Rear hub carrier removal?

[Jeff K]

How do I remove the rear hub carrier from the driveshaft? I've stripped it down, sans rotor. The front hub came off easy. I was hoping this would pull off the splined driveshaft.

Thanks
Jeff

[Jeff K]

Here is a pic of where I am at this. I used a puller to get the hub off. I'm guessing I need a puller to get the hub carrier off, but I didn't want to charge ahead and do damage. Although I'm replacing the bearings anyway.
16178

[DMCMW Dave]

You knock it out - a brass hammer or something similar (softer than the driveshaft). The inner bearing race will stay on the driveshaft, and you will have to get that off. And definitely replace the bearing at that point. The fun part is getting the bearing in and out.

PS - you do have the axle completely unbolted and out of the car, right? The way you asked the question I was not sure.

Other question is "why?". Is the bearing bad?

[SS Spoiler]

Gently heating up the alum. carrier allows the bearing to slip out easier. Before putting the bearing back in throw it in the freezer overnight, again gently heat up the carrier and the bearing will slide in with your fingers. Works great.

Paul Cerny
Kalispell, MT

[Jeff K]

You knock it out - a brass hammer or something similar (softer than the driveshaft). The inner bearing race will stay on the driveshaft, and you will have to get that off. And definitely replace the bearing at that point. The fun part is getting the bearing in and out.

PS - you do have the axle completely unbolted and out of the car, right? The way you asked the question I was not sure.

Other question is "why?". Is the bearing bad?

Ummm... ok.. I did not remove the axles, I was hoping I could slide it out without doing that. I see the bolts to remove it, is that pretty much it?

I'm doing that front end resto, and I decided to change all my bushings in the rear too. Pretty much ever single bushing/joint/bearing I took out of the suspension has been bad. I was the guy who sent you that UCA photo with that unusual dry rotted bushing.

Since I had all the stuff off the rear suspension pretty much, I figured why not change the bearings too. I get that rear end "clink" that people said on here is a loose/bad rear bearing anyway.

[DMCMW Dave]

--

Since I had all the stuff off the rear suspension pretty much, I figured why not change the bearings too. I get that rear end "clink" that people said on here is a loose/bad rear bearing anyway.

I asked because this is a relatively annoying job to do "just because".

I thought you might be thinking it came apart like modern front-driver axle splines. No such luck, it's all press-fit.

To remove the axles take all the bolts out that go to the hub flange THEN all the ones that hold the axle to the transmission flange. If you do it opposite order you'll swear a lot more. This is also a lot easier if you take the axles out before you remove the wheels so that you can lock it in gear and put on the emergency brake to keep the axles from turning. This isn't a huge issue with power tools but if you are using a hand ratchet it's a real issue.

Once the axles are out of the way you knock the spindle and about 1/2 the bearing out, then pull the bearing race out of the hub after removing the C-Clip. When you put it back together you will need some spacers to put the correct pressure in the right places. If you simply pound the axle shaft back through the bearing you will destroy the bearing.

As Paul mentioned - the bearing outer race is a press fit into the hub carrier as well, so it can be tricky to get out and back in without some specialized tools, especially with the hub carrier in the car. The hot/cold thing really works too.

[Delorean Industries]

If you are looking for an easy way out. Fully refurbished units from DPI. Includes all components either powder coated or plated. New bearing pressed into hub and stainless wheel adapter plate.
https://www.deloreanindustries.com/shop/parts/refurbished-components/rear-hub.html

[DMC5180]

I get that rear end "clink" that people said on here is a loose/bad rear bearing anyway.

FWIW: Rear end "clink" or CLUNK is not a sign of a bad bearing. (Howling would be). The Machined bore in the HUB with the snap ring retainer is slightly wider than the bearing which creates a gap. The click or clunk you here (usually backing up) is the bearing shifting in the hub.

[Jeff K]

Thanks everyone for all the good input.

Dave, Do I have to remove the axle from the transmission? Can I just disconnect it from the outdrive?

I have a good shop that does all my pressing, a real motor-heads place. Do I have to tell them anything special about pressing out/in the outdrive, & bearing?

[DMCMW Dave]

Dave, Do I have to remove the axle from the transmission? Can I just disconnect it from the outdrive?

I have a good shop that does all my pressing, a real motor-heads place. Do I have to tell them anything special about pressing out/in the outdrive, & bearing?

Yes. If you take ou the outer end bolts, the outer end will be captured in the hub carrier. You'll find this out if you try. Also you never want to let the axles hang in the car, it will damage the CV boot retainer.

