Delorean/Bricklin animosity

[grayghost]

I have a few questions about some animosity that I have noticed and have experienced at some car shows. First off I am not a Delorean owner but a Bricklin owner and I have a great deal of respect and admiration for the Delorean. I had my first project car at a local show in California just to expose the car to some people in a small town there was a Delorean there and a Mercedes SL 300 gullwing there also and we got situated near each other. I will admit that my car was the worst looking car there but I had only had it for about 2 weeks and just got new tires and a tune up performed I felt well received by the Mercedes owner and a few of the other older car guys around but the Delorean owner and some of the Camaro/Corvette guys there that bought their cars and did not build their cars treated me like my car was the plague. That was my first experience with a Delorean owner but not my last a few other shows I had gone to I had seen other Delorean owners and it seemed as if I was always treated as for the lack of a better term "red headded step child" but what do I know about the at times weird California car owners.

Well fast forward a year and I move cross country and take my car out to a different local car show and someone says that there is a Delorean there. I stroll over and talk to the owner start to have a nice chat with him when I mention I have a gullwing car he kind of perks up but when I say the name Bricklin he looks at me like a kid would if I had cooties. I know there are alot of similarities in the design and after the first year of ownership I have become well aware of the fact that everyone calls my car a Delorean and I can accept allot of misinformation with peoples assumptions and the BTTF movies. My quick responses to why did you paint a Delorean from "experts" I will ask them where the engine on a Delorean located or how many cylinders does the Delorean have but when someone actually wants to learn about the car I will talk with them about the Bricklin. Most people I have actually talked to are quite pleased with the way I talk to them about my car and some of the similarities with Delorean but at least in my experience with the Delorean owners I have met all treat my car like it is the redheadded step child.

Does some of this animosity come from the CCR TV show where Malcom Bricklin says that the design of the Delorean came from a Bricklin built car that was loaned to JZD? I have seen pictures of Delorean's prototype 1 but there is a car before this that JZD used to get funding it would have been called a design/concept car do any pictures of this car exist? I have heard rumors that the first car used to show to banks to get finding was fiberglass and had a front mounted engine. This fits with the Bricklin concept build but does anyone have pictures of this car from Delorean?

I know that Delorean took a bit longer to actually produce a car and that resulted in a much higher build quality in the actual production cars. But there can be something to be said for a car company to go from the first actual day of operation that designs a car and rolls off the first production car 9 months after the first day of opening the doors. Yes the Bricklin does have allot of build quality issues but while production went along they tried to correct the problems. These are the problems that JZD learned from and lead him to take longer to build a better quality product than Bricklin produced.

[thirdmanj]

Fuck Bricklins.






............…………………................. ....j/k man!

I happen to like Bricklins, I've read lots of negative things about them to be sure. But really, fuck that noise. You like what you like right? There's plenty of negative scribble on DeLoreans too. It's whatever, I've never heard of any DeLorean owners and Bricklin owners getting into fights or anything.

[Silverbullet]

No animosity here, I always thought Bricklins were cool, I liked the V8 Idea. I know they were pretty heavy cars, and the doors had some issues, some were converted to air power. If I were at a car show, I would chat with the owner to learn more...

Craig

[Kenny_Z]

I've never seen a Bricklin in person but I really want to. Same with the SL 300. I can't say I've ever been interested in owning a Bricklin (SL300 either) but not for any particular reason. They're just not "that car" for me. The Delorean is actually outside my normal interest, I prefer classic muscle cars. I think I fell for the Delorean for two reasons. I was an 80s kid so Back to the Future and John Delorean can be argued as the father of the muscle car and the DMC-12 was born from that same mind.

The animosity might stem from the fact that in a car show a DeLorean tends to steal attention away from almost anything else. Exotic owners don't like to be parked near us. Maybe your Bricklin was stealing the thunder and that was more jealousy than animosity. Then again I could be completely off base.

On a side note, any pictures of the car? :wave2:

[thirdmanj]

Oooooo yeah! Pictures please!!

[Michael]

Anyone who judges or alters their attitude toward anyone based on what kind of car they decided to show is a prick.....unless that person has a Bricklin. In Tennessee its actually legal to shoot a Bricklin owner on sight. ;)

AFAIK, the ONLY thing Bricklin and DeLorean share are gull wing doors, and even those are designed completely different. If that logic were followed through, then a Bricklin and a Mercedes SLS are equally as similar.

[grayghost]

This car is one of 2 red 4-speeds and has a very colorful history as a prototype crash car. This is one of the better photos I have access to right now this photo was taken right before I bought the car.

http://i1091.photobucket.com/albums/i392/matt_vaq136/proto0005_zps32565aa0.png

[dustybarn]

I haven't seen a Bricklin since the '80's, but I'd love to see one again. I suspect that owners of Bricklins and Deloreans have much in common. They both own weird, rare, orphaned cars with colorful histories, cars that each have their own peculiarities. I see no reason why there should be anything but comradeship (and commiseration) among everyone with funky doors, whether they're stainless or acrylic.

[Silverbullet]

Red?... It looks like Safety Orange....

