View Full Version : Transmission 5-Speed Clutch problem... Feedback needed please...
aenglish87
06-15-2013, 03:25 AM
PLEASE READ AND RESPOND WITH ANY KNOWLEDGE AND EXPERIENCE!!!
I became a DeLorean owner a few weeks ago. Purchased from a large private classic car collection. 1983 with 5k miles, 5-speed. Extensive car history and service docs showed extensive maintenence and restoration 1.5 years ago at 3k mikes (2k miles since then) including new clutch slave and master cylinder.
I had the car sent to DMC Florida for a full inspection. They Indicated it was an excellent example in excellent overall condition. They Recommended very little in repairs, preventative maintenance and minor cosmetic fixes most of which I elected to have them do (door struts, AC mode switch repair, twilight bulbs & circuit board, horn, fix inner hood cable, fuse box/terminals/fuses replaced, replace tie rod/ball joint boots and oil change).
So I picked the car up today. Test drove it and all was well... Got it up to highway speed and went through the gears. It was my first time driving it or any Delorean and I thought to myself how short and stiff the clutch felt and how horrible the brakes were but they assured me that they checked out ok so I thought both the stiff/short clutch and weak feeling braking were just standard for the car.
As I loaded the car on a trailer for e 2 hour trip home I had some difficulties loading and aligning on a steep loading ramp and did not get it up and o. Straight and smooth on the first or second try so it resulted in working the clutch pretty hard (definitely got it hot to the point of smelling that burn smell briefly) while battle the inclined loading angle. Lesson learned. However, we got it loaded up and safely home by evening.
Then the problems began. While preparing to ease it off the car trailer I could not get it to go into reverse. Engine on, clutch pressed, can't "find" reverse to the point I am re-checking the shift nob repeatedly to make sure I'm not crazy. There was seemingly no lingering effects of working the clutch so hard a few hours prior while getting it loaded. I could get it into the other gears just fine with with no problem with the clutch pressed but couldn't even vaguely get into anything that remotely felt like reverse. I realized that in my test drive I had not tried reverse and thought (as a first timer in a DeLorean) that there may be some slight "trick" to it. So I played with the angles on the shifter with no luck and thought that perhaps the clutch needed to be further or more fully pressed to allow it into reverse. When I did this the clutch seemed to press farther in than it did before and I noticed a "hydraulic type sound" when I released the clutch as the clutch came back out far more slowly than before/normal. At that point, in addition to not being able to "find" reverse I could no longer get the car in gear at all. the clutch was not working at all as discovered by my attempt to put the car in 1st gear and getting that startling grind noise. I shut her off for a few minutes and started her back up (with the stick in neutral) and she fired up with no problem but still had a "mushy clutch feel and slight hydraulic type noise when releasing the clutch and still could not put it any any gear. I shut her off again and tried to start it in first gear and would not start.
I have obviously damaged the clutch in some way but the two big questions are...
1. Did I kill the clutch or is it possibly something more simple and easy to repair?
2. Did I cause this by damaging the clutch when struggling to load it on the trailer incline? Or did I simply press it to hard when trying to figure out why I could not get it into reverse?
Keeping in mind that the clutch slave and cylinder were replaced with DMC parts 1.5 years ago with only 2k miles since then, I didn't think I could ruin the clutch with just 15 seconds of overworking it while trailer loading (although it did make a slight burning smell). Nor did I think that more firmly than normal pressing the clutch could cause it to "break".
I need any thoughts and feedback please. I appreciate it. I am kicking myself for killing the clutch before I could even enjoy the car for the first time this weekend. I'm not a 'gear head' or big do-it-yourselfer but I am a capable and experienced car owner/driver (including high performance and classics) and I have never killed a clutch ...until today.
Needless to say my introduction into DeLorean ownership has been a rough one today. Any thoughts on my situation and insight on questions 1 & 2 above is much appreciated.
