Fuel leak- accumulator

[ZX-14]

Hi everyone, this is my 1st post, so I will attempt to be as clear as possible.

I purchase my car a few weeks go. I drained and cleaned the tank and replaced the fuel pump and sender.

The car has been driven, or at least started a couple times per year at best. I expect I will be reolacing things here and there. I put about 4 gallons of gas in the tank and started it up. It took a few tries, foot to the floor, but finally started.

I let the car idle for about 15 minutes, a slightly rough idle never the less. Then noticed a fuel leak under the car, pretty bad one too.

Jacked the back up and it seems to be coming directly from the fuel pump line where it attaches to the front of the accumulator.

The line has no hole or cracks from what I can tell, so I put a hose clamp on it and tightened it down.

Went to restart the car , but would not start, still leaks. Bad accumulator?

[deloumis]

Hot start problem could be the accumulator is bad. How many times did you try cranking? How long did it sit before you tried starting again?

[ZX-14]

It took me a 3 minutes of cranking to get it started. First time it ran in a year.

After I noticed the fuel leak, I turned it off, and worked under the car for about an hour.

Climbed back into the car and cranked on it (turning the key) for about 5 minutes, with about a minute or two of waiting in between.

It sputtered for a split second, but never started.

Would a bad accumulator caught the line from the fuel pump going tnto it leak?

It's a diaphragm right? If it's closed, could it be forcing fuel out of the connection?

[Bitsyncmaster]

The accumulator is a spring loaded "balloon" so it keeps liquid under pressure. If that "balloon" has a pin hole leak the pressure drops to quickly and you will have a hot start issue. If it's a massive leak, you will not build correct fuel pressure and have hard or no starting.

If your accumulator is original, replace it. Get new fuel lines (100 psi rated or more) to replace the OEM lines if you have a broken one.

[thirdmanj]

The accumulator is a spring loaded "balloon" so it keeps liquid under pressure. If that "balloon" has a pin hole leak the pressure drops to quickly and you will have a hot start issue. If it's a massive leak, you will not build correct fuel pressure and have hard or no starting.

If your accumulator is original, replace it. Get new fuel lines (100 psi rated or more) to replace the OEM lines if you have a broken one.

I'm with Dave. If the accumulator is original, you should just replace it. You can if it is because they originally used sweated lines and the replacement ones come with new rubber hoses and clamps.

[ZX-14]

I'm with Dave. If the accumulator is original, you should just replace it. You can if it is because they originally used sweated lines and the replacement ones come with new rubber hoses and clamps.


Thanks guys- will do.

Even though it is not the factory original- as the pics I have seen show the original being all black. Mine is bronze and gray, also with a bright orange hose, which seems odd.

[DMCMW Dave]

a bright orange hose, which seems odd.

Bright orange hose was common a few years ago, we have seen quite a few of them crack and leak. They were provided for accumulator and fuel pump hoses. If you have them on your car you should replace them at your earliest convenience as they seem to be a time bomb now.

[thirdmanj]

...time bomb....

HA HA HA!! Good one, Dave! :hysterical:

[Tillsy]

Bright orange hose was common a few years ago, we have seen quite a few of them crack and leak. They were provided for accumulator and fuel pump hoses. If you have them on your car you should replace them at your earliest convenience as they seem to be a time bomb now.

My old fuel pump had bright orange hoses and they were split to buggery (amongst other issues I found) - very glad I never fired her up until I had replaced all of that.

[ZX-14]

Bringing up my old thread, today I finally replaced the accumulator. That's a job that made me want to kick a dent in every panel on the car when I finally finished.

Seems to start up right away when warm, even after sitting for 5 minutes or so. But I let it sit for an hour and it took forever to start again.

Pulled it back up into the garage, pulled the air box and checked the throttle plate for bleed away. Held good pressure, but after 10 minutes, it starts to lose it. Before I changed the accumulator, it would bleed away to nothing right when you killed the motor.

So- I guess I need to check something else. Suggestions?

Thanks.

[ZX-14]

Posted this to my first topic started in the wrong section, in short, it starts 5-10 minutes after, but let it sit for an hour and it has trouble. Definitely holds fuel pressure at the throttle plate better then before, but after 10 mn, it bleeds off.

A few more things:

Fluid leak coming from my half shafts where they come out of the side of the tranny. Driver side worse then pass side.

Annoying squeak coming from my louvers, oiled all visible joints, bolts, etc- no fix.

[Ron]

Posted this to my first topic started in the wrong section
...

Fixed that for ya...

=======

If you can't find any more leaks, try pulling all of the injectors (including cold start) out and see if they are leaking (and flooding the engine...). If not you may need a check valve (on top of, or built into, the fuel pump.)

[Delorean Industries]

Posted this to my first topic started in the wrong section, in short, it starts 5-10 minutes after, but let it sit for an hour and it has trouble. Definitely holds fuel pressure at the throttle plate better then before, but after 10 mn, it bleeds off.

A few more things:

Fluid leak coming from my half shafts where they come out of the side of the tranny. Driver side worse then pass side.

