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SupercoolBill
11-07-2021, 06:39 PM
I have titled this thread as a restoration but I am not sure what will become of it. First a little background. My wife were both teenagers in the 80s. We are both BTTF fans. She has always loved and wanted a DeLorean car. Mostly because of BTTF. I have always wanted one partially because of BTTF but mostly because I like odd ball vehicles that other people can't easily get or wouldn't want because they think they are junk or ugly. Basically if most people have it,..I don't want it. Back in around 2002 I was visiting a local friend of mine. One day he mentioned that he had a DeLorean. It wasn't at his house so at first I thought he was messing with me. He said he bought it for like $6000 off a guy that he worked with and it was in a nearby storage barn. He said it ran and drove but needed a minor frame repair because of rust issues. I tried to get him to sell it but said he was going to fix it up and keep it. We kept in touch over the past 20 or so years. He always knew I was interested in the car and when asked said he didn't want to sell it. Besides that I didn't really have any good place to work on a car project anyways. Well this Fall he sold his house (which had a large garage) and was planning on downsizing. He decided that the DeLorean project was never going to get done and he was sick of paying storage fees. So he gave me first dibbs on the car. He said for me he would sell it for $15,000. I told him I wanted it (after talking to the wife of course haha) I thought to myself "He is saying $15,000 but I am thinking $10,000 max".
I asked him a bunch of questions about the car and went to look at it. The car was in worse shape than I had pictured from his stories about it. It was very rusty. He had told me that it hadn't been driven "In like 8 years" (if I remember correctly) but as he started remembering and calling out dates we realized it has been sitting in storage, not started, for 21 years. Yikes!!! Game changer in my opinion. I talked to the wife about it. We agreed to not pay $15,000 for a non running car that was going to need a full frame off restoration.
We offered him $10,000 cash to be paid immediately. He said he needed to think about it for a day. He said that $10,000 was not enough. He said "Meet me half way" I talked to the wife again and did some research on line to see what these cars and projects were selling for and we decided to do.
Here are the pics on the day the car got dropped off and the next day.6729467295

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82DMC12
11-07-2021, 06:54 PM
Aside from your frame post, It looks great from here. You have your work cut out for you and unless you're retired it will be a long time before you are driving it. If you love the car and it's your dream, start working on the frame-off. Don't be dumb and spend tons of money on interior and cosmetics before it's safe to drive as so many do. You paid a good price in today's market but don't kid yourself, you'll be probably be into this for another $10,000+ and hundreds of hours before it's safe and reliable to drive. Oh well. We love the punishment. Right?

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SupercoolBill
11-07-2021, 07:11 PM
Aside from your frame post, It looks great from here. You have your work cut out for you and unless you're retired it will be a long time before you are driving it. If you love the car and it's your dream, start working on the frame-off. Don't be dumb and spend tons of money on interior and cosmetics before it's safe to drive as so many do. You paid a good price in today's market but don't kid yourself, you'll be probably be into this for another $10,000+ and hundreds of hours before it's safe and reliable to drive. Oh well. We love the punishment. Right?

Sent from my Pixel 3a using TapatalkThanks for your reply.
Yes this "Ain't my first rodeo" as they say. I've been wrenching on stuff since I was a young kid. I made those stupid mistakes for years. By a vehicle, spend a bunch of time and money pimping it out, then I go to get an inspection and it won't take a sticker. Lol.
I have fixed of several older vehicles and motorcycles and done my own motor swap from a carburetor engine to a MPFI engine. My latest project was a 1970 BMW motorcycle that I shouldn't have bought (rode hard, put away wet) but nonetheless I completely restored to showroom condition. Had an estimated 600 hours and $13,000 into the project. Luckily those motorcycles in mint condition are worth as much as $22k now.




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82DMC12
11-07-2021, 07:15 PM
I think you have a lot of headroom even after accounting for a frame off. Just depends on how much, or how little, you value your time. Not everyone has the patience for "the big one". I'd go for it.

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Helirich
11-07-2021, 07:23 PM
It’s a good price. Is the front fender wrinkled bad? (I can’t see from the pic) I know one fender (can’t remember L or R) is really hard to get. You maybe able to hammer that out. Is the frame rust going to need metal welded in? Looks like a good project.

SupercoolBill
11-07-2021, 07:24 PM
The first thing the wife and I did was check the car all over. None of the lift struts worked which was really annoying. We cleaned the car out. There was a mouse nest in the car jack stowage. The interior was somewhat musty but not horrible. I had learned that the fuel pump was most likely junk. So we checked it out. Sure enough the fuel pump was badly corroded and the associated parts were a black gooey mess.
We pumped out the remaining fuel in the tank with a siphon pump and cleaned out the gas tank. I was thankful that this car has a plastic gas tank. 6729767298672996730067301

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SupercoolBill
11-07-2021, 07:25 PM
It’s a good price. Is the front fender wrinkled bad? (I can’t see from the pic) I know one fender (can’t remember L or R) is really hard to get. You maybe able to hammer that out. Is the frame rust going to need metal welded in? Looks like a good project.It isn't horrible. Of course it is the $4000 one,...the left side.

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82DMC12
11-07-2021, 07:30 PM
It isn't horrible. Of course it is the $4000 one,...the left side.

Sent from my SM-G970U using TapatalkChris Nicholson can fix that quarter panel right up and you'll never know it afterwards

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SupercoolBill
11-07-2021, 07:34 PM
Bit the bullet and ordered a modern style fuel pump kit for around $600.00 while installing the new electrical connector for the new fuel pump I found my first mouse damaged wiring. And a wire that I'm not sure what the heck happened to it. The original fuel pump plug connector was pretty corroded looking.
Attached is a picture of the roofing tar that leaked out of the fuel return hose over night on the work bench. 67302673036730467305

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82DMC12
11-07-2021, 07:38 PM
Bit the bullet and ordered a modern style fuel pump kit for around $600.00 while installing the new electrical connector for the new fuel pump I found my first mouse damaged wiring. And a wire that I'm not sure what the heck happened to it. The original fuel pump plug connector was pretty corroded looking.
Attached is a picture of the roofing tar that leaked out of the fuel return hose over night on the work bench. 67302673036730467305

Sent from my SM-G970U using TapatalkSo far so good. I have the same fuel pump kit (DPI). Making the weatherpack connectors was more work and special tools but I'm sure it was worth the effort, long-term. Might as well change the fuel filter and fuel accumulator while you're at it. Probably injectors, too. Hopefully the fuel distributor isn't too far gone.

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SupercoolBill
11-07-2021, 07:42 PM
Here are some rust pics, homemade frame extension that someone did, and sketchy front suspension.673066730767308673096731067311

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SupercoolBill
11-07-2021, 07:46 PM
So far so good. I have the same fuel pump kit (DPI). Making the weatherpack connectors was more work and special tools but I'm sure it was worth the effort, long-term. Might as well change the fuel filter and fuel accumulator while you're at it. Probably injectors, too. Hopefully the fuel distributor isn't too far gone.

Sent from my Pixel 3a using TapatalkYeah those connection suck to try to do down in there. I wanted to solder them on but I didn't have my soldering gun out at the shop. I may take it back apart an put some solder on it at some point.

I bought a fuel filter which ironically they had in stock at my local Advance Auto because someone order one years ago and never picked it up. Just ordered an accumulator. I haven't ordered injectors yet.
Next post is about fuel distributor. [emoji846]

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82DMC12
11-07-2021, 07:50 PM
Yeah those connection suck to try to do down in there. I wanted to solder them on but I didn't have my soldering gun out at the shop. I may take it back apart an put some solder on it at some point.

Sent from my SM-G970U using TapatalkI pulled the wires out into the brake fluid access cover and had more room for the crimper.

Also - you want to put a 2x4 between the jack and the frame from now on. The frame is very thin in the boxed sections, I think 1/16", and you will literally put your jack right through the bottom of the frame if you don't spread the pressure out!! Repeat after me: "I will never let my jack touch the car without a 2x4 on the pad".

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Michael
11-07-2021, 07:59 PM
I think you are in a nice resto car at a very nice price. I believe you shoud feel good because at 12.5k, you were fair to yourself and your friend. I almost envy you on the journey you are about to take.

If you want, post your location. We are a dedicated bunch and if you are close to one of us, you will no doubt have some willing hands eager to help.

SupercoolBill
11-07-2021, 08:13 PM
I don't have pics but basically we put a plastic container up front,, set the new fuel pump in the container with new, non-ethanol gas in it about 3" deep. We bolted the supply and return lines together out on out on engine end so the fuel would be pump out through the supply piping and back through the return line. We had the return line dump into another container until it cleaned up then just recycled the same fuel through for a half hour. while jumping out the fuel pump connector we found more signs of mice. Yeah....

Yesterday the wife and I installed the new lift struts (which I purchased off Amazon for a pretty reasonable price). And tackled the fuel distributor which seemed to have a stuck piston. (Intake disk stuck).
This thing is sooooo rusty!! I had to use a hand impact to get the mounting screws out (and they still barely came out!!) and had to literally PRY the distributor off the engine with a small pry bar.
The piston was stuck solid. I couldn't spin it or pull it out at all. Like a moron I tried tapping it in further hoping it would break free and come out. Well that just gave me less meat to grab on to. I went to the hardware store and bought a band new set of vise grips for my slide hammer. I tried for a half hour to get the piston out. No matter how tight I went with the vise grips they would pull right off and the piston wouldn't budge. At this point I ALMOST decided to take the distributor apart even though everything I read online said NOT TO TAKE IT APART. Then I suddenly had an idea. I took a Demel tool with a cutoff wheel and made some roughness on the piston. This gave the Vise grips something to grab. BOOM BABY!!!! [emoji95] Piston pulled right out!! Cleaned everything and put some light oil on the piston. It now slides in and out easily. We put the distributor on the engine and hooked up all the fuel lines. We had dropped and lost a couple copper washers so we had to use some from a kit I had. Not a perfect fit but good enough for now. We also pulled all the spark plugs and sprayed some Kroil down in the plug holes as suggest by someone on FB.
I had the wife get in and crank over the car. Nothing....just a good battery going dead from cranking. I knew my wife was getting frustrated. She had been saying for the past couple days "I just want to hear this thing run". So I dumped a little gas down in the intake "Turn it over" I said
"VROOOOMM!!!" It fired up and ran for a few seconds. All kinds of noise and smoke from all the crap burning off the engine and exhaust. She was happy. Did it again in hopes that it would stay running on its own but no luck.
We called it a night.
67312673136731467315

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SupercoolBill
11-07-2021, 08:15 PM
Forgot to mention a few things. We changed the oil and oil filter, replaced a rusted out hose clamp on a coolant tube and topped off the coolant the first day we worked on the car.

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SupercoolBill
11-07-2021, 08:22 PM
I pulled the wires out into the brake fluid access cover and had more room for the crimper.

Also - you want to put a 2x4 between the jack and the frame from now on. The frame is very thin in the boxed sections, I think 1/16", and you will literally put your jack right through the bottom of the frame if you don't spread the pressure out!! Repeat after me: "I will never let my jack touch the car without a 2x4 on the pad".

Sent from my Pixel 3a using TapatalkI was thinking that as I jacked it up. But then I was like "Screw it, the frame is junk anyways" lol

Question. Is it OK to use regular jack stands on the body jack points or do I need some sort of an adapter that fits inside that metal recess?

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SupercoolBill
11-07-2021, 08:26 PM
I think you are in a nice resto car at a very nice price. I believe you shoud feel good because at 12.5k, you were fair to yourself and your friend. I almost envy you on the journey you are about to take.

If you want, post your location. We are a dedicated bunch and if you are close to one of us, you will no doubt have some willing hands eager to help.I may do that but also my wife and I made a pact to do every part of this project together so I have turned down offers for buddy's to come work on the car with me. In the past I have been obsessed with projects and totally neglected spending time with my wife so she grew to not like said project. The plan is to do this together. The work, the money spent, then the usage after it is all done.

We are in southern Maine.

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SupercoolBill
11-07-2021, 08:31 PM
So the next steps as we see it based on what I have read and watched online.
Replace fuel filter and accumulator (if we can).
Try to start the car again. If is doesn't start try to somehow figure out if it is a blockage before the distributor OR between the distributor and the intake (hoses or injectors)
I may just go ahead and order injectors. Really we are just trying to see if this engine is any good or not. It doesn't need to run good at this point. It just needs to run on its own.
If we get it to run, monitor oil pressure to make sure the pump is working and the pick up screen isn't plugged and monitor the coolant temperature to make sure the water pump, etc. works.

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Michael
11-07-2021, 08:33 PM
I may do that but also my wife and I made a pact to do every part of this project together so I have turned down offers for buddy's to come work on the car with me. In the past I have been obsessed with projects and totally neglected spending time with my wife so she grew to not like said project. The plan is to do this together. The work, the money spent, then the usage after it is all done.

We are in southern Maine.

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No problem! I can certainly appreciate that and I doubt I could name one of my friends that has a wife take such an active interest in her husband's DeLorean...she sounds like a keeper!

82DMC12
11-07-2021, 08:39 PM
I was thinking that as I jacked it up. But then I was like "Screw it, the frame is junk anyways" lol

Question. Is it OK to use regular jack stands on the body jack points or do I need some sort of an adapter that fits inside that metal recess?

Sent from my SM-G970U using TapatalkIf you have the jackstands with a flat pad on top, those are ok, if we are talking about the four jack points on the underbody. If you only have the jack stands with the two-finger channel, you should have a 2 x 4 between the stand and the body or else the stand will dimple the underbody.

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SupercoolBill
11-07-2021, 08:40 PM
I won't go into all her attributes but yeah she's a keeper!

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SupercoolBill
11-07-2021, 08:41 PM
If you have the jackstands with a flat pad on top, those are ok, if we are talking about the four jack points on the underbody. If you only have the jack stands with the two-finger channel, you should have a 2 x 4 between the stand and the body or else the stand will dimple the underbody.

Sent from my Pixel 3a using TapatalkOk ill have to rig something up

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SupercoolBill
11-07-2021, 08:45 PM
Does anyone know if there is a car VIN search services that gives info of previous owners? I used Carfax on the last couple vehicles and noticed that they no longer give you names and addresses of previous owners. Just the state it was registered in.

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Michael
11-07-2021, 09:49 PM
Does anyone know if there is a car VIN search services that gives info of previous owners? I used Carfax on the last couple vehicles and noticed that they no longer give you names and addresses of previous owners. Just the state it was registered in.

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LOL...if any group can tell you the history based off the vin, this one can!

PS, search the DML archives(if they are still up), I got a ton of info on mine that way.

