Alternator alternatives

[mluder]

Gonna re-post this since I got no response on the first atempt.

Still sporting the Duc but at idle under load my voltage reading on the dash is plummeting dangerously low.

Thinking about going the route of the Special-T replacement instead of the Motorola.

Anybody have any experience with it - recomendations - things to watch out for.

Steven

[Bitsyncmaster]

Gonna re-post this since I got no response on the first atempt.

Still sporting the Duc but at idle under load my voltage reading on the dash is plummeting dangerously low.

Thinking about going the route of the Special-T replacement instead of the Motorola.

Anybody have any experience with it - recomendations - things to watch out for.

Steven

My 110 amp from John is still going strong after 5 years. But I did have to tighten the three bolts that hold the two halves together. A friend had one that had a noise. John replaced the unit no problem.

[jawn101]

+1 on John's 110. Very happy with it. Keep in mind you'll need a shorter than stock V belt with it installed at tuneups. John includes one with the alternator. Be sure your battery is fully charged off the car before putting the new alt in or you may fry the regulator trying to charge it. That happened to me - John clucked his tongue, reminded me that he had warned me about exactly that, and fixed the alt anyway.

[DMC3165]

I have a special T stock Motorola replacement (90-97amp) works really well in conjunction with my optima yellow top. No issues at all and I've had this setup now for a year and a half. Highly recommend john's alternators.

I also have a used 140 DMCH unit if your interested. You would just need to purchase the wire for the 3 prong connector.

[WelmoedJ]

+1 on John Hervey's 110A alternator.

IMHO 140A is a bit overkill for our car. That one seems to not provide sufficient charge on low speeds.
Unless you have a heavy load on the electrical system, stick with the 110A (it has about 37 percent more max charge over a standard D (80A) alternator.

[Michael]

I think you need to consider a few things before replacing the alternator:

First, test your current alternator off the car.
Second, realize the factory dash gauge is sometimes not very accurate. The only way to know for sure is to use a multi-meter
Third, it's been said before, make sure your grounds are clean. Although the alternator may be grounded fine, you could have something else with a bad ground that when on, will kill your charge rate. Say if your aux. fan is not grounded well on your frame extension, when it engages, you will see your volt meter drop a lot more than it should.


Now I would still replace the factory alternator simply due to it's age and history. Just to plug, DMC makes a fine 90A that I have had no problems with(and I have Hervey's 110A in my garage collecting dust if that tells you anything)

[congerz83]

I'm not sure what your budget situation is, but there are crossovers for the alternator.

I believe these will fit with a pulley change and adding washers to line it up properly. If anyone can expand on this, please feels free. I'll probably go that way if I ever experience alternator failure. Not knocking the vendors, but I like bargains whenever I can get them. Plus the lifetime warantee seems more my style, even if the odds of it being needed may be higher than a vender alternator.

Champion 74-1502, Velo, 9AR, Excel: 14324, Delco: 21020854, Delco: CS130 (1991-1994 Saturn)

Like I said, I'm not sure what your budget situation is, but it's nice to have options..

I honestly LOVE my Duralast Starter for the 3.0 Eagle Premier...

[DMC5180]

Delco: CS130 (1991-1994 Saturn) Requires some minor modifications for mounting it. Somebody posted photo's on the old .COM site.

[deloumis]

I also have a used 140 DMCH unit if your interested. You would just need to purchase the wire for the 3 prong connector.

How much are you asking for the alternator?

[DeLorean]

Delco: CS130 (1991-1994 Saturn) Requires some minor modifications for mounting it. Somebody posted photo's on the old .COM site.

I'd like to see this too. My Ducy is still working just fine - makes enough amps & volts, so long as I don't roll around with the AC on full, lights wipers, radio and defrost all running at once. At maximum load it does start to draw from the battery. It's somewhat baffling that they installed an alternator without the necessary capacity to run all the standard accessories.

[Farrar]

FWIW, I installed one of Houston's alternators a few years ago and it has performed quite nicely. I believe it's a 105-amp unit.

