Windshield replacement in two weeks....

[82DMC12]

Hey everyone,

Long time no posts...

So I made the move to Kansas City from Fargo, ND. I'm in Overland Park, to be exact. On April 19 I am flying into Fargo so I can get my D out of winter storage, then drive it 700 miles back to KC on Sunday April 21.

The big problem is this - when I put it away in October last year, I put it away with a cracked windshield, all the windshield trim removed, center headliners removed, center console out, and T-panel removed. I didn't have enough time in the fall to install my new windshield which is still boxed up. At the time, I had no idea I would be moving so it didn't seem like a big deal. Now I have exactly 2 days available to get the new windshield in and put the roof back together.

I plan to remove the windshield myself - no problem. Questions -

1. What will I find under the glass? Will the old adhesive be difficult to remove? What are the pitfalls and what tools will I need?
2. If I hire Safelite to come and do the actual glass install, are there any special precautions that are different from other cars? What will I need to inform them about when making the appointment?
3. Is there a danger of ripping the A-pillar trim?
4. I know it is advised to "jack up" the roof. That is why I removed the center console. I'm not sure exactly how to do this. Anyone have any pics or further information?
5. Which adhesive to use, what size bead, etc? Is this a no-brainer for Safelite or do I have to guide them?
6. One issue I had in the past was some water coming into the front headliner. It was not from wicking and I doubt the fiberglass is cracked. I heard it can come in under the stainless strip? What precautions to take, how can I fix this??

Any other tips would be great! I really need this done right the first time so I can get the car home!

Will take pics when I get the job underway!

Andy

[dmc6960]

I plan to remove the windshield myself - no problem.

Actually I found this to be the most difficult part of my windshield replacement. I even had the special air-powered windshield cutter-outer. The blades weren't perfect though which may have attributed to its difficulty. I would suggest having the glass company do this as well since this is all part of the standard install.


1. What will I find under the glass? Will the old adhesive be difficult to remove? What are the pitfalls and what tools will I need?
You will find leftover adhesive with spider-cracked fiberglass underneath. Some glass shops dont remove all the old adhesive with the concept that there is less chance for damage to the car (nick the paint, and it could start rusting there compromising integrity). Some of the old adhesive will be very difficult to remove. Have lacquer thinner and gloves.


2. If I hire Safelite to come and do the actual glass install, are there any special precautions that are different from other cars? What will I need to inform them about when making the appointment?
Couldn't tell you this first hand as I did my own windshield. But I would tell them you would like to assist with any DeLorean-centric parts of the installation. Dont tell them you have all the trim already removed unless they ask about it first, let that be a pleasant surprise.


3. Is there a danger of ripping the A-pillar trim?
Yes, that is a real possibility. Small rips will be hidden by the urethane and trim, large ones will be visible. I chose not to replace mine because I didn't want to spend the money, and I didn't realize how visible it would be after the new install. Hindsight here is 20/20. The new UV/IR windshield doesn't have a built-in black strip around the edges to hide anything. I'm unsure if the new standard windshields do. I'm still pondering exactly how I should go about hiding the imperfections, which are now visible both inside and outside the car.


4. I know it is advised to "jack up" the roof. That is why I removed the center console. I'm not sure exactly how to do this. Anyone have any pics or further information?
This isn't 100% necessary, and if you do it it may jack up your door alignment. Lay the new glass over the car before you do any cleaning prep to either surface. Look at the top middle and see if there is a gap. If its large, I would jack the roof as that would be a large area that may not seal properly (also likely where your current leak is coming from, MANY cars have this leak). If its less than 1/2" I'd probably leave it alone and just make sure the urethane bead there is a little thicker. I believe mine was closer to 3/4". To jack my roof, I used a few small 2x4s and the scissor jack out of my daily driver. I didn't close the cap completely, but I did reduce it to about 1/4". I operated the jack solely by hand, and did NOT use the large crank handle on it. After you do all this, then remove the new glass and prep both surfaces.


5. Which adhesive to use, what size bead, etc? Is this a no-brainer for Safelite or do I have to guide them?
Safelite will use a urethane windshield adhesive. Probably 3M 08690 or similar. Since they are auto glass installers, they should already know about the proper bead, and applying primer.