[grayghost]

Anyone who judges or alters their attitude toward anyone based on what kind of car they decided to show is a prick.....unless that person has a Bricklin. In Tennessee its actually legal to shoot a Bricklin owner on sight. ;)

AFAIK, the ONLY thing Bricklin and DeLorean share are gull wing doors, and even those are designed completely different. If that logic were followed through, then a Bricklin and a Mercedes SLS are equally as similar.

The last Bricklin I am aware of that was in Tennessee was located in a Knoxville pull-a-part junkyard so I made sure I covered up my Bricklin on a trailer when I went to visit a friend in Clarksville when I was moving cross country! LOL... But I do have to say this I did buy parts from this car that had been pulled off by a Delorean/VW guy that knew what the extremely hard to find parts were for Delorean's so I am thankful for that because many of the parts that are hard for Delorean people to come by are the same parts for the Bricklin people. Here is the last known picture of Bricklin vin#2242 before it met its fate in the crusher. Now that I think of it that guy is I think the only owner of Delorean's that I met that was a cool down to earth guy and understood the dynamics of B's and D's that did not own one of each.

But there is a rumor that the guy that actually performed the crushing was a Delorean owner..... Hmmm.... making my care more rare and valuable are you? hehehe....

But I really do hate to see a rare car meet its fate in this way but a Honda in the crusher brings a smile to my face any day.

http://i1091.photobucket.com/albums/i392/matt_vaq136/100_2814-1_zps5db57b03.jpg



Red?... It looks like Safety Orange....

And yes it is red believe it or not. I like to think of it as a light red that reminds people of orange at times... But it is all original acrylic that sat outside for 25 years. so even if it was painted it would have faded.

[louielouie2000]

I've only seen 1 Bricklin in person, but I have to say I was very impressed with it. The car was concours quality... it only had 3,000 miles and was original down to it's tires (which themselves were in perfect condition). In the flesh, a well preserved Bricklin is quite handsome, even striking. I know many DeLorean owners sneer at the finish/build quality of Bricklins, but I think that is a bit unfair. DeLoreans and Bricklins are separated by a decade... which is quite a long time when it comes to automotive advancement. If you look at cars of the early 70s vintage, they are pretty comparable to the Bricklin. Lots of exposed screws in the interior, cheap gauges/switchgear, naugahyde upholstery, etc. The 70s were a pretty dark time when it comes to automobiles for sure. However, after seeing an extremely nice example in person, I'd love to own a Bricklin one day. They are a really neat, handsome, affordable automotive footnote.

[pezzonovante88]

I like Bricklins and I think they're cool. I'm surprised anybody (especially a D owner) would be a dick to you.

[grayghost]

I was extremely shocked by my experiences at the local car shows I attended. But I do not know if it was because I stole some of their thunder or what the case might have been. Since my car was not in tip top shape I did not mind if some of the people touched the car some people wondered how someone as tall as me (6"6") could fit in a car as small as the Bricklin and evel showed them how I "put the car on" and even let them sit and see what it was like inside. Coolest thing though by far was 2 young kids maybe 5 and 10 both brothers came to look at the cars and were amazed there was a "time machine" at one of the shows. The Delorean owner was apprehensive about letting a child touch his car that I could tell by the look on their faces but when they came next to my car they asked why I painted my "time machine" then I explained a little and they understood there was a difference.

Their father was a quazi car guy from what I could gather knew the basics of popular cars like what they were probably a guy with an appreciation for old cars but probably didn't own a classic at the time or had a 10 year old project sitting in the garage. But back to the boys after I explained the difference I asked them if they would like to sit in a "sports car" needless to say they were all over that each sat in the drivers and passengers side of my car I was cautious but I let them push the buttons to open and close the doors. Well long story short I think that me stealing his spotlight was part of why I had not the best experience with a few Delorean owners. But I do hope that I did plant a seed for the kids to maybe one day restore an old car wheather it be a Bricklin or a Delorean. As the kids were walking away with their dad I heard them say that they wanted to get one of the "cool" cars.

[Dangermouse]

I know of at least 2 DeLorean owners that are Bricklin owners too (or vice versa)

[Jonathan]

And yes it is red believe it or not. I like to think of it as a light red that reminds people of orange at times...

I might copy paste this into the "what colour is Marty's vest?" thread :)

Seriously though, I would say you might have got a one-off guy and that it is not a theme. Probably true in a lot of stuff whether it be car owners, sports teams fans, or whatever. There are all kinds in pretty much every group. And the larger the group, the more of each kind. I have had the odd strange reception to the car from a wide range of types of people and there doesn't seem to be a lot of rhyme or reason to it.

With the Bricklin, I don't doubt that those owners would get the same comments we get, just in the opposite direction. We get asked if our cars were built in Canada, have the Ford engine (in the front!), etc., etc. Much like a Bricklin owner gets the paint/stainless comments, BTTF references, or whatever it is they get. Most of them would be from people misinformed rather than trying to be mean. That's my take on it anyway.

I have seen a few of these cars in person. Could be that there are more here in Canada since they were built here. Not sure about that stat really.