[TTait]

I had John's D140 for 4 years before it died. It was good at speed but did not charge sufficiently at idle. If you had the AC and the headlights on at the same time it could not keep up unless you kept the idle at about 1300 rpms.

Generally speaking the higher the amperage amp, the worse it will perform at idle.

When that one died I decided to get the cadillac alternator - had to do some mods and get a J bracket which I had to cut and drill. The first one lasted a year (new - lifetime warranty unit) and the second lasted about 6 months. It was obvious from the sound of the bearings it wasn't designed for the higher rpms that result from the smaller pulley you must swap on to it.

At that point I was fed up with the cadillac unit, and I ordered a new unit from DMCMW - the same one Houston now sells but I heard that it was Dave that was having them built, so I preferred to buy direct from him. That unit is outstanding - can't recommend it highly enough.

I have another Houston alternator on my wife's car, circa 2008. That unit is excellent as well, but I heard that version was improved upon with the current units.

As for the second caddy alternator - I coudn't get a refund so I thought I'd get yet another caddy unit to leave on the shelf as an emergency spare - but they did not have one in stock at the moment, so I talked them into the Saturn alternator instead. Seems fine, but I have never installed it. I'll put it on in an emergency - but I'll never waste my time with a cadillac unit again.

[The_Reverend]

I did the modified Chevy Lumina alternator on mine, works like a charm.

[galbiati]

I did the modified Chevy Lumina alternator on mine, works like a charm.

10440 alternator failed last week. Found alternator poorly installed (crooked). Only one ear of the two needed to keep the alt. mounted perpendicular to the belt was there, Lumina was a bad choice for a interchange. Saturn alternator would be a perfect fit with the double ears. Once again, I am redoing someone elses poor work on this car. It's funny that every single problem I have found, always stems from a [] repair job or something being unconnected or disassembled and the parts missing.

[AugustneverEnds]

10440 alternator failed last week. Found alternator poorly installed (crooked). Only one ear of the two needed to keep the alt. mounted perpendicular to the belt was there, Lumina was a bad choice for a interchange. Saturn alternator would be a perfect fit with the double ears. Once again, I am redoing someone elses poor work on this car. It's funny that every single problem I have found, always stems from a [] repair job or something being unconnected or disassembled and the parts missing.

+1 Amen

[David T]

When a new owner gets a Delorean, aside form any storage related issues, the biggest things that usually need to be done is undoing or redoing all of the previously done (and improperly done) work from the DPO's (Dreaded Previous Owners). Removing alarm systems, hacks in the cooling and fuel wiring, wrong or missing hardware, wrong parts, and neglect. All too often, by the time a seller parts with the car, he is tired of it and has not taken care of it for a long time and it shows. Even buying a car in better cosmetic condition is no guarantee that the mechanical or electrical systems were well taken care of. The PO may have let the neighborhood mechanic fix it up for him because he was nearby and cheap. A well known combination that leads to poor quality work. You have to figure ANY car of this age has had a lot of hands on it and many did not know what they were doing but that won't stop a DETERMINED person! To take care of an old car you have to figure you will be doing a lot of restorative work till you get it to the condition you want.
David Teitelbaum

[AugustneverEnds]

When a new owner gets a Delorean, aside form any storage related issues, the biggest things that usually need to be done is undoing or redoing all of the previously done (and improperly done) work from the DPO's (Dreaded Previous Owners). Removing alarm systems, hacks in the cooling and fuel wiring, wrong or missing hardware, wrong parts, and neglect. All too often, by the time a seller parts with the car, he is tired of it and has not taken care of it for a long time and it shows. Even buying a car in better cosmetic condition is no guarantee that the mechanical or electrical systems were well taken care of. The PO may have let the neighborhood mechanic fix it up for him because he was nearby and cheap. A well known combination that leads to poor quality work. You have to figure ANY car of this age has had a lot of hands on it and many did not know what they were doing but that won't stop a DETERMINED person! To take care of an old car you have to figure you will be doing a lot of restorative work till you get it to the condition you want.
David Teitelbaum

Going off topic here but I have to say you are definently correct. I'm spoiled because my other "old" car (1988 BMW) was in my family for its entire life and was well cared for. I'd drive it across the country tomorrow if I wanted to. I just have to take a few patience pills with the D and keep going.