That's DeLorean Mailing List BTW

82DMC12
11-07-2021, 10:36 PM
Does anyone know if there is a car VIN search services that gives info of previous owners? I used Carfax on the last couple vehicles and noticed that they no longer give you names and addresses of previous owners. Just the state it was registered in.

Sent from my SM-G970U using TapatalkYou can check to see when/if your VIN was ever registered on the DeLorean VIN Registry

http://www.citizenkidd.com/dmc/pages/vin.aspx

Or you could use Google to search the DML as Michael suggested as well as DMCTalk. Maybe a previous owner was an active member.

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SupercoolBill
11-11-2021, 09:34 PM
This came with my blasting booth. Do you think it is safe to use? Or should I buy glass beads?67328

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SupercoolBill
11-13-2021, 03:05 PM
Well, I am still a bit in shock but our prayers have been answered.
We found a usable frame 6 miles from my house!!!
It needs work but I think it is definitely usable.
The odds of this situation occurring is mind blowing. I live in a town of only around 4000 people but there still happens to be someone else in town that owns a DeLorean. And, oh by the way,...he just happens to have a good frame sitting put back. For $1000.00 [emoji2962]
Who says prayer doesn't work?!67339

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Andrew
11-13-2021, 03:46 PM
Wow! That’s a great find! It looks like it’s in great shape. What repairs does the frame need?

Mark D
11-13-2021, 05:33 PM
Well, I am still a bit in shock but our prayers have been answered.
We found a usable frame 6 miles from my house!!!
It needs work but I think it is definitely usable.
The odds of this situation occurring is mind blowing. I live in a town of only around 4000 people but there still happens to be someone else in town that owns a DeLorean. And, oh by the way,...he just happens to have a good frame sitting put back. For $1000.00 [emoji2962]
Who says prayer doesn't work?!67339

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When I pray for DeLorean frames, I like to picture my Jesus in a tuxedo t-shirt. 'cause it says like, I want to be formal, but I'm here to party too.

'cause I like to party, so I like my Jesus to party.

SupercoolBill
11-13-2021, 11:46 PM
Jesus loved to party. Just think about it. Almost every good story was when he was at a party.

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SupercoolBill
11-13-2021, 11:48 PM
Wow! That’s a great find! It looks like it’s in great shape. What repairs does the frame need?Andrew, it looks like it was in an accident or at some point over the years someone hit it with a snowplow or something.6734067341

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82DMC12
11-13-2021, 11:50 PM
Wow, crazy that you found a frame so close! Aside from being a home for squirrels, what's the story here? It looks pretty good except for the tower. Did this guy do a frame swap?

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82DMC12
11-13-2021, 11:51 PM
I see the lower ball joint is sheared off on the lower control arm. Maybe that caused the accident?

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SupercoolBill
11-13-2021, 11:54 PM
No he bought it of Grady way back many years ago for cheap "Just in case I ever needed it" as he said. It has just been sitting outside behind his mom's house for like 15 years.

Basically after I got my DeLorean a month or so ago I was like a bloodhound tracking down anyone in the state that had every owned a DeLorean. This guy lived right near by and it turns out that he just randomly had a spare frame.

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SupercoolBill
11-13-2021, 11:56 PM
Another weird coincidence, this guy that I got the frame from has an 82 also but his is an auto. Pretty nice car.6734267343

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SupercoolBill
11-14-2021, 09:09 AM
One thing that didn't make sense to me is that the pull straps were on the door handles. Wouldn't that mean it is a 1981?

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SupercoolBill
11-14-2021, 09:19 AM
Yesterday the wife did the following work on the car- changed the fuel filter (twice because the first one leaked like a sieve), removed the intake parts to check for block rot on the top of the engine, Cleaned the top of the engine block, hooked everything back up and tried to get the car to start.
Found more rust damage to the frame. I am really glad that I found a replacement frame. 6734467345673466734767348

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SupercoolBill
11-14-2021, 09:24 AM
We couldn't get the car to start still. I DID NOT change the accumulator. I looked up in there and said "No way!" This car is getting a total frame off restoration so I don't think I should be disturbing the accumulator right now.
If I push down the airflow plate down a few times with the fuel pump running the car will try to start. What should I do next? What about the WUR? Does that send more fuel during start up?
How do I troubleshoot this?67349

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82DMC12
11-14-2021, 10:07 AM
Do you have a K-Jet fuel pressure gauge that can read both primary pressure and control pressure? That's job #1.

You are already familiar with jumping the fuel pump and pressing on the air plate it seems. Have you tried a spray pattern check on the injectors? Also compare volume of fuel delivered per injector. Likely due to all the other clues on this car that you need new injectors anyway.

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Andrew
11-14-2021, 01:03 PM
One thing that didn't make sense to me is that the pull straps were on the door handles. Wouldn't that mean it is a 1981?

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Perhaps the door panels were swapped out at one point. Both of my 81s now have the later style integrated pull straps. I like the look better, I also think the early style pull straps cause wear on the grab handles and the later pull location causes the door to latch better / more evenly from front to rear.

Andrew
11-14-2021, 01:08 PM
Andrew, it looks like it was in an accident or at some point over the years someone hit it with a snowplow or something.6734067341

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Perhaps you can graft your existing shock tower to the new frame.

There’s a lot of stuff you can get done during a frame swap ie hard fuel / brake / vacuum lines and easy access to AC hoses Check out Rich_NYS’s build page for details regarding his frame off restoration.

SupercoolBill
11-14-2021, 06:39 PM
Perhaps you can graft your existing shock tower to the new frame.

There’s a lot of stuff you can get done during a frame swap ie hard fuel / brake / vacuum lines and easy access to AC hoses Check out Rich_NYS’s build page for details regarding his frame off restoration.Thanks for the info. Yeah it will be getting all new brake lines, fuel lines, etc.
I was going to go SS but have changed my mind and decided to go original which costs less also.

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SupercoolBill
11-14-2021, 06:42 PM
So the longer I look at this frame the more damage I see. All repairable though.673506735167352

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SupercoolBill
11-14-2021, 06:45 PM
Is this factory?6735367354

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82DMC12
11-14-2021, 07:35 PM
Not factory, looks like someone did kind of a lame repair right there

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SupercoolBill
11-15-2021, 07:03 AM
It seems interesting though that it looks like a manufactured part. If someone was just doing a repair then why would they go to all the trouble of making it shaped in a special way? And those rivets? I've never seen someone use those rivet before but yet they are used to attach the ball joints to the A arms.

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82DMC12
11-15-2021, 08:18 AM
It seems interesting though that it looks like a manufactured part. If someone was just doing a repair then why would they go to all the trouble of making it shaped in a special way? And those rivets? I've never seen someone use those rivet before but yet they are used to attach the ball joints to the A arms.

Sent from my SM-G970U using TapatalkIs this anomaly on both sides or just one side? I can't explain why someone would use those rivet nuts but maybe something happened where the lower link came in contact with the frame and damaged it. And for some reason they chose this as the repair method.

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SupercoolBill
11-15-2021, 08:41 AM
Both sides are exactly the same.

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82DMC12
11-15-2021, 08:49 AM
Both sides are exactly the same.

Sent from my SM-G970U using TapatalkWell here is another OEM frame and in picture 12 you can see the same location (sideways) and it definitely doesn't have the rivets.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/362948887080

It's a common location for damage. maybe a dumb-dumb put jackstands there.

Very curious about the rivet style though. It almost seems like something the factory did..
..

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82DMC12
11-15-2021, 08:53 AM
But wait! Check out this gallery.

https://imgur.com/gallery/Wz6xO5J

This frame seems to have two of those rivets per side. I'd have to say it did come from the factory now but I don't know why and not all frames have it. This is the first time I've noticed this. My frame definitely doesn't have any of them. I will check my spare frame when I get to work later this morning.

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SupercoolBill
11-15-2021, 07:37 PM
Today I contacted a place that does hot dip galvanizing in case I decide to go that route. I was hoping that they had a dip tank for eating off all the old epoxy but no such luck.
One cool thing though, they said they can color match to the original epoxy color or at least pretty close. So I could have a hot dipped galvanized frame in the original Silly Putty color. 6741067411

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SupercoolBill
11-15-2021, 07:38 PM
Pricing seems reasonable to me.

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SupercoolBill
11-15-2021, 07:41 PM
So my question is. If you are trying to do a mostly original restoration and you have a frame with 90% of the epoxy coating still intact should you just peel off ant loose epoxy and then fix the missing or open areas with the same epoxy coating? Because I actually have some that I think is the same product, same color.

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SupercoolBill
11-15-2021, 07:43 PM
More frame pics
The last is probably the worst rust on the whole frame.6741267413674146741567416

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andyo
11-16-2021, 12:35 PM
So my question is. If you are trying to do a mostly original restoration and you have a frame with 90% of the epoxy coating still intact should you just peel off ant loose epoxy and then fix the missing or open areas with the same epoxy coating? Because I actually have some that I think is the same product, same color.

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A lot of guys, myself included, have done what you are saying. I removed the loose coating, repaired the rot, cleaned the rust, then coated with POR15 gray coating. Then i painted the entire frame in Krylon smoke gray. It looked amazing and I'm sad that all the work i put into the frame cant be seen under the car....

POR15 is great stuff, a little tedious to work with, but the result is really good. I cant speak to its longevity of it myself as i just did mine last year, but i read others who said its been solid for many years.

On another note, blasting the original coating is going to eat up media in a hurry, and will also take a very long time. The coating that's still intact is tough stuff. If you plan to do that, i recommend heating and scrapping off as much of the old coating as possible beforehand.

-Andy

SupercoolBill
11-16-2021, 01:50 PM
A lot of guys, myself included, have done what you are saying. I removed the loose coating, repaired the rot, cleaned the rust, then coated with POR15 gray coating. Then i painted the entire frame in Krylon smoke gray. It looked amazing and I'm sad that all the work i put into the frame cant be seen under the car....

POR15 is great stuff, a little tedious to work with, but the result is really good. I cant speak to its longevity of it myself as i just did mine last year, but i read others who said its been solid for many years.

On another note, blasting the original coating is going to eat up media in a hurry, and will also take a very long time. The coating that's still intact is tough stuff. If you plan to do that, i recommend heating and scrapping off as much of the old coating as possible beforehand.

-AndyOk
I think I will just fix what is cracked or missing with a good primer and epoxy paint that matches the original.

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82DMC12
11-16-2021, 01:53 PM
Let's just say the guy you're talking to who thinks sandblasting would take "1 to 2 hours tops" has never seen a DeLorean frame and has no idea what he's in for LOL. More like 1 to 2 days.

SupercoolBill
11-16-2021, 05:45 PM
Let's just say the guy you're talking to who thinks sandblasting would take "1 to 2 hours tops" has never seen a DeLorean frame and has no idea what he's in for LOL. More like 1 to 2 days.Yeah I was like "Hmmm....I wonder if he will give me a fixed price for that sight unseen." Lol

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cdrusn
11-16-2021, 06:57 PM
A great project and should come in way under the $40K the cars seem to be going for in the online auctions. I would suggest that even though the outside
looks quite good don't forget the inside of the frame. There are lots of dead end corners that can't be seen without a cheap camera but if missed will result in rot
from the inside out. I've found a couple of bubbles on the outside that when I took a grinder to it, went through and made a decent sized hole. I finally went
through the inside of the frame with Eastwood frame coating.

SupercoolBill
11-17-2021, 07:18 PM
Nothing done on the car recently.
I did find out about a guy a few towns away that specializes in straightening frames and best of all has been doing it a long time. So in other words he has seen a lot of odd stuff and was doing frame work in the 80s so may have even done one of these before. I emailed him pictures. I am waiting to hear back from him.

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SupercoolBill
11-17-2021, 07:28 PM
This is funny. A trucking company dropped off some equipment at my garage today. I caught the guy noticing the DeLorean out back then purposely going wide with the pallet jack so he could get another look. Lol67424

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SupercoolBill
11-19-2021, 07:36 PM
Spoke to the guy that I had contacted about straightening our donor frame for us. He said he could do it but spent like 10 minutes telling me about all the other resto-mod projects he is working on right now (weird flex?) I stopped in at another shop in town. This guy has a mechanic shop but does a lot of special jobs that other people can't or won't do. He is a certified welder also. He is a motor head and said that he is definitely interested in the project. I was impressed by how clean and organized his shop was. So we will see. I feel pretty confident that the wife and I could do the work but we work a lot of hours and don't have a lot of time for a project like this as it is so doing this work on the frame might be best to be outsourced. I know one other guy I could try also. He has built a lot of hot rods and other stuff in his little two car garage. He is a phenomenal welder and really inexpensive because he just does this stuff on the side. I have seen him tig weld full custom work on snowmobiles and motorcycles and his work is awesome.
We will see...

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SupercoolBill
11-20-2021, 05:41 PM
Worked on the D with the wife today. Printed out some good instructions on rebuilding Bosch fuel distributors.
Removed the fuel distributor.
The other day I picked up bolts to fit in all the ports on the distributor. So we plugged all the ports on the regulator and taped over the piston area. I worked on getting my/used blasting booth ready to go with glass beads. My wife got to be the first person to use the blaster. After the distributor was blasted, blown off with air, and cleaned thoroughly, we removed the plugs.
We proceeded to try to rebuild the fuel distributor. In the process of trying to get the two halves split apart it suddenly flew apart. Spring, shims, etc. Went flying everywhere!! So we spent some time trying to track down all of the shims, springs, etc. We came up with six springs, six spring cups, and 12 shims so we figured we were good to go.
67437674386743967440

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SupercoolBill
11-20-2021, 06:17 PM
I measured the depth of all of the pockets where the shims and springs go. Then we measured the shims. My wife is better at math than me so I put her to work figuring out which shims should go in which pockets. Then she measured the new depths. All 6 pockets measured very close so we figured that she did a good job. 67441

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SupercoolBill
11-20-2021, 06:30 PM
Surprisingly the fuel distributor was actually very clean inside and in good shape. It got all new o-rings and a new diaphragm anyways. We used a Napa product that was supposed to be their equivalent to Hylomar. I've never used Hylomar so I don't know how it is to work with but this stuff was not fun. It came out very runny but got tacky, like it was drying, very quickly! I was going to take some pictures but I felt really rushed to get the distributor back together ASAP.
After it was all back together we put the plugs back in and my wife painted it with POR-15. Hopefully it doesn't leak because it might be hard to split it apart after the POR-15 dries.67442674436744467445

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SupercoolBill
11-20-2021, 06:44 PM
Next we pulled all the fuel lines from the distributor to the injectors with the injectors still attached. Right side,...a pain but not terrible. Left side,...OMG...horrible. Of course the one that was stuck like it was welded in was the front left...the one that is almost impossible to get to. [emoji849]
Managed to get them all out. The wife separated the injectors from the lines, flushed the lines out, and installed new injectors.
674486744967450

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louielouie2000
11-20-2021, 07:09 PM
If you haven’t ordered them already, get a set of braided stainless fuel lines from your DeLorean vendor of choice. The original lines are hard plastic and are known to crack and rupture, causing engine fires. Several DeLoreans have burned to the ground because of this issue, unfortunately.