Here are a couple I found I had pictures of. I have a few pictures of these two cars and in some angles they look orange and in others they look yellow. Not sure which is the "safe" choice.

1611816119

[sdg3205]

I was contacted to facilitate the sale of DeLorean vin 972 this fall. Know what else was in the garage?! Safety orange!

It's still for sale (the bricklin)

16120

[Jonathan]

Hmmm, it would appear as though the rule of thumb in Brickland is 'orange is red, and yellow is orange.' I wonder if that was some sort of fad(e) in the 70s?

[marcel]

Hey Dave, I thought that I read before that the Bricklin was sold also. I am interested in the bricklin. Where abouts is it at?

[sdg3205]

Pit meadows. I don't recall ever reporting that the bricklin was sold, just the Delorean. Then again I did loose my CSV.

Ill call tomorrow.

[Nicholas R]

I remember watching the interview where Malcolm Bricklin says that John DeLorean completely ripped off his car and I wont lie, it pissed me off for a couple reasons. The interview happened not long after after John DeLorean had died. Did Malcolm Bricklin really wait until after John DeLorean was dead to claim he stole his cars design? Come on now... There is boatloads of documentation regarding the cars styling and design by Giorgetto Giugiaro, as well as the influence from Lotus, Peugeot, Volvo, etc. We have documentation of where the parts and designs came from and more. Oddly enough, none of it traces back to Bricklin. Even more, aside from the damn doors, the two cars are truly nothing alike. When I watch that interview, it sounds more to me like with the gradual rise in popularity of the DeLorean in the last decade, Malcolm wanted to try to claim some of that success and popularity for his own. "well it was my idea first"

"he wanted to copy my car in every way, name, and demand... so John DeLoreans car is the exact car that I rejected, and I still have that prototype..."
-Malcolm Bricklin

He brings up John DeLorean starting at 0:55

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=_NosbiOsjO4#t=55s

So... that being said, despite my feelings about Malcolm Bricklin, I actually like Bricklins. They're low production, very unique, and have a 351. (not a fan of the lack of manuals though) I've actually considered buying Bricklins several times.

Car owners can be jerks though. The first Bricklin owner I met was a total jerk to me. I was living in Charlotte NC for a summer and had my DeLorean with me, and decided to stop into a local cruise in. When I pulled in, someone told me there was a Bricklin, so naturally I parked next to him. As soon as I met him, it was pretty clear that he was a regular to the cruise in and that I was not welcome. Over the next few hours, the guy didnt want to talk about anything but the extensive problems that DeLoreans have and how much it drove him crazy that people are always confusing his car with a painted DeLorean (actually happened several times at the cruise in). To make things worse, his friends spent the evening pointing out and asking about flaws on my car. (the evening did end on a bright note though when I won the audience's choice award for the cruise in :) )

After that I certainly had a bad opinion of Bricklin owners.

Luckily, I got the chance to meet MANY more that were really cool. Ken tried really hard to bridge the gap between the Bricklin and DeLorean community with the 2008 Gettysburg Carshow and the 2010 Lexington Carshow. (also tried for the 2012 Orlando show but he couldn't get enough Bricklin interest)

At the 2008 and 2010 shows I met a lot of really cool Bricklin owners with really awesome cars and awesome stories. Definitely gave me a much better opinion of Bricklins and their owners.

Bottom line is you cant judge the whole community from just a few.

[john 05141]

Wouw mixed feelings...

I was at DCS in Gettysburg and there were a bunch of Bricklin owners there. I felt fortunate to have the opportunity to have a good look at these cars. I do prefer the Delorean, that is why I have one, but I can appreciate the Bricklin. I can tell they certainly sound a lot better than the Deloreans. But I was surpised to see despite the combined Bricklin / Delorean show those owners do not mix that well. I saw this too in the video from Videobob (I had to buy via an American, becasue VB does not like to sell to Europeans.. sorry could not resist)
Malcolm Bricklins claim upset me too, and I do consider this a lie, he woud have said this in publick at the very beginning if this were true. But that does have nothing to do with the Bricklin owners who share their love for their gull winged set of wheels just like we do.
About the early plastic Delorean cars; I have written a story in the Dutch Delorean magazine about the prototypes and mules or early Deloreans. I did quite some research on that and it is very interesting. Is was actuallo more about the location on thse early cars. But I can say the first prototypes were Stainless steel cars. It is when they built 28 pre-series they switched some cars to colored plastic (or epoxy or acrylic or whatever) Delorean for 2 reasons. Lotus was not convinced the Stainless steel would remain in the project (thank God Delorean rejected Lotus' idea to switch to palstic) and the secons reason is cost. Those plastic body plates were way cheaper in plastic as those cars were built for various purposes, brake testing, suspension, .. some were sent to Germany (Bosh) for improvements,.. you name it. so they did not need SS body panels.
To continue the story, all of these cars were destroyed. There were certainly blue and red versions.
There were nevery any serie build Delorean other than SS panels.



