Vibration in steering wheel...not a tire balance issue.

[Patrick C]

Hi all. I've been having this issue for a few years now, and it is annoying me more lately. When I drive 50mph+, I get a side to side vibration in my steering wheel. The car still tracks straight when I let go of the wheel, but the wheel is visibly shaking side-to-side. I just had new tires and wheels installed which neither helped nor hurt the problem, so that rules out tire balancing. I can take the car to 100mph and the shaking does not seem to be much worse (if any) than when I am driving 50mph.

It is also worth noting that the shocks are fairly new, all bushings except the LCA to the frame have been replaced with polyurethane, I have Toby P's polyurethane swaybar bushings, and I have Ed Uding's LCA brackets. And the car currently has 47,000 miles on it. So I doubt this is an issue of worn suspension components.

Any ideas? When I take this in to get looked at by a local mechanic, what things should I be suggesting he look at? Thanks in advance!

[DCUK Martin]

Is part number 15 installed (properly)? This prevents side-to-side movement of the rack assembly

http://store.delorean.com/c-352-5-2-0-steering-rack-assembly.aspx

Other than this, it must be something that's spinning and is out of alignment. Next stop for me would be brake discs, and I have heard of one time where someone discovered their hub (pn 100400) was not true.

[Ron]

+1

Have you tried watching all of the joints in the steering ink age while someone moves the steering wheel, left and right front wheels individually, while holding the others?

[David T]

Vibration is caused by either something not running "true" or something out-of-balance. Any good shop should be able to find it. You start with the biggest rotating parts, the tires, the rims, rotors, the hubs and bearings. Any loose parts will only allow the vibration to get worse, not cause it.
David Teitelbaum

[stevedmc]

Have you considered upgrading to Spec .02 steering?

[82DMC12]

Have you considered upgrading to Spec .02 steering?

You mean by numbing the steering so you can't feel what's broken?

[stevedmc]

You mean by numbing the steering so you can't feel what's broken?

I'm joking. It really sounds like he has a bad steering column bushing. He should start there first.


For what its worth, he can numb the steering all he wants but the steering column will still rattle against the firewall if there is no bushing.

[DMCMW Dave]

It have shown up with the tire work, but did anyone look for a bent rim? On the inside AND the outside?

[Patrick C]

Thanks for the tips guys. Keep 'em coming!


I'm joking. It really sounds like he has a bad steering column bushing. He should start there first.


Definitely not the steering column bushing, replaced that with the DMCH upgraded version.


It have shown up with the tire work, but did anyone look for a bent rim? On the inside AND the outside?

This happened with my old stock rims and tires, and it still happens with my brand new rims and tires.

[Ron]

It have shown up with the tire work, but did anyone look for a bent rim? On the inside AND the outside?He has new rims with no a change in vibration...but you never know ;-)

[delornut]

Hi all. I've been having this issue for a few years now, and it is annoying me more lately. When I drive 50mph+, I get a side to side vibration in my steering wheel. The car still tracks straight when I let go of the wheel, but the wheel is visibly shaking side-to-side. I just had new tires and wheels installed which neither helped nor hurt the problem, so that rules out tire balancing. I can take the car to 100mph and the shaking does not seem to be much worse (if any) than when I am driving 50mph.

It is also worth noting that the shocks are fairly new, all bushings except the LCA to the frame have been replaced with polyurethane, I have Toby P's polyurethane swaybar bushings, and I have Ed Uding's LCA brackets. And the car currently has 47,000 miles on it. So I doubt this is an issue of worn suspension components.

Any ideas? When I take this in to get looked at by a local mechanic, what things should I be suggesting he look at? Thanks in advance!