SupercoolBill
11-20-2021, 07:23 PM
If you haven’t ordered them already, get a set of braided stainless fuel lines from your DeLorean vendor of choice. The original lines are hard plastic and are known to crack and rupture, causing engine fires. Several DeLoreans have burned to the ground because of this issue, unfortunately.Yeah they are on order. Right now we are just trying to get the car to run in the shop.
What are people doing that want to keep their car all origonal?

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SupercoolBill
11-21-2021, 07:40 PM
Today we installed the rebuilt fuel distributor on the intake assembly, hooked up all of the fuel lines to the FD, put the injectors in empty water bottles. Plugged in the fuel pump and jumpered the fuel pump relay.
We got all kinds of fuel out of lines #1 & #3 with the air flow plate not being depressed at all. Nothing out of all of the other lines. Pushed the plate down still nothing out of the other lines. Unplugged the fuel pump. Decided to swap line and injector #3 with line with injector #2. Plugged fuel pump back in.
Same thing,..no fuel out of line #3 (now on port #2) but all kids of fuel spraying out of line #2 (now on port #3). We pushed the plate down and eventually started getting fuel out of the other ports (#2,4,5,&6). So ports #1 & #3 are feeding all the time for some reason.
Needless to say we are pretty frustrated at this point. My guess is that the fuel distributor is shimmed incorrect so that ports #1 & #3 are feeding fuel when they shouldn't be.
The most frustrating thing of all is that the fuel distributor looked perfect inside. So the issue was probably just our injectors and maybe rich/lean adjustment.

Not sure where to go from here besides coughing up the money for a new fuel distributor.
Thoughts? Anyone know how to properly shim these?
I found out that other cars had the six port fuel distributor with an external adjustment for each port. Anyone know if one of these would work on a DeLorean? I really like the idea of the external adjustment vs. The shim design.674616746267463

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SupercoolBill
11-22-2021, 09:51 PM
Some parts showed up today.
I ordered these thinking they may be required to get the car to start and run but now we know that the factory lines are not restricted at all but we will be installing these lines at some point. 67473

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SupercoolBill
11-22-2021, 09:54 PM
I thought that I was just ordering new OEM rubber bushings for the injectors. I thought it was a lot of money for rubber bushing but now it makes sense why they cost so much. These are quite a set up. Once again probably not going to install them until much later in the restoration but for now I think it would be more of a pain to put my injectors in and out to troubleshoot issues with this set up vs. OEM rubber bushings.6747467475

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82DMC12
11-22-2021, 10:14 PM
I thought that I was just ordering new OEM rubber bushings for the injectors. I thought it was a lot of money for rubber bushing but now it makes sense why they cost so much. These are quite a set up. Once again probably not going to install them until much later in the restoration but for now I think it would be more of a pain to put my injectors in and out to troubleshoot issues with this set up vs. OEM rubber bushings.6747467475

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Yikes. The rubber bushings are like $3 each. But how do those clamps hold the injector down? Do you have an injector out and can demonstrate? They are expensive as hell but look pretty cool. The bushings do degrade over time and get really hard, maybe crack, and cause potential vacuum leaks.

Ron
11-23-2021, 12:52 AM
... But how do those clamps hold the injector down?
I had to look that one up.
https://deloreanindustries.com/11-integrated-injector-seal-retainer-system-kit/#gallery-2

SupercoolBill
11-23-2021, 06:37 AM
I had to look that one up.
https://deloreanindustries.com/11-integrated-injector-seal-retainer-system-kit/#gallery-2Yeah that is them!

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SupercoolBill
11-23-2021, 06:43 AM
I feel like they are a bit too nice for my engine unless I end up vapor blasting everything and replacing the parts that is pressed into the intake. The ones in the picture are not OEM. Mine are just stamped steel that has lost the plating and has corrosion. I am assuming that those can get pulled out with a slide hammer and the new stainless ones get chilled then pushed in place with a hammer and a brass drift.

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82DMC12
11-23-2021, 02:58 PM
Is this factory?6735367354

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Hey I was thinking of you when I saw this video from DMCMW today -

https://youtu.be/iT33xOhmpn4?t=310

SupercoolBill
11-25-2021, 08:47 AM
I was planning on grinding off the welds on the bottom plate and installing a thicker plate that can be jacked up on without bending.. in which case I would be removing the unique plate with the special riveted pieces.

SupercoolBill
11-25-2021, 09:07 AM
Took fuel distributor apart again, checked everything,, put it back on the car and tested it. Same issue. Ports #1 & #3 feed fuel all the time. Switched hoses and injectors around. Same thing. Whatever lines are on ports #1 & #3 keep spraying.

Trying to think what could be causing this. Seems like the following could be causing fuel to spray out of the injectors on #1 & #3:

1. Injectors are opening at too low of pressure (already disproved this as being the problem)

2. The spring, shim arrangement on these ports is too strong thus holding the port open.

3. There is some sort of solid debris on the face of these two ports holding them open.

4. These ports are somehow damaged (face of port not flat) allowing fuel to pass by when the diaphragm is push up against them.

When I looked at the ports it did look like at least one of them had a notch in it for some reason.



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82DMC12
11-25-2021, 10:28 AM
Took fuel distributor apart again, checked everything,, put it back on the car and tested it. Same issue. Ports #1 & #3 feed fuel all the time. Switched hoses and injectors around. Same thing. Whatever lines are on ports #1 & #3 keep spraying.

Trying to think what could be causing this. Seems like the following could be causing fuel to spray out of the injectors on #1 & #3:

1. Injectors are opening at too low of pressure (already disproved this as being the problem)

2. The spring, shim arrangement on these ports is too strong thus holding the port open.

3. There is some sort of solid debris on the face of these two ports holding them open.

4. These ports are somehow damaged (face of port not flat) allowing fuel to pass by when the diaphragm is push up against them.

When I looked at the ports it did look like at least one of them had a notch in it for some reason.



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I don't have any advice for you but if you decide to let someone else fix it for you, these guys are very well regarded https://k-jet.biz/

Ron
11-25-2021, 09:38 PM
Took fuel distributor apart again, checked everything,, put it back on the car and tested it. Same issue. Ports #1 & #3 feed fuel all the time. Switched hoses and injectors around. Same thing. Whatever lines are on ports #1 & #3 keep spraying.

Trying to think what could be causing this. Seems like the following could be causing fuel to spray out of the injectors on #1 & #3:

1. Injectors are opening at too low of pressure (already disproved this as being the problem)

2. The spring, shim arrangement on these ports is too strong thus holding the port open.

3. There is some sort of solid debris on the face of these two ports holding them open.

4. These ports are somehow damaged (face of port not flat) allowing fuel to pass by when the diaphragm is push up against them.

When I looked at the ports it did look like at least one of them had a notch in it for some reason.



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RE:
2. I don't remember any shims?? (Check out the 2nd pic HERE (http://dmctalk.org/showthread.php?12821-Fuel-Distributor-Rebuild&p=185030&viewfull=1#post185030).)
(FWIW, the springs should exert .1 bar, assembled, iirc.)
3. Four slits partially blocked?
4. Ya distorted the diaphragm during assembly?

SupercoolBill
11-25-2021, 10:07 PM
RE:
2. I don't remember any shims?? (Check out the 2nd pic HERE (http://dmctalk.org/showthread.php?12821-Fuel-Distributor-Rebuild&p=185030&viewfull=1#post185030).)
(FWIW, the springs should exert .1 bar, assembled, iirc.)
3. Four slits partially blocked?
4. Ya distorted the diaphragm during assembly?Shims are in your pics. Aluminum washers.

What is the aluminum circle in this pic???
67484

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Ron
11-26-2021, 08:03 AM
Shims are in your pics. Aluminum washers.

What is the aluminum circle in this pic???
67484

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I don't see any washers in the pic I pointed to (only "spring cups")...

If you're asking about the circle that's off center at ~4 o'clock, that is the end of an adjustment screw found only in the adjustable style FD.

You mentioned six springs, six "spring cups", and 12 shims earlier. I'm wondering if you have a mix of styles...
The adjustable style should have 6 upper "spring cups" that the adjusting screws push against, 6 springs and 6 lower "spring cups" that rest against the diaphragm.
(Check out this vid (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bW9EP3x0rHU) at 11:00, and 11:44.)

I don't remember the the non-adjustable having upper "spring cups". I could be wrong there, but there are no shims in the parts I have for two non-adjustable FDs I have torn down in my bones box (just looked). (Maybe I've lost them and my mind... ;-)

When you tear it down again, post pics of what you have.

SupercoolBill
11-26-2021, 12:06 PM
See attached pics6748767488

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lazabby
11-27-2021, 09:33 AM
Jesus loved to party. Just think about it. Almost every good story was when he was at a party.

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That's right!

SupercoolBill
11-27-2021, 10:10 PM
Well, I give up. We tried after more things with no luck whatsoever. Put on the new fuel distributor hoses without the injectors. Ran the fuel pump and pushed the intake disk all the way down to try to flush a bunch of fuel through the distributor. We did this a few times. Then put empty water bottles on the injector hoses. The same thing happened again. The hose for cylendars #1 and #3 constantly feeding a bunch of fuel. Other hoses feeding little or no fuel.

Took EVERYTHING APART AGAIN. Opened up the fuel distributor AGAIN. Found a tear in o ring on the center tube.

Looked more closely at the metal diaphragm this time. Noticed dimples on it from it contacting the nozzles. As one might expect there were no dimples on #1 & #3. So this verifies what we were thinking. For some reason these two ports are never closing off. My wife measured everything again. She thought she had it figured out. She swapped around some springs. We put everything back together. Put the distributor on the car and hooked EVERYTHING BACK UP AGAIN.

Guess what? The same thing happened. Lines #1 & #3 constantly fed fuel.

We are done...time to get the distributor rebuilt by a professional.

Anyone ever used Special T Auto for a WUR or fuel DISTRIBUTOR? Their prices are a lot less than anywhere else.
On a positive note the fuel pressure test kit that I ordered showed up this week.

675176751867519

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SupercoolBill
11-27-2021, 10:14 PM
The morale of the story....if you try to rebuild your own fuel distributor DO NOT,....I repeat DO NOT mix up where the springs and shims were located or you will probably never get the distributor to work correctly.
That little mistake cost us $800

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Ron
11-28-2021, 01:08 PM
See attached pics6748767488

Sent from my SM-G970U using Tapatalklol...I can't count the shims/washers in that pic much less see them very well...


Well, I give up. We tried after more things with no luck whatsoever. Put on the new fuel distributor hoses without the injectors. Ran the fuel pump and pushed the intake disk all the way down to try to flush a bunch of fuel through the distributor. We did this a few times. Then put empty water bottles on the injector hoses. The same thing happened again. The hose for cylendars #1 and #3 constantly feeding a bunch of fuel. Other hoses feeding little or no fuel.

Took EVERYTHING APART AGAIN. Opened up the fuel distributor AGAIN. Found a tear in o ring on the center tube.

Looked more closely at the metal diaphragm this time. Noticed dimples on it from it contacting the nozzles. As one might expect there were no dimples on #1 & #3. So this verifies what we were thinking. For some reason these two ports are never closing off. My wife measured everything again. She thought she had it figured out. She swapped around some springs. We put everything back together. Put the distributor on the car and hooked EVERYTHING BACK UP AGAIN.

Guess what? The same thing happened. Lines #1 & #3 constantly fed fuel.

We are done...time to get the distributor rebuilt by a professional.

Anyone ever used Special T Auto for a WUR or fuel DISTRIBUTOR? Their prices are a lot less than anywhere else.
On a positive note the fuel pressure test kit that I ordered showed up this week.

675176751867519

Sent from my SM-G970U using TapatalkI'm with Bitsy, sounds like the nozzles aren't flush with the mating surface.
If you want, check them with a straight edge and if that is clearly the case, I'll swap heads with you, if you pay the shipping.

Does your original plate have dimples?

SupercoolBill
11-28-2021, 01:41 PM
lol...I can't count the shims/washers in that pic much less see them very well...

I'm with Bitsy, sounds like the nozzles aren't flush with the mating surface.
If you want, check them with a straight edge and if that is clearly the case, I'll swap heads with you, if you pay the shipping.

Does your original plate have dimples?Ron, sorry is don't have a better pic of the shims. They are basically just little washers, 12 total. None of them look the same as what you posted. What you poated looks like a top hat.

The old diaphragm has slight dimples but not at prominent as with the new one now.
Just had a thought. I put bolts in all of the ports to block them to glass beads blast the FD so I wouldn't get any media inside of it. Not all of the bolts were really short like I wanted so I had to stack up sealing washers on those ones. I specifically remember tightening one bolt in and meeting resistance before the sealing washers got tight so I took it back out and added more washers.
I am wondering if I inadvertently pushed down several of the nozzles. I thought that we checked it with a straight edge but maybe not. So if this is the case the reason that #1 & #3 is feeding when the others aren't isn't because THEY are the issue,...it is because the other nozzles are protruding too far.
Could this be possible? Could the other ports being "too tightly closed off" be causing the other ports to constantly feed fuel?
I might have to pop it open one more time. If the nozzles are protruding too far how should I push them back? 1/4" drive socket over the nozzle? Flat surface with some high grit emery paper? Or....just get a new top? Or just send it out to a pro?

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Bitsyncmaster
11-28-2021, 01:49 PM
I wonder how the nozzles are held in. I would think they have to be sealed real well so suspect they are glued in. I would guess the whole assembly is then surfaced on a surface grinder.

SupercoolBill
11-28-2021, 02:06 PM
I wonder how the nozzles are held in. I would think they have to be sealed real well so suspect they are glued in. I would guess the whole assembly is then surfaced on a surface grinder.Yeah or interference fit, pressed in like you said. Then probably lapped. I don't have a granite flat surface at my shop for relapping.

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Ron
11-28-2021, 02:54 PM
Ron, sorry is don't have a better pic of the shims. They are basically just little washers, 12 total. None of them look the same as what you posted. What you poated looks like a top hat.