Hope this helps a bit

Jan

[Hcloud13]

I've had both the Bricklin & the delorean at the same time.
Both cars have there up's and downs.The D has a better build quality as the B was really just a Kit car. I was always afraid I was always going to break something when I drove it.
BUT the B had a great engine with the 351 windsor and could haul ass lol.
The doors freaked me out as the were SOOOO heavy and if the line broke or poped they would SLAM down fast.

Only reason I can think other D owners don't like it is it's competition for attention at the car show?
I'd sometime have my friend drive the B and follow me to the Car shows and park them next to each other.

http://i247.photobucket.com/albums/gg130/Hcloud13/Picture457_zpsd2e919be.jpg
http://i247.photobucket.com/albums/gg130/Hcloud13/Picture4512_zps45bb3f8e.jpg
http://i247.photobucket.com/albums/gg130/Hcloud13/Picture458_zps52863204.jpg
http://i247.photobucket.com/albums/gg130/Hcloud13/Picture417_zps1000c5a8.jpg

[thirdmanj]

I found an orangish one in really shit shape at a local car dealer a few years back. The dealer said 10k and its mine. I just looked at him with that glazed over look for a few seconds, then broke out in to a huge smile, and hysterical laughter and said, "you're crazy dude." There was no way that car was in 10k shape, the doors didn't work, it looked really ratty on the interior. Windshield was cracked in a couple places, just really sad to see such a rare car in that state of disrepair.

[Jonathan]

I remember watching the interview where Malcolm Bricklin says that John DeLorean completely ripped off his car and I wont lie, it pissed me off for a couple reasons. The interview happened not long after after John DeLorean had died. Did Malcolm Bricklin really wait until after John DeLorean was dead to claim he stole his cars design? Come on now... There is boatloads of documentation regarding the cars styling and design by Giorgetto Giugiaro, as well as the influence from Lotus, Peugeot, Volvo, etc. We have documentation of where the parts and designs came from and more. Oddly enough, none of it traces back to Bricklin. Even more, aside from the damn doors, the two cars are truly nothing alike. When I watch that interview, it sounds more to me like with the gradual rise in popularity of the DeLorean in the last decade, Malcolm wanted to try to claim some of that success and popularity for his own. "well it was my idea first"

"he wanted to copy my car in every way, name, and demand... so John DeLoreans car is the exact car that I rejected, and I still have that prototype..."
-Malcolm Bricklin


Yikes, he sounds arrogant to me. The part that stuck out that I hadn't heard before was when he said something like "... yada, yada, yada... wanted to bring some notoriety to a province no one had heard of before." I guess that just depends on who you are and where you come from. One could probably think of a ton of places in the world that are not as famous as a New York city or San Francisco or London. The statement just sounds like he doesn't speak too highly of the people he used to build his car. On the other hand, with the "success" of his car, he might just still be holding a grudge with JZD that the DMC-12 did better. You're right Nick, pretty shallow for a guy to wait to say these things until the other guy is dead.

[DMCMW Dave]

I's surprised it wasn't mentioned more than in passing - there are at least 2 (3?) Delorean Car Shows where the organizer invited the national Bricklin club to attend and exhibit. They did and it was enjoyed by both groups.

I sure don't understand what you've been seeing.

[grayghost]

Here are some pictures of the car that Malcom was talking about. You have to admit that this initial design looks closer to a Delorean than it does a Bricklin also it should be noted that this car has finally been located and is still surviving.

http://i1091.photobucket.com/albums/i392/matt_vaq136/ScreenShot2012-08-15at7_27_07PM_zps373a2973.png

here is a different view of the Bricklin design/concept car along with a picture of what is supposed to be Delorean prototype 2. Does anyone have pictures of the Delorean design/concept car that JZD used to get funding I feel it would be interesting to see the differences in the two.

http://i1091.photobucket.com/albums/i392/matt_vaq136/288242_477418122287773_774705797_o_zps7b1944f9.jpg

I think that the two cars look more alike the prototype or production Bricklin's produced. But it could be me.

[thirdmanj]

"Proto 1" Is the one you're referring to. Quite frankly, like Nick said, aside from the damn doors they look nothing alike. And Proto 1 has more in common with its production variant than ANY concept I've ever seen.

I see more in common with a Corvette than I do the DeLorean. The DMC-12 is euro, through and through.

[Jonathan]

"Proto 1" Is the one you're referring to. Quite frankly, like Nick said, aside from the damn doors they look nothing alike. And Proto 1 has more in common with its production variant than ANY concept I've ever seen.

I see more in common with a Corvette than I do the DeLorean. The DMC-12 is euro, through and through.


Here are some pictures of the car that Malcom was talking about. You have to admit that this initial design looks closer to a Delorean than it does a Bricklin...

...But it could be me.

I'm with James on this one. I don't see it. Sure the DMC-12 looks more like an SV-1 than it does a Chevy AstroVan, but I see those Bricklin photos and think something like old Datsun's maybe or something similar. When you see the two "prototype" photos side by side, I get that they are both cars, but the lines aren't even close to being the same. To say that you have to admit the initial design looks closer to a DeLorean than it does a Bricklin, is a bit of a stretch in my opinion. I just don't see it. Yea, it might just be you.