Try jacking up the front of the car so the tires are about an inch off the ground and spin the wheels. Look for an out of round condition where the tire tread isn't running true but moving up and down slightly compaired to the ground. Tires can be balanced even when they're out of round and many tire shops don't look beyond balancing. This may not be your problem but it's a simple place to start. There are a few shops that do tires and front suspensions that can spin the wheel to speed on the car. The balancing hardware they use doing this won't fit on the DeLorean wheel but a good shop can run the wheels up to speed on the car and help you diagnose what's going on there. You won't find this done at Sears, Goodyear or the like but call around and you'll find one that will help work out front end vibrations.

Bruce Benson

[David T]

My suggestion is to jack the front up and place a stick right at the outer edge of the rim of each tire. Slowly rotate the tire and see if it moves towards or away from your indicator (stick). You can do it for sideways and up and down. You can also grab each wheel and shake it to see how much play there is up and down and side-to-side. Also feel for roughness in the bearings. One tip-off that something is bent or out-of-round (or a bad tire) is if they had to put a LOT of wheel weights on a tire to get it "balanced". You should never need more than 4 weights and all of them should not be much. Never get static balancing. You have to get a dynamic (rotating) balance. Just about every tire shop does it now. Even with the best job you will find at a particular speed you may get some shimmy-shake but only at that speed and it goes away at all other speeds. Typically a shake that worsens as you go faster means something is bent. If it is about the same at all speeds it is usually a balance problem.
David Teitelbaum




Try jacking up the front of the car so the tires are about an inch off the ground and spin the wheels. Look for an out of round condition where the tire tread isn't running true but moving up and down slightly compaired to the ground. Tires can be balanced even when they're out of round and many tire shops don't look beyond balancing. This may not be your problem but it's a simple place to start. There are a few shops that do tires and front suspensions that can spin the wheel to speed on the car. The balancing hardware they use doing this won't fit on the DeLorean wheel but a good shop can run the wheels up to speed on the car and help you diagnose what's going on there. You won't find this done at Sears, Goodyear or the like but call around and you'll find one that will help work out front end vibrations.

Bruce Benson

[Patrick C]

Could the steering column u-joint be an issue if it has too much play? I'm guessing so. Here is a video I just took, please let me know if this is an acceptable amount of wiggle in the joint or if it needs replacing. Thanks!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5JnyOVJEnwc&feature=youtube_gdata_player

Thanks in advance!

[DMCMW Dave]

Generally there should be zero play there. It would not cause a vibration, but it would make any other system vibration feel worse.

[DMC3165]

I've had the exact same issue with my car for as long as I can remember. Being somewhat paranoid to begin with I've had it checked and rechecked at least half a dozen times and everything's ok. It is more of a nuisance problem then anything serious but I've heard that this issue providing its not severe, is really not uncommon for a DeLorean.

[DCUK Martin]

It should be nonexistent in any car, even a DeLorean. So often tyres aren't balanced even when you've paid to have it done, and as I said earlier even the hubs have been known to be out of true.

It has to be caused by something spinning that isn't balanced or running straight.

[Fox2506]

I vote wheel bearings.

You wouldn't believe the things my previous wheel bearings did (all four of them).

[Josh]

Patrick, was this ever resolved?

I have the same issue. I even replaced a rim as I believed it as bent. Fixed the issue a bit, but not entirely.

[Patrick C]

Patrick, was this ever resolved?

I have the same issue. I even replaced a rim as I believed it as bent. Fixed the issue a bit, but not entirely.

It was resolved, but I'm not sure what fixed it. I did all kinds of work at the same time and the issue vanished. I did install the Borgeson stainless u-joints and anti-vibration joint on the steering rack end.

[Josh]

It was resolved, but I'm not sure what fixed it. I did all kinds of work at the same time and the issue vanished. I did install the Borgeson stainless u-joints and anti-vibration joint on the steering rack end.

hmm

That anti vibration u joint was my next plan of attack.

glad to hear your issues were sorted though!

[DMC5180]

It was resolved, but I'm not sure what fixed it. I did all kinds of work at the same time and the issue vanished. I did install the Borgeson stainless u-joints and anti-vibration joint on the steering rack end.

Patrick,

I curious which mid-shaft type you used, round splined or Double D?

