The Deep and Timeless VOD: Questions from a novice

[AugustneverEnds]

Alright last night I scored the most important accomplishment in my short DeLorean ownership (besides getting the car) I removed all of the fuel mix unit, idle speed motor, CSV etc... to gain access to the intake manifold :cheers: The only snafu I hit was the rapidly dropping temperatures in the garage and the two 11mm bolts on the drivers side.17751

Will a wobble socket help to gain a firmer grip on these? Or is there something else I should try?

I plan to clean the engine valley, replace the leaking water hoses, inspect the y-pipe, replace the sensors in the pipe, and paint the intake manifold which leads to my next question. The fuel mix unit is pretty dirty and, as everyone knows, quite visible. Is it worth the effort to paint it or should I just get it as clean as possible and nod and say I did? 17752

Thank you for all of your help in advance. Also major props to the intake manifold removal guide here and to whomever recommended Loctite Freeze and Release :thumbup:

[sdg3205]

A long extension should be sufficient to carefully remove those 11mm bolts.

You can paint the mixture assembly if you like. It's a lot of careful prep. Cleaning with degreaser and brushes works well followed by acetone and rags. For distributor, gentle cleaning and hand paint it with black por15. Mask it well if you spray bomb the metering assembly.

[mluder]

Alright last night I scored the most important accomplishment in my short DeLorean ownership (besides getting the car) I removed all of the fuel mix unit, idle speed motor, CSV etc... to gain access to the intake manifold :cheers: The only snafu I hit was the rapidly dropping temperatures in the garage and the two 11mm bolts on the drivers side.17751

Will a wobble socket help to gain a firmer grip on these? Or is there something else I should try?

I plan to clean the engine valley, replace the leaking water hoses, inspect the y-pipe, replace the sensors in the pipe, and paint the intake manifold which leads to my next question. The fuel mix unit is pretty dirty and, as everyone knows, quite visible. Is it worth the effort to paint it or should I just get it as clean as possible and nod and say I did? 17752

Thank you for all of your help in advance. Also major props to the intake manifold removal guide here and to whomever recommended Loctite Freeze and Release :thumbup:

I Painted mine - It makes a uge difference but be careful. Use a high temp paint that cures with heat and even then you have to be careful about getting fuel on it - At least in the first few days. I found out the hard way. After getting everything back together I had a fuel spray and it ate right throught the paint. I had to take it all apart again and re-spray.

Cheers
Steven

[AugustneverEnds]

Thanks gentlemen. I picked up some high temperature engine paint today. Still haven't got the last two bolts. :mallet: I tried a 10" extension to clear the sides of the intake but I can't get a straight lock on them and I don't want to file 'em down. Will heating them up and giving them a tap be of any benefit? Drill? I'm open to any suggestions

[David T]

Try either a universal joint or a flex socket.
David Teitelbaum

[mluder]

Thanks gentlemen. I picked up some high temperature engine paint today. Still haven't got the last two bolts. :mallet: I tried a 10" extension to clear the sides of the intake but I can't get a straight lock on them and I don't want to file 'em down. Will heating them up and giving them a tap be of any benefit? Drill? I'm open to any suggestions

I assume you started with a generous soak of penetrating fluid? Don't use WD40 but any of the others are good. Blast it with spary.. let it sit. Come back in an hour or two and spray it again. Maybe let it soak over night.

If you still can't get it you could try heat.

If I recall correctly, I had to use two extensions that each had the "universal joint" tip to allow the offset to reach around the manifold.

Drilling sould always be the last resort

Cheers
Steve

[AugustneverEnds]

I assume you started with a generous soak of penetrating fluid? Don't use WD40 but any of the others are good. Blast it with spary.. let it sit. Come back in an hour or two and spray it again. Maybe let it soak over night.

If you still can't get it you could try heat.

If I recall correctly, I had to use two extensions that each had the "universal joint" tip to allow the offset to reach around the manifold.

