealerships resorted to painting some of the cars to help try and get rid of them when no one wanted to buy them, not to cover-up damage on ones coming over from the used car lot or body shop.

[DMCJosh85]

Here's a red one that might not be far from you as reference point with 27K that they are asking 37K for unless this is it and the numbers are flip flopped. It looks really cool in red IMO.


https://palmsprings.craigslist.org/cto/d/back-to-the-future-in-red/6561970815.html

No need to post pictures. That's the very one. Gonna work out the last details today but its sold to me.

[Hill Valley PD]

Here's a red one that might not be far from you as reference point with 27K that they are asking 37K for unless this is it and the numbers are flip flopped. It looks really cool in red IMO.



No need to post pictures. That's the very one. Gonna work out the last details today but its sold to me.


Congrats! It looks very clean and pretty awesome in red. I'd drive it and sort it mechanically for a while before stripping it. You might even get used to and like the red and leave it for while. I figured that was the one based on the crack in the binnacle, which is not that bad. Nice original CA blue plate to boot.

[MikeWard]

4463 was one of the cars I got to test drive a few years ago when I was looking to purchase a car. You did a hell of a job removing the paint, as when I saw the car I had no idea it had ever been a painted car.


The stainless didn't get its grain back until it went over to sea to its new home in London 2 owners later and it looks flawless now which gives me reason to believe that I could do it again and the end result would be that you could look at it and never know that it was painted.

Our resident stainless guru Chris Nicholson deserves all of the credit for the sterling job his did on restoring the stainless on 4463 back to it's former glory. We are lucky to have him in the UK.

Before - with a trio of nasty dings on the top of the door
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After a visit to Chris where he removed all of the dents and completed a full rebrush.
56202

[David T]

Our resident stainless guru Chris Nicholson deserves all of the credit for the sterling job his did on restoring the stainless on 4463 back to it's former glory. We are lucky to have him in the UK.

Before - with a trio of nasty dings on the top of the door
56201

After a visit to Chris where he removed all of the dents and completed a full rebrush.
56202

Yes, Chris N is the MASTER at doing S/S work. He does come to the US and if you can get him, he would be the one to do it. That said, I have seen very passable jobs done by rank amateurs after some learning and experience. And if it doesn't turn out as nice as you like you can always get Chris N to make it better. With any regraining job there will always be a few minor dings or dimples that will become really noticeable and Chris N can make them go away so well he makes it look easy. His excellent work doesn't come cheap but it is worth every penny. If the car was painted by a dealer "back in the day" the likelihood of the car being painted to cover damage is lower but still exists. If necessary you can always remove the panel and send it out to be repaired. Because this falls under "Cosmetics" I would get everything else done first and save up to remove the paint last.

[DMCJosh85]

Deal didn't hold up. Apparently a certified cashiers check isn't a secure enough way to pay the owner.... I'm at a loss for words but no bother, for me the search goes on. its still for sell in-case anyone else wants it. Additionally message me if you have questions about its condition. I made up some good notes on its condition. The seller is a kind older man with a busy schedule. Good luck.

[DMC-81]

Deal didn't hold up. Apparently a certified cashiers check isn't a secure enough way to pay the owner.... I'm at a loss for words but no bother, for me the search goes on. its still for sell in-case anyone else wants it. Additionally message me if you have questions about its condition. I made up some good notes on its condition. The seller is a kind older man with a busy schedule. Good luck.

Sorry that it didn't work out. :( Don't worry, another car will come along. I remember when I was looking for mine, being bummed that I was not successful in an eBay auction for a car in Missouri, but I wound up finding a car in much better shape at DMCFL.

From my experience, I think a bank draft is preferable to a lot of sellers as a cash equivalent, but it just depends on the person.

[Bitsyncmaster]

Deal didn't hold up. Apparently a certified cashiers check isn't a secure enough way to pay the owner.... I'm at a loss for words but no bother, for me the search goes on. its still for sell in-case anyone else wants it. Additionally message me if you have questions about its condition. I made up some good notes on its condition. The seller is a kind older man with a busy schedule. Good luck.

The certified checks have been known to be counterfeit. I don't blame a seller to wait for it to clear or demand cash.

[David T]

Using "Instruments of Credit" can be especially difficult if it is on a weekend or holiday and you can't call the bank to confirm authenticity. Cash is KING but even that is counterfeited and many people do not feel comfortable carrying around a lot of it. One problem with not using cash is once a bank check (or whatever) is made out you can't negotiate the amount unless you have several in different denominations. Out-of-State banks make it more problematic. A wire transfer is about the safest method now but that can only be done on a business day and it can take hours. If you lose a bank check it is like losing cash and most banks charge to issue them. Money orders can be good but you will wind up with a bunch because they only go up to $1,000 each and they charge for each one. Best to discuss this with the seller in advance especially if you are going to travel a distance and haven't seen the car up close. On the other side, you should see the Title BEFORE you agree to a price and make sure you are buying from the actual owner.

[dodint]

I generally offer to wire funds if it's over $10k. It's practically instant and fraud proof from the buyers perspective.

[SamHill]

Buyers should understand that the car needs to stay put until the deposit clears.