[content22207_2]

One advantage of a DD column -- you can push it through the normal U Joint (vibration reducing U Joint has a solid bottom -- can't push the shaft through it) to make the overall assembly shorter during installation, then pull the shaft back down and lock it after it's in place. Makes installation much easier. Borgeson's splined shafts can't be pushed through the U Joint (splines aren't long enough).

If you use a DD shaft don't forget to drill recesses for the set screws -- you only want the shaft sliding through the U Joint during initial installation, not while driving down the road:

45545 45546

Bill Robertson
#5939

[DMC5180]

Thanks Bill,

I was aware of the installation advantages/disadvantages of each type. I was just curious which one Patrick used. Some prefer the Splined version over the DD even if installation is more involved. Patrick is very particular about the appearance of the modifications he does. Even though the shaft is not visible per se, the round shaft looks better than the DD. You can also tweak the joint phasing. The OEM shaft assembly was not in true clocking alignment. It looks to have 10-20 degree offset in phasing to counteract potential binding. It may be that the installation angles of the joints are not steep enough to matter in our case though. I have not heard anyone comment on that aspect of it. Perhaps those who have the DD version just don't notice it since it would only be noticeable during sharp turns in parking lot maneuvering.

I can see where the advantages of the DD installation out weigh the lack of phasing adjustability though.


Dennis

[content22207_2]

DD shaft has to be cut to length (Borgeson only sells a couple of DD lengths). Stainless is a very soft metal (until you work harden it...), so an ordinary hack saw works great. Both of my cars used 11.5" shafts, but I think some owners have reported slightly different lengths, which is another advantage of DD shafts -- they can be custom cut:

45552

Bill Robertson
#5939

[DMC5180]

Bill,
I am curious about the male/female fit tolerance of the DD shaft. Was there any noticeable play before locking the set screw? This is where I liked the OEM pinch bolt design, it removes all play. I have experienced set screw loosening in dynamic shaft/socket applications with somewhat loose figment tolerances.


Dennis

[FABombjoy]

There is just enough play in the DD to make assembly easy but no more. You don't need a mallet to set the DD shaft into the U joint but it isn't going to click back & forth during turns.

The U joints have 2 set screws per DD side and you could drill dimples & set all 4 screws if you wanted.

[David T]

There should be no vibration in the first place. The vibration joint should not be necessary. Vibration is bad and you should look to fixing the problem, not dealing with it as a symptom. If you have vibration in the steering system it is usually because something is bent and/or out-of-balance. Looseness and wear allow the vibration levels to increase so you also need to check and replace any worn parts in the front suspension. The first place to start is with the tires and rims. Any good shop should be able to check them. You can start yourself by checking air pressure. Tire pressures too high or too low can cause a lot of vibration. The recommended tire pressures are on a label on the inside of the glove box door. Keep in mind there are a lot of other Deloreans out there and, for the most part, no one is complaining about vibrations. And none of them have a vibration damping joint.

[Bitsyncmaster]

Lots of info and comments on this thread:

http://dmctoday.com/showthread.php?531-Spec-01-Steering&highlight=dd+shaft

I did my steering with the DD shaft and even though there is not force fit, it will not move once you lock it down with both lock nuts on each end.

[DMC5180]

. Keep in mind there are a lot of other Deloreans out there and, for the most part, no one is complaining about vibrations. And none of them have a vibration damping joint.

I put it in the under reported issue category.

I have personally talked with several owners over the years asking the question about steering wheel vibrations, nearly all of them reported some form of rolling vibration they put up with as opposed to bump steer feed back. I think our mismatched tire diameters play into the equation more than the typical 4 same size setups.
I also know someone who had his wheels trued prior to refinishing and reported the results as Cadillac smooth afterwards. I had my wheels checked for runout several times with nothing significant was reported and they were road force balanced. I still get rhythmic vibrations ( comes & goes) at highway speeds. I have not run a dial indicator on the hub flanges though.


