View Full Version : Engine painting engine and transmission
Instead of putting my grungy looking engine back into my new chassis I might as well paint it and make it look presentable. Right now the timing cover, valve covers, intake, and waterpump (everything that could be removed) are powdercoated but the heads and block as well as the transmission are still dingy looking. I have seen many people paint their engines, just not entirely sure of the products used and the prep that is involved. Hopefully you guys can share you knowledge! If it makes any difference, I am looking to paint the engine and trans a semi-gloss or gloss black (not flat) for easy cleanup.
Delorean Industries
08-07-2013, 04:48 PM
Instead of putting my grungy looking engine back into my new chassis I might as well paint it and make it look presentable. Right now the timing cover, valve covers, intake, and waterpump (everything that could be removed) are powdercoated but the heads and block as well as the transmission are still dingy looking. I have seen many people paint their engines, just not entirely sure of the products used and the prep that is involved. Hopefully you guys