6. One issue I had in the past was some water coming into the front headliner. It was not from wicking and I doubt the fiberglass is cracked. I heard it can come in under the stainless strip? What precautions to take, how can I fix this??
The leak was likely the old urethane letting go of the windshield as the roof sagged. You will want to put silicone sealant in every screw hole though when you reattach all the trim pieces. Also concerning cracked fiberglass... I did have that on my car when I bought it near the drivers side corner around the inner weather seal lip. Someone previously used it to assist in getting out of the car. Not a good place to pull all of your weight on. It was a very thin crack and I only found its exact spot by driving the car in pouring rain without the headliner on.


Any other tips would be great! I really need this done right the first time so I can get the car home!
Get the install done as early as possible, and wait as long as possible to drive the car after its installed. Have the windows already rolled down before the install and immediately after make sure the doors are shut and you leave the car alone for a day. This is probably less important if you jacked the roof, but should still be done.

Good luck!

[82DMC12]

Hi Jim!

So on the A-pillars, if I understand correctly. the front edge of the A-pillar trim is glued to the front face of the body, and then the windshield is glued on top of the A-pillar trim? And the A-pillars are attached to the interior with fir-tree clips?

Perhaps I should just order two A pillars and have them on hand in case things go awry.

When removing the old adhesive you said you used lacquer thinner. Did that soften things up pretty well so that it could be cleaned up, or did it take a lot of elbow grease and time to clean it? I'm guessing you removed every bit of the old glue. I'm worried about having Safelite come, they take the glass out, then it takes hours to get the car prepped for glass install. Do you think I should have them come early Friday morning so I can take the whole day prepping, then have them come back late in the afternoon? Is it not realistic to get this done in a day?

Dave Swingle, if you are out there... what do you do in the shop when you need a quick job done?

Andy

[DMCMW Dave]

Hi Jim!

Dave Swingle, if you are out there... what do you do in the shop when you need a quick job done?

Andy

We bring in a glass guy. :thankyou:

We generally remove the glass ourselves, and we do all the trim work. Generally the guy shows up with a tube of glue and some other secret sauce and installs the glass. Then we put all the trim back on.

I've never found a Safelight that will install glass that they didn't sell you, but independents will (sometimes). They will not take hours to prep things, but if you want to replace the pillar trims they won't want to hang around. They will probably charge you more if they have to make two trips.

Note that the pillar trims are glued to the fiberglass but you need to leave some fiberglass exposed so that the adhesive bonds the glass directly to the fiberglass. You really don't want the windshield held in by only glue to the trim vinyl.

Other notes
No fir trees on the a-pillar trims. Just glue.
Laquer thinner will not cut the original adhesive enough to remove anything more than a thin film. I have not found anything that will other than a razor blade.

[82DMC12]

Thanks Dave. Sounds like the windshield adhesive is more like half on the fiberglass, half on the A pillar?

How likely is A pillar damage? Good enough I should count on replacing them?

Andy

[DMCMW Dave]

Thanks Dave. Sounds like the windshield adhesive is more like half on the fiberglass, half on the A pillar?

How likely is A pillar damage? Good enough I should count on replacing them?

Andy

Yes

If you or the glass guy is careful with the power knife, and they are in good shape, you can leave them.

[Bikercmbc]

I did the glass replacement on my car and another owners car 7 months ago, I used the Blue Point window remover tool that uses razor blades, took my time cutting the windshields out, but worth it. here are some pics on how I had to raise the roof, both cars I did I had to raise the roof up about an inch to get the glass to even touch the roof. I did adjust the door striker pins after the glass polyurathane had time to dry. If you have other questions let me know1790317904179051790617907

[82DMC12]

Cool... Looks like you had no problem at all with the A-pillars? Thanks for the bottle jack pic. That will help a lot!!

Andy

[Bikercmbc]

My originals were warped beyond repair and decided while I was there I would be putting new ones in. Those are new ones from DMCH, depending on your interior color - black both sides NOS shouldnt be a problem, grey interior pass side is NOS looks good, drivers side is remanufactured and the leather HAS to be heated up to stretch around the pillar or it will rip...ask me how I know. PO was trying to glue the A-pillars into shape and use visegrip pliers to hold in in place, when they came loose it popped and cracked the windshield. 179081790917910179111791217913

[82DMC12]

I see. How did you glue the A-pillars into place? What kind of glue?