Cory W
06-15-2013, 03:35 AM
Based on what you've said here, I'm thinking you blew a seal in the clutch master or slave cylinder.
I did that with a brake MC on my old truck when changing it once..a "hydraulic" sound, with no function afterwards.
Lift the carpet in the driver footwell and look for any signs of moisture or leaks. If there's nothing there, look around the MC itself...and wipe up any and all brake fluid you find on the frame. It eats the epoxy
Oh, to get into reverse, LIFT the shifter from the neutral position, then move it into place. Sounds like you were just getting second gear repeatedly, which combined with high revs would contribute to your burning clutch smell.
Elvis
06-15-2013, 03:52 AM
Hi and congratulations to your purchase.
I don't know what happened to you clutch, visual inspection of the clutch
hydrauliks is up to you. I have seen almost new clutch master cylinders that
leaked into the interior and the carpet had to suck the DOT4.
How to get it into reverse ? did you try to RTFM ? as a new owner and fan
of this car I guess this is the minimum one can do to appreciate the car.
It's a classic car and the fun behind it is not only to buy it, but also to
know a little something about it. Or the guys at the gas station will tell
you incredible stuff about it :-P
Let's assume you did RTFM and simply forgot to pull the stick before pushing it
to the far left...
BTW - I am a fan of real names, at least first names. What's your name ?
Have fun with your new baby, sister 6548 says hello :-)
Elvis
WelmoedJ
06-15-2013, 04:03 AM
Based on what you've said here, I'm thinking you blew a seal in the clutch master or slave cylinder.
I did that with a brake MC on my old truck when changing it once..a "hydraulic" sound, with no function afterwards.
Lift the carpet in the driver footwell and look for any signs of moisture or leaks. If there's nothing there, look around the MC itself...and wipe up any and all brake fluid you find on the frame. It eats the epoxy
Oh, to get into reverse, LIFT the shifter from the neutral position, then move it into place. Sounds like you were just getting second gear repeatedly, which combined with high revs would contribute to your burning clutch smell.
+1
Welcome to the surprises of a DeLorean ownership.
You mentioned the car being in a very good condition.
From that I presume it also came with the DeLorean Owners Manual?
Like with any other car a new owner should at least make himself/herself familiar with many things heloing you understand and enjoy your car.
It seems major maintenance has been too long ago, so the seals in many important systems may be on their way out.
It may be a good idea to overhaul your brake and clutch systems.
This way you can be sure they work if and when needed.
As to the harsh shifting: the rod and bell crank rubber bushings may be totally dry or rotted away.
Lubricate the bell crank itself and the shifter cable.
Exchange the rubber bushings and notice the difference (see another thread for this: http://dmctalk.org/showthread.php?7247-Changing-the-bushings-on-the-shifter-mechanism)
Bitsyncmaster
06-15-2013, 04:30 AM
FYI:
My car is always tricky to get into reverse (and I know to lift the shifter). Most times it takes two tries, moving the shifter to neutral and releasing the clutch in neutral.
WelmoedJ
06-15-2013, 07:46 AM
FYI:
My car is always tricky to get into reverse (and I know to lift the shifter). Most times it takes two tries, moving the shifter to neutral and releasing the clutch in neutral.
Perhaps your shifter cable needs minor adjustment.
Not too much otherwise the 5th gear will get hard to lay in.
aenglish87
06-15-2013, 10:18 AM
Based on what you've said here, I'm thinking you blew a seal in the clutch master or slave cylinder.
I did that with a brake MC on my old truck when changing it once..a "hydraulic" sound, with no function afterwards.
Lift the carpet in the driver footwell and look for any signs of moisture or leaks. If there's nothing there, look around the MC itself...and wipe up any and all brake fluid you find on the frame. It eats the epoxy
Oh, to get into reverse, LIFT the shifter from the neutral position, then move it into place. Sounds like you were just getting second gear repeatedly, which combined with high revs would contribute to your burning clutch smell.