As for the press work, there won't be a problem if they know what they are doing. If they don't they will screw up the bearing and/or crack the (irreplaceable) carrier. They need to properly support everything, and be aware of what is being pressed. For example when pressing the outdrive back in, they need to support against the inner race on the opposite side or the bearing will come apart. When they press the bearing in, they need to press on the outer race with even support of the carrier.

To such a shop this should look JUST LIKE replacing the rear bearings on a BMW.

Should all be obvious but . . . :jawdrop:

[Mark D]

I can attest that all of the advice that Dave has given in this thread is sound. (Not that anyone is doubting him :thumbup:)

I replaced the bearings in my rear hub carriers last year and had similar questions about pressing in and out. An air chisel worked wonders for getting the inner hub out from the carrier. That little dimple in the center of the shaft is perfectly set up for this tool and the shaft will come out with minimal issues. The air chisel also worked great for getting the inner race of the bearing off the shaft, and getting the outer race out of the hub.

To press everything in and out I purchased a bearing press kit from harbor freight:
http://www.harborfreight.com/fwd-front-wheel-bearing-adapters-66829.html

This kit includes all the various sizes of plates you'll need to properly press the new bearings in. You'll also probably want to go out and rent a ball joint press/removal kit from your local advance auto or auto zone that has a bunch of different sized metal sleeves that are helpful in the press.

I have step by step pictures that I took that I can post a little later on if anyone is interested.

[Ron]

I have step by step pictures that I took that I can post a little later on if anyone is interested.

Post em!!!

[Jeff K]

I can attest that all of the advice that Dave has given in this thread is sound. (Not that anyone is doubting him :thumbup:)

I replaced the bearings in my rear hub carriers last year and had similar questions about pressing in and out. An air chisel worked wonders for getting the inner hub out from the carrier. That little dimple in the center of the shaft is perfectly set up for this tool and the shaft will come out with minimal issues. The air chisel also worked great for getting the inner race of the bearing off the shaft, and getting the outer race out of the hub.

To press everything in and out I purchased a bearing press kit from harbor freight:
http://www.harborfreight.com/fwd-front-wheel-bearing-adapters-66829.html

This kit includes all the various sizes of plates you'll need to properly press the new bearings in. You'll also probably want to go out and rent a ball joint press/removal kit from your local advance auto or auto zone that has a bunch of different sized metal sleeves that are helpful in the press.

I have step by step pictures that I took that I can post a little later on if anyone is interested.

Thanks and yes, please post them!

[Mark D]

I'm missing pictures for a few of the early steps, but this is what I've got.

Let me also start by saying I was rebuilding the entire suspension so I had the hub carriers completely off the car. It would be much more difficult to do with them installed, and then you'd need a bearing puller tool. Also in all of these steps I used a thin coat of grease when reinstalling all the parts.

Here we go with the photos:

Hub carriers off the car w/ outer hub still intact. To remove the outer hub I supported the whole assembly by the outer hub on my work bench using a few blocks of wood. Then I used an air hammer/chisel to push down on the inner shaft and the whole works dropped out from underneath the outer hub.
http://dmctalk.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=16269&d=1360013443


The round machined center in the shaft is set up to receive a cone shaped attachement for your air hammer If you don't have an air hammer they're only 15 bucks a harbor freight.
http://dmctalk.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=16271&d=1360013444
http://dmctalk.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=16270&d=1360013443


Here's a photo with the outer hub off:
http://dmctalk.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=16291&d=1360013650


Next comes presing the inner shaft out of the bearings. I set the hub carrier on my bench top and use the air hammer again to push down on the shaft. The small blows from the air hammer are less likely to damage the hub than trying to put the whole thing in a press and push out the shaft. The abnormally shaped casting of the hub makes it dangerous to support from below without stressing areas that weren't designed for constant high pressure load you would see in a hydraulic press. Here's a photo showing the shafts pressed out of the carriers.
http://dmctalk.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=16272&d=1360013444


Note the shaft on the left shaft still has half of the bearing race pressed onto it. To get the race off the shaft you'll need the chisel attachment for your air hammer. I worked around in a circle from the sides being careful not to damage the shaft with the sharp chisel. Once you've got the race worked up the shaft slightly and there is a gap you can use blunt tools and work the race the rest of the way off.


At this point you will also have the outer race of the bearing stuck inside the hub carrier casting. To get the outer race out I supported it from below by stacking up some plates and metal sleeves from the ball joint press kit I had and pressed down on the circular outer face of the hub carrier. This part of the casting is strong enough to take the load of a press. Alternatively if you had a puller tool you could use it here also. Or use the same chisel method as before.

