Rear Anti-Sway Bars

[AdmiralSenn]

Time for the perennial thread..

Any news on updated rear anti-sway bars? Everything I can find says that the Addco bars are 1) no longer available 2) tended to crack the frame.

I have heard whispers that Toby Peterson may have been working on one but can't find anything recent.

Just curious.

[FABombjoy]

Last time I harassed Toby, word is that the RSB project is a no-go.

The Addco mountings could probably be reworked, but the kit is no longer available and I haven't seen one come up for sale in years.

I'm slowly working on a one-off nascar style bar. You can buy bars and links in tons of sizes, so it seems easier than trying to adapt an existing bar or having one custom bent.

[AdmiralSenn]

I was sort of afraid of that. I have a few ideas about making one as a one off but it's far outside my expertise so I'd rather have someone who understands suspension engineering do it for me!

[Mark D]

From a design standpoint it really interests me to see how the rear sway bars could be made to work. The previous version I've seen looks like it would be OK but with some pretty significant frame modifications to prevent the cracking issues that have already been mentioned. I think having to grind epoxy off and weld plates onto the frame would make most people shy away vs. a completely bolt on version.

Practically speaking I don't think I'd ever install a rear sway bar on my stock DeLorean but I can see the need for it on you guys with engine swapped cars. All that extra power probably amplifies the shortcomings in the handling department pretty significantly.

[FABombjoy]

My goal is to cut down on the massive body roll. Even a little more roll control in the rear should go a long way to improve cornering feel. I get a little sad in our local roundabouts.

The pics of prototype aftermarket setups pass the bar through the hollow section of the cradle and use existing suspension points for the mounting. Tie the end links into the radius arm mounts at the hub carrier. Seems like a reasonable approach.

[CFI]

My goal is to cut down on the massive body roll. Even a little more roll control in the rear should go a long way to improve cornering feel. I get a little sad in our local roundabouts.

What type of suspension are you using? I don’t notice much body roll at all with my high performance suspension from DMCH.

[FABombjoy]

Spax + high rate front springs. Further increasing rear spring rate or stiffening the dampers to compensate would likely compromise overall ride quality. Since Michigan roads are awful I'm trying to avoid going to rock-hard suspension.

I think body roll is OK up to a point, but when I throw the wheel hard to one side it really comes on quickly and the and understeer is surprising. There are a few videos of people autocrossing and you can the roll even at slower speeds.

[Mark D]

There are a few videos of people autocrossing and you can the roll even at slower speeds.

This thread comes to mind:
http://dmctalk.org/showthread.php?9380-Autocrossed-the-DMC

[FABombjoy]

That thread is a photo essay of what a decent RSB would tame.

You can buy a kit for a VW bus so I'm surprised there aren't any options for our modest sports car.

[CFI]

That thread is a photo essay of what a decent RSB would tame.

You can buy a kit for a VW bus so I'm surprised there aren't any options for our modest sports car.

How many VW busses did they sell:)

That thread mentions the Eibach setup, which I think is what I have. I think it handles great but I’ve never pushed my car that hard.

[Josh]

This thread comes to mind:
http://dmctalk.org/showthread.php?9380-Autocrossed-the-DMC

I took a geo metro and my delorean to autocross.
Two dozen cars out that day.
I did three runs in my delorean, averaged about 2-3 from last in the standings.
I did one run in the geo metro - about middle of the pack.

It is pretty embarrassing.

[FABombjoy]

All things being equal, .75 -> .79 would be a nice improvement and probably wouldn't add significant oversteer.

https://scontent.fdet1-2.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/27336686_10155216064798085_8926237144356063395_n.j pg?_nc_cat=102&_nc_ht=scontent.fdet1-2.fna&oh=8531221fd517f7f5685c734faa86c7de&oe=5D272609

Other than the crap mounting system, the few people I've talked to that have driven a car with the Addco bar spoke positively of it.

[AdmiralSenn]

I wonder about the frame mounting part. I wonder if it would make sense to fit a custom rubber or poly bushing into the cradle - basically using the cradle itself as a frame attachment point.

[vwdmc16]

That sounds like the best place to mount it. If only the frame were wider there, leave alot of space between the bushing and where it attaches to the the suspension. Lot of deflection in the bar before it does anything.

[AdmiralSenn]

True. Although a thick enough bar may minimize that enough to have the desired effect.

Incidentally, I think I found 'Triad' from that letter posted earlier: http://www.triadservicesgroup.com/ - they even have a DMC on their home page.

[Gfrank]

I haven’t got to the point of buying anything yet, but I’ve always intended on buying a tube style one (no idea if they actually have a name). Slide the tube into the rear cross member and mount it top and bottom

[Bob635]

I have an ADDCO rear sway bar on the 97 Delorean Time Machine. It was ADDCO part # 841. It was under $100 back in the late 80s.
I have talked to ADDCO about making another one or two, but they said they are all computer controlled now and this rear sway bar was their old paper system.

However, ADDCO advertises that they make "custom sway bars." All you have to do is provide the dimensions.

This is where I hit a brick wall. I told them I wanted a custom rear sway bar- that I have one - with the dimensions. .... And I got the response - we don't make
custom sway bars.

It was probably some tech own just pushes computer button and really does not know anything about this.

So..... I am interested in another two. Perhaps if we can get enough people willing to commit to an order from ADDCO. we can get this done.
Money aka orders -- talks.

Bob

[Bob635]

Time for the perennial thread..

Any news on updated rear anti-sway bars? Everything I can find says that the Addco bars are 1) no longer available 2) tended to crack the frame.

I have heard whispers that Toby Peterson may have been working on one but can't find anything recent.

Just curious.

And yes the car handles better with a rear sway bar. 1/2" dia.