Also, did you find it easier to just remove the A-pillars instead of scrape the old windshield adhesive? Interested in the actual process.

Like I said, I won't have a ton of time... I would replace the A-pillars if only because it makes the job quicker!!

Andy

[Bikercmbc]

I was a mercedes mechanic at the time and I used the convertible top glue that we used to replace the canvas top, get it at the dealership, think it was $15. just put a thin layer on both the fiberglass and the A-pillar, let it sit for a few min (about 5 Min), once both are tacky you are ready to install. you need to try to get it right the first time, the more you play and move the glue the less it will make a solid bond. the mercedes glue is really strong and resists the suns heat and is made to bond fabric to metal like on the conv tops, so thats why I used it on the A-pillars.

As for the excess polyurathane left on your A-pillars and windshield frame, just use an razor blade or the blue point too I showed you above to get the majority of it off, you dont have to remove it all and actually it is best to leave a tiny amount about the thickness of the razor blade. this way the new polyureathane can bond to the old poly, A-pillar, and the fiberglass. I used 3M polyurethane from autozone, you HAVE to check the date when manufactured. if it was close to a year old sitting on the self dont buy it, it will be dried up and will delay you time putting your windshield in. needs to be only manufactured a few months ago. there is a special way to cut the tip, Kinda hard to explain. you wasnt to cut the tip down to about the size a pencil could easily slide through, then you want to cut two V's across from each other into the side. what the V's will do will create a flat bead on the bottom (against the fiber glass) and a flat area on the top (windshield side). you want the bead to be about 3/8 inch on the bottom and about 1/4 inch on the top. the bead height needs to be about 3/8 inch also. doesnt have to be precise but you need to make sure its right.. too little can cause leaks when it rains, too much will cause it to spill out onto the A-pillar.

Once you have dry fitted your glass and you have it where you want it get some painters tape and lay across the glass and connect it to the top and bottom othe the windshield frame, draw a line with a sharpie right in the center of the tape vertically, then cut the tape so you can pull the glass out. reason you do this is so when you are ready to place the glass you will have it lined up exactly where you dry fitted it. I used random spots on the top roof and used the windshield holders as the marker on the bottom of the glass.

once you are ready you can lay your bead of polyurethane. you need to do this in a timely manner and have someone there ready to help you place the glass. once you lay the glass you cant move it. press the glass onto the car making you bead height go from 3/8 to 1/4, dont push it all the way to the fiberglass. this 1/4 inch will give it the flex it needs.

As for your question on the A-pillars, the other owner didnt need to replace the a-pillars so we were just careful around the pillars not to cut it, same with the dash.. so much easier with the dash out, you can kinda get to the lower edge of the glass with the tool I showed you but not all the way, plus if it slips you will cut your dash. he used a piano wire and got a helper to be on the inside and him on the outside where they "lumber jack" sawed the window out. you can find the type of windshield tools on line. he said it took a while but shorter than removing the dash. just cut the extra poly off the a-pillar if you dont need to remove/replace yours.

polyurethane should dry in a few hours but need to wait 24 to let it fully set correctly, just an FYI
PIC below is to show you how the poly will spread once the windshield is place in.


17914

[82DMC12]

Hey all,

Windshield replacement went on without a hitch! Since I was flying into Fargo for only a couple of days, I decided not to attempt replacing the windshield myself and I scheduled an appointment with a Harmon Auto Glass shop.

One of the techs said he actually replaced a DeLorean windshield in the 80's so he at least had a clue what was going on. They replace glass in RV's and motorhomes which often have fiberglass bodies so he was very familiar with sagging issues.

I delivered the car with the headliners out, console removed, T-panel off, and windshield trim pieces removed. The old windshield was already loose so it was very easy for them to pull it off. The new windshield looks fantastic and they did a factory-quality job with no damage to the A-pillars or rest of the car. It cost me about $120 - very well worth it!