The old diaphragm has slight dimples but not at prominent as with the new one now.
Just had a thought. I put bolts in all of the ports to block them to glass beads blast the FD so I wouldn't get any media inside of it. Not all of the bolts were really short like I wanted so I had to stack up sealing washers on those ones. I specifically remember tightening one bolt in and meeting resistance before the sealing washers got tight so I took it back out and added more washers.
I am wondering if I inadvertently pushed down several of the nozzles. I thought that we checked it with a straight edge but maybe not. So if this is the case the reason that #1 & #3 is feeding when the others aren't isn't because THEY are the issue,...it is because the other nozzles are protruding too far.
Could this be possible? Could the other ports being "too tightly closed off" be causing the other ports to constantly feed fuel?
I might have to pop it open one more time. If the nozzles are protruding too far how should I push them back? 1/4" drive socket over the nozzle? Flat surface with some high grit emery paper? Or....just get a new top? Or just send it out to a pro?

Sent from my SM-G970U using TapatalkI finally found my reference material. After viewing THIS VID (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XCUtzN_zuM0), I'm with you on the shims (Sorry, played with too many different systems over the years...;-).
What you are saying makes sense to me, IFF #1 and #3 shut off with the [air] plate all of the way up (and the CO screw backed out enough)...If #1 and #3 OK and are set up correctly (5.2mm to 5.3mm height), they should act normal.

"As the control plunger rises, and fuel flow into the differential-pressure valve increases, the fuel pressure deflects the diaphragm. This causes a proportional increase in the area of the fuel outlet to the injector and maintains the same pressure drop at the control-plunger slit. Even though there is more fuel flow through a more open slit, the differential between pressure inside the slit and pressure outside the slit is constant.It may seem, because the deflection of the diaphragm enlarges the outlet to the fuel injectors, that fuel metering is a
function of how close the diaphragm is to the outlet. But this is not the case. All fuel metering takes place at the control-plunger slits. The movement of the diaphragm acts only to maintain constant pressure drop-to eliminate pressure drop as a variant and maintain accurate metering to each injector, regardless of changing fuel flow rates."
(Bosch)

I'd suggest: open it up one more time, measure and record the stacked heights, and check if the nozzles are flush. That should tell you what is wrong here. If the nozzles are off, I'd just swap it out or send the whole thing off personally. (Not worth trying to get the precision required and risk leaks ect. concerning the nozzles.)

Ron
11-28-2021, 02:56 PM
Yeah or interference fit, pressed in like you said. Then probably lapped. I don't have a granite flat surface at my shop for relapping.

Sent from my SM-G970U using TapatalkI wonder if the nozzle tip will stand milling...

SupercoolBill
11-28-2021, 03:32 PM
I finally found my reference material. After viewing THIS VID (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XCUtzN_zuM0), I'm with you on the shims (Sorry, played with too many different systems over the years...;-).
What you are saying makes sense to me, IFF #1 and #3 shut off with the plate all of the way up (and the CO screw backed out enough)...If #1 and #3 OK and are set up correctly (5.2mm to 5.3mm height), they should act normal.

"As the control plunger rises, and fuel flow into the differential-pressure valve increases, the fuel pressure deflects the diaphragm. This causes a proportional increase in the area of the fuel outlet to the injector and maintains the same pressure drop at the control-plunger slit. Even though there is more fuel flow through a more open slit, the differential between pressure inside the slit and pressure outside the slit is constant.It may seem, because the deflection of the diaphragm enlarges the outlet to the fuel injectors, that fuel metering is a
function of how close the diaphragm is to the outlet. But this is not the case. All fuel metering takes place at the control-plunger slits. The movement of the diaphragm acts only to maintain constant pressure drop-to eliminate pressure drop as a variant and maintain accurate metering to each injector, regardless of changing fuel flow rates."
(Bosch)

I'd suggest: open it up one more time, measure and record the stacked heights, and check if the nozzles are flush. That should tell you what is wrong here. If the nozzles are off, I'd just swap it out or send the whole thing off personally. (Not worth trying to get the precision required and risk leaks ect. concerning the nozzles.)I agree

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SupercoolBill
11-28-2021, 03:34 PM
I finally found my reference material. After viewing THIS VID (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XCUtzN_zuM0), I'm with you on the shims (Sorry, played with too many different systems over the years...;-).
What you are saying makes sense to me, IFF #1 and #3 shut off with the plate all of the way up (and the CO screw backed out enough)...If #1 and #3 OK and are set up correctly (5.2mm to 5.3mm height), they should act normal.

"As the control plunger rises, and fuel flow into the differential-pressure valve increases, the fuel pressure deflects the diaphragm. This causes a proportional increase in the area of the fuel outlet to the injector and maintains the same pressure drop at the control-plunger slit. Even though there is more fuel flow through a more open slit, the differential between pressure inside the slit and pressure outside the slit is constant.It may seem, because the deflection of the diaphragm enlarges the outlet to the fuel injectors, that fuel metering is a
function of how close the diaphragm is to the outlet. But this is not the case. All fuel metering takes place at the control-plunger slits. The movement of the diaphragm acts only to maintain constant pressure drop-to eliminate pressure drop as a variant and maintain accurate metering to each injector, regardless of changing fuel flow rates."
(Bosch)

I'd suggest: open it up one more time, measure and record the stacked heights, and check if the nozzles are flush. That should tell you what is wrong here. If the nozzles are off, I'd just swap it out or send the whole thing off personally. (Not worth trying to get the precision required and risk leaks ect. concerning the nozzles.)Interesting....so the nozzles aren't what is meter fuel to the individual injectors. It is the position of the plunger that modulates the flow. It might be worth removing the center tube and checking my six o rings I guess.

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Bitsyncmaster
11-28-2021, 03:39 PM
I wonder if the nozzle tip will stand milling...

Probably would work if just milling a mill or two. But the surface grinder would give the best finish and maybe lapped on a surface block.

https://www.amazon.com/TTC-Thick-Grade-Granite-Surface/dp/B0058JW99I/ref=sr_1_4?gclid=Cj0KCQiA7oyNBhDiARIsADtGRZZ6-soUm2ExCjZbtP-23j88cixWNHsQL3U1O9wzg7p2e1hyTXgDU48aAhEOEALw_wcB&hvadid=410084664443&hvdev=c&hvlocphy=9007686&hvnetw=g&hvqmt=e&hvrand=16077210288060603755&hvtargid=kwd-910031931&hydadcr=8458_11337698&keywords=granite+surface+plate&qid=1638128270&sr=8-4

SupercoolBill
11-28-2021, 03:40 PM
I finally found my reference material. After viewing THIS VID (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XCUtzN_zuM0), I'm with you on the shims (Sorry, played with too many different systems over the years...;-).
What you are saying makes sense to me, IFF #1 and #3 shut off with the plate all of the way up (and the CO screw backed out enough)...If #1 and #3 OK and are set up correctly (5.2mm to 5.3mm height), they should act normal.

"As the control plunger rises, and fuel flow into the differential-pressure valve increases, the fuel pressure deflects the diaphragm. This causes a proportional increase in the area of the fuel outlet to the injector and maintains the same pressure drop at the control-plunger slit. Even though there is more fuel flow through a more open slit, the differential between pressure inside the slit and pressure outside the slit is constant.It may seem, because the deflection of the diaphragm enlarges the outlet to the fuel injectors, that fuel metering is a
function of how close the diaphragm is to the outlet. But this is not the case. All fuel metering takes place at the control-plunger slits. The movement of the diaphragm acts only to maintain constant pressure drop-to eliminate pressure drop as a variant and maintain accurate metering to each injector, regardless of changing fuel flow rates."
(Bosch)

I'd suggest: open it up one more time, measure and record the stacked heights, and check if the nozzles are flush. That should tell you what is wrong here. If the nozzles are off, I'd just swap it out or send the whole thing off personally. (Not worth trying to get the precision required and risk leaks ect. concerning the nozzles.)I watched that video like 6 times.
Interestingly he never shows removing the shims or really says much about them. This was part of the reason that mine ended up all over the work bench and floor. I was using this video as my guide.

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Ron
11-28-2021, 04:25 PM
Interesting....so the nozzles aren't what is meter fuel to the individual injectors. It is the position of the plunger that modulates the flow. It might be worth removing the center tube and checking my six o rings I guess.

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..and inspect the slits closely.

SupercoolBill
11-28-2021, 08:54 PM
+1

..and inspect the slits closely.Yeah ill check those again too

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SupercoolBill
11-30-2021, 06:53 AM
Last night I took the FD apart one more time.
I couldn't find anything obvious wrong with it. Used a straight edge to check the depth of the nozzles. All of them appear to be exactly flush with the surface of the cover. The only thing I noticed was that the o ring on cylendar was damaged a bit. This seems to happen everytime even if we lube it before assembly. I don't see how this o ring being damaged would make only two ports feed too much fuel. Instead I would think if anything it would cause a fuel leak. Some of the o-rings on the slit ports look a bit funny, like they went in kind of dry. But non of them are ripped, or not over the little fuel ducts.
At this point I am throwing in the towel on this job. 675436754467545

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SupercoolBill
12-10-2021, 05:08 PM
Well, I figured that I have to put this thing back together to mail it in anyways so I double checked everything. One thing I forgot to do until now is remove the little filters and clean them. That wouldn't really cause the issue that I am seeing but why not. This time I swapped around the shims and springs. No measuring or anything. I dropped two shims in each port but no regards as to how they measure. I did this just as a test to see if anything changes.

I am going to test it tomorrow. I'll share whether anything changed or not. 675696757067571

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SupercoolBill
12-11-2021, 02:09 PM
Installed the distributor back on the car.
Decided to put on all the new banjo bolts and sealing washers.
Hey!!! Whadda ya know!! It doesn't leak by on #1 & #3 anymore!!!
Time to see if this baby will start!67573

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Ron
12-11-2021, 02:21 PM
Wild guessing you put it back together dry??

SupercoolBill
12-11-2021, 10:02 PM
Wild guessing you put it back together dry??Yeah mean dry as in no sealant?
I used the Hylomar type stuff.

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SupercoolBill
12-11-2021, 10:10 PM
Worked on the car today with the wife. Managed to get it to start and run. The wife was pretty excited. I didn't dare to let it run too long since I don't know if the coolant system is actually working or not.
The important thing we know that it runs and we got it warm for a accurate compression test. 67582

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SupercoolBill
12-11-2021, 10:14 PM
Pressures look great. They are actually closer than they look. Some of the pictures were not taken exactly head on. 675876758867589675906759167592

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82DMC12
12-11-2021, 10:19 PM
That is really good compression.

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SupercoolBill
12-11-2021, 10:20 PM
Noticed this today. Looks like something hot was up against the wires and melted the insulation. 67593

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SupercoolBill
12-11-2021, 10:24 PM
Pulled off everything that was bolted to the donor frame. 6759467595

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SupercoolBill
12-11-2021, 10:26 PM
Used some primitive methods to see if the frame was twisted or just damaged in isolated areas
Took measurements and compared to frame measurements I found on line. Seems like the frame isn't too messed up.

6759667597

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SupercoolBill
12-11-2021, 10:31 PM
Removed the horribly designed nut retainers.675986759967600

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SupercoolBill
12-11-2021, 10:36 PM
I plan on removing the flimsy crossmember bottom plating with 3/16" material. So I traced out a pattern on some cardboard676016760267603

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SupercoolBill
12-15-2021, 06:54 AM
Removed the horribly designed nut retainers.675986759967600

Sent from my SM-G970U using TapatalkI am learning now that I shouldn't have removed the captive nut holders. So I might have to get new nuts and weld the holders back in. The nuts freely spun in the holders though so I may replace them with something else.

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82DMC12
12-15-2021, 02:31 PM
You cut off these welded-on square nut holders? Probably not the end of the world - I think you could get away with running the body bolts into new nuts as long as you can hold the nut in place with a wrench while someone else drives it in.

67617

SupercoolBill
12-15-2021, 02:50 PM
You cut off these welded-on square nut holders? Probably not the end of the world - I think you could get away with running the body bolts into new nuts as long as you can hold the nut in place with a wrench while someone else drives it in.

67617It is a tight spot in there.


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DMC-Ron
12-16-2021, 06:01 AM
It is a tight spot in there.

Use long nose vice grips or masking tape the nut to a thin wrench.

SupercoolBill
12-18-2021, 09:30 PM
Worked on the D with the wife today. She worked on disconnecting stuff in the engine bay and I worked on disconnecting stuff up front. 6767767678

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SupercoolBill
12-18-2021, 09:36 PM
Everything on this car is a struggle. Every hose clamp is rusted stuck, almost every bolt strips out or snaps off. Had to grind off almost every access panel screw because the screws were sized and rivnuts just spun. Pretty much ended up ruining the access panel so I'll need to get another one of those. 6768067681

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SupercoolBill
12-18-2021, 09:38 PM
This,....this is going to be interesting. I hate these old style AC lines. They are usually seized in place and the nut just rounds off. Even worse than that is...how the heck am I even going to get a couple wrenches onto these connections to loosen them??676826768367684

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SupercoolBill
12-18-2021, 09:41 PM
Took the bolt out of the steering shaft but couldn't get it to separate. This maybe only comes apart as you are lifting the body off??
Discovered that there is a LOT of play in my steering rack input shaft.67685

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82DMC12
12-18-2021, 09:45 PM
Took the bolt out of the steering shaft but couldn't get it to separate. This maybe only comes apart as you are lifting the body off??
Discovered that there is a LOT of play in my steering rack input shaft.67685

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You'll probably have to try and "open" the clamp part of the joint with a big screwdriver or chisel. And lots of penetrating oil. The OEM u-joints are a common failure area (excess play). New U-joints are recommended! You can slide the shaft up towards the firewall if you loosen both u-joints with everything else in-situ. I didn't say it was easy on a rust bucket like this though. Slather in anti-seize once you put it all back together.

Ron
12-18-2021, 09:46 PM
This,....this is going to be interesting. I hate these old style AC lines. They are usually seized in place and the nut just rounds off. Even worse than that is...how the heck am I even going to get a couple wrenches onto these connections to loosen them??676826768367684

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Crows Foot.
...and as you probably guessed, you do not want the Evaporator tube to twist ANY whatsoever!!

SupercoolBill
12-18-2021, 10:06 PM
Crows Foot.
...and as you probably guessed, you do not want the Evaporator tube to twist ANY whatsoever!!Yeah figured. Don't want to pretzel it.

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SupercoolBill
12-18-2021, 10:08 PM
You'll probably have to try and "open" the clamp part of the joint with a big screwdriver or chisel. And lots of penetrating oil. The OEM u-joints are a common failure area (excess play). New U-joints are recommended! You can slide the shaft up towards the firewall if you loosen both u-joints with everything else in-situ. I didn't say it was easy on a rust bucket like this though. Slather in anti-seize once you put it all back together.I actually did hammer a large screwdriver in there and sprayed it all down with Kroil.