Dennis

[dn010]

I've dealt with vibration issues on and off for the past 14 years. Some of this was due to worn out steering shaft joints - I'm currently on my 3rd and it is being replaced with the Borgeson unit in the next few months. While I had also rebuilt my entire front end (twice), my first steering shaft joints were sloppy from the PO, the second "upgraded" u-joints from DMCH back in the early 2000's lasted the longest but still died due to wonderful upstate NY roads. I am on my 3rd, used set of original u-joints and they're starting to go. A simple test is to take the joints out, twist them in your hands and if they move even the slightest - you've obviously got problems.

[content22207_2]

Vibration isolation in the steering column has been standard industry practice for at least half a century, usually via a flexible disc coupling ("rag joint"). Even the lowly VW Beetle/Bug had a flexible coupling. I really don't understand why some owners are so vehemently opposed to upgrading a DeLorean to industry standards. It's kind of like arguing against upgrading bias ply tires to radials on a 1960's classic.

Note that vibration isolation within the steering column is not the same thing as steering column to body isolation (the firewall bushing). That is a totally different matter altogether, to compensate for the frame moving independently of the car body. Most cars have both.

A traditional flexible coupling will not fit on a DeLorean. That is why some of us use a vibration reducing U Joint instead.

Bill Robertson
#5939

[David T]

Vibration isolation in the steering column has been standard industry practice for at least half a century, usually via a flexible disc coupling ("rag joint"). Even the lowly VW Beetle/Bug had a flexible coupling. I really don't understand why some owners are so vehemently opposed to upgrading a DeLorean to industry standards. It's kind of like arguing against upgrading bias ply tires to radials on a 1960's classic.

Note that vibration isolation within the steering column is not the same thing as steering column to body isolation (the firewall bushing). That is a totally different matter altogether, to compensate for the frame moving independently of the car body. Most cars have both.

A traditional flexible coupling will not fit on a DeLorean. That is why some of us use a vibration reducing U Joint instead.

Bill Robertson
#5939

My complaint is not about your trying to improve the car. I encourage it. My complaint is trying to fix a symptom. Let's assume putting the vibration isolation joint in is great. All it does it prevent the vibration from entering the steering column and being felt in the steering wheel. It does nothing to eliminate the vibration in the first place. That vibration will continue on and wreak havoc with all of the parts subjected to it making them wear prematurely. The solution should start with trying to minimize or eliminate the vibration in the first place. One common source is if the car is parked for a long time the tires will "flat spot". Usually cured by driving on them for a few miles at least. Next up is tire pressure. Then the other common causes include hitting curbs, tires over 7 years old, bent rims, loose lugnuts. These are causes. Worn, loose parts are not the cause but they become worn and loose because of the vibration and then amplify it.
Last point, one of the things about driving a Delorean is the direct contact you experience with the road. Part of that is because there is no vibration isolation joint and there is no power steering to dampen the road feel. It adds to the experience and I prefer it over trying to make the car into something it isn't. But that's just my opinion.

[content22207_2]

As several owners have pointed out, even with all new components DeLorean steering is unacceptable compared to other cars.

The problem isn't masked symptoms, the problem is every single wiggle and bump experienced by the rims is transmitted through an unbroken chain of hard couplings to the steering wheel. After the rubber tires, next isolation is leather wrap on the steering wheel itself. Steering wheel vibration is built in from the factory (exacerbated by other weaknesses in the front end design).

That is why flexible steering couplings were invented in the first place, and why nearly every other car ever built uses them. Even the lowly Chevette has a flex coupling in its column.

Bill Robertson
#5939

[BABIS]

You can also tweak the joint phasing. The OEM shaft assembly was not in true clocking alignment. It looks to have 10-20 degree offset in phasing to counteract potential binding. It may be that the installation angles of the joints are not steep enough to matter in our case though. I have not heard anyone comment on that aspect of it. Perhaps those who have the DD version just don't notice it since it would only be noticeable during sharp turns in parking lot maneuvering.


do the owners with the splined shaft have installed it "mirror phased" or with the factory offset?