The next day I installed all of the trim, new weatherstripping, console, and T-panel. On Sunday I drove 10 hours back to Kansas City with off-and-on rain the whole way. I elected not to install the headliners just in case I had a water leak. Luckily I was in some pretty heavy rain for a bit and not a drop came in. This week I will put the headliners in and finish up the trimming. It sure was incredible driving the car at night with new glass! Before it could get a little scary around dusk with all the pitting and light scratches.

I'm very thankful my car is well-sorted - I had no time for a shakedown period and basically just changed the oil filter, topped off the oil, turned the key, and drove right out of winter storage on a 700 mile trip! Love this car. Now it's at its new home and life is good!

Andy

[Viper Guy]

I'd like to talk to Andy about his windshield replacement. My car is in Kansas City, KS and would like his first hand assistance as I will be having my windshield replaced late this week or early next. [email protected] or 816-590-3685

Thanks,

Fred

[82DMC12]

Hi Fred,

I haven't logged into DMCTalk since my last update in this thread (life gets in the way). Just got the notification that you posted in the thread. Windshield is still doing great.... I just bought a house in South Olathe. I'll PM you.

Andy

[Viper Guy]

Hi Fred,

I haven't logged into DMCTalk since my last update in this thread (life gets in the way). Just got the notification that you posted in the thread. Windshield is still doing great.... I just bought a house in South Olathe. I'll PM you.

Andy

Thanks Andy and welcome to the KC area. I will be having a glass shop install the windshield but am curious as to the amount of preparation I should or need to do. I just want the job done right and nothing broken, marred, or disfigured in any way. I just bought my car about a month ago and it needs some minor fixes. Just an FYI, there is a repair shop in Merriam, KS, Eudell's, and he is a DeLorean trained mechanic. I plan to have him go over my car once I get all the stuff done I can do myself or what he can't do like install the windshield.

[82DMC12]

Thanks I've actually been here a bit over a year now. Great city, I'm enjoying it here. Good to hear about Eudell's. What else do you know about his DeLorean credentials? Is he factory trained? Did he work at a dealership? I'd be happy to help go over the car with you. There are a couple other owners in KC as well.

For the windshield prep, if you read my thread, I didn't do any prep at all. The windshield installers are used to doing that sort of thing. Be sure to read about how to support the roof while the epoxy is setting. Be aware that the A pillar trip wraps around and faces the windshield. The glass is literally glued to it. If the installer doesn't know this, he might tear the vinyl.

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[Josh]

Subbed! I have to replace my windsheild in the next week or so. The poly let loose and is causing major leaks and MAJOR door misalignment.

[Viper Guy]

Thanks I've actually been here a bit over a year now. Great city, I'm enjoying it here. Good to hear about Eudell's. What else do you know about his DeLorean credentials? Is he factory trained? Did he work at a dealership? I'd be happy to help go over the car with you. There are a couple other owners in KC as well.

For the windshield prep, if you read my thread, I didn't do any prep at all. The windshield installers are used to doing that sort of thing. Be sure to read about how to support the roof while the epoxy is setting. Be aware that the A pillar trip wraps around and faces the windshield. The glass is literally glued to it. If the installer doesn't know this, he might tear the vinyl.

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Good morning:

Eudell is a factory trained De Lorean technician/mechanic. He did work on my car when it was owned by the previous owner. I just want it to be dependable and will have him go over it regarding cooling, heat and A/C control, engine running smoothly, try to get the key buzzer disconnected as it has a mind of its own and will buzz without the key in the switch, and anything else I can think of after I get the windshield in. Even though DMC in Texas said I shouldn't have to support the roof as long as the doors are closed, I will do so anyway.

I have installed a new A/C compressor and the kit included the accumulator and orifice. The compressor was a piece of cake but the others need a lot of dis-assembly and reassembly. Is it necessary to install the accumulator and orifice? I will continue to use R-12 as suggested by DMC and there were no leaks in the system as the pressure was full before replacing the compressor.

[82DMC12]

Good morning:

Eudell is a factory trained De Lorean technician/mechanic. He did work on my car when it was owned by the previous owner. I just want it to be dependable and will have him go over it regarding cooling, heat and A/C control, engine running smoothly, try to get the key buzzer disconnected as it has a mind of its own and will buzz without the key in the switch, and anything else I can think of after I get the windshield in. Even though DMC in Texas said I shouldn't have to support the roof as long as the doors are closed, I will do so anyway.