Annoying squeak coming from my louvers, oiled all visible joints, bolts, etc- no fix.

Most likely a fuel distributor issue. Lip seal replacement is required on your differential flanges. The flanges are pitted most likely as well. You will need to sleeve or replace these too. The louvre is miss alignment along the rub strips, partially worn support strut moving up and down with road vibrations or a misalignment of the center latch.

[Ron]

Most likely a fuel distributor issue.
Are you thinking it may be leaking past the plunger or ?
...Asking because he says it idles...starts ok if it sits 5-10 min...less than an hour.

[Delorean Industries]

Are you thinking it may be leaking past the plunger or ?
...Asking because he says it idles...starts ok if it sits 5-10 min...less than an hour.

No it is leaking down through the return line. If he has a gauge set on the car the next step is to isolate the distributor to prevent a bleed down condition on the primary line. If the line pressure holds that tells you that there is still a issue on the primary side. If it bleeds down your problem lies on the return leg.

[Ron]

Got ya! PPR, o-ring...

I was assuming, after he cleaned it out and had it idling a few times, the hard starting (cold) was probably due to flooding.

[ZX-14]

Thanks Josh- new struts on the louvre already, engine compartment hood has a jacked up latch, so it sometimes hooks to it, sometimes not. Squeak comes up high, by T-panel.

The car def starts like it should, right when you turn the key..

Opened up the fuel distributor and checked an 0 ring (again) at the front and its good. Been drivinced it today, although its still slowly bleeding off. Once key bumps forward fuel pressure is restored and fires up.

Still needs corrected.

[David T]

One quick thing to try:
When it won't start try doing the plug swap. If it starts right up the problem is somehow you are not holding "Rest Pressure" up high enough and/or long enough. Since you replaced the accumulator it is either the check valve in the fuel pump or (less likely) the Primary Pressure Regulator in the Fuel Distributor. If the plug swap doesn't help you have a problem in the CSV (Cold Start Valve) system. A wiring problem or a bad Thermo-Time switch.
David Teitelbaum

[ZX-14]

One quick thing to try:
When it won't start try doing the plug swap. If it starts right up the problem is somehow you are not holding "Rest Pressure" up high enough and/or long enough. Since you replaced the accumulator it is either the check valve in the fuel pump or (less likely) the Primary Pressure Regulator in the Fuel Distributor. If the plug swap doesn't help you have a problem in the CSV (Cold Start Valve) system. A wiring problem or a bad Thermo-Time switch.
David Teitelbaum



Will do. The fuel pump is new, it's the pump/sender combo from DMCH.

[David T]

You should NEVER assume just because you installed a new part, that it cannot be bad. Besides, you will drive yourself nuts looking all over at everything else till you convince yourself the "new" part is the problem. Happens to even the best mechanic. Sometimes it is because it is installed wrong or maybe it got damaged in shipping. I would call DMCH and ask them how to check it.
David Teitelbaum

[Ron]

+1

With the clamp-on quick connects that came on Chris's combo unit (BTW, it had a bad check valve!), you trim the connectors off during installation...easy to connect a shut-off or plug the return (then use a short bump on the pump with power and check it).....poor-mans, but would work for a 10 min leak down test.

=========

It seems to me that you may be headed back to internal leaks...
FWIW- Since it has started and idled, has it ever been dead cold (say over night) and the pump activated and let leak down w/o trying to start it a few times (while you worked on it or ??), and then you tried to start it right afterwords for the first time with it being hard to start, or no start? If so, was there a heavy fuel smell then, or other ANY time.

[ZX-14]

No, there was no smell of fuel. When I go to start the car, I always click the key forward to hear the fuel pump- then I start it. Fires right off.

I will say this- the car starts normally about 80% of the time now compared to before the accumulator install. So I really have to try to find that window of time that it gives me problems. Somewhere after all the fuel bleeds down, but when it hasn't totally cooled off.

So out of the 12-15 times in the last day and a half, it did it to me once, and had a rough idle 2 or 3 times for a few secounds after start up.

Plus- it still bleeds off at that 10 mn mark.

[Ron]

When I go to start the car, I always click the key forward to hear the fuel pump- then I start it. Fires right off.

I see.
What I'm thinking is it may be leaking internally (injectors, CSV, and/or FD) such that when it is dead cold, it is not a problem because it likes the extra fuel (ie helps the CSV). Same if you shut it right off and try it again, until it warms up a bit. As you let it warm up, it may get harder to start, depending on hot hot and how long it sits after being shut off. Once it is "hot", it could be flooding a bit, maybe fouling a plug or three, some of which may clear up right away when it fires off... ie not a "De Lorean hot start" problem, or a combination.

Food for thought if all else fails and/or you are waiting on a gauge or ??:
Since you said it runs a little rough, I'd check the above for leaks anyway since it has been sitting for so long, just GP... Maybe just cycle the switch the next time it is cold and let it set the 10 minutes several times back to back w/o starting it and see if you then smell fuel when starting, or, if you hear any cylinders pick up during the first few seconds or so.
If new plugs, take a new look...
Borrow/buy a gauge set :biggrin:
Hang in there...