It could also answer some of the questions as to why you've encountered some DeLorean owners who weren't nice to you. It happens to anyone if you're rubbed the wrong way about stuff. Not sure what all that means, but we were trying to figure it out in a type A, B, C thread not long ago.

[grayghost]

"Proto 1" Is the one you're referring to. Quite frankly, like Nick said, aside from the damn doors they look nothing alike. And Proto 1 has more in common with its production variant than ANY concept I've ever seen.

I see more in common with a Corvette than I do the DeLorean. The DMC-12 is euro, through and through.

That I did not know about Prototype 1 for the Delorean I would have assumed that the later prototypes were closer to the actual production models produced like other companies at the time. I have people that look at the Bricklin's and assume it is a Delorean "that it is not a delorean but if they can imagine what would happen if a Corvette and a Delorean had a baby and popped something out the size of a Mazda rx-7" then that is a Bricklin. That comment usually makes people chuckle quite a bit and I do have a pretty good sense of humor when it comes to things like that. I will agree with what Nicholas R said in that Malcom jumped on the bandwagon trying to gain some more publicity for the Bricklin and apparently according to Malcom JZD approached him when Bricklin was starting production and wanted in on the ground floor but I have heard rumors from other people about this too but nothing in writing that was concrete like a letter of invite or anything like that so I do believe that it is just wishful thinking.

I do have to admit this though I have been toying around with the possibility of getting a project Delorean nothing too expensive. I have talked to some people and have found a car that has been sitting in a field for about 15-20 years in kentucky that the owner wants about 3,500 for. I do not want a show car or anything like that I want a car that I could put a different motor in and not feel too bad about destroying a nice original car something without an engine would be best but how much do they usually sell for in a rough project shape with no serious damage?

[OverlandMan]

The Bricklin is missing one key thing that the DeLorean has going for it: Hollywood notoriety. My thought is that some (and hopefully just a small handful) of the Bricklin owners hold this against the DeLorean community.

I'm a car enthusiast and the Bricklin is an interesting car. I don't have a desire to own one but I have nothing against it nor their owners.

[thirdmanj]

...I do have to admit this though I have been toying around with the possibility of getting a project Delorean nothing too expensive....

:hihi2: No such DeLorean exists.

[Jonathan]

I do have to admit this though I have been toying around with the possibility of getting a project Delorean nothing too expensive. I have talked to some people and have found a car that has been sitting in a field for about 15-20 years in kentucky that the owner wants about 3,500 for. I do not want a show car or anything like that I want a car that I could put a different motor in and not feel too bad about destroying a nice original car something without an engine would be best but how much do they usually sell for in a rough project shape with no serious damage?

$3,500 might be okay depending on what you get. Take particular note of the condition of the frame. Check for rust, whether it be of the surface variety or worse. No one wants to deal with a swiss cheese frame. Get a look underneath and take pictures if you can. Put it on a lift if possible. The front frame extension gets rotted relatively quickly as do some of the other corners and seams and near areas that got hot and blistered the epoxy coating. Look around the catalytic converter, behind and above the muffler, etc.

How are the stainless panels? Between these and the frame, that'll pretty much tell you if you got your $3,500 worth or not. Of the four quarter panels, front left is the rarest and most expensive. Check it out closely. Small little blemishes or scratches aren't too bad, but keep an eye out for significant bangs in them.

There are a number of other parts which would make your $3,500 a deal. But some of this logic comes to mind if you made it a parts car. Conversely, if you want this car to be complete and driveable again in the future, best to find a car with the majority of the expensive pieces in suitable condition. A number of the interior pieces are that way. Trim panels, knee pads, consoles, etc.

If the car sat for 15-20 years, it might take $15k-$20k to make it go again. This comes from the $1k per year it sat rule of thumb. Pictures of all aspects of the car are best at this point. Post them here and you will get no shortage of opinions. Keep the exact location to yourself if you are concerned of someone else snatching it up.

Definitely do not try to start the car before a lot of inspecting. Mainly ensure the condition of the fuel system and any other gunk that sat for that long. If you can figure out what condition it was in prior to sitting, that is good too. Clean title is important as well.

Many of these cars will take $25k to $30k to get into good, reliable condition. If you get it for $3,500, conceivably it might need another $25k worth of stuff over the coming years. Don't worry too much about little things like the windows not being aligned on their tracks, or the ashtray missing or something. Focus on the big ticket stuff and what would be really expensive if you realized yours was unuseable.

Check out delorean.com and go to their store and start looking at prices. See for yourself compared to what this car may need and gauge how expensive it would be. Be mindful of parts on the store website that are priced at $0.00. This is not because they have a sweet deal on that part at the moment. It usually means you are not going to find that part very easily. Or at least not inexpensively. Of course doing a lot of the labor hours yourself is going to save you money.

Post some photos here if you get the chance. Let us know what the VIN is (last 5 digits) and what month and year the car was made in. This can be found on the drivers door sill info plate. Post a picture of that too and let us know the type of transmission and color of the interior. We keep a detailed chronology of this info to try and answer the eternal "how many of these cars did they build?" question.