I have installed a new A/C compressor and the kit included the accumulator and orifice. The compressor was a piece of cake but the others need a lot of dis-assembly and reassembly. Is it necessary to install the accumulator and orifice? I will continue to use R-12 as suggested by DMC and there were no leaks in the system as the pressure was full before replacing the compressor.

I would highly recommend changing the orifice and accumulator. They are not difficult to replace, and accumulator is generally replaced anytime the system is exposed to outside air (when you replaced the compressor).

Would love to see the car and help you poke around. I've been an owner for 13 years. Mine needs Kansas registration before I can drive again though, recently moved here... . Maybe weekend after next we can meet up? There's another owner who would be down to meet too I'm sure.

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[GS450-Junkie]

Dave,
Of the windshields you replace in your shop how many would you say need the roof jacked up?

Would a professional glass installer even see this as a needed scenario or option if he were replacing my windshield in my garage and I hadn't mentioned it? I'm betting most glass guys would have little DeLorean glass experience, especially if they are younger...

I'm still trying to wrap my head around this...

[82DMC12]

Apparently it's really common when replacing RV truck windshields, so I don't think it's as left field as it sounds.

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[DMCMW Dave]

Dave,
Of the windshields you replace in your shop how many would you say need the roof jacked up?

Would a professional glass installer even see this as a needed scenario or option if he were replacing my windshield in my garage and I hadn't mentioned it? I'm betting most glass guys would have little DeLorean glass experience, especially if they are younger...
..

A professional installer will not see this coming, at least on most cars. He may comment that the glass is not a good fit for the car, but the real problem will be that the car is not a good fit for the glass.

Depends on the car. If the "bad" windshield is simply cracked, and the doors work well to start with, things are probably pretty well lined up. You install the new glass and immediately close the doors (with the side windows open so as to not create pressure enough in the car as you close the door to unseat the glass!). Let it sit overnight at least.

If the doors don't work well to start with and are seemingly impossible to align (i.e. the rearward edge of the doors wants to hit the rear quarter panels, and/or you need to have the front striker pin set with a stack of washers) the car may have settled or someone has previously installed a new glass and then let the glue cure with the doors open.

We've also seen cars where the glass was out for a long time, or severely damaged enough to lose structural integrity, where the front of the roof needed to be raised as much as an inch.

In general a good idea is to clean everything up, set the new glass without glue, then jack the roof (a small bottle jack between the tunnel and about where the dome light goes) enough to close up the gap between the glass and the roof. The set the glass.

This can be done with the headliner and console in place by removing the dome light and removing the plate around the shifter. Make wooden tools.

If you do all this you'll probably have to adjust the door fit as it has probably been adjusted to compensate for the sag. This can be a really tedious process if someone has messed with the hinges and/or shims.

[Josh]

Extremely useful post, thank you Dave!

One question regarding the shims... Is there a "default" or "Factory" setup of the shims? Like 2 upwards on the rear and 1 outwards on the front? My room is extremely sagged and the shims are all messed up.

[DMCMW Dave]

One question regarding the shims... Is there a "default" or "Factory" setup of the shims? Like 2 upwards on the rear and 1 outwards on the front? My room is extremely sagged and the shims are all messed up.

Not that I'm aware of. If someone messed with it your are starting from scratch.

[dmc6960]

When I dry-fitted my windshield it was off by about an inch in the middle. The old windshield's glue had let go of that spot at least 12 years prior. I jacked mine up leaving a gap about 1/2"-1/4". Let the urethane handle the rest, just get it thicker to ensure a good bond still. The urethane bead I put on my car was completely uniform in its whole application, so the very top middle has the smallest section adhered to the glass. Guess who has a water leak there again?

[Bikercmbc]

out of the 5 windshield I've installed every one of them needed the roof lifted, most were around the 1/2" to 3/4' gap.
270382703927040

[Josh]

Here's a question... Does glass change shape over time?