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SupercoolBill
12-18-2021, 10:09 PM
You'll probably have to try and "open" the clamp part of the joint with a big screwdriver or chisel. And lots of penetrating oil. The OEM u-joints are a common failure area (excess play). New U-joints are recommended! You can slide the shaft up towards the firewall if you loosen both u-joints with everything else in-situ. I didn't say it was easy on a rust bucket like this though. Slather in anti-seize once you put it all back together.U-joint has some play but the shaft on the steering rack is worse. It is REALLY loose!!

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DMC-Ron
12-19-2021, 04:52 AM
Took the bolt out of the steering shaft but couldn't get it to separate. This maybe only comes apart as you are lifting the body off??
Discovered that there is a LOT of play in my steering rack input shaft.67685

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As an alternative, you can loosen the upper spline clamps on the steering shaft. Sliding the shaft forward will disconnect the upper u-joint from the steering column at the firewall. I sprayed mine with PB Blaster and it slid fairly easily despite being rusty.

Ron

SupercoolBill
12-31-2021, 03:01 PM
Haven't posted for a while. The wife and I own a small HVAC company and have a lot of responsibilities so we work long days which doesn't leave much time for working in the car.

That being said I have been reaching out to any local person or business that could fix our donor frame. I found one place locally that advertises on that they are experts in frame straightening. On their website is a picture of the set up they use for straightening frames. It is basically a large flat table full of slots and holes, posts around the outside, etc. So basically you lock down the frame in there then set up pull points. Ok now we are talking!!! So I reached out to them by email. I was disappointed when the owner said that he didn't think he could straighten it because he doesn't have the car "in his computer"
I told him that I have all the measurements that the frame is supposed to be. He said "That doesn't matter,...what's the VIN?"
I sent him my VIN and haven't heard back. [emoji849]

Then a guy I know told me that he had got in an accident with his truck once and a local guy straightened out his frame. He said the guy is an old retired guy that has been building hot rods and restoring vehicles since the 70s. He called the guy right then and there. Next thing you know we scheduled a meeting at my shop for an hour later.
So this guy looking like one of the guys from ZZ Top shows up at my shop.
He was a cool guy but he is an American muscle guy and just kept making fun of the car and how it was made. He said he could fix the frame but if I wanted it "perfect" he wasn't the guy for that. He was explaining how he would fix it and I didn't get warm fuzzies about it.
So,...probably not going to use him. I was glad I had him look at the frame. He did give me some good nuggets of information.

Basically he thought I should just sell the car for what I can get out of it and get something else.
I think the next step is to get the body off the frame and see if the rust is repairable on my original frame and go from there.


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MrChocky
01-01-2022, 11:37 AM
Basically he thought I should just sell the car for what I can get out of it and get something else.
I think the next step is to get the body off the frame and see if the rust is repairable on my original frame and go from there.


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Welcome to DeLorean ownership. I've had a couple of guys tell me I should get something else; usually of course they have
some agenda, or the DeLorean is upsetting to them because it doesn't quite fit into their idea of what a car ought to be.

I'm sure your frame guy is out there; but it's going to take some persistence and probably a lot of stupid jokes.

SupercoolBill
01-01-2022, 12:11 PM
Welcome to DeLorean ownership. I've had a couple of guys tell me I should get something else; usually of course they have
some agenda, or the DeLorean is upsetting to them because it doesn't quite fit into their idea of what a car ought to be.

I'm sure your frame guy is out there; but it's going to take some persistence and probably a lot of stupid jokes.Yeah I am kind of used to it. I grew up in a town way out in the middle of nowhere population 800 and I was the only one that was into Hip Hop music and didn't like hunting, fishing, and drinking budweiser.
Then I got into going 4x4ing. Everyone else had Jeeps,...I had Suzuki Samurais. I got into antique motorcycles a few years ago. I own a 2 stroke Suzuki and a BMW air head. Everyone else in my area (including the guy that looked at my frame) are obsessed with Harley Davidsons.

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SupercoolBill
01-01-2022, 07:39 PM
We worked on the car today.
I am going to start by saying this is the most frustrating project I have ever worked on so far and my wife has only helped me on one other project with me and it was much easier. It seems like every bolt is seized but not just seized. A seized bolt can be dealt with. You heat it up with a torch and get it to start moving but it these are bolted through fiberglass or embedded in plastic or right just plain inaccessible to heat up. The fasteners that are not seized have heads that are already stripped out. Then there are the fasteners that it is like "How the heck am I supposed to get to that??" Ugh....I digress.

Here is what we got done today.
-Removed the rear facia of the car (is that what it is called??)
-Removed all of the body to frame bolts except the ones inside the cabin. Those still need to be done.
-unhooked ground wires, clutch master hydraulic hose, etc.

Sounds simple enough but what has to be done to remove those things from a rusty car from 1982,.....well put it this way it took the two of us 9 hours to do that stuff. 677526775367754677556775667757677586775967760

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SupercoolBill
01-09-2022, 09:51 AM
The wife and I spent five hours or so working on the car yesterday. The wife unhooked the parking brake cables, unbolted the seats and took them out (well I took the first one out) while I worked on getting the AC evaporator separated.
The more I thought about it I decided the best thing to do is to cut the lines for now. I can't find a kit that has the size of crows foots, (crows feet??) That I need and this is holding up the entire project. The accumulator and rubber lines are getting replaced anyways so I just cut them out.

Then hopefully after the body is lifted off the frame I can more easily get at the connection on the evap to be able to get them apart. If not then I'll be replacing the evaporator also.6778867789

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SupercoolBill
01-09-2022, 09:58 AM
The evaporator side of the accumulator was a lot harder to cut. I have all kinds of different cut off tools but the only thing that would really fit in there was a Sawzall with a long fine tooth blade bent at a 30 degree-ish angle. There was no good way to keep downward pressure on the blade. This wasn't to much of a problem for the first 1/2" or so but then as I got deeper the blade wasn't cutting and if I pushed downward the blade just jammed and bent. So I ended up putting leather gloves on, kind of acting as a guide and downward pressure for the blade. It took a long time but eventually the aluminum was thin enough that I could wiggle the accumulator back and forth until the remaining aluminum at the cut fatigued and broke.6779167792

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SupercoolBill
01-09-2022, 10:11 AM
The shifter knob needed to be removed but it seemed to be stuck. I have pretty good grip strength and I could not get the thing to budge...to the point that I was worried that I was going to damage the shifting linkages. I put a post on the FB DeLorean restoration page asking if all DeLorean shift knows were threaded and if I was a trick to getting it off (heat?)
The wife also started looking online and found someone's post where they said to use a pipe wrench with a rag. I had tried a flat faced pipe wrench before and it just slipped. So I grabbed a rag and a pipe wrench. I gave it a yank and "Crack!" just like that the knob was loose but.....the wrench put some marks in the knob. I guess I should have used a tougher rag or as someone mentioned on the FB page,..a rubber jar opener. That's a pretty good idea. Hopefully the knob can be repaired or maybe OEM replacements are still available for not a million dollars. Or I keep it as is and always remember how hard the thing was stuck on there. [emoji1]
Some people said that the DeLorean shift knob had a jam nut under that needed to be loosened. Mine didn't have a jam not and if it did I am not sure how I would even be able to get to it to loosen it because it is recessed in there. (see pic of underside of knob).67793677946779567796

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Bitsyncmaster
01-09-2022, 11:11 AM
The jamb nut is just to be able to set where the knob holds tight so your lettering is pointed correct. As you said you would not be able to get loose even if it had one.

You can run with jamb nut but probably would want a washer to prevent the boot from twisting. You may need to make some shims for that washer to get it to stay with the lettering pointed as you like.

SupercoolBill
01-09-2022, 07:10 PM
The jamb nut is just to be able to set where the knob holds tight so your lettering is pointed correct. As you said you would not be able to get loose even if it had one.

You can run with jamb nut but probably would want a washer to prevent the boot from twisting. You may need to make some shims for that washer to get it to stay with the lettering pointed as you like.It will be a long time before it gets reassembled but my thought was RTV on the threads. That should keep it facing the way I want but allow it to be screwed off if needed.

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DMC-Ron
01-10-2022, 06:43 AM
The shifter knob needed to be removed but it seemed to be stuck. I have pretty good grip strength and I could not get the thing to budge...to the point that I was worried that I was going to damage the shifting linkages. I put a post on the FB DeLorean restoration page asking if all DeLorean shift knows were threaded and if I was a trick to getting it off (heat?)
The wife also started looking online and found someone's post where they said to use a pipe wrench with a rag. I had tried a flat faced pipe wrench before and it just slipped. So I grabbed a rag and a pipe wrench. I gave it a yank and "Crack!" just like that the knob was loose but.....the wrench put some marks in the knob. I guess I should have used a tougher rag or as someone mentioned on the FB page,..a rubber jar opener. That's a pretty good idea. Hopefully the knob can be repaired or maybe OEM replacements are still available for not a million dollars. Or I keep it as is and always remember how hard the thing was stuck on there.


Just for future reference, a plumbers strap wrench works to loosen things without marring. I have two sizes and use them to hold and loosen all kinds of things where I don't want to leave channel-lock teeth marks.
67797

Ron

SupercoolBill
01-10-2022, 06:50 AM
Just for future reference, a plumbers strap wrench works to loosen things without marring. I have two sizes and use them to hold and loosen all kinds of things where I don't want to leave channel-lock teeth marks.
67797

RonI actually have a set like that and the metal type with a nylon strap. Could have tried that. Although it was stuck so hard that I think it may have just slipped or if it had teeth (like the one in the picture) it would have still left its mark. Maybe not though. I'll have to try it on the next manual transmission shift knob that is stuck on. [emoji1]

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SupercoolBill
01-10-2022, 02:10 PM
Last night I cleaned up the area around the car, put tools away, bagged, boxed, tagged parts.677996780067801

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SupercoolBill
01-10-2022, 02:22 PM
I can't believe that I am even asking this but, has anyone ever used the fake yellow plating spray paint? I have seen it before online somewhere. Basically it is supposed to make you part look like it has been plated with zinc yellow chromate.

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82DMC12
01-10-2022, 02:42 PM
I can't believe that I am even asking this but, has anyone ever used the fake yellow plating spray paint? I have seen it before online somewhere. Basically it is supposed to make you part look like it has been plated with zinc yellow chromate.

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Last week I used VHT Engine Metallic in Gold Flake (Advance Auto has it) for a test spray on my idle microswitch bracket to see how close it would match my water pump pulley. It's very close, close enough. Looks fantastic. Here's a pic but it's not zoomed in on that part. You're supposed to bake the painted part at 200F for an hour to ensure it is will be chemical-resistant when you're done.

Compare it to the two S-brackets for the mixture unit support and the Q-clip for the water hose in front of the compressor - both of those are plate (either zinc or cadmium, not sure)

67802

SupercoolBill
01-10-2022, 03:02 PM
Last week I used VHT Engine Metallic in Gold Flake (Advance Auto has it) for a test spray on my idle microswitch bracket to see how close it would match my water pump pulley. It's very close, close enough. Looks fantastic. Here's a pic but it's not zoomed in on that part. You're supposed to bake the painted part at 200F for an hour to ensure it is will be chemical-resistant when you're done.

Compare it to the two S-brackets for the mixture unit support and the Q-clip for the water hose in front of the compressor - both of those are plate (either zinc or cadmium, not sure)

67802Cool.
On one hand I can tell that it isn't the same but it still looks pretty good.

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82DMC12
01-10-2022, 03:18 PM
Cool.
On one hand I can tell that it isn't the same but it still looks pretty good.

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In my experience, plating looks splotchy and uneven and it comes off with solvents. I like that it's so thin that it doesn't affect putting parts together or causing fitment issues, but it's not very durable. For that reason, I like plated fasteners and washers, etc. But for bigger parts that you actually see, I think paint or powder coating is best. Each method has its place. You can make plated stuff last longer if you clear coat it with Clear engine enamel by Dupli Color. Good for calipers and stuff.

SupercoolBill
01-14-2022, 06:49 PM
Worked on the car with the wife the other night. I am not allowed to work on it without her. [emoji846]
We jacked the car up until we ran out of blocks. It still was not high enough for the stick shift to clear the rear timber. So my wife suggested taking the wheels off. I remember that I had some 4 wheel dollies so I thought that was a great idea. 6781667817

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SupercoolBill
01-14-2022, 06:53 PM
Well it was a great idea until I got to the last two lug nuts on the left front wheel (why is it always the last one or last ones?).
The nuts were stuck solid. I found this strange since all the wheel studs so far had generous amounts of anti-sieze compound on them. I started with a 19mm on my impact gun. Eventually the stainless steel covers on the nuts came loose. Now they were 18mm lug nuts. 6781867819

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67821

SupercoolBill
01-14-2022, 06:55 PM
Both lug nuts ended up rounding out completely. I though that the nut was actually coming off finally but it was just becoming a circle.
I was surprised that my cordless impact had that much power.



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SupercoolBill
01-14-2022, 07:03 PM
Ended up drilling between the wheel studs and the lug nut to see if I could get the nut to kind of split and come off. Quite a pain but it kind of worked. Main objective was to not damage the rim.678236782467825

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SupercoolBill
01-14-2022, 07:05 PM
The wife gave it a try on the next one. Eventually we got the other one off and the wheel off.

A moment of silence for all of the drill bits that we ruined in the process.[emoji17]67826678276782867829

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SupercoolBill
01-14-2022, 07:07 PM
Now we were finally able to set all 4 corners on the flat dollies and roll the frame out from under the body. Yeah!!6783067831

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82DMC12
01-14-2022, 08:49 PM
Christ on a crutch, what a mess. Is there not some way to remove the manual gear shifter from the frame from up top so that you wouldn't have had to clear the lever?

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Helirich
01-14-2022, 11:24 PM
Wow, I bet that felt good to get those lugs off!

SupercoolBill
01-15-2022, 09:07 AM
Wow, I bet that felt good to get those lugs off!Yeah it did. What a pain.