Drilling sould always be the last resort

Cheers
Steve

So far I have used Loctite Freeze and Release. I have some PB Blaster sitting around so might as well throw some on. I'm just going to let it sit and soak tonight. We'll see what happens tomorrow. Thanks again all :)

[Nicholas R]

If you can, try using 1/4" drive sockets and extensions (as long as they're not ridiculously tight). I've removed those 4 M7 bolts without even removing the mixture unit before by using 1/4" drive sockets and long extensions. One time on the morning of a parade I had to replace the big hose on the back of the water pump that goes to the y pipe. Pretty much removed those 4 bolts and moved a few other things and was able to push the entire intake assembly forward enough to access the hose.

[jmettee]

Spraying the HEAD of a bolt will to little to nothing to loosen it since its difficult for anything to get down in the threads. If you see any openings, try getting some WD40 or better yet, Liquid Wrench into the opening to reach the threads. I've never been impressed with PB Blaster & still wonder why people recommend it. Take a look here at some other options: http://rivperformance.editboard.com/t7128-penetrating-oil-comparison-test

When I took my intake off for the first time, 1 of those 4 bolts were seized in the engine. I would say heat is your best friend here as you probably can't get penetrating oil onto the threads. Hit it with a propane torch to heat it up & then try to remove it. Try to "shock" it loose by using a combination wrench & some taps with a hammer (i.e. like a mini impact wrench) which is better than just wrenching on it harder & harder until it snaps.

Worst case scenario is you are going to break the bolt. If you do, get a Dremel so you can operate carefully on the bolt & prepare to drill it out. When mine broke, it was my first time having to deal with a broken stud in aluminum. Also my first time with a Dremel. A lot was learned & I can't believe how useful a Dremel was. Also, so NOT try EZ-Outs....they will just break & make a bigger mess (ask me how I know!).

[AugustneverEnds]

If you can, try using 1/4" drive sockets and extensions (as long as they're not ridiculously tight). I've removed those 4 M7 bolts without even removing the mixture unit before by using 1/4" drive sockets and long extensions. One time on the morning of a parade I had to replace the big hose on the back of the water pump that goes to the y pipe. Pretty much removed those 4 bolts and moved a few other things and was able to push the entire intake assembly forward enough to access the hose.

Damn, you're the Harry Houdini of PRVs :thumbup2: Thanks for the info

[AugustneverEnds]

Spraying the HEAD of a bolt will to little to nothing to loosen it since its difficult for anything to get down in the threads. If you see any openings, try getting some WD40 or better yet, Liquid Wrench into the opening to reach the threads. I've never been impressed with PB Blaster & still wonder why people recommend it. Take a look here at some other options: http://rivperformance.editboard.com/t7128-penetrating-oil-comparison-test

When I took my intake off for the first time, 1 of those 4 bolts were seized in the engine. I would say heat is your best friend here as you probably can't get penetrating oil onto the threads. Hit it with a propane torch to heat it up & then try to remove it. Try to "shock" it loose by using a combination wrench & some taps with a hammer (i.e. like a mini impact wrench) which is better than just wrenching on it harder & harder until it snaps.

Worst case scenario is you are going to break the bolt. If you do, get a Dremel so you can operate carefully on the bolt & prepare to drill it out. When mine broke, it was my first time having to deal with a broken stud in aluminum. Also my first time with a Dremel. A lot was learned & I can't believe how useful a Dremel was. Also, so NOT try EZ-Outs....they will just break & make a bigger mess (ask me how I know!).

Yeah, I've never heard of any raving endorsements for EZ-Outs. The plan is to put the torch on it tonight and if that fails bring out the Dremel; don't want to but we do what we have to :bang: thanks

[kings1527]

Alright last night I scored the most important accomplishment in my short DeLorean ownership (besides getting the car) I removed all of the fuel mix unit, idle speed motor, CSV etc... to gain access to the intake manifold :cheers: The only snafu I hit was the rapidly dropping temperatures in the garage and the two 11mm bolts on the drivers side.17751

Will a wobble socket help to gain a firmer grip on these? Or is there something else I should try?