Thanks. I will look for any leaks and report back. The high revs that resulted in a burning clutch smell were only in first gear while trying to load the car up the steep incline of the transport trailer. I wasn't revving or touching the gas at all while trying to get into reverse to unload the car off the trailer hours later. I simply could not get it into reverse and pressed the clutch harder which seemed to cause the problem. What would most likely be the "break" caused by pushing too hard on the clutch and suddenly having no clutch and getting a hydraulic type sound from it as it slowly returns back up to normal position when I release it?
David T
06-15-2013, 10:22 AM
Perhaps your shifter cable needs minor adjustment.
Not too much otherwise the 5th gear will get hard to lay in.
Verify the clutch hydraulics are working by observing the pivot arm while someone depresses the clutch pedal and check the fluid level next to the gas fill under the rubber cap. If all is well you probably need a clutch. Never force shifts, you will damage the internal parts of the transmission.
David Teitelbaum
aenglish87
06-15-2013, 10:36 AM
Hi and congratulations to your purchase.
I don't know what happened to you clutch, visual inspection of the clutch
hydrauliks is up to you. I have seen almost new clutch master cylinders that
leaked into the interior and the carpet had to suck the DOT4.
How to get it into reverse ? did you try to RTFM ? as a new owner and fan
of this car I guess this is the minimum one can do to appreciate the car.
It's a classic car and the fun behind it is not only to buy it, but also to
know a little something about it. Or the guys at the gas station will tell
you incredible stuff about it :-P
Let's assume you did RTFM and simply forgot to pull the stick before pushing it
to the far left...
BTW - I am a fan of real names, at least first names. What's your name ?
Have fun with your new baby, sister 6548 says hello :-)
Elvis
Thanks for the reply Elvis (although deems kinda tude in tone) but I don't know what you mean by "the carpet had to suck the DOT4". I admittedly have not studied the manual like a college kid for exams but I have done plenty of research as a fan if Ds before buying and did the diligent owner thing to take the car to DMC for inspection and any needed maintenance before even bringing the car home or driving it. I haven't just randomly bought a D with no understanding if the car, it's history, etc. I am guilty of not knowing to pull the knob up for reverse but I did try pulling up and pushing down among other things and could not "find" reverse. One if those things I tried was pressing the clutch in a little harder to ensure its all the way down thinking that my be what was preventing it from sliding over to find reverse. When I did that the clutch "broke". I have no idea if its related at l to revving and working the clutch hard a few hours prior when loading the car up the ramps of the transport trailer. Respectfully, I already feel dumb enough for doing something to the clutch on day one but don't need a "RTFM" lecture... Just looking for some friendly help from other owners knowledge and experience what the problem may most likely be. I appreciate it.
EDIT: PS- My name is Alex. Thx
aenglish87
06-15-2013, 10:42 AM
FYI:
My car is always tricky to get into reverse (and I know to lift the shifter). Most times it takes two tries, moving the shifter to neutral and releasing the clutch in neutral.
Thanks. I do recall trying to lift up on the knob to get it into gear and could not do it but I was trying multiple things and it was dark as we were trying to unload it off the trailer. I took it to my local mechanic (rather than turn right back around and haul it the 3 hours back to DMC) so can't just step out into the garage and try it right now.
aenglish87
06-15-2013, 10:50 AM
Verify the clutch hydraulics are working by observing the pivot arm while someone depresses the clutch pedal and check the fluid level next to the gas fill under the rubber cap. If all is well you probably need a clutch. Never force shifts, you will damage the internal parts of the transmission.
David Teitelbaum
Thanks David. I will try that. I didn't force any shifts other than realizing the clutch was no longer working when I tried to put it into first and got that brief loud grind sound. Does it lead you to think its something specific given that it was going into gears just fine and then when I pressed the clutch firmer it stopped working and now can be pressed in much further than when it was working and does not "spring" right back out when you let off it like it normally would? It now comes out super slow while making a slight hydraulic noise while coming back out in slow motion.