I removed my old windshield and am waiting for the new one to come. It did not crack during removal. I cleaned up the sealant and dry fitted it. There was a very small gap in the middle, barely 1/4". So is this because my roof has not sagged and does not require jacking or has the 32 year old window deformed over its lifetime?

[Rich]

Here's a question... Does glass change shape over time?

The answer is that glass does not change shape over time.

You might still need to jack your roof when the new windshield goes down because you'll need to apply pressure all the way around the perimeter to get the new bead of (thick, pasty) glass sealant to properly wet out and spread. The windshield frame may or may not offer enough stiffness to stay where it is right now when you do that.

I don't have personal experience on the second point but I am sure about the first one.

[Viper Guy]

I would highly recommend changing the orifice and accumulator. They are not difficult to replace, and accumulator is generally replaced anytime the system is exposed to outside air (when you replaced the compressor).

Would love to see the car and help you poke around. I've been an owner for 13 years. Mine needs Kansas registration before I can drive again though, recently moved here... . Maybe weekend after next we can meet up? There's another owner who would be down to meet too I'm sure.

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Good evening Andy,

Am in Branson for our son's wedding Saturday. Will be back home sometime Sunday. The windshield is scheduled to be installed Tuesday morning and my A/C should also be working later that day. It appears I have the wrong belt as the new compressor is squealing like the old one. DMC in Texas said the A/C belt needs to be the "B" belt which is 1/2" wide and not the "A" belt that is only 3/8" wide. I'm going to try that as the more I think about it, the more I think the squealing is the belt slipping and not the compressor because the squealing is while the compressor is locking up and stopped. Only the belt will squeal then while it is slipping. The compressor is not moving so how can it be making the noise? If this is what it is, looks like I have two good compressors now.

I will be attending a few cruises this summer and one of them is at the Longbranch on Metcalf and 87th st every Friday. Others I attend fairly regularly are the Belton cruise the 4th Saturday of every month, Johnny Rays in Lee's Summit the third Saturday of every month, and the Hartman cruise in Independence every Saturday during the year as long as the temp is above 60 degrees.

Hope to meet you one of these days.

Fred

[82DMC12]

Hi Fred,

Glad to hear things are moving along on your car. Today I actually drove mine, legally, for the first time this year now that I finally have Kansas registration done. I let the registration lapse after I moved to KC since I wasn't driving it in the winter. Actually I drove to work today too. Lots of people walking by the office taking pictures LOL.

I would make sure you have the correct belt... but there's a very high chance the problem is actually one of the two idler pulleys for the AC belt. They have bearings in them and seems like they are the usual culprit. You can probably tell if it's the idlers if you loosen the belt and try to spin the pulley, one at a time, and with a flick, see if they keep spinning for a while. If they lock up fairly fast or make any noise, the bearings need to be replaced.

I've heard of a couple of those cruises but I haven't done too much with local shows personally. Dave here in KC does a lot more of them. In fact we meet up at Latteland at the Plaza area on Sundays from time to time. Hope you can meet us up there sometime!

Andy

[GS450-Junkie]

So how do I pull the outer windshield trim pieces off to begin the windshield removal process? Pics and suggestions please? Thanks.

[DMCMW Dave]

So how do I pull the outer windshield trim pieces off to begin the windshield removal process? Pics and suggestions please? Thanks.

Take off the glued weatherstripping. Take out all the screws holding the trim in place. Lift the parts off. Then take out the screws holding the stainless retainer panel in place. Those often need to be drilled out and replaced with stainless screws.

[GS450-Junkie]

Anyone have pictures?

[Josh]

What do you need pictures of specifically?

[GS450-Junkie]

I'd like to see how the trim and header panels are held down. I'm not understanding how they come off exactly.

[82DMC12]

The side trim pieces are simply held in by screws which go in horizontally into the underbody. The header, same thing. The stainless retaining strip has screws which go in vertically. Once take the rubber trim off it will be quite obvious.

[DMCMW Dave]

The side trim pieces are simply held in by screws which go in horizontally into the underbody. The header, same thing. The stainless retaining strip has screws which go in vertically. Once take the rubber trim off it will be quite obvious.

Often when you peel of the weatherstripping the screws are not obvious due to the glue. But they are there.