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SupercoolBill
01-15-2022, 09:17 AM
Now some pictures of the frame and other areas that couldn't be seen while the frame was under the car. I feel like sending these pics to everyone who said "Why are you guys pulling the body off the frame?" "Can't you just fix it from below?"
Or all the people that crapped me on the FB restoration page because I had to cut things to get them apart. This car is REALLY rusty!!6783267833678346783567836

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SupercoolBill
01-15-2022, 09:48 AM
Great news!!!
I have someone lined up to do the repair work on our donor frame!! I was having such bad luck getting someone to do the work that I was going to try to tackle the job myself. I have never straightened a bent frame before, I don't have much spare time for this project, and I haven't welded for years so I still hoped I could find someone else to do it or help me.
I have a buddy (Donny) that has welded professionally for many years. He even owned his own metal fabrication business for a few years. Now he just does fabrication work on nights and weekend. I have used him on past restoration projects. His work is exceptional and his prices are really reasonable.
I have seen some of the other projects he has done and was blown away. I asked him about fixing my frame a while ago. He said he may be able to do it but since then I haven't heard from him. Basically he has been working a lot of hours out of town (he is a supervisor for a company that builds commercial steel buildings).
He finally stopped in today to look at the project.
Immediately I got a lot better feeling about him than the other guy that had come to look at it.
He was very confident he could fix it and make it look totally original again. He was already telling me how he was going to make sure it was straight, how he was going to fix the bent parts, etc. PERFECT!!
So I asked him "How much do you think to fix the bent parts, remove the bottom panels, install thicker 3/16" bottom panels, etc." "Be honest, I won't be offended"
I had a number in my head of $2000.00. He looked at me and said "Ok I am just gonna say it...$2000.00" "That's what I think it will cost,..maybe a bit more,...maybe a bit less"
I say "Ok sounds good, that what I was expecting." "A replacement frame costs $8500.00 plus delivery which is probably another $1000.00." "So I think we are still going to save money going this route."

So I paid $1000.00 for the bent frame. It is going to cost around $2000.00 to get it straightened and made stronger than original on bottom. It costs $600.00 to have the epoxy coating baked off. I got a quote for galvanizing and powder coating from Duncan Galvanizing and I think it was $600.00
So potentially I could have a "like new" frame with tougher bottom plates for $5000ish, even less if I just clean up the frame myself and touch up the bad area.
One thing I really like about this approach vs. buying a new frame is that I used a local frame that may have ended up getting scraped. Used a local friend to do the work. Used a New England company to strip it and coat it.

Donny said he will use my shop to do the work (makes sense because the frame is already there and it is a big heated garage)
He can't start on it for a couple weeks so we need to be patient.

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Quinn
01-15-2022, 01:06 PM
However, you may take a hit on resale value, when you disclose that it has a straightened frame.

82DMC12
01-15-2022, 01:15 PM
However, you may take a hit on resale value, when you disclose that it has a straightened frame.Personally, I probably would not be overly concerned as long as it looks like the frame was totally refinished, looks like a million bucks, and I take it to an alignment shop to verify it can be aligned. Now if it was some basic ass daily driver, yeah I'd steer totally clear, but for a somewhat rare classic car, considerations can be made.

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SupercoolBill
01-15-2022, 01:42 PM
Personally, I probably would not be overly concerned as long as it looks like the frame was totally refinished, looks like a million bucks, and I take it to an alignment shop to verify it can be aligned. Now if it was some basic ass daily driver, yeah I'd steer totally clear, but for a somewhat rare classic car, considerations can be made.

Sent from my Pixel 3a using TapatalkYeah that is basically what I have been told by people that regularly restore old vehicles. As long as it is done right, everything is back to factory specs or better, then there is really nothing to disclose.
That being said if anyone ever was interested in buying the car I would give them the file with our log book, all of our pictures of the entire restoration, and a link to this thread.
I would think that the buyer would appreciate all of the time and money put into the project as opposed to buying one that has never has anything done to it. Unless of course they can find one of those cars that has no rust, was driven all it's life but not driven very many miles, stored in a climate conditioned environment.

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Helirich
01-15-2022, 03:31 PM
Personally, I probably would not be overly concerned as long as it looks like the frame was totally refinished, looks like a million bucks, and I take it to an alignment shop to verify it can be aligned. Now if it was some basic ass daily driver, yeah I'd steer totally clear, but for a somewhat rare classic car, considerations can be made.

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This is my thought. In fact, I would be more likely to buy when a thicker material was used to repair it.

MrChocky
01-16-2022, 08:01 AM
Personally, I probably would not be overly concerned as long as it looks like the frame was totally refinished, looks like a million bucks, and I take it to an alignment shop to verify it can be aligned. Now if it was some basic ass daily driver, yeah I'd steer totally clear, but for a somewhat rare classic car, considerations can be made.

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Yes, what you said. This isn't some rare pony car that needs to be "original". The DeLorean market is different (although not hugely so); so many cars how have had extensive work done, it's interesting as history, but not much else.
Anyway, you'll be driving it, so it doesn't matter that much. Certainly it'd be worth a lot less as unfinished car with a wonky frame.

SupercoolBill
01-16-2022, 10:02 PM
Tonight I watched a bunch of tech videos on YouTube then watched the old DMC factory footage video. Really bad quality but I learned a lot about the car and how it was made. Also lots of good info on how the car parts looked originally. I didn't realize how gold looking the plated parts were. It looks more like gold plating than the zinc with yellow chromate that they do now. I qm rethinking having our parts replated vs. Painting them with gold colored gas proof paint.
The video has no sound for the factory but instead has sound footage of a DMC presentation at a car dealers event. Lots of good info there too. You can hear John saying that they car has (or will have) a stainless steel frame.67838

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82DMC12
01-16-2022, 10:34 PM
I'm really liking that paint I mentioned before. VHT Engine Enamel in Gold Flake and Dupli-Color Engine Enamel Gloss Clear with Ceramic. Also for aluminum stuff I am using Dupli-Color Engine Enamel with Ceramic in DE1650 Cast Coat Aluminum.

You can see in the picture I painted the throttle linkage with the clear so it looks like bare metal but will not get tarnished/rusty. https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20220117/193df91e224025bbc2c8938af5ff82c5.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20220117/bfdc6d5cd2a481cd9dce203c0a1ea08f.jpg

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SupercoolBill
01-16-2022, 10:53 PM
I'm really liking that paint I mentioned before. VHT Engine Enamel in Gold Flake and Dupli-Color Engine Enamel Gloss Clear with Ceramic. Also for aluminum stuff I am using Dupli-Color Engine Enamel with Ceramic in DE1650 Cast Coat Aluminum.

You can see in the picture I painted the throttle linkage with the clear so it looks like bare metal but will not get tarnished/rusty. https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20220117/193df91e224025bbc2c8938af5ff82c5.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20220117/bfdc6d5cd2a481cd9dce203c0a1ea08f.jpg

Sent from my Pixel 3a using TapatalkThat's a bit more orange than the original which has more yellow to it. It does look pretty great though.

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SupercoolBill
01-16-2022, 10:57 PM
Pimped out my work desk today. It was polyethylened Baltic Birch. I had a brushed stainless top made for it. Today I touched up the edges, put it on the desk and peeled the protective vinyl off from it. I think it looks pretty sweet. I am going to order the OEM DeLorean hood insignia to put on the corner just like the hood on the car.67839

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SupercoolBill
01-16-2022, 10:58 PM
With all my "stuff" on it.67840

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82DMC12
01-16-2022, 11:03 PM
Could also be the lighting, I will send a better picture once everything is reinstalled. It's very close to the plating I received from DMC Midwest but since it's paint it's a bit more consistent than plating would look.

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SupercoolBill
01-17-2022, 07:12 PM
This doesn't look stock. I appreciate what they were trying to do but I would rather that it was not modified.67844

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SupercoolBill
01-17-2022, 07:14 PM
Could also be the lighting, I will send a better picture once everything is reinstalled. It's very close to the plating I received from DMC Midwest but since it's paint it's a bit more consistent than plating would look.

Sent from my Pixel 3a using TapatalkYeah it could be the lighting.

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SupercoolBill
01-17-2022, 07:16 PM
That's a bit more orange than the original which has more yellow to it. It does look pretty great though.

Sent from my SM-G970U using TapatalkWhen I watched the old video of the DMC plant the throttle link was actually gold too. Not sure if it was maybe just the first cars that had so much gold plated stuff or not.

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82DMC12
01-17-2022, 07:48 PM
This doesn't look stock. I appreciate what they were trying to do but I would rather that it was not modified.67844

Sent from my SM-G970U using TapatalkDealer procedure was to cut off the old captive nuts and replace with nuts/bolts if the upper ball joint needed to be replaced.

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SupercoolBill
01-17-2022, 07:52 PM
Dealer procedure was to cut off the old captive nuts and replace with nuts/bolts if the upper ball joint needed to be replaced.

Sent from my Pixel 3a using TapatalkYeah do you see the bar stock welded onto it also?

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82DMC12
01-17-2022, 07:55 PM
Yeah do you see the bar stock welded onto it also?

Sent from my SM-G970U using TapatalkOh.... Did not see that. Yeah not stock. But upper A arms are actually not really a failure point so I wonder why someone thought that was required.

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Josh
01-17-2022, 09:18 PM
When I watched the old video of the DMC plant the throttle link was actually gold too. Not sure if it was maybe just the first cars that had so much gold plated stuff or not.

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its yellow zinc plating.

SupercoolBill
01-17-2022, 11:38 PM
its yellow zinc plating.Looks different than yellow zinc. Super bright gold whereas yellow zinc just has a yellow tint to it.

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82DMC12
01-18-2022, 11:50 AM
I always thought the original plating was cadmium. That's hard to get done nowadays because apparently cadmium plating is not very eco-friendly so most shops have moved to just zinc plating. At least that's what two shops near me said. My understanding is Lotus had the same plating in that era.

SupercoolBill
01-18-2022, 12:08 PM
I always thought the original plating was cadmium. That's hard to get done nowadays because apparently cadmium plating is not very eco-friendly so most shops have moved to just zinc plating. At least that's what two shops near me said. My understanding is Lotus had the same plating in that era.Yeah a lot of the stuff was cad. I am just referring to the stuff that had a gold color to it. The gold stuff may have had cad then the yellow chromate over it.
I just restored a 1970 BMW motorcycle recently and I ran into the issue of that being all cad plating originally. I did find a place on the east coast that did cad plating but I didn't like their answer when I asked for an estimate on what it would cost to have my stuff plated,..Basically they wouldn't give me even a ballpark. They just wanted me to send them my stuff. I know how that works. You have all of my parts which are rare and worth a lot then you say "OK if you ever want to see your parts again you need to pay us $1000 to have them plated."
In the end I had a buddy of mine zinc plate them. I asked a lot of guys on line and basically that's what most people doing restorations are doing unless your doing a concors resto. Once it gets weathered the zinc looks pretty close to cad anyways.

It was someone I could trust, a local operation, and he didn't charge me anything for it so I sold what the heck. Parts came out pretty nice but I did notice that it wasn't worth it for nuts and bolts. It seemed like it made the metal more weak. Also some of the threads were too thick.

I should see if he can plate my stuff for the car.[emoji848]

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67846

82DMC12
01-18-2022, 12:32 PM
Yeah a lot of the stuff was cad. I am just referring to the stuff that had a gold color to it. The gold stuff may have had cad then the yellow chromate over it.
I just restored a 1970 BMW motorcycle recently and I ran into the issue of that being all cad plating originally. I did find a place on the east coast that did cad plating but I didn't like their answer when I asked for an estimate on what it would cost to have my stuff plated,..Basically they wouldn't give me even a ballpark. They just wanted me to send them my stuff. I know how that works. You have all of my parts which are rare and worth a lot then you say "OK if you ever want to see your parts again you need to pay us $1000 to have them plated."
In the end I had a buddy of mine zinc plate them. I asked a lot of guys on line and basically that's what most people doing restorations are doing unless your doing a concors resto. Once it gets weathered the zinc looks pretty close to cad anyways.

It was someone I could trust, a local operation, and he didn't charge me anything for it so I sold what the heck. Parts came out pretty nice but I did notice that it wasn't worth it for nuts and bolts. It seemed like it made the metal more weak. Also some of the threads were too thick.

I should see if he can plate my stuff for the car.[emoji848]

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67846

That's weird, the bolts I got back from DMCMW's plating service were perfect and the threads were clean and well-plated. But I also blow out the threaded hole it is going into with shop air and then put a drop of tap and die oil on pretty much every bolt and thread it in by hand before I pull it out, wipe it off, and then finally assemble. That way I know the threads are good. Also a thin layer of copper anti-seize on the threads and shank of any bolt that doesn't have a specific torque requirement.

Bitsyncmaster
01-18-2022, 01:24 PM
I found CAD plating on bolts would come right off the threads on first use. Those bolts were also AN rated aircraft hardware.

SupercoolBill
01-18-2022, 05:06 PM
I found CAD plating on bolts would come right off the threads on first use. Those bolts were also AN rated aircraft hardware.Yeah lots of cad plated stuff on planes.67852

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SupercoolBill
01-20-2022, 08:05 PM
Update-
Last night we worked on the car for around 3 hours.
Managed to get the engine and transmission ready to come out.
I am sure people are sick of me saying this but,..MAN this car is so rusty!!

New discoveries last night:
1. Transmission mount is broken.
2. Heater piping above the engine (Valley of death) just crumbled when I moved the rubber hosing.
3. The alternator bracket is a homemade hack job.
4. Even with the body removed a lot of fasteners on this car are nearly impossible to get to.
678706787167872678736787467875678766787767878

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82DMC12
01-20-2022, 10:04 PM
So that's actually not the alternator bracket. The alternator is attached to the head with a block of metal that doesn't break. That welded bar you see is the upper muffler bracket which is a very common failure point. The muffler bracket doesn't actually have anything to do with the alternator attachment.

SupercoolBill
01-21-2022, 06:55 AM
So that's actually not the alternator bracket. The alternator is attached to the head with a block of metal that doesn't break. That welded bar you see is the upper muffler bracket which is a very common failure point. The muffler bracket doesn't actually have anything to do with the alternator attachment.It was kind of "all in one" on my car.

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SupercoolBill
01-21-2022, 11:46 AM
I was lamenting (basically complaining) to my buddy that we bought the car off telling me how rusted everything is and how many bolts have broke off or had to be cut off and he tells me that he has a heat induction tool that we can borrow. Sweeeet!!67884

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Helirich
01-22-2022, 12:59 PM
I’m very excited to hear how you and Dr Win make out with this tool. Please give us a complete review.

SupercoolBill
01-22-2022, 09:30 PM
Worked on the D with the wife today. She has improved by leaps and bound! In the beginning every 5 minutes she would start complaining and I'd end up having to drop what I was doing to go talk her off a ledge. Today we both just attacked the project. It was like a competition to see who could get more done on it.
First we pulled the motor and transmission out.
The motor mounts didn't want to separate so we ended up having to remove the four bolts that bolt the bottom section of the mounts to the cradle....horrible horrible task. But eventually we got it. 678996790067901

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SupercoolBill
01-22-2022, 09:35 PM
I got a chance to use the induction heater that my buddy (ironically the same person that sold us the car) let me borrow.
I honestly was amazed. I literally don't understand how the wire on this device gets the object so hot so fast. It's like a an oxygen acetylene torch! 67902

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SupercoolBill
01-22-2022, 09:39 PM
We pulled out both half shafts, removed the parking brake mechanism, removed the rear brake calipers, and removed the rear brake rotors. This all came apart without too much struggle...then things went south..6790367904

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SupercoolBill
01-22-2022, 09:41 PM
Some of the suspension bolts were stuck pretty good but we managed to get most of them except for the bottom link bolts (the one where the rear shock bolts onto) those are still seized.