[DMC5180]

do the owners with the splined shaft have installed it "mirror phased" or with the factory offset?

I have no Idea, probably mirrored if I was guessing. I only mentioned that with the splined shafts, it CAN be adjusted to mimic the OEM shaft. Whether it is needed or not? :dunno:

[content22207_2]

Steering column isn't spinning like a drive shaft -- I really don't think phasing is an issue.

That said, another advantage of DD shafts is it is physically impossible to get the U Joints out of phase (U joints work best when they are both pointed in the same direction).

Bill Robertson
#5939

[DMC5180]

It does make you wonder if the engineers, back then, offset the OEM assembly to fix a known or anticipated issue or just because it was common practice. IE: we did this on the Europa or Esprit so we'll do it on the DMC-12 too.


Dennis

[content22207_2]

Or just to speed up the assembly line, depending upon how the locking bolts were positioned.

Bill Robertson
#5939

[Drive Stainless]

Too much caster can also cause vibration in the steering wheel. If you have DPI's slotted swaybar mounts, you can adjust the caster slightly.

[Bitsyncmaster]

Too much caster can also cause vibration in the steering wheel. If you have DPI's slotted swaybar mounts, you can adjust the caster slightly.

My vibration was fixed when I replaced the OEM LCAs with the stainless LCAs.

I installed the dampener in my steering after the LCAs and really did not notice much difference in steering wheel vibration.

[Spittybug]

I know the OP said it wasn't tires since he replaced them, but for the sake of others reading this thread..... I had a hell of a time figuring out what my steering wheel vibration was. I had the front tires meticulously balanced and that wasn't it. Steering rack rebuilt, that wasn't it. Front bearings checked, that wasn't it. After all was said and done (and checked), a rear wheel was the culprit. I had some tread separation from age (not wear). It was creating a bit of a bubble in the tread surface and this was being transmitted through the frame to the steering. New tires all around were in order since they were ~10 years old. Now drives beautifully!

Moral of the story; sometimes the problem is pretty far removed from the symptom.

[David T]

I know the OP said it wasn't tires since he replaced them, but for the sake of others reading this thread..... I had a hell of a time figuring out what my steering wheel vibration was. I had the front tires meticulously balanced and that wasn't it. Steering rack rebuilt, that wasn't it. Front bearings checked, that wasn't it. After all was said and done (and checked), a rear wheel was the culprit. I had some tread separation from age (not wear). It was creating a bit of a bubble in the tread surface and this was being transmitted through the frame to the steering. New tires all around were in order since they were ~10 years old. Now drives beautifully!

Moral of the story; sometimes the problem is pretty far removed from the symptom.

Vibration complaints are almost as hard to diagnose as noise complaints. It can seem like it is coming from one place but it is really coming from another. Typically if you have a vibration problem with the rear you feel it more in your belly shaking rather than the steering wheel but not necessarily as you found out. As a matter of course, when you have a vibration problem, you check and rebalance all four wheels. But first check date codes and don't waste any time on tires over 7 years old. Then check air pressure and lug nuts. If you still have vibration problems then you go for balancing. These steps will fix 99% of vibration problems. The more unusual ones will be problems with the half-shafts or driveshafts, wheel bearings, rotors, etc.

[content22207_2]

Even the World's Most Perfect DeLorean will have steering wheel vibration on even mildly rough or imperfect pavement -- every single vibration experienced by the rims is transmitted via a chain of hard couplings to the steering wheel.

Down South we get wrinkled asphalt. Sun heats it up and traffic scrunches it like a rug. It's especially bad in the right hand lane. That is where I noticed my steering wheel improvement the most (compare the right hand lane versus the passing lane -- if vibration goes away in the left lane then the problem is the pavement, not the car).