Elvis
06-15-2013, 12:32 PM
Hey Alex,
I had a car here a few years a go with a new clutch master cylinder. While I was doing a test drive (1 mile ?!?)
the car started to grind and suddenly I couldn't get a gear in - had to turn the engine off, push in first gear and
start it to get the car back home.
The master cylinder was leaking into the carpet - the carpet sucked up that ugly fluid !!!
This is what I meant with - it's up to you to do a visual inspection.
Get down on your knees and check if sou can see something at the clutch pedal, linkage and if the carpet is wet.
I doubt you broke something by pushing the pedal a bit stronger.
What I have also seen was a worn linkage, this could only be seen by taking the bolts out.
Can't imagine this on a low mileage car.
Then we also had the linkage at the clutch itself - somehow the bolt moved out where the
slave cylinder pushes the fork that engages the clutch.
Leaking slave cylinders are also possible.
Like David already wrote - check the fluid level.
This is useful information you won't find in the manual :-)
Elvis
David T
06-15-2013, 04:27 PM
It is starting to sound more and more like the master or slave cylinder leaked and now you cannot release the clutch. You MUST examine the fluid level in the reservoir and if it is low pull the carpet on the driver's side and look for brake fluid. You can also look underneath the car front and rear. If it leaked out it went somewhere!!!! If it did leak you must find and fix it. Always best to replace (or rebuild) BOTH master and slave at the same time and if you still have the red plastic hose replace it also with a S/S braided one. As for shifting into reverse, maybe it wouldn't hurt to RTFM. You do need to lift the knob while shifting into reverse to get around the reverse gate. If you are having trouble after lifting the knob something is wrong. BTW, you will NEVER get into reverse (even lifting the knob) if the clutch isn't being released because the hydraulics are not working. If you DO find the clutch hydraulics are leaking you should prepare yourself for rebuilding the brake system very soon. Deloreans do NOT like old brake fluid. It corrodes the insides of the brake and clutch systems and then they leak. This is not in any manual but every newbie learns about this quickly! Once you go through the expense of rebuilding these systems you will figure out it is MUCH cheaper to flush these systems every other year with new brake fluid!!!!!!!!!!!
David Teitelbaum
aenglish87
06-15-2013, 08:10 PM
Thanks Elvis and David for the feedback and info. Everything visible has been checked out and Clutch master cylinder is fine and reservoir is full along w/brake master cyl. Both full of fluid, no leaks at all, carpet is fine. It's not a leak issue with the clutch. Unfortunately that means we have to get in there now and drop tranny to figure it out. based on circumstance of how it happened and feel of the clutch now, we are thinking that either the fingers on the pressure plate were damaged somehow (unlikely) or the clutch fork came off the pivot ball or the piston shaft on the clutch slave cylinder punched thru the clutch fork. Has anyone experience any of these?
aenglish87
06-16-2013, 11:22 PM
Anyone???...
DMCMW Dave
06-16-2013, 11:43 PM
Anyone???...
I've had a "barn car" or two where the pressure plate springs rusted and/or collapsed. The strangest one was starting up a car and having about a cup of sunflower seeds come flying out of the bellhousing. Of course where there are seeds, there are mice. Mouse pee is, erm, corrosive.
What's the history on the car/clutch?
But yes, the springs in the clutch can fail and it can go into a mode of slipping AND not releasing all the way.
David T
06-17-2013, 10:23 AM
I've had a "barn car" or two where the pressure plate springs rusted and/or collapsed. The strangest one was starting up a car and having about a cup of sunflower seeds come flying out of the bellhousing. Of course where there are seeds, there are mice. Mouse pee is, erm, corrosive.
What's the history on the car/clutch?
But yes, the springs in the clutch can fail and it can go into a mode of slipping AND not releasing all the way.