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AugustneverEnds
01-22-2022, 09:43 PM
I got a chance to use the induction heater that my buddy (ironically the same person that sold us the car) let me borrow.
I honestly was amazed. I literally don't understand how the wire on this device gets the object so hot so fast. It's like a an oxygen acetylene torch! 67902

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Sounds like a must have tool for restorations, thanks for letting us know how it worked out :thumbup:

SupercoolBill
01-22-2022, 09:49 PM
The trailing arm front mounts were a battle!! The pivot bolts were seized into the trailing arms. I sprayed them, heated them, chilled them, hit them, yelled at them, they wouldn't budge. I thought "Well, ok then I'll just unbolt the mounting plates instead and work at trying to get the large pivot bolt out later."
Hahahah....[emoji1787][emoji1787] yeah....the four bolts that hold on the plates are threaded into nuts welded onto the frame mounts...which is no problem. But,..there are lock nuts used as jam nuts INSIDE the mounting plate welded to the frame. Two of the are accessible but the other two were not. I tried every type of tool I had and nothing fit in there good enough to break the lock nuts free.
Pictured is one of the ones that is accessible.6790567906

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SupercoolBill
01-22-2022, 09:56 PM
I finally said the heck with it and decided to Sawzall the large pivot bolt on one side. My theory being that once the bolt was out of the way I'd be able to fit a wrench in there to loosen the lock nut. Sure enough after I got the large bolt out of the way I was able to get the lock nut backed off. Not saying it was easy but at least it was doable.
After I got the trailing arm off I put it in a bench vise and tried again to get the pivot bolt (or what was left of it) out of the TA. No luck.. I got looking at the TA and noticed that it was rusted right though....junk....
So at that point I had no worries about sawing through the other pivot bolt. If I'm replacing one TA then I am replacing both.
We will be replacing both trailing arms.
679076790867909

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SupercoolBill
01-22-2022, 10:02 PM
We finished off the day by removing the coolant lines, the shifter linkages, the fuel filter, fuel lines, gas tank closing plate, and the gas tank.
Lots of rust and epoxy flakes to clean up on the shop floor when we were done. I was really hoping that the gas tank closing plate was salvageable but it is too rust damaged. I feel like the replacements are over priced but I may have to pony up and get one.67910679116791267913

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SupercoolBill
01-22-2022, 10:08 PM
Last but not least tonight was the deadline for deciding if we are going to try to restore this frame at some point, sell the frame for someone else to restore, or cut out what we can use on the donor frame and sell off any good sections of the frame.
Well, this frame is just way too rust damaged for me. I don't think it is worth trying to fix and the parts that I need for my door frame actually appear to be in good serviceable condition on this frame so......A moment of silence for the original car frame. [emoji17] 679146791567916679176791867919

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AugustneverEnds
01-22-2022, 10:21 PM
You poor man and your wife, you are courageous souls!

Where was this car stored, the bottom of a lake?? :shock:

SupercoolBill
01-22-2022, 11:19 PM
It was driven in the winter in Maine. The stuff they put on the roads in the winter eats metal.

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AugustneverEnds
01-22-2022, 11:47 PM
It was driven in the winter in Maine. The stuff they put on the roads in the winter eats metal.

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Road salt and I are very well acquainted from living in Upstate NY; my car was originally sold in Vermont and then spent two decades in Massachusetts. At least the dash and binnacle don't crack under the Northeast's grey skies.

SupercoolBill
01-23-2022, 06:35 AM
Road salt and I are very well acquainted from living in Upstate NY; my car was originally sold in Vermont and then spent two decades in Massachusetts. At least the dash and binnacle don't crack under the Northeast's grey skies.Yeah well some cars from the Salt belt are rust free. It depends on whether the owners drove it or parked it for the winter. I find that Maine,.NH, and VT can actually be one of the best places to buy sports cars, convertibles, boats,.and motorcycles vs. Sunshine states. The reason being because: the prices are lower (buy in the off season), often times they have low milage/usage, and many have spent most of their lives in sheltered storage.

As far as the binnacle goes,, unfortunately the one in this car is cracked.[emoji849]


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SupercoolBill
01-23-2022, 06:46 AM
Sounds like a must have tool for restorations, thanks for letting us know how it worked out [emoji106]Yeah honestly on this occasion I didn't have much luck with it but that wasn't the fault of the tool. It was just a situation where the bolts and nuts all came loose with the impact and I didn't need it, two of the bolts (TA pivot bolts) were so seized that nothing works on them, and the other fasteners that we had issues with had rounded off heads or accessibility issues.
Hoping to try it out on the engine and transmission bolts.

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SupercoolBill
01-28-2022, 03:26 PM
Late update on the progress. Today is Friday but we worked on the car Tuesday night. Just getting around to updating things.

Decided to get the frame up off the floor. Lifted it with the forklift then put saw horses under it to keep it stable. 67959

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SupercoolBill
01-28-2022, 03:29 PM
All these little brackets are pretty rough. I need to see how much some of these things cost. I am not sure if it is even worth fixing them, blasting them, and replating them. 679616796267963

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SupercoolBill
01-28-2022, 03:49 PM
It looks like the car has bottomed out more than once (sway bar mounts)
These are getting replaced along with the rubber bushings.67964

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SupercoolBill
01-28-2022, 03:51 PM
More rusty parts that need to be replaced or blasted and replated.
The steering rack came out without too much of a fight. A new one from DMC is not too expensive so probably just going to go ahead and replace it. 67965

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SupercoolBill
01-28-2022, 03:55 PM
Right side suspension came apart pretty well. I peeled the epoxy off the RH strut tower to see how rusted it is since we need this for our other frame.
It is very rusty but...I think the metal thickness is still good. After we severe it from the frame we will clean it all up in the blasting booth then further assess the condition.679666796767968

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SupercoolBill
01-28-2022, 04:07 PM
The LH suspension did NOT want to come apart. Both bolts are seized in place bad. They have been soaked in Kroil, heated, hit with a hammer, cranked on in both directions with my 1/2" impact. They are stuck.
The top one is stuck inside the metal pipe that goes through the tower. It isn't moving at all.
The bottom, from what I can tell, is stuck on the inside of the LCA bushing.
I see no good or easy way of getting these bolts out.
Luckily I don't actually need any of these parts right now. My new frame had all the same stuff on it in decent shape. It still bugs me though. I would really like to finish stripping the frame down if nothing else just to make it easier to move around.67969679706797167972

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SupercoolBill
01-28-2022, 05:58 PM
We haven't decided yet what approach to take on the suspension yet. Do we try to stay all stock except for new shocks? New shocks and springs?
Instead of trying to doctor up the bent up LCAs go with some nice billet aluminum LCAs?
Adjustable coil overs?

These things individually don't seem TOO bad cost wise but then if you go for the gusto and replace everything with modern, adjustable replacements it gets expensive. 67973

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SupercoolBill
01-29-2022, 07:49 PM
Worked on the car for half the day while the worst snowstorm in years was going on outside.
The wife worked on trying to get the left front suspension and spindle apart while I tried to figure out how to make a jig to use on the other frame.

Here is the plan-

1. Make a jig that locates the parts that are bent on my other frame (right strut tower, left rear frame extension) and also just to make sure that the overall frame is not bent.
2. Remove the right front strut tower from both frames.
3. Remove the left rear frame extention from both frames
4. Installed the unbent parts from the rusted frame onto the non-rusted frame using the jig to locate the parts in the correct places.
5. Also use the jig to make sure the non-rusted frame is not bent anywhere else.67985679866798767988

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SupercoolBill
01-29-2022, 07:53 PM
I showed my wife how to use the MIG welder and let her give it a try. I was going to try to hit a bunch of the locating holes in the frame but what we are doing it really isn't necessary.
The jig isn't anything fancy or nice. It just needs to do its job then it will get chopped up probably.

6798967990679916799267993

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SupercoolBill
01-29-2022, 07:59 PM
Before closing up for the night I wanted to show the wife why we were making the jig and how it will work.
We had a hard time getting it off the frame. I used short 9/16" bolts on the front cross member to drop into the locating holes. This was a bad idea because when we welded the pipes from the bolt heads to the framework of the jig I think the warped from the heat. So the bolts were jammed hard up against the edge of the holes in the crossmember.
I had to jack up on the jig with a scissor jack to get it to pop off.

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Bitsyncmaster
01-29-2022, 08:16 PM
I showed my wife how to use the MIG welder and let her give it a try. I was going to try to hit a bunch of the locating holes in the frame but what we are doing it really isn't necessary.
The jig isn't anything fancy or nice. It just needs to do its job then it will get chopped up probably.

6798967990679916799267993

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Now that is cool your wife tried MIG welding. Welds look pretty good to.

SupercoolBill
01-29-2022, 08:41 PM
So, as you may guess, we had a hard time getting the jig to go onto that part of the other frame.
I'll have to take some measurements and maybe heat up this locating bolts and move them slightly.
We did get it on there though.
The rear part of the jig wanted to sit off to one side by about 1"
I am not sure if this definitely means that the rust free frame is off buy 1" from front to the back or something else. You can push the jig sideways at the rear and "make it fit" but it doesn't naturally fit right.
I'll probably put the jig back on the old frame again and see how it sits on there now that it has be removed and moved. Maybe something moved after I pried it up off the old frame.6799567996

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SupercoolBill
01-29-2022, 08:45 PM
Now that is cool your wife tried MIG welding. Welds look pretty good to.Yeah she's a keeper.

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SupercoolBill
01-29-2022, 08:49 PM
I have realized that I posted this restoration in the wrong place on the forum. Does anyone know do I contact someone that can move it to the proper location?
Without loosing all of my hard work!!!

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Helirich
01-30-2022, 01:03 PM
Yeah she's a keeper.

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Agreed!


I have realized that I posted this restoration in the wrong place on the forum. Does anyone know do I contact someone that can move it to the proper location?
Without loosing all of my hard work!!!

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This seems like a good place to me. If they move it, I hope I don’t lose my subscription.

SupercoolBill
02-01-2022, 02:43 PM
Last night I spent some time taking measurements on both frames and writing them down. Then comparing my data.

Kind of a primitive way of doing it but the triangulation theory seemed to suggest that this was a good method to determine if my replacement is bent.
I am not set up to measure on the same exact plane as the datum but instead what I did was take a small 12' tape measure and just started measuring from point to point all over both frames and writing it all down. I was able to catch the end of the small tape measure end in the factory holes in the frame then measure to other points.
So far it looks pretty good. It appears that the main part of the X of the frame is still squared up to within a 1/8" to 1/4" corner to corner. Really the only part of the frame that seems to be off is what was already obvious. Which is the right front strut mount, the left trailing arm mount which is squished, and the left rear most corner of the frame which is pushed down approx 1/2" and is off to the right 7/16".
The main part of these frames must be pretty tough or the frame was froze into the ground behind the previous owners house when the damage (hit by a plow or tractor bucket?) occurred.

6799767998

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Ron
02-01-2022, 04:31 PM
I have realized that I posted this restoration in the wrong place on the forum. Does anyone know do I contact someone that can move it to the proper location?
Without loosing all of my hard work!!!

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Should be good to go now...

SupercoolBill
02-08-2022, 10:19 PM
Tonight the wife worked on Cleaning parts and disassembling brake calipers while finished making my frame jig. I didn't like how the centering posts came out up front so I ground the welds off and removed the bolts I used. I replaced them with shouldered bolts. I cut the threaded section off them and tapered them on the grinder. Now the mounting tubes we set in place first before welding the bolts onto them. Last time I welded the bolts on first then the tubes and of course they warped so the bolts didn't properly line up with the holes in the frame.
68083 68084 68085 68086 68087

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SupercoolBill
02-09-2022, 09:37 PM
I finished the jig off by installing some uni-strut to keep it rigid.
Second pic is of the jig all bolted down onto the rusted frame that came off the car. I am assuming that the old frame is straight. I took a bunch of measurements and it seems to be straight and true.6809868099

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SupercoolBill
02-09-2022, 09:42 PM
I was pretty disappointed when we set the jig on the replacement frame and it didn't line up like it should have. The replacement frame is definitely bent (not just the strut tower and rear subframe as we had hoped). The jig will not fit on it and when measured front to back on each side it is 1" longer on the right side which makes sense with how the strut tower is bent.
Now I thinking about how I going to lock down the frame and pull it into spec. Luckily the damage is not too bad I just need to figure out how to get it bent back to where it should be.6810068101

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SupercoolBill
02-22-2022, 08:57 PM
Update, found a local autobody guy that is willing to work on our frame. He came right to our shop to look at the frames. He said that he straightens frames for one of the local major brand dealerships. He also said that he did nothing but straighten frames for many years.
Sounds like just the right person for the job. Next week I need to drop both frames off at his shop.

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SupercoolBill
02-22-2022, 09:01 PM
I started making a spreadsheet of all the parts on the car that we need to replace or upgrade. I may eventually put every single part of the car in the spreadsheet.
It is very time consuming and for someone like me that isn't naturally a computer, office work type guy it is kind of exhausting.
I plan on having pricing and part numbers from all the major suppliers of DeLorean parts,..eventually.68133

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SupercoolBill
02-22-2022, 09:06 PM
I was looking at the motor mounts. I really want to try to remove those studs that go through the aluminum bosses cast into the engine block but...I have been advised (rightly) not to try and remove them.
I am going to let sleeping dogs lie. We will just clean them up, chase the threads, paint the studs with some silver paint and call it good.68134

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SupercoolBill
02-28-2022, 09:54 PM
Our metal plating kit showed up today! 68146

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Helirich
03-01-2022, 07:53 PM
Our metal plating kit showed up today! 68146

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Will be interesting to see how this works out.

SupercoolBill
03-02-2022, 06:41 AM
Yesterday was the day! It was very cold and not snowing so the roads were dry.
We loaded up both of the frames and the frame jig on my buddy's trailer. Brought them to a autobody guy that has a small self owned collision and autobody shop one town away.
I really hope this guy knows what he is doing, sounds like he does.681486814968150

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SupercoolBill
03-02-2022, 06:45 AM
Also cleaned up some more parts after work to relieve stress.
I am trying to decide if we should buy new brake caliper pistons or not. They are not damaged on the part that is in past the seal but the part where the boots go on is rusty, flaky. Is this chrome or nickel plating? 68151681526815368154

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82DMC12
06-08-2022, 10:40 PM
Hey man! We want an update!