Bill Robertson
#5939

[DMCMW Dave]

Even the World's Most Perfect DeLorean will have steering wheel vibration on even mildly rough or imperfect pavement -- every single vibration experienced by the rims is transmitted via a chain of hard couplings to the steering wheel.



Sports cars are supposed to be like that. Road feel and all that. It's not supposed to be a Lincoln Town Car.

[Lou and "Boo"]

I have a very similar and quite violent vibration in the steering wheel at around 50 but it doesn't always do it and it goes away as I go faster. Makes my whole hand shake in a rhythm while holding the wheel.

Still can't figure it out.

[David T]

If it is the road you will have the shaking at any speed and it gets worse the faster you go. If you have vibration at a particular speed that is probably because of a tire or rim being bad or bent. The Delorean was built to be driven on smooth, flat roads. If the roads in your area are that bad maybe you do need a vibration isolation joint! And big tires with whitewalls! Or ride the rails. Some areas of the US flood. Does that mean we should make the cars watertight so they can float? If Bill has a problem in his area it does not mean every Delorean owner should install a vibration isolation joint. Also keep in mind, if you don't do it right, just imagine the consequences if you lost steering? IMHO it is not a necessary or safe modification. Certainly not something I think most owners should attempt to do themselves.

[content22207_2]

I still don't understand David's vehement objection to vibration isolation. Costs an additional $41. Upgrades the car to Chevette standards (does not upgrade it to Yugo standards -- Yugo has no steering column isolation).

IMHO the question isn't why upgrade to vibration isolation -- the question is why not?

Bill Robertson
#5939

[content22207_2]

Also keep in mind, if you don't do it right, just imagine the consequences if you lost steering? IMHO it is not a necessary or safe modification.

Fail.

Houston sells Borgeson columns (Toby does too): http://store.delorean.com/p-10502-steering-u-joint-assy-stainless.aspx All we're doing is cutting out the middle man, and the middle man's markup, buy buying direct from the manufacturer.

If an owner is going to mess up installation he is going to mess up no matter where the column comes from, Houston or Borgeson direct.

If you don't know what you're doing don't buy a steering column from anybody, Houston included.

Bill Robertson
#5939

[David T]

I still don't understand David's vehement objection to vibration isolation. Costs an additional $41. Upgrades the car to Chevette standards (does not upgrade it to Yugo standards -- Yugo has no steering column isolation).

IMHO the question isn't why upgrade to vibration isolation -- the question is why not?

Bill Robertson
#5939

As I said in earlier posts, fixing a vibration problem by attacking the symptom is not fixing things in my book. A certain level of vibration is considered normal for a Delorean. If you have too much the answer is not to mask it with a vibration isolator, the answer is to find and fix the SOURCE of the vibration. Think of the vibration as a warning that something is wrong, like a bent rim or a bad tire. Would you rather ignore it or fix it?

[Patrick C]

As I said in earlier posts, fixing a vibration problem by attacking the symptom is not fixing things in my book. A certain level of vibration is considered normal for a Delorean. If you have too much the answer is not to mask it with a vibration isolator, the answer is to find and fix the SOURCE of the vibration. Think of the vibration as a warning that something is wrong, like a bent rim or a bad tire. Would you rather ignore it or fix it?

The stock steering setup in any DeLorean has feedback transferred from the road. A vibration reducing ragjoint is a no-brainer on any DeLorean. Is it critical to do it? No. Are Ed's LCA braces critical to the car? Also no, but both greatly improve the driving experience. My $0.02

[DMC5180]

+ 1

Patrick, per my post a ways back , which shaft type did you use with your isolation joint?


Dennis

[content22207_2]

A vibration reducing ragjoint is a no-brainer on any DeLorean.

Traditional rag joint won't fit (I've already tried). That's why I'm using a vibration reducing U Joint instead.

Bill Robertson
#5939

[Patrick C]

Traditional rag joint won't fit (I've already tried). That's why I'm using a vibration reducing U Joint instead.

Bill Robertson
#5939

That's what I meant. I'm using the same vibration reducing u-joint as you.