I have seen cars with the friction plate so rusted to the flywheel and pressure plate that you could not release the clutch and others where the splines were so rusty nothing moved. If the car sat a long time chances are the throwout bearing will soon be making bad noises too. If the clutch hydraulics are working and you see the pivot arm moving and the clutch is not working properly, the only choice you have is to pull the clutch and see what is going on. I have seen bad clutch jobs where the friction materiel breaks up and flies off the friction plate. I have seen where the pressure plate is not set up correctly and either the clutch slips or won't release. Very critical on a Delorean where there is no adjustment.
David Teitelbaum
aenglish87
06-17-2013, 01:31 PM
I've had a "barn car" or two where the pressure plate springs rusted and/or collapsed. The strangest one was starting up a car and having about a cup of sunflower seeds come flying out of the bellhousing. Of course where there are seeds, there are mice. Mouse pee is, erm, corrosive.
What's the history on the car/clutch? But yes, the springs in the clutch can fail and it can go into a mode of slipping AND not releasing all the way.
I have seen cars with the friction plate so rusted to the flywheel and pressure plate that you could not release the clutch and others where the splines were so rusty nothing moved. If the car sat a long time chances are the throwout bearing will soon be making bad noises too. If the clutch hydraulics are working and you see the pivot arm moving and the clutch is not working properly, the only choice you have is to pull the clutch and see what is going on. I have seen bad clutch jobs where the friction materiel breaks up and flies off the friction plate. I have seen where the pressure plate is not set up correctly and either the clutch slips or won't release. Very critical on a Delorean where there is no adjustment.
David Teitelbaum
This car was stored indoors in air conditioned space "on display" as part of a private collection in Arizona from around 1991 to 2011. In 2001 it was brought back to driving life by a very reputable restoration shop in Arizona with all parts purchased from DMC-Houston and extensive consultation with DMC-H. As it relates to the clutch they replaced the master cylindar and clutch slave but no other clutch or transmission related work was noted as needed or performed at that time. The car has only 5K miles and is very clean, runs great (other than this new clutch issue) and is in overall excellent condition. I certainly would not expect the culprit on this clutch prolem to be anything you might find or blame on being a "barn car" and being an Arizona car up until about a year ago I don't think there is a spec of rust on/in the car. The restoration to bring the car back to driving life was done about 1.5 years ago with about 3k miles on it and the car now has 5K miles on it so it has been properly used and driven 2k miles in last year and a half with no record of any issues in all of the extensive records with the car.
I know that whatever is wrong with the clutch is simply a result of me pushing to hard on the clutch pedal. Of course I am kicking myself for creating around 10 hours of labor just to get into it to see what the exact problem is but the question is what exactly could I have done or knocked loose to cause it. The clutch was engaging just fine and I was able to put it into gears just fine before pressing the clutch too firmly and then suddenly the clutch was going in "too far" and no longer springing back out normally and could not be put into gear at all.
The other question is, even though its only a 5k miles car/clutch, since we have to get all the way in there to fix it anyway, even if it is something very simple, should I go ahead and replace all the clutch components and anything else that is in that vicinity that would normally make sense to do while that far into the labor breakdown? And if so, what other items would be smart to replace/upgrade while into this labor job?
David, The clutch hydraulics are not currently working properly and the pivot arm is moving but not far enough to engage it properly (thats how I understood the explanation), which is why my local guy things it could be as simple as something coming "unclipped" but unfortunately everything that is easy to get to is fine and not leaking which means we have to go all the way into dropping the tranny, etc to figure it out. This is how it was explained to me. I have my local mechanic who is going to be looking at it (mostly Porsche experienced) checking into this thread here for any feedback that may help him/us better diagnose it so any thoughts or feedback is appreciated.