[DMCMW Dave]

The downside to the Lumina unit is that you have to modify the cast iron bracket that holds it to the head. When/if you or the next guy decide to use one that fits, you need to replace that part 102426. Which is about $70.

I understand people going for substitute/crossover units, but please use ones that don't require you to cut up original parts that are somewhat expensive to put back right.

[Kenny_Z]

I've been running the caddy alternator since early September and so far it hasn't given me any issues. The only thing I had to modify was one of the two wires. It needed to be lengthened but it was a pretty tight fit on the stock alternator so either way I was going to modify the wire. I created a bracket and used a spacer as well as a turnbuckle style adjustment bracket. Everything is 100% reversible and I even kept the old alternator and all related parts.

http://uploads.m-cgi.com/kennyz/Delorean/Projects/alt10.jpg

[galbiati]

The downside to the Lumina unit is that you have to modify the cast iron bracket that holds it to the head. When/if you or the next guy decide to use one that fits, you need to replace that part 102426. Which is about $70.

I understand people going for substitute/crossover units, but please use ones that don't require you to cut up original parts that are somewhat expensive to put back right.

Actually the alternator case is modified to make the pulley line up on the Lumina alternator. The Saturn works perfectly.

[jmettee]

I wonder if my car is different than everyone else's. It looks completely stock so I don't suspect any mods. I'm replacing the Motorola alternator. I got the CS130 style alternator for a 94 Saturn that has the square plug. From what I've measured, the stock bolt is a 10 mm & the ears are for 8mm bolts on the Saturn unit. Also, the Saturn unit needs a spacer of approx .5" to fit properly on the mounting bracket. This is far from a "perfect fit". The alternator I am using is from Autozone & is remanufactured. It says Delco Remy in the casting of the housing .

I'm still going to be making this unit work, but wondering why mine isn't a "perfect fit" Asa mentioned by others.

[dmruschell]

I wonder if my car is different than everyone else's. It looks completely stock so I don't suspect any mods. I'm replacing the Motorola alternator. I got the CS130 style alternator for a 94 Saturn that has the square plug. From what I've measured, the stock bolt is a 10 mm & the ears are for 8mm bolts on the Saturn unit. Also, the Saturn unit needs a spacer of approx .5" to fit properly on the mounting bracket. This is far from a "perfect fit". The alternator I am using is from Autozone & is remanufactured. It says Delco Remy in the casting of the housing .

I'm still going to be making this unit work, but wondering why mine isn't a "perfect fit" Asa mentioned by others.

I just had the same experience while replacing an old Houston (I'm guessing) alternator in 3196, which I think has a case identical to the Hervey alternator in 5786. Here's what I had to modify to get the Saturn alternator to work:

I had to get an M8 bolt, washer and nut to replace the M10 mounting bolt since the ears for the Saturn alternator are smaller. (The store near me didn't have M8 in the correct length, but they had 5/16, which is very close and worked fine).

I had to get a longer M8 bolt (and nut/washers) where the tensioner mounts to the alternator, because the bolt hole is not threaded like it is on the DMC alternators. It's the same size bolt as stock, but it needs to be longer to reach through the mounting hole on the alternator and fit through a nut.

I had to get a 1/2 inch length spacer to fit around the M8 (5/16) mounting bolt, as the ear on the DMC alternator is about 1/2 inch thicker.

I didn't need to put a spacer between the M8 (5/16) bolt and the mount. It was a little loose while setting the tension, but once I tightened the nut on the bolt, it didn't move at all.