[content22207_2]

As I said in earlier posts, fixing a vibration problem by attacking the symptom is not fixing things in my book. A certain level of vibration is considered normal for a Delorean. If you have too much the answer is not to mask it with a vibration isolator, the answer is to find and fix the SOURCE of the vibration. Think of the vibration as a warning that something is wrong, like a bent rim or a bad tire. Would you rather ignore it or fix it?

With the exception of the upper wishbones (which hardly ever wear out) my entire front end is brand new, thank you very much -- I'm not masking anything.

"A certain level of vibration is considered normal for a Delorean" -- not on my car.... (I guess my silky smooth steering is abnormal).

Bill Robertson
#5939

[Patrick C]

+ 1

Patrick, per my post a ways back , which shaft type did you use with your isolation joint?


Dennis

I honestly can't remember. I called Borgeson and talked to Gil and he set me up with exactly what I needed. You can ask him to look up my order (Conlon) and it should be easy to duplicate.

[content22207_2]

That's what I meant. I'm using the same vibration reducing u-joint as you.

That means your car is abnormal too.

Bill Robertson
#5939

[Patrick C]

That means your car is abnormal too.

Bill Robertson
#5939

And I'm damn proud of it! Haha

[content22207_2]

I honestly can't remember. I called Borgeson and talked to Gil and he set me up with exactly what I needed. You can ask him to look up my order (Conlon) and it should be easy to duplicate.

Gil will also tell you what Houston is ordering. The man has no secrets.

Bill Robertson
#5939

[johnsdenm]

Hi all. I've been having this issue for a few years now, and it is annoying me more lately. When I drive 50mph+, I get a side to side vibration in my steering wheel. The car still tracks straight when I let go of the wheel, but the wheel is visibly shaking side-to-side. I just had new tires and wheels installed which neither helped nor hurt the problem, so that rules out tire balancing. I can take the car to 100mph and the shaking does not seem to be much worse (if any) than when I am driving 50mph.

It is also worth noting that the shocks are fairly new, all bushings except the LCA to the frame have been replaced with polyurethane, I have Toby P's polyurethane swaybar bushings, and I have Ed Uding's LCA brackets. And the car currently has 47,000 miles on it. So I doubt this is an issue of worn suspension components.

Any ideas? When I take this in to get looked at by a local mechanic, what things should I be suggesting he look at? Thanks in advance!

Hi! It sounds like you've already ruled out a lot of potential causes. Given your description, you might want to have your mechanic check the following:

1. **Wheel Alignment:** Even if the car tracks straight, improper alignment can cause vibrations.
2. **Tie Rod Ends and Ball Joints:** These can cause steering wheel vibrations if they're worn out.
3. **Steering Rack:** Check for any play or damage.
4. **Drive Shafts and CV Joints:** Any wear or imbalance here can cause vibrations at higher speeds.
5. **Wheel Bearings:** These can also cause vibrations if they?re worn or damaged.

Good luck, and I hope you get this sorted out!

[Patrick C]

Hi! It sounds like you've already ruled out a lot of potential causes. Given your description, you might want to have your mechanic check the following:

1. **Wheel Alignment:** Even if the car tracks straight, improper alignment can cause vibrations.
2. **Tie Rod Ends and Ball Joints:** These can cause steering wheel vibrations if they're worn out.
3. **Steering Rack:** Check for any play or damage.
4. **Drive Shafts and CV Joints:** Any wear or imbalance here can cause vibrations at higher speeds.
5. **Wheel Bearings:** These can also cause vibrations if they?re worn or damaged.

Good luck, and I hope you get this sorted out!

Resolved 8 years ago, but fun to walk down memory lane in this thread!

[Jonathan]

Resolved 8 years ago, but fun to walk down memory lane in this thread!

Resurrected!! Got me thinking... what's the longest any of you have had an issue on your car go unresolved? Sort of like, "yea, I know that feature/thing isn't working right, but I don't know how/what to fix and it ain't that bad just leaving it like it is"... lol.