Here are the inner half shafts after sand blasting. I masked off the press fit surfaces during blasting and afterwards polished those surfaces by hand with a scotch brite pad. Both bearings have been pressed out of the hub carriers also at this point.
http://dmctalk.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=16273&d=1360013445


POR-15 on the half shafts.
http://dmctalk.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=16275&d=1360013447


Powder coated hub carriers...be sure to have the inner press fit surfaces masked off if you go this route.
http://dmctalk.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=16274&d=1360013447


Ready to install a new bearing. The black disc is one of the parts that comes in the bearing puller kit I linked to above in my previous post.
http://dmctalk.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=16276&d=1360013449


I used an air hammer to install the new bearing. In this pic the black disc is larger in diameter than the bearing.... I worked it half way down into the carrier, and then when the bearing was flush with the outer surface I switched to a different disc that was slightly smaller in diameter than the bearing but was still large enough to be only resting on the outer race of the bearing. You do not want to press on the inner race or you'll separate the bearing in half and then you'll need to go buy a new one.
http://dmctalk.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=16277&d=1360013452
http://dmctalk.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=16278&d=1360013455


Bearing installed with new circlip. (Note: go buy yourself a nice set of snap ring pliars. Spend at least 25 bucks on a good set. It'll be worth the savings in frustration)
http://dmctalk.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=16279&d=1360013458


Ready to install the half shaft and hub.
http://dmctalk.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=16280&d=1360013461


To install the shaft I set up the press with a sleeve that was approximately the diameter of the inner bearing race. Here you want to support by the inner race only.
http://dmctalk.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=16281&d=1360013463
http://dmctalk.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=16282&d=1360013467
http://dmctalk.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=16283&d=1360013471
http://dmctalk.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=16285&d=1360013478
http://dmctalk.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=16284&d=1360013475


I had my outer hubs plated in yellow zinc so they also needed to be pressed on. If your old ones are loose enough you may be able to just slip them on.
http://dmctalk.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=16286&d=1360013482


I set up the press with a large sleeve to support the half shaft from below. Then used a hollow ball joint cup to push down on the hub.
http://dmctalk.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=16287&d=1360013485
http://dmctalk.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=16289&d=1360013492


And I added some extra grease on the spines to keep them rust free.
http://dmctalk.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=16290&d=1360013496


aaaaand....Done
http://dmctalk.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=16268&d=1360013440

[Morpheus]

Wow. Great work and beautiful pics! Well Done!

[Jeff K]

Thank you Mark for that great post. I got the air hammer today.. I'll post my results!

I appreciate everyone's input as well
Jeff

[Jeff K]

Ok, I got the outer hub off.. but the air hammer will not budge the out-drive at all. How hard do I push or lean on it? I'm afraid to break the carrier.

[Mark D]

I had to lean into mine pretty good with the air hammer to get the shafts to break free from the bearings. One was rusted in there and I spent a good 10 minutes going in bursts trying to bust it loose. Eventually the bearing will fail and separate from behind, splitting the bearing into two halves. The lower half of the inner bearing race will stay stuck on the outdrive shaft and you'll have to carefully chisel between the two pieces to break the inner race free. Then switch to a more blunt attachment for your chisel and work it the rest of the way off the shaft. Or insert some C shaped plates (like some large washers cut in half) in the gap you've opened up and use a hydraulic press to push the inner race the rest of the way off.

Working on your bench top with an air hammer isn't going to exert nearly the forces you'd see in a press...I wouldn't be too worried about breaking anything with the air hammer method. The hub carriers are strong parts but awkwardly shaped. The way they would be supported in a press isn't ideal because all of the load would be concentrated at the outer extremities. If there were a good way to support it more towards the center then it would be less of an issue.

Using an air hammer works just as well as a press though. Just spray on some penetrating oil on the bearings and let it sit for a while and then come back and try again. A little heat from a torch will help as well... Eventually the parts will come loose.

[BABIS]

very nice work!

[Jeff K]

I guess I gave up too early Mark. After leaning on it and trying for a few minutes, I figured it was out of my scope.

I took it to my local parts/machine shop. These guys are the real deal. My friend there picked it up, turned it over (outdrive facing the floor)

He smacked it twice on the carpeted floor and it popped right out! Maybe the air hammer did weaken it enough, but we got it out!

What you did to yours is great, I might have to plagiarize your rear hub resto!

Jeff

[Mark D]

Success! Glad to hear you got it separated. and thanks for the compliments on my hub carrier restoration... while it's not 100% factory original with the powder coat and zinc plating it should give years of corrosion protection and keep it looking nice. If I really wanted the hubs to look that dull black/grey color from the factory I guess I could always paint them. I also considered clear coating the aluminum carriers but just couldn't get them as clean as the silver powder coat looks.