[dustybarn]

I am using a reman CS130 and it works well. With this alternator, it is not strictly necessary to connect the sense wire; I think that there is an internal pullup that allows the regulator to sense the alternator's output voltage.

However, I recommend connecting the sense wire. I connected it to the large +BAT passthru stud behind the coil cover so that the regulator senses the voltage that is actually present on the vehicle power bus. Any voltage drops in the battery and alternator cables are compensated for, and on my car the voltage as read by the dashboard voltmeter never changes regardless of how much electrical load I add.

The sense wire can be pretty small because it's not carrying any significant current.

[DMCMW Dave]

I am using a reman CS130 and it works well. With this alternator, it is not strictly necessary to connect the sense wire; I think that there is an internal pullup that allows the regulator to sense the alternator's output voltage.

However, I recommend connecting the sense wire. I connected it to the large +BAT passthru stud behind the coil cover so that the regulator senses the voltage that is actually present on the vehicle power bus. Any voltage drops in the battery and alternator cables are compensated for, and on my car the voltage as read by the dashboard voltmeter never changes regardless of how much electrical load I add.

The sense wire can be pretty small because it's not carrying any significant current.

There is a sense wire in the in the early car (originally Dulcillier) wiring harnesses (a very small diameter solid brown wire). It is tied to the "brown bundle of hot wires" inside the car. It's often still in the harness near the alternator.

[TTait]

Update to my post from a few years ago - The DMC updated alternator that I have had installed since 08 is doing great.

I also wanted to mention an anomaly that I ran into when I put it in however. When I pulled the Ducillier (which was working fine) the DMC unit initially appeared to not charge. I put the Ducey in again, and it was fine - must be the alternator - right? Nope! For some reason the Ducey continued to charge the car even though the batt light in the instrument cluster had burned out. We all know that the bulb has to be working for the car to charge, and you are always supposed to change, or at least check it it when you install a new alternator - but I skipped that step as I thought it must be fine if the old alternator was working.

Once I replace the bulb the DMC alternator worked fine, and I have not had to think about it since. I finally gave up on aftermarket alternators on the other car as well, and put a Houston (Swingle) alternator on that car as well - it was still perfect as well when I shipped that car away.

I wholly support the idea of having options and have gone down that route myself - but there is something to be said for just fitting a part up once and forgetting about it (or in my case moving on to replacing the bulb in the cluster). If anyone is on the fence as to which way to go, call Dave and order up a DMCMW alternator and know it will fit right the first time, and even charge the battery when you are idling.

[dmruschell]

I just had the same experience while replacing an old Houston (I'm guessing) alternator in 3196, which I think has a case identical to the Hervey alternator in 5786. Here's what I had to modify to get the Saturn alternator to work:

I had to get an M8 bolt, washer and nut to replace the M10 mounting bolt since the ears for the Saturn alternator are smaller. (The store near me didn't have M8 in the correct length, but they had 5/16, which is very close and worked fine).

I had to get a longer M8 bolt (and nut/washers) where the tensioner mounts to the alternator, because the bolt hole is not threaded like it is on the DMC alternators. It's the same size bolt as stock, but it needs to be longer to reach through the mounting hole on the alternator and fit through a nut.

I had to get a 1/2 inch length spacer to fit around the M8 (5/16) mounting bolt, as the ear on the DMC alternator is about 1/2 inch thicker.

I didn't need to put a spacer between the M8 (5/16) bolt and the mount. It was a little loose while setting the tension, but once I tightened the nut on the bolt, it didn't move at all.

For some reason, the ability to edit my previous post is not available, so I'm forced to make a new post just to add a little bit of information.

The 1/2 inch spacer I ended up using was a 9/16 nut. It is more than large enough to fit the M8(5/16) mounting bolt through it and fits solidly onto the mounting ear and mount.

I'm also guessing that a 5/16 bolt can be substituted for the longer M8 bolt that is used to mount to the tensioner. Because the holes aren't threaded, metric vs SAE shouldn't be an issue as long as the size is about the same.