Toll both windows not working?

[FLYBOY]

Question--does anyone have any ideas on what to check for. Both my windows stopped working all the sudden (fuse is good) and both have power at least to the switches because they are illimunated (the led kind)?
At first it blew the #11 fuse twice each time I tried to roll down the driver window-each time I replaced it, and now the fuse is still good but neither window moves( ALL other fuses are good especially the #10 which I think controls the window motors.
Just thought I'ld throw that out there before I start to get into it this week. Hopefully it's not a big deal!
Thx

[Ron]

Fuse 10 is for the AC and Door Lock Lamps.
Fuse 11 is for the windows (and other things...).
Check the wires at the switches for shorts etc, they are notorious for causing problems.

(Check out the Resources Section (http://dmctalk.org/forumdisplay.php?5-Resources) for most any schematic you may need... )

[FLYBOY]

ill check it out tomorrow and see what happens????
:facepalm:

[mluder]

Question--does anyone have any ideas on what to check for. Both my windows stopped working all the sudden (fuse is good) and both have power at least to the switches because they are illimunated (the led kind)?
At first it blew the #11 fuse twice each time I tried to roll down the driver window-each time I replaced it, and now the fuse is still good but neither window moves( ALL other fuses are good especially the #10 which I think controls the window motors.
Just thought I'ld throw that out there before I start to get into it this week. Hopefully it's not a big deal!
Thx

Pull the switches from the console.
Disconnect the plug and make sure you are getting 12 volts from the wiring.
Check for continuity in the switches themselves.

If those both check out then its either in the door or somewhere in between. You'll want to check for electrical at the motor and that means getting into the door.
Could also be your motors have seized.

Cheers
Steven

[FLYBOY]

Probably a stupid question but could the window motors seize due to the cold. Because I recently moved from South Fl. to Snowy, Western North Carolina.
Thats about the only thing thats changed because I really havent driven it yet.

[mluder]

Probably a stupid question but could the window motors seize due to the cold. Because I recently moved from South Fl. to Snowy, Western North Carolina.
Thats about the only thing thats changed because I really havent driven it yet.

It's possible that there is water that got down inside the mechanism and froze. Kinda depends on a lot.

You can always remove the door cards and take a look at the condition.

Cheers
Steve

[Ron]

Probably a stupid question but could the window motors seize due to the cold. Because I recently moved from South Fl. to Snowy, Western North Carolina.
Thats about the only thing thats changed because I really havent driven it yet.
After following mluder's suggestions to check for power, refer to the following schematic and remove a pair of wires going to one of the windows (eg Slate/Purple and Slate/Green for Drivers Side). Apply 12V to them (I'd just get it right off of the battery with some jumpers). Do this briefly in case the motor has already been ran as far as it will go in one direction. If it has, the motor will not run and there will be a heavy spark, so you should reverse the wires. If you reverse the wires and get the same result, the motor is probably froze up, seized by other parts, or there is a dead short on one of the two wires (try them one at a time with 12v (+) ).

http://dmctalk.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=101&d=1306264526

[FLYBOY]

Wow thanks alot, guys I appreciate it.
I'll try that this weekend.
with that info. I should get my answer.
I'll keep you posted!

[FLYBOY]

Still haven't got to deep into it but it keeps blowing the #10 fuse, when that fuse does blow the led swiches no longer light up (not the # 11 fuse)?
There is power to pax side green/white but not on the other side and neither window moves when then fuse is replaced.
New Swicthes LEDs and they do click, I'll still got to devote move time to it but that's what's going on so far!

[Ron]

In your OP you said it was fuse 11 that was blowing, now 10...did this change or ???

Are you sure it is a Green/White wire, not a Light Green/White wire?

You have to be particularly careful with wire descriptions here because they chose to come off of fuse 9, 10 and 11
with a Light Green/White wire...:swear1:

Do the switch lights still burn when the fuse is blown?

[FLYBOY]

At first the #11 fuse the one above the #10 (both blew)but that has not happen since then and I have been working at it for awhile. The fuse that's blows is the lower middle- I think it's#10. I just don't have the diagram in front of me(out of town)
Anyway upon more research both light green/white wires to the swicthes (there's only one) to each swicth anyway, right at the swicth have power to the Swicthes and when the fuse does blow, the LEDs on the Swicthes go out, but thats only went I Move the pax switch around.
Also I have given all four wires power directly from the battery(one at time) and they just spark (no movement fron the windows)-with the wires still connected-
(slate/green, slate/purple, slate/red, slate/blue.
What is weird is when a touch a test light to those wires and hit the switch the test light goes out just while I hold the switch almost like its grounding itself out-is that normal?-power from battery
I still have to disconnect the wires to see if I'm getting 12v, I just haven't had enough time, but even giving them 12v from the battery I get no response so that should not really matter, right?
Any thoughts?
Thx

[FLYBOY]

Okay so far I looked into the window problem not working and this is what I found.
There is power to the center light green/white wire on both Swicthes and when I press either swicth up or down there is power on the that particular wire wheather it be slate/blue-slate/red-or slate/purple-slate/green one at time of coarse. So I now know the problem is not at the Swicthes but it still blows the#11 fuse if I monkey around with the pax swicth swicth and in mine car the wires are reversed even at the door-pax side is Slate/purple and slate/green.
But that's no big deal.
So I tested the wires on the driver door, behind the door card Slate/blue no response with 12v power-just gets hot and sparks however when I do the same with the slate/red the driver window goes down slowly- I think that motor was going bad because it started working slowing a few months ago but the pax side always was very powerful.
Not working now.
Unfortunately I can't tell much more on the pax side side because the fuse blows so often.
Any ideas? I don't think it's the motors but where to look for a short or break.
I can't believe it would be effecting all four wires on where to look?