David T
06-17-2013, 04:07 PM
As I said before, if the slave cylinder is moving when you step on the clutch pedal and the clutch is not releasing, all you can do is remove the clutch and whatever problem there is will be apparent. All the rest is guesses but the only way to confirm is, again, to get the clutch out. Once you get it apart you can decide what is necessary to replace. As long as it's apart you should consider replacing the throwout bearing and the pilot bearing at a minimum.
David Teitelbaum
DMCMW Dave
06-17-2013, 06:37 PM
I know that whatever is wrong with the clutch is simply a result of me pushing to hard on the clutch pedal. .
Not possible. It's self-limiting and hydraulic.
.$02
I don't think there is such a thing as pushing the clutch too hard. This makes me think that something in the clutch set broke and wouldn't allow the pressure plate to travel fully, which may have made you feel a lot of resistance before the pedal reached its normal maximum travel (?). There would be no way to force it further...possibly bent something else too. I would get the mechanic to manually work the fork (he'll have to get inventive ;-) and see if it will release.
I also wonder if the hydraulic sound you hear may be you blew one of the internal MC seals and it is bypassing.
Otherwise, I'm with David T....
aenglish87
06-17-2013, 10:57 PM
Not possible. It's self-limiting and hydraulic.
So it's total coincidence that the car was sitting still and clutch working fine (engaging and allowing shifter into gears) then I pushed clutch harder than normal trying to get reverse and suddenly from the moment if that exact clutch push, the clutch no longer worked and would not let me put the car in gear AT ALL. I'm not trying to argue against you but it makes no sense that wuthout moving the car an inch it was working fine and then as soon as I did the "harder clutch push" it no longer worked at all and suddenly seem to press further back and no longer springs back when I let off the pedal as any clutch normally would. Isn't bit possible that I over pressed the clutch in some way that possibly pushed the clutch fork off the pivot ball or the piston shaft on the clutch slave cylinder punched through the clutch fork? I am a mechanic novice but based on what my local guy is seeing (Porsche background, not a DMC expert) the clutch hydraulics are not leaking but are not working "all the way" and the master cylinder seems fine. You mentioned that the springs in the clutch can fail. Is it likely that they would fail on a well stored 5k mile car and happen to do so right in sync with pushing the clutch harder than usual? It's a very frustrating and confusing problem and I'm trying to explore anything before having to drop the tranny mount and all those labor hours to get in there. There was no signs of slipping or any issue at all until the moment I pushed the clutch pedal harder than usual trying to find reverse. David, I may give you a quick call tomorrow to pick your brain on it if you don't mind.
Isn't bit possible that I over pressed the clutch in some way... No.
Although hard to do, with brakes it is possible, but not for a clutch. If there is nothing wrong with the clutch itself, the pedal will go to the floor and from then on you are only putting pressure on the floorboard (or a pedal bracket stop etc. if so equipped). In other words, unlike brake pads/shoes against a solid drum/disk, when you push the pedal, 100% of the force is going against a set of springs that have pressure squeezing the clutch disk between the plate and flywheel (you are releasing this) -- All pressure is on the springs. So unless something got out of alignment or got into the mechanism to stop the travel, it is impossible to push the pedal too hard and put too much pressure on the clutch mechanism. In fact, there is WAY more travel than you could ever take up, even with an adjustable rod ("piston shaft") -- There is simply nothing solid to push against. See?
...that possibly pushed the clutch fork off the pivot ball or the piston shaft on the clutch slave cylinder punched through the clutch fork? Either of these could cause you to feel an abnormal resistance in the pedal making you have to push harder than normal, if things were just right..., but not the other way around. But, it is more likely that they would create excess play in the travel, causing you not to be able to get in gear, and, after trying it a few times, the pedal would start to grab closer to the floor and/or flop around when the linkage fell apart after the piston blew out of the slave.
Manually working the fork will tell you if it is the clutch or the hydraulics -- Try it, you'll like it!