Have fun and patience :)

[Michael]

The average person can barely identify their own car in a parking lot....so it goes without saying once they see the doors go up they make an immediate connection with the only car they know with gull wing doors.

I remember the day I brought my DeLorean home. I owned a 91 300zx just a few days prior and my neighbor thought my DeLorean was my old Nissan that I just had painted a different color and had a "door mod" done.

With that said the Bricklin and DeLorean are both pretty cars...but have nothing in common. The doors are even different. I think the Bricklin looks more like a 280zx than anything else. And the prototype Bricklin looks like a Bricklin...not even close to a DeLorean.

[Evildeli]

A few years ago, at the Lake Mirror Classic in Lakeland, FL there was a black Bricklin parked across from our Deloreans. We all crowded around the Bricklin and bombarded the owner with questions. Everyone was enthusiastic about it, and I hope we made him feel welcomed and respected. I think the Deloreans got more attention that day only because the D has more notoriety and there were more of us, but I think it was a treat to have a gullwing section populated with more than the D's.

[delornut]

I owned a Bricklin in the seventies and the styling was cool for that era but Malcolm Bricklin was film flam man of the first degree. He made his money in the hardware business and his "expertise" in building an automobile was at the hardware store level. True he hired some folks from automakers, Terry Tanner, Bricklin's ME manager, came from Ford but Malcolm put his dad, another hardware store guy, in charge of quality control. Yikes!!! To say someone with JZD's background would approach Bricklin for advice is crazy. If, in fact, he did investigate Bricklin's organization he would have walked away without looking back. I do know that after Bricklin's fall Aston Martin imported at least one Bricklin for an engineering study to see if it would be worth trying to revive. At the Belfast DeLorean event in 2001 my wife and I ended up at a table with Mike Loasby and his wife. I asked him about the Bricklin when he was with Aston Martin and he couldn't remember if he imported one or two cars but couldn't remember much else as the car was just too far below their engineering standards to consider. It appeared it was just a footnote in his memories of his time with AM.

Bruce Benson

[grayghost]

Ive said since I owned my Bricklin that if it had been chosen over the Delorean in the BTTF movies I would be driving around in a Delorean because Being known is what makes cars more valuable. I know of 1 former Tucker owner that had at one time 3 Tuckers and had a total of 17 thousand in all three bear in mind that this was in the 1970's he had sold one to George Lucas in the early 80's he sold the car for 9,000 because Lucas wanted one so bad. Then the movie came along by that time the former owner had sold his remaining cars before the movie came out well right after the movie the cars were selling for 100,000 dollars after being known.

[Nicholas R]

Here are some photos of Proto 1:
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7145/6749754801_9762cc19ff_z.jpg
http://www.aronline.co.uk/images/dmc12story_05.jpg
http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1224/1412253221_e03abb36fe.jpg
http://www.streetlegaltv.com/wp-content/blogs.dir/10/files/2011/09/DeLorean-DMC-12-prototype.jpg

When comparing those to this:
http://i1091.photobucket.com/albums/i392/matt_vaq136/ScreenShot2012-08-15at7_27_07PM_zps373a2973.png

I really dont see it.

I see a lot more Corvette/Datsun than DeLorean.

I mean really... if you're going to claim that one car is an exact copy of another, they at LEAST need to have the engine in the same place :rolleyes1:

[grayghost]

Here are some photos of Proto 1:
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7145/6749754801_9762cc19ff_z.jpg
http://www.aronline.co.uk/images/dmc12story_05.jpg
http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1224/1412253221_e03abb36fe.jpg
http://www.streetlegaltv.com/wp-content/blogs.dir/10/files/2011/09/DeLorean-DMC-12-prototype.jpg

When comparing those to this:
http://i1091.photobucket.com/albums/i392/matt_vaq136/ScreenShot2012-08-15at7_27_07PM_zps373a2973.png

I really dont see it.

I see a lot more Corvette/Datsun than DeLorean.

I mean really... if you're going to claim that one car is an exact copy of another, they at LEAST need to have the engine in the same place :rolleyes1:

I think what Malcom may have meant by his statement in the CCR TV show is that the initial concept car not the prototype but the pre-prototype used to gain funding for the initial investment was a car loaned by Malcom. I do not know of any companies even Dodge Brothers that started out with a "prototype" design to gain funding when first building a car they had a concept that they showed to investors for a rough idea on what the design would be like. Tesla motors had a concept car that they debuted that was an idea for a car then they had their prototypes which lead to the production design. If you think about it like this if someone approached you asking for an investment such as Steve Jobs and had no solid product to base the design off of and the initial investors did not have anything in front of them to actually see just some words by a individual as to what they wanted to do I dont see how anyone could gain capital to start a buisness. We even have something similar to this even today but on a large scale where anyone can invest called www.kickstarter.com and once money started coming in then a prototype could be made that would be closer to the actual finished design.