[dmc4087]

I have an ADDCO rear sway bar on the 97 Delorean Time Machine. It was ADDCO part # 841. It was under $100 back in the late 80s.
I have talked to ADDCO about making another one or two, but they said they are all computer controlled now and this rear sway bar was their old paper system.



Bob

Do you happen to have any pictures of the sway bar?

[FABombjoy]

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190221/ca247cfc2dde65b7089209d0a0f87090.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190221/f5ffb34a7eda95939f548540de7b4552.jpg

Here’s a couple from a BHCC car

[Josh]

i wonder what that sway bar is sourced off of. Thanks for the pictures Luke

[dmc4087]

Thanks for the pics. That must make some difference alright!

[FABombjoy]

It was ADDCO part # 841.
Should be #418 :)

Addco still has the install instructions online:
http://addco.s3.amazonaws.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/03/418.pdf
They're almost intelligible.

Addco would probably make more if there was a guaranteed number of units. But really I think with a little more work a better solution could be made that doesn't require drilling the trailing arm or mounting the bar under the cradle.

Fred Lockett used to sell a bar through DeLorean Specialties. I asked him on Facebook if it was a custom design or the Addco but I didn't see a comprehensive response, other than it might have been an adapted Lotus aftermarket part.

[Mark D]

My car is lowered slightly and I estimate with that bar installed I'd only have about 2" of ground clearance.

If there was a solution that mounts the bar through the engine cradle instead of below that would be a lot cleaner. I'm thinking a reinforcement plate on the bottom side would still be required to beef up the sheet metal but with some countersunk bolts that would be perfect.

The only other thing to consider would be making sure the bar was shaped in such a way that it would actually fit through the engine cradle.

[vwdmc16]

Thanks for the picture and install info. No wonder those ripped up the frame metal. Just a u bolt inside the frame? The bar itself Looks bigger than 1/2" diameter too.

That would hit speed bumps badly on my lowered car.

[dn010]

That would hit speed bumps badly on my lowered car.

+1. I have the front springs in the rear and I’ve slammed the cradle on pavement hitting a dip at speed.

[Farrar]

OK, you geniuses -- get bending! 3/4" steel rod is cheap! ;-) http://www.mcmaster.com/8890K119

But seriously, you'd probably want to reinforce the entire engine cradle -- probably clad it in at least 12-gauge sheet metal to strengthen what's already there -- and still use reinforcement plates where the fasteners go, to make sure that the frame itself suffers no damage while you're autocrossing your LS-DMC.

It could be done, but apart from the steel rod it would be an expensive proposition.

(Edit: But if you've already done $4,000 of engine and transmission upgrades ...)

[FABombjoy]

How about these instead:

http://www.colemanracing.com/Sway-Bar-1-14-49-Spline-Solid-P3539.aspx

[Farrar]

Nice find, Luke!

[FABombjoy]

I can't take any credit! Both Toby's and Josh's prototype rear ARB setups appear to use nascar style hardware. Pics from a few of these setups are floating around in another thread somewhere around here.

[Bob635]

i wonder what that sway bar is sourced off of. Thanks for the pictures Luke

It looks like the ADDCO sway bar.

[Josh]

It looks like the ADDCO sway bar.

well... yeah LOL

what im getting at is they are likely sourcing it off a production vehicle instead of making their own from scratch.

[Bob635]

well... yeah LOL

what im getting at is they are likely sourcing it off a production vehicle instead of making their own from scratch.

So who wants to order sway bars?

I can tell you I did have to reinforce the pan locations where it bolts to. This is more a Delorean thin metal problem. Though ADDCO should give you reinforcement plates.

However, mine needed reinforcement only after 20 years of driving. So who knows.

Bob

[BABIS]

Pics from a few of these setups are floating around in another thread somewhere around here.

http://dmctalk.org/showthread.php?13412-DMCMW-aluminum-LCA&p=193915#post193915

I really liked Josh's approach with a new "subframe"

[AdmiralSenn]

I've been thinking about the stresses involved here. I wonder if you could utilize the existing rear shock mount bar as a sway bar reinforcement? Either make arms that weld directly to the existing bar, or weld on some tubular arms that would hold bushings for the bar to pass through.

I'm thinking most of the stresses involved have got to be vertical, right? And that bar is already bolted into existing relatively reinforced bolt holes which should be able to take way more upwards force than the bar would ever exert. There shouldn't be a whole lot of front to back or side to side motion.

I'll have to see if I can draw up what I'm thinking. It might be too space consuming for engine swaps but the beauty of having 'remote mount' bushing attachments is you could design them to route around almost anything, in theory.

[FABombjoy]

Rear shock mount bar?

[dn010]

Rear shock mount bar?

My only guess is he is talking about the 'crossbrace' 108330

[AdmiralSenn]

Yes, sorry, I tried to edit the post but I missed the window. I am talking about the cross brace, part # 108330.

I imagine that using it in any way for an anti-roll bar mount might require making a new brace, but that has to be less scary to consider than modifying the frame directly, especially if this is something that someone might want to sell to others.

[Josh]

http://dmctalk.org/showthread.php?13412-DMCMW-aluminum-LCA&p=193915#post193915

I really liked Josh's approach with a new "subframe"

it seems to be promising!

[Riley88]

If this is designed I'm buying it.

[driveintim]

https://www.speedwaymotors.com/Speedway-Universal-Rear-Anti-Sway-Bar-Kit,4053.html

They have many other kits designed for street rods.

[Josh]

https://www.speedwaymotors.com/Speedway-Universal-Rear-Anti-Sway-Bar-Kit,4053.html

They have many other kits designed for street rods.

As illustrated in the thread the issue is not fabricating the sway bar itself, it is finding a way to mount it without being too invasive or cracking the frame.