SupercoolBill
07-02-2022, 06:59 PM
Hey everyone. Sorry for the lack of updates for so long. Life has been crazy busy and hectic and the DeLorean has been on the back burner for a while. My antique motorcycle got some new pannier cases installed. My wife's Miata got a cold air I take I take, new upgraded brakes all the way around, and some other work done. My son is getting married this summer. The HVAC business that my wife and I own has been very demanding....you get the picture.

Here's he shorti-sh version of what is going on with the DeLorean.

We brought the rust free (but damaged) frame, the straight but badly rusted frame, and the jig we made to a guy that claimed he could fix the rust free frame and have it back to us in a few weeks. He had the frame for over a month and had done hardly any work on it. After more than 2 months of me bugging him he finally said it was done. He had fixed the trailing arm mount, managed to straighten the front strut tower pretty well, and claimed that he had straightened the frame. I went to pick up the frames and didn't get the "warm fuzzies" as they say. I asked him if the jig that I had made to fit the rusty frame fit on the frame he had straightened and he said "No,...but I can tell you it is straight,..probably your rusty frame is not straight because it is so rusty." I wasn't really believing him but I just wanted my frames back at that point so I paid him $1400 for his time working on the frame, loaded up, and headed back to my shop. The frames sat in my shop for a couple weeks. The other night my wife and I took a bunch of measurements. The frame is not straight. It is straight on a lot of measurements but the rear Y is a little tweaked to the left.
At this point we are just done dealing with this frame and done trying to find someone to fix it correctly. So we made an executive decision to buy a known straight, rust free OEM frame if we can find one and it isn't a obscene amount of money. We will then sell the rust free frame and the rusted frame to recoup some (hopefully a good amount) of our money. I'm sure the right person could finish fixing this frame super easy but there are too many bad memories for us. We just want a known good frame so we can start rebuilding this car. I have contacted Josh at DPI and he is checking to see if he can find us a good used frame.
We are also looking for a good set of trailing arms.
End of story for now

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Helirich
07-02-2022, 07:35 PM
Sorry to hear of your frame troubles. If you do find one, I suggest you do all your measurements before buying it. I wonder how straight these frames were right from the factory. I suppose Josh would know. I could easily believe they are 1/8” off, maybe even a 1/4”. How bad was your “fixed” frame?

SupercoolBill
07-02-2022, 07:40 PM
Sorry to hear of your frame troubles. If you do find one, I suggest you do all your measurements before buying it. I wonder how straight these frames were right from the factory. I suppose Josh would know. I could easily believe they are 1/8” off, maybe even a 1/4”. How bad was your “fixed” frame?The worst measurement is the comparison of rear shock mount hole to front shock mount hole. As far as we can tell the right side is longer by 1+ inches.

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Helirich
07-03-2022, 06:03 PM
The worst measurement is the comparison of rear shock mount hole to front shock mount hole. As far as we can tell the right side is longer by 1+ inches.

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Wow, hard to have the nerve to charge someone for that.

SupercoolBill
07-03-2022, 06:05 PM
Wow, hard to have the nerve to charge someone for that.Yup we got had. The guy didn't do what he said he did. The one thing is the work that he DID do is worth something....not sure if it I'd worth that much or not. He claimed that he had 2 full days I of work into it.

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82DMC12
07-03-2022, 08:29 PM
Bill,

I will be changing my frame out this fall. My car has a manual frame that has some rust, three or four easy patch repairs, but it is straight as an arrow. I'm swapping it out because I got a great deal on a restored frame from someone near by and I don't have the space or wife-patience to have my car laid up for months waiting for frame repair. You clearly have the space to do this. I would be selling my frame for a very reasonable price if someone is willing to come pick it up once I get my new frame under my car. Probably in Sept/Oct. Located in Kansas City. Just a thought.

SupercoolBill
07-03-2022, 09:48 PM
Bill,

I will be changing my frame out this fall. My car has a manual frame that has some rust, three or four easy patch repairs, but it is straight as an arrow. I'm swapping it out because I got a great deal on a restored frame from someone near by and I don't have the space or wife-patience to have my car laid up for months waiting for frame repair. You clearly have the space to do this. I would be selling my frame for a very reasonable price if someone is willing to come pick it up once I get my new frame under my car. Probably in Sept/Oct. Located in Kansas City. Just a thought.Thanks so much for thinking of me. I am going to look for a totally mint frame but if I can't find one I will be interested

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82DMC12
07-04-2022, 01:36 PM
Thanks so much for thinking of me. I am going to look for a totally mint frame but if I can't find one I will be interested

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Good deal. For anyone who has more time and space than I do, it will be a good deal and very repairable.

SupercoolBill
07-14-2022, 06:55 PM
Update, we found a good used frame for $7,000. This seems like a ridiculous amount of money for a stock used frame but like I said we have decided that this is the route that we are going. Hoping to sell our two frames for a total close to that but who knows. It would be nice.

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Mark D
07-15-2022, 03:02 PM
Update, we found a good used frame for $7,000. This seems like a ridiculous amount of money for a stock used frame but like I said we have decided that this is the route that we are going. Hoping to sell our two frames for a total close to that but who knows. It would be nice.

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Glad to hear you found one, but sucks it's so expensive.

You deserve a lot of credit for trying to fix what you had available from the start. I wish it would have worked out better given all the time and effort you've put into it. Hope this new one measures out correctly and you can use it and move on with your project.

SupercoolBill
07-15-2022, 08:32 PM
Glad to hear you found one, but sucks it's so expensive.

You deserve a lot of credit for trying to fix what you had available from the start. I wish it would have worked out better given all the time and effort you've put into it. Hope this new one measures out correctly and you can use it and move on with your project.Thanks Mark. Yeah $7k was hard to swallow for sure. Basically my wife and I decided to put off a bunch of home repairs that we should be doing in order to move forward with this project.

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SupercoolBill
10-18-2022, 09:45 AM
Okay everyone..I'm still alive.
My wife and I own a small HVAC business so between that, other hobbies, weddings, etc. The car project totally got put on the back burner. There was even thoughts of doing ourselves a favor and just selling it.

Since my last post I had reached out to Josh at DPI or D-Ind whichever you like to call it. I believe it is the closest Delorean shop to Maine (besides Gradys that is, but I heard heard that he sold off everything and got out of the Delorean scene which I have have recently been correct on). Also DPI has all these people bringing thier Deloreans to them to have the whole car rebuilt with all kinds of stainless goodies.
So,...my thought, hope, DREAM, was that they had this surplus of mint, used, OEM parts that we could buy for half of new. So I sent Josh a big list and waited. I lost track of time and Josh of course was super busy. Months went by...eventually I got a list. Much to my surprise the list was all NEW DPI parts.
Great stuff but big money of course. So then we didn't know what to do. Do we spend way more than we wanted to on this stage of the project to have top of the line non-OEM components or do we keep trying to find good used parts. We considered buying new OEM style and NOS parts (DMCH) but the cost was still a lot and a lot of the parts are not as good of quality as DPI, have been laying around since 1982, etc.
In the end we decided time is money, we want to do this once the right way. I just don't have time to keep messaging and emailing people trying to find good used parts and I want the best option for most of the parts. So at this point we are up to the third (and hopefully final) revision of our parts list from DPI and I can tell you it is several pages of stuff. Josh has been great. I appreciate his patience with us.
No turning back now! We are planning a road trip to Ohio at the end of the month.

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SupercoolBill
10-23-2022, 09:03 PM
Things are so crazy in my life right now that I have decided to be very proactive in getting ready to make this trip to Ohio. Last week I test fit one of my frames in my buddy's small enclosed trailer. It fit perfectly with even some extra space lengthwise.
The trailer didn't have any tie down points so I re-purposed some tie downs that came in one of our Ford Transit work vans. I didn't like how far they were spaced up off the floor so I made my own bushings out of 1/2" copper pipe, quick and easy.
I put a bunch of heavy stuff in the trailer to simulate the parts we will be hauling back with us.
Next I took a test drive. I hit some hills in rural areas, drove in city traffic, and drove on the highway between two local exits. This trailer has no brakes so I was a bit worried but the Tacoma handled it no problem. Would it be better to haul it with a full size V8 truck? Yeah definitely but this set up works fine and I feel is quite safe. I unloaded everything back out of the trailer (by myself...that was fun). I left my core steering rack and axle shafts in the trailer so I don't forget them. https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20221023/32bf5f2fc88f0191c83d740dceec811c.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20221023/ea79d40cd33fb697dfbb8f7aa5c8ba39.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20221023/200813b4e9b6bbfefa528d93bf7c1132.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20221024/1e6ded8f4b55b555fa85def6a2e105b5.jpg

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SupercoolBill
10-31-2022, 09:16 PM
Got the goods and made it home safely at 9:30 last night. It was a rough one.

1,550 miles, 7 states, 3 days, in a 12 year old V6 truck on oversized all terrain tires and stock gearing, towing a enclosed trailer, like 10 fuel stops, no in car entertainment the whole time (wife was reading books so no noise allowed).
Did my wife and I get sick of each other? Yes. Did we yell a lot? Yes. Did one of us yell a lot more than the other? Yes, Did the truck get horrible gas milage? Yes (10-11 MPG[emoji51]). Did we get sick of the drone of the exhaust and tires? Definitely...but we made it. Delorean parts and frame back home safely. Even managed to go for a run in the park in Buffalo NY and hit Niagara Falls on the way.

Would I do it again? Probably not...unless we had more days to do it in and a more suitable vehicle for towing a trailer and a butt made of steel. My hat goes off to trailer truck drivers.https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20221101/d58facfebc1094ab861f70f77cf02466.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20221101/f02b36df47fdbb2a6abdcf777f7ea29f.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20221101/050107643da2f5c843991b8ca92192fa.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20221101/9e8f9ece61a6d2cbe793036f98129aa5.jpg

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82DMC12
11-01-2022, 09:14 AM
I see you got the DPI stainless water pipes and the new exhaust system. NICE! Those water pipes are really really nice and fit perfectly. The only part of the exhaust I haven't installed yet is the tips because I want the bumper on first so I can align and center them. Our cars will be practically twins when you're done!

SupercoolBill
11-06-2022, 08:34 PM
No progress on the actually car yet but I tested the new frame with my alignment jig that I had built based on my original (rusty) frame. I was so happy to see the jig fit PERFECTLY!https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20221107/2e252f8e08d7c85f140dccc8c2174ae0.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20221107/b60c2c59acc0e45c7fcd19ae9ba0c212.jpg

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SupercoolBill
11-06-2022, 08:42 PM
The wife and I spent three hours going through the parts we bought at D-ind. We printed the quote from D-Ind and marked off thing as we found them. The proved to be easier said than done. A lot of the parts were in boxes with other unrelated parts with no explanation of what was what. After some messaging back and forth with Josh we had some of the mysteries solved. It looks like most everything is there and accounted for. One thing missing is two of the aluminum heating pipes. I let Josh know and he said that he is going to check his stock to see if the missing pieces are there. https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20221107/9fe18b58700081c8d3029725efdc4264.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20221107/6dcc7ebec2bb1be44c3be157cbd30fd8.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20221107/5b17a8ec319cb613406060dcf6591bb5.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20221107/36a84a25dd2b00c024270a418c4e2788.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20221107/2f64d2dccbffd144770e760a7329e454.jpg

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SupercoolBill
11-06-2022, 08:50 PM
I made a list and went to H.F.
I bought a engine load leveler, a engine stand, and some jack stands that go up 22" and have rubber tops.

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SupercoolBill
11-07-2022, 11:10 PM
Got to work on the car for a whole 30 minutes today.
Removed the fuel accumulator out of the old frame.
Murphy's law at work in my life. I figured for sure that the accumulator mounting bolts would snap off in the frame but since I have a replacement frame I didn't care. Well,...of course they all came right out easy.

Fittings are all badly corroded. Since my new fuel lines are all SS now I am kind of wondering if I can buy SS fittings to replaced the OEM mild steel ones. [emoji848]
Otherwise I will just replace or re-plate these ones.

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SupercoolBill
11-07-2022, 11:13 PM
I also sorted out some of my parts that are getting plated or painted. Some parts, like the front spindles, it is hard decide whether to plate or paint.https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20221108/1893ca5ef1f2fba6086056f6ba407309.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20221108/93b46c2924233b6f631b9454caf5c493.jpg

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SupercoolBill
11-08-2022, 02:53 PM
Today I stopped by the local hydraulic hose shop to see what they had for new fittings. They had the special 90 degree connector and ferrul nut for my fuel accumulator but didn't have the more simple 90 degree connector for the fuel filter which I thought was kind of strange. I thought it was interesting that the new adapter has a o ring inside it. Should make it seal better I'd think. I asked if the o ring was fuel proof and they said it was. https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20221108/d62859d238b8cb667053779ad74a936a.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20221108/2cf7b0be588fd79bc350cfc56a4fef29.jpg

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SupercoolBill
11-08-2022, 03:00 PM
I found this stainless steel 90 degree connector for the fuel filter on Amaz. Looks pretty sweet. I guess we will see. My stock fuel filter holder is rusted and pitted. I think I will try to find something better for a fuel filter holder.https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20221108/68e1f6c3bf8f59dd5f624f11720f0cc6.jpg

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82DMC12
11-08-2022, 04:00 PM
I also sorted out some of my parts that are getting plated or painted. Some parts, like the front spindles, it is hard decide whether to plate or paint.

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My thought regarding "plate versus powder coat" was if the part could possibly affect brake disc runout, I plated it rather than powder coat it, thinking the plating is a thinner application and more likely to be applied evenly. I don't know how critical that is and I've been told many people have powder coated everything but I had some brake vibration I wanted to be sure I eliminated so that's what I did.

82DMC12
11-08-2022, 04:02 PM
I found this stainless steel 90 degree connector for the fuel filter on Amaz. Looks pretty sweet. I guess we will see. My stock fuel filter holder is rusted and pitted. I think I will try to find something better for a fuel filter holder.https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20221108/68e1f6c3bf8f59dd5f624f11720f0cc6.jpg

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The fuel filter mounting band is readily available from the vendors (cheap, too) and you could get it powder coated for nice long life. I didn't do that but I might still do it before it gets too dirty.

SupercoolBill
11-10-2022, 09:27 PM
More parts showed up today. https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20221111/c48572dd20d54a12ab1acdebb401bc64.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20221111/2186f26cdbb91a4f447a7d11dea054a0.jpg

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SupercoolBill
11-10-2022, 09:30 PM
Stainless steel fitting for fuel filter showed up also.
It is really nice but there is an issue.....the fitting is not tapered thread. Although on the other hand I think I could install a o-ring between the fitting and the fuel filter. Or a copper ring. https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20221111/fd435c994ae9bbe892c50589654ad4d8.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20221111/7aa9d6c1a749f576e2ca84ea91f8d447.jpg

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