I plan to clean the engine valley, replace the leaking water hoses, inspect the y-pipe, replace the sensors in the pipe, and paint the intake manifold which leads to my next question. The fuel mix unit is pretty dirty and, as everyone knows, quite visible. Is it worth the effort to paint it or should I just get it as clean as possible and nod and say I did? 17752

Thank you for all of your help in advance. Also major props to the intake manifold removal guide here and to whomever recommended Loctite Freeze and Release :thumbup:

Congrats on the VOD! That's a huge accomplishment!

I did the exact same thing you're doing last summer and the results came out great! I chronicled the whole thing on my blog. I don't remember having a tough time with the four bolts that mount the intake to the engine and I don't even remember using a universal joint. I think I just used a 3/8" drive wobble extension and a regular socket. The angle was offset a little bit and it took a gentle amount of pressure to get it on there and everything was fine.

Oh, and I love Break Free. That stuff works the best for me to remove anything rusted.

[AugustneverEnds]

Congrats on the VOD! That's a huge accomplishment!

I did the exact same thing you're doing last summer and the results came out great! I chronicled the whole thing on my blog. I don't remember having a tough time with the four bolts that mount the intake to the engine and I don't even remember using a universal joint. I think I just used a 3/8" drive wobble extension and a regular socket. The angle was offset a little bit and it took a gentle amount of pressure to get it on there and everything was fine.

Oh, and I love Break Free. That stuff works the best for me to remove anything rusted.

Thank you! You have put together an excellent blog too.

Status update: Heating and tapping failed so the drill was deployed. Drilled through the bolts but the intake still will not move. I have used the intake manifold removal guide from this forum. It doesn't mention anything about the intake being difficult to remove once the bolts are off. Is this normal or not? Will whacking it upwards help free it? Thank you for all assistance - Nick

[Bitsyncmaster]

Thank you! You have put together an excellent blog too.

Status update: Heating and tapping failed so the drill was deployed. Drilled through the bolts but the intake still will not move. I have used the intake manifold removal guide from this forum. It doesn't mention anything about the intake being difficult to remove once the bolts are off. Is this normal or not? Will whacking it upwards help free it? Thank you for all assistance - Nick

From memory, you would have to drill all the shank off the bolts. The intake is V shaped so it cannot have any bolt shanks there to remove it.

[kings1527]

Thank you! You have put together an excellent blog too.

Status update: Heating and tapping failed so the drill was deployed. Drilled through the bolts but the intake still will not move. I have used the intake manifold removal guide from this forum. It doesn't mention anything about the intake being difficult to remove once the bolts are off. Is this normal or not? Will whacking it upwards help free it? Thank you for all assistance - Nick

I've never heard of those bolts being that hard to remove. Particularly since those bolts don't come into contact with coolant or anything else corrosive, under normal circumstances. Mine took all of about 2 minutes to unfasten.

After the bolts are out, the intake lifts right out (as you snake it around the wiring harness). Since you're drilling now, you might have to re-tap the holes.

[AugustneverEnds]

I've never heard of those bolts being that hard to remove. Particularly since those bolts don't come into contact with coolant or anything else corrosive, under normal circumstances. Mine took all of about 2 minutes to unfasten.

After the bolts are out, the intake lifts right out (as you snake it around the wiring harness). Since you're drilling now, you might have to re-tap the holes.

Well the intake is free now. Had to cut off the bolt heads and drill. I think I surprised myself with how many curses I can mutter in a five minute stretch! Also I needed to use a crow bar to get some leverage to get the intake to make the initial movement. My passenger side bolts took all of two minutes but the driver side must have been overtorqued or something in the past. Probably will use a helicoil to fix the driver side holes. Pics to follow...

[AugustneverEnds]

178651786617867

Well I've got a VOD to clean, broken bolts to remove, hoses to replace and (probably will since I'm here) a water pump to swap out. Hoping the water pump bolts will be easier to deal with. What water pump kit does everyone recommend? I already bought new W-pipe gaskets, o-rings, silicone water pump hoses, thermostat, a heater valve and some other odds and ends. Haven't made any progress as the weather around here has swung back to winter mode :ehh: At least cleaned up the mixture unit

[AugustneverEnds]

A few more progress shots:1812218123

Added the water pump to my to-do list and an inspection of the rear portion of the frame.