And, hey, it's not you fault! :deviltail:
Elvis
06-18-2013, 12:06 PM
I also repeat it:
NO YOU CAN'T OVERPRESS THE CLUTCH LOL
Did you take the stuff apart I suggested to do ?
Get on you knees and take that clutch linkage apart and check the bolts if they are worn.
They shouldn't with that low mileage, but looking at it is better than guessing over the internet.
Bleeding the clutch hydraulics is also a good thing. The slave cylinders like to fail over
the years, too.
This is what a german guy had last year - this is seen from the engine on the clutch slave
and the linkage / fork. This did no happen suddenly, but it got worse and worse the more he
drove it. As we couldn't ge a lift to look under the car, he had to get towed on the way back home
as the eventually clutch failed completely.
19931
I love this song: :-D
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x3mgkv_elvis-presley-a-little-less-convers_music#.UcCD5JzI8tU
Elvis & 6548
DMCMW Dave
06-18-2013, 04:31 PM
I
This is what a german guy had last year - this is seen from the engine on the clutch slave
and the linkage / fork. This did no happen suddenly, but it got worse and worse the more he
drove it. As we couldn't ge a lift to look under the car, he had to get towed on the way back home
as the eventually clutch failed completely.
19931
Elvis & 6548
I've seen some cars where that hardened pin was replaced with a common screw and nut. Guess how long that lasts?
David T
06-18-2013, 08:49 PM
I've seen some cars where that hardened pin was replaced with a common screw and nut. Guess how long that lasts?
We can continue to speculate on "overpushing", "hard clutch pedal" etc. Non of this matters anymore. Not even the length and the way the car was stored. If the clutch hydraulics are functioning and the clutch is not releasing, you WILL be removing the clutch. Once you can get the clutch on the bench (more likely as you take it apart and the parts fall on the floor!) you will see the problem. Maybe the clutch fork broke? No matter, you can't fix it without taking it all apart anyway. The good news is you did not have to get towed home. When you awaken a car that has been in "hibernation" all kinds of weird things happen that you have to fix. The sooner you decide to get it apart the sooner we all will know what happened (and it IS going to have to come apart).
David Teitelbaum
SS Spoiler
06-18-2013, 09:16 PM
I'd put money one the clutch fork.
SS Spoiler
06-18-2013, 09:17 PM
I'd put money on the clutch fork.
Tillsy
06-19-2013, 12:36 AM
You can say that again ;)
dmc6960
06-19-2013, 11:08 AM
Isn't bit possible that I over pressed the clutch in some way that possibly pushed the clutch fork off the pivot ball or the piston shaft on the clutch slave cylinder punched through the clutch fork?
No, you didn't "over press" the pedal to cause any problems. The clutch should indeed be pushed all the way in every single time you use it. But punching through the clutch fork is a real possibility given a perfect storm of conditions. Like that picture Elvis posted, and Dave S's comment about replacing the pin with a screw. My clutch once got stuck disengaged. Upon releasing the pedal the hydraulics filled with additional fluid, and now pushing on the pedal reached full extension of the clutch fork. Still not releasing on its own (probably not possible at that point without bleeding the hydraulic line), I pushed on the now-hard pedal with all my might, only for it to fall to the floor and loose all resistance. Clutch was still stuck disengaged and I used my last bit of momentum to coast into a parking lot where my car was towed home the only time I've owned it. I get underneath to look at what had happened, and the connecting pin (replaced with a BOLT by a previous owner) had been sheered all the way through and the piston from the slave cylinder had actually been ejected. All parts just happened to still be there, so I removed the slave cylinder and all of its spewn guts. With merely a tap of a long screwdriver, the clutch fork SNAPPED back into position. Reassembled the slave cylinder. Only thing I had to "fix" was the dust boot which was torn. By sheer luck, everything worked normally afterwards. I replaced the broken bolt, with another (but much harder) bolt. Continued to drive the car for a few more years and tens of thousands of more miles until eventual clutch and clutch fork replacement.
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