THX

[mluder]

Best Guess - if you've applied straight 12v to the window motors and they aren't moving then they are probably siezed and need to be replaced.

Cheers
Steven

[Ron]

+1 (assuming you disconnected them from the rest of the wiring...and other parts aren't binding).

[FLYBOY]

One window goes down when 12V apllied but not up, havn't tried the pax window yet but, Hopefully I can get to the bottom of this at the tech day on the 20th in N.C
Because this is one I can't figure out, it's got me stumped
If I can get out of work

[mluder]

One window goes down when 12V apllied but not up, havn't tried the pax window yet but, Hopefully I can get to the bottom of this at the tech day on the 20th in N.C
Because this is one I can't figure out, it's got me stumped
If I can get out of work

OK... You did reverse the polarity on the battery to test the working one in the opposite direction right?

Not judging - Just making sure.

Cheers
Steve

[FLYBOY]

OK... You did reverse the polarity on the battery to test the working one in the opposite direction right?

Not judging - Just making sure.

Cheers
Steve

I applied 12V from the battery (good12V) to the slate/red I think? And the window goes down the other slate/blue nothing happens just sparks wire gets hot.
Did I do that right?
Not really sure what you mean by the question, could you word it in a different way?

[Ron]

To test the motor only, disconnect all wires going to it, then use two test wires to feed it with right off of the battery +/-. It should try to run in one direction -- Then swap the two feed wires around to check the other direction.

[beernpizzalover]

I had mine quit working recently, too. The driver's side is stuck in the down position; have not tried the passenger side, yet.
So I'm curious about your problem resolution here, as well.

[FLYBOY]

To do that test, do I have to take off the BOTTOM
Panel too, on the Door, I hope not!
Let me know, if so then got to do it I guess.
I've done it so many time in the past, it's
Just not fun!

[DMCMW Dave]

To do that test, do I have to take off the BOTTOM
Panel too, on the Door, I hope not!
Let me know, if so then got to do it I guess.
I've done it so many time in the past, it's
Just not fun!

Yes.

[FLYBOY]

Yes.

Okay finally got into the driver door Today for the window that does not go up or down(haven't tried the Pax yet)
But I disconnected both wires going to the motor and applied a direct wire from the battery and nothing happens, I guess I was not doing it wrong because if I leave one wire hooked up to the motor I.e slate/blue and I apply 12V from the battery the window works in one direction if I reverse the wires then it works in the other direction. Before that the window worked slowly last month and now not at all. But now I know it's not the motor, it is strong and I had extra window switches same result no movement so it's not the switchers either, there must be a short somewhere because neither window works.
Any ideas where to go from here?
Unfortunately now I have more questions than answered but at least I know my motor is good and I'm sure it probably is on the Pax as well? Odds are anyway.

[FLYBOY]

Okay got the driver window working at Darren's Tech Session
Problem was I had a remote hooked up to it up and down and as
Soon as I disconnected it it works fine probably a relay went bad.
But honestly I never really used the remote window anyway.
As far as the Pax side it looks like the motor is bad. So I have to test
It first.
So that's that odd all of the sudden but that comes with owning.

[David T]

If you have non-original wiring mods there is no way we can offer advice except to suggest it be removed, especially if it isn't working. The original circuit has no relays. If you test the motor and it works then the problem is obviously in the wiring. A good approach would be to remove any changes, get the windows working, and then decide if you want to put the mod back (assuming you can make the mod work of course!).
David Teitelbaum

[FLYBOY]

If you have non-original wiring mods there is no way we can offer advice except to suggest it be removed, especially if it isn't working. The original circuit has no relays. If you test the motor and it works then the problem is obviously in the wiring. A good approach would be to remove any changes, get the windows working, and then decide if you want to put the mod back (assuming you can make the mod work of course!).
David Teitelbaum

Yes I do realize that of coarse. I never would never of thought
To check the one remote window because I never even touched the
Car since it started to not work and that has Nothing to do with the
Passenger side which still does not work and has no mod attached to it at all.
So why would a mod. on one side only, stop both windows from working at all.
It wouldn't! and that's why I never bothered to look at it.
Lesson leaned...
Just one of those crazy things that's unrelated, combination bad motor on
one side and the other bad wire/relay in the mod. on the other.

[FLYBOY]

Issue resolved
Pax side window is good took it out and it ran both ways with 12v power applied
Not sure why it would not in the car.
Anyway the window switch is bad even though its the new
Led Houston type-the first thing I did was switch the switches and that
Didn't matter but Now it does and Every thing is working great.
Just have to order a new switch, or have Dave Mckeen fix it?
Hope this helps and thx to all who gave their input!

[Dangermouse]

You had a remote for the window operation? Seems an odd thing to have.

[FLYBOY]

You had a remote for the window operation? Seems an odd thing to have.

Yeap, one might say I have a lot of odd little things like that on the car.
Don't really drive it just tinker on it for fun!