But that is neither here nor there I do know of some movies that the Bricklin has been in though most though cant be watched in polite company. Movies such as B-rate horror movies like Hobo with a shotgun and adult movies but all in all I would say that the Bricklin does not have the movie fame that the Delorean has but it is not for a lack of trying possibly some different venues would be a good change of pace. As for the project Delorean I already have a motor that I want to put in it an american V-8 from the late 60's high nickle block with maybe 400hp something similar to the Pantera setup to give you an idea. As for pictures I am working on getting them and if it is something saveable I will post a good thread about it if not there will be a thread about it too. I can imagine after sitting for so long I would have to replace the interior and clean the frame up probably fix some rust and I know that the body will not be perfect but was told that the panels were saveable with tiny dings. Speaking of dings is there anywhere in the USA where they remove dings and regrain the stainless?

[Dangermouse]

I see more of the 1980 TVR Tasmin (sans rear side window) in that Bricklin pic than the D:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/9/97/TVR_Tasmin_%28280i%29.jpg/800px-TVR_Tasmin_%28280i%29.jpg

http://i1091.photobucket.com/albums/i392/matt_vaq136/ScreenShot2012-08-15at7_27_07PM_zps373a2973.png

[Jimmyvonviggle]

I think it's fair to say the bricklin does not look like the D at all (besides the gullwings). I always felt the bricklin look too narrow, and it's finish made it look like a cheap kit car. Bricklin himself seems like a very annoying arrogant man in love with himself, and not afraid to rewrite history.

As far as D owners that were less than friendly maybe it's because of the constant comparisons. Why can't you just accept the bricklin as its own unique car. People are always trying to say that DeLorean stole the design, but the fact is this Giugiaro design has been used on many cars (Scirroco for example) and copied by many designers. It is in my opinion a truly beautiful design with the right width and squareness, that captures that 80s look.

The Tucker cars didn't rise in price due to the movie, but because of car enthusiasts who realized how ahead of its time the engineering on these cars was, and the fact there werent that many made. I think the going price these day for a well restored one is in the millions (Barrett-Jackson).

[grayghost]

I think it's fair to say the bricklin does not look like the D at all (besides the gullwings). I always felt the bricklin look too narrow, and it's finish made it look like a cheap kit car. Bricklin himself seems like a very annoying arrogant man in love with himself, and not afraid to rewrite history.

As far as D owners that were less than friendly maybe it's because of the constant comparisons. Why can't you just accept the bricklin as its own unique car. People are always trying to say that DeLorean stole the design, but the fact is this Giugiaro design has been used on many cars (Scirroco for example) and copied by many designers. It is in my opinion a truly beautiful design with the right width and squareness, that captures that 80s look.

The Tucker cars didn't rise in price due to the movie, but because of car enthusiasts who realized how ahead of its time the engineering on these cars was, and the fact there werent that many made. I think the going price these day for a well restored one is in the millions (Barrett-Jackson).

I don't know if I would say he is arrogant I would say he is most certainly conceded. I do accept both the B and the D as each very unique and each has their own individual identity. As for the rise in price of the Tucker the movie did have ALOT to do with the value because there are cars that are just as rare if not rarer that without publicity dont sell for millions once the tucker movie was produced people saw the movie and just HAD to have one. I have personally worked on a real tucker that was a complete and total wreck when a friend got it from his late fathers estate I helped with the body work and the welding on this car The original title for this Tucker has the sale date and price to my friends late father as being 09/22/81 and a sale price of 4,900 then the car sat for many years under a tarp. Because my friends father had a stroke in early 1983 and could not work on the car much if at all it sat for 25 years in the same spot before it was moved. The first sales after the movid ramped up and hit over 100,000 dollars within the first year after the movie.

Here is a photo of the car I worked on this photo is atleast 2 years old now. There is still alot that needs to be done to get this car back into shape.

http://i1091.photobucket.com/albums/i392/matt_vaq136/386432_342770649085855_2132061132_n_zps24af25a2.jp g

[Nicholas R]

As for the project Delorean I already have a motor that I want to put in it an american V-8 from the late 60's high nickle block with maybe 400hp something similar to the Pantera setup to give you an idea. As for pictures I am working on getting them and if it is something saveable I will post a good thread about it if not there will be a thread about it too. I can imagine after sitting for so long I would have to replace the interior and clean the frame up probably fix some rust and I know that the body will not be perfect but was told that the panels were saveable with tiny dings. Speaking of dings is there anywhere in the USA where they remove dings and regrain the stainless?

Now that's what I like to hear :biggrin:. Are you thinking about anything specific? With the Bricklin I assume you're pretty familiar with 60-70s Ford drivetrains. It's a tight fit in the back there but with the right modifications a V8 can fit. Also just in case you didn't know, the Pantera drivetrain sits opposite the DeLoreans. What I mean is the Pantera still has the transmission behind the engine, where the DeLorean has the transmission forward of the engine. I actually talked to a few Pantera guys recently at a carshow in Cincinnati. They said that they did believe the differential could be flipped in a ZF transmission so that it could be used in the reverse setup. I was glad because it's another option in case the LS1 overpowers the DeLorean transmission. Just something to consider.