[jawn101]

If you're doing the water pump, this is a great time to replace that OEM header bottle since you'll have to open and flush the cooling system anyway :)

[krs09]

178651786617867

Well I've got a VOD to clean, broken bolts to remove, hoses to replace and (probably will since I'm here) a water pump to swap out. Hoping the water pump bolts will be easier to deal with. What water pump kit does everyone recommend? I already bought new W-pipe gaskets, o-rings, silicone water pump hoses, thermostat, a heater valve and some other odds and ends. Haven't made any progress as the weather around here has swung back to winter mode :ehh: At least cleaned up the mixture unit

Im just getting done doing the same thing. My intake bolts were fine but watch out for the water pump bolts , 2 of mine snapped off and had to drill. I would try to use time-serts to repair the threads. Helicoil is a temp fix, next time you go in there is a good chance the helicoil will come out with the bolt. Time-serts seem hard but they are pretty easy and permenent. I also would use some anti seize on those bolts when they go back in. Got my water pump from SpecialT and so far so good.

[AugustneverEnds]

Im just getting done doing the same thing. My intake bolts were fine but watch out for the water pump bolts , 2 of mine snapped off and had to drill. I would try to use time-serts to repair the threads. Helicoil is a temp fix, next time you go in there is a good chance the helicoil will come out with the bolt. Time-serts seem hard but they are pretty easy and permenent. I also would use some anti seize on those bolts when they go back in. Got my water pump from SpecialT and so far so good.

Thanks for the advice. I ordered time-serts from amazon.com after some more research. Also, I finally stopped being a cheap SOB long enough to buy an impact wrench last week. Already it's one of my favourite tools after it removed the Y-pipe bolts intact, after my attempts with my hand socket failed. Since I have owned the DeLorean and been working on it anti-seize has become the closest thing to religion I have :wink: Really glad to hear the SpecialT pump is working for you. I ordered one and I am waiting on it. Did you go for the whole installation kit or just the pump? If you got the kit, was everything there as advertised? So far my purchases from Mr. Hervey have all gone well.

[AugustneverEnds]

If you're doing the water pump, this is a great time to replace that OEM header bottle since you'll have to open and flush the cooling system anyway :)

But I actually like the plastic bottle. Does anyone know if any vendors make a better quality repro bottle? I heard a rumor somewhere that DMCFL might be making a batch. Any truth to this?

[jawn101]

But I actually like the plastic bottle. Does anyone know if any vendors make a better quality repro bottle? I heard a rumor somewhere that DMCFL might be making a batch. Any truth to this?

Houston does if you call them, apparently... but it's still plastic.

Read over this thread for advice from lots of folks, including Dave at DMCMW as to why the stainless bottles are superior. http://dmctalk.org/showthread.php?3602-Coolant-Reservoir-Repair

[krs09]

Thanks for the advice. I ordered time-serts from amazon.com after some more research. Also, I finally stopped being a cheap SOB long enough to buy an impact wrench last week. Already it's one of my favourite tools after it removed the Y-pipe bolts intact, after my attempts with my hand socket failed. Since I have owned the DeLorean and been working on it anti-seize has become the closest thing to religion I have :wink: Really glad to hear the SpecialT pump is working for you. I ordered one and I am waiting on it. Did you go for the whole installation kit or just the pump? If you got the kit, was everything there as advertised? So far my purchases from Mr. Hervey have all gone well.

I went for the whole kit. The hardware was great but I was a little iffy on the gasket so I ordered that from DMCH. Fit like a glove.

[AugustneverEnds]

Hey all, I have an update and yet another question. I received the water pump I ordered from SpecialT and in preparation I cleaned the VOD as best as I could. I removed the Y-pipe and the label I attached to the left most vacuum hose fell off. Where does this go again? Thanks and here's a pic for reference18552

Again the hose to the left on the vacuum pivot switch is the one I'm trying to remember what it connects to. Cheers

[AugustneverEnds]

DUHHH!!!! There is the vacuum hose routing diagram on the engine cover!!! And it says the line goes to the distributor advance solenoid... :blush: Sometimes I think my car is making me lose what few marbles I have left...