I've had my new https://store.delorean.com/101764ss-rear-fasica-lower-support-bracket-stainless-steel.html ... rear fascia lower support bracket installed for what seems like forever without actually going in and replacing at least 5 of the 7 studs that long ago rusted out on the plastic fascia side. At least ten years like that for sure.

Non-functioning A/C doesn't count!!!

[dn010]

Three things still linger for my car:

1) Defrost switch broke 15-20 years ago. I bought a "new" unused one from someone here 3 years ago that turned out defective but at least it looks good.

2) Fan speed #3 has never worked in the 22 years I've owned the car.

3) I recently learned the headlight switch and hazard switch have little light bulbs inside them! I'll get to replacing those next week (probably not).

[Timeless]

Three things still linger for my car:

1) Defrost switch broke 15-20 years ago. I bought a "new" unused one from someone here 3 years ago that turned out defective but at least it looks good.

I installed a blank/dummy switch for the defrost since I live in S. FL and never use the defrost function.

[Rich]

In case you didn?t know there is a relay just for Fan Speed 3. Did you try cleaning the connections or replacing it?

It just happens to be in the 3rd relay location in the diagram for the electrical bay behind the passenger seat.



2) Fan speed #3 has never worked in the 22 years I've owned the car.

[David T]

The rear defroster doesn't really work all that well when it works anyway. As for fixing things, if you don't keep up with them, you wind up with a large list and then you don't want to do anything. Try to be methodical and do them one-at-a-time. Prioritize them and do the reliability and safety ones first. Keep up with the scheduled maintenance like battery, tires, wiper blades, oil changes, etc.

[r00b]

The rear defroster doesn't really work all that well when it works anyway.

Maybe yours doesn't work well. It's almost never needed, but I've had to use mine a few times and it's worked great each time. I once hit a large puddle of water, steamed the glass right up, flicked on the rear defroster and it quickly cleared.

[ssdelorean]

Maybe yours doesn't work well. It's almost never needed, but I've had to use mine a few times and it's worked great each time. I once hit a large puddle of water, steamed the glass right up, flicked on the rear defroster and it quickly cleared.

In over 260,000 miles I have only needed to use the rear defroster 2 times. Both were in a monsoon like downpour. It would be more beneficial if the rear quarter glass had the defroster lines in it.

[dn010]

I've used the rear defrost a few times back when it did work and I was driving (and parking outside) in NY year round including the dreaded winter, and it did work for me. Then a day came when I went to remove the switch and the cover popped off. I never knew how to put it back together then and once the instructions were available I had lost the bar that goes across internally. Fast forward to now living in Florida and parking in a garage, I wouldn't need it but wanted to fix it so I had all working features. I have the "new" switch working to some extent so I'll probably just leave it alone.

Thanks for the tip about the fan speed relay, I'll check into that soon.

[Trstno1]

Does anyone have the link to the anti vibration u joints?

[dn010]

https://dmctalk.org/showthread.php?17041-How-To-Install-Borgeson-vibration-dampening-u-joints

Just plug the part numbers into Amazon, or google to shop around.

[Bitsyncmaster]

Does anyone have the link to the anti vibration u joints?

I had a vibration in the steering wheel around 60 MPH when I first bought my car. New tires did not help. It was only after I replaced the LCRs with stainless LCRs that it went away. I've since installed the anti vibration U joint but did not notice anything better.

[Trstno1]

It was resolved, but I'm not sure what fixed it. I did all kinds of work at the same time and the issue vanished. I did install the Borgeson stainless u-joints and anti-vibration joint on the steering rack end.

Curious?.what work did you do at the same time to tackle the vibration issue?

[Patrick C]

Curious?.what work did you do at the same time to tackle the vibration issue?

Trying to think back 10 years ago. I believe I did a new DMCH steering rack, Borgeson steering shaft and U-Joints, and Ed Uding's vented rotors at that same time.