Anyway, sorry to get off topic. :D

[Michael]

I don't know if I would say he is arrogant I would say he is most certainly conceded. I do accept both the B and the D as each very unique and each has their own individual identity. As for the rise in price of the Tucker the movie did have ALOT to do with the value because there are cars that are just as rare if not rarer that without publicity dont sell for millions once the tucker movie was produced people saw the movie and just HAD to have one. I have personally worked on a real tucker that was a complete and total wreck when a friend got it from his late fathers estate I helped with the body work and the welding on this car The original title for this Tucker has the sale date and price to my friends late father as being 09/22/81 and a sale price of 4,900 then the car sat for many years under a tarp. Because my friends father had a stroke in early 1983 and could not work on the car much if at all it sat for 25 years in the same spot before it was moved. The first sales after the movid ramped up and hit over 100,000 dollars within the first year after the movie.

Here is a photo of the car I worked on this photo is atleast 2 years old now. There is still alot that needs to be done to get this car back into shape.

http://i1091.photobucket.com/albums/i392/matt_vaq136/386432_342770649085855_2132061132_n_zps24af25a2.jp g

WOW, I have never seen a Tucker that wasn't anything short of flawless.

[adam_knox]

Hey grayghost,
Is there a forum you have going about this car's progress? If not, would you be willing to share a few pics and stories on a new thread in Open Discussion? Such a neat car, would love to hear about your work with it!

[grayghost]

Hey grayghost,
Is there a forum you have going about this car's progress? If not, would you be willing to share a few pics and stories on a new thread in Open Discussion? Such a neat car, would love to hear about your work with it!

My friend wants to keep the cars location a secret for obvious reasons he recently got a garage built after nearly 3 years at being at his new residence as far as I know he does not have a build thread going on anywhere that I am aware of. But I feel comfortable in saying some things about the car that I do know. We actually met at NAPA where I was living before I moved cross country I was asking about parts for a car and the guy behind the counter asked if it was for my Bricklin I said yes then this guy behind me asks a bit about it and I ask him if he would like to see it. Well we end up going back to my house and he sees the car and likes it he mentions that he has a car that I would not believe if I saw it so jokingly I say "what do you have a Tucker tucked away" to which he just smiles a cheshire cat grin. so I drive the 20 miles to his house and nearly crap my pants when I see the car as I was in the presence of a real Tucker.

The car was in shambles to say the least it looked as if it had been sitting in a swamp for decades with all of the rust but it was all there. The entire front of the car was rusted through like swiss cheese from where the hood is cut in half forward the car was mainly gone. I asked him if he wanted some help with the car and the tear down began I can actually say I cut up pieces of a tucker and threw them away because they were so bad. But there was enough to work from and using an english wheel and planishing hammer we recreated the front end of the car. The hood front was in rough shape and we actually had to cut the hood in 5 pieces and used hood pieces for other cars to recreate the factory look for the seams since we did not have a pullmax. There is surprisingly little bondo on any of the work we had done the metal finish on the work performed was nearly indiscernible from any factory stampings.

My friend has going as far as finding willing Tucker owners in rebuilds and asking to come cast engine parts we taught ourselves how to cast aluminumn parts through the internet and various forums the vast majority of the car is being hand made even with some minor lead work. But it is a Tucker so parts are rarer than most cars than I can think of right now. But the fabrication of the front end is what my part was with the car I was lucky to have the opportunity to work on this car for 9 months without a garage, getting sunburned, heat stroke, and working in nearly 10 degree weather. some of the "lost arts" as I like to call them such as leadding we had some real hotrod guys like Gene Winfield and Bill Hines is who we learned some of the lost arts through.

[adam_knox]

Wow, that is a fantastic stroke of luck! Man, sounds like you guys did a swell job on the hood. Glad to hear you could be a part of the restoration process, thanks for story!

[videobob]

I saw this too in the video from Videobob (I had to buy via an American, becasue VB does not like to sell to Europeans.. sorry could not resist)

Not sure what this is about?
You can buy my videos from my website or from eBay, as long as you are willing to pay the international priority shipping of $16 I will ship anywhere in the world. I would say at least 25% of my shipping is international.
Thanks.

[Kenny_Z]

Tuckers are very cool. You're lucky enough to have seen one let alone worked on one. I think I saw his sons or grandsons on an episode of Search and Restore while they assisted with the rebuild of a Hudson (another awesome car) and I think they said they were building one of his prototype drawings into a working car? Tucker was easily the da Vinci of the automobile era. I'd love to see what ideas are tucked away in one of his notebooks.

[Dangermouse]

t but was told that the panels were saveable with tiny dings. Speaking of dings is there anywhere in the USA where they remove dings and regrain the stainless?

Any of the DeLorean franchises can help you there (delorean.com for locations) or PJ Grady in NY. The "master" is a guy from England called Chris, and he comes over to the states occasionally when a local owners club organizes a group of cars with stainless needs (and it isn't possible to get the car to DMC).

Several owners do the regraining themselves, though.

[Michael]

You will forgive me for being dumb, but I would have thought that car in its present condition would still be worth six figures?

[SamHill]

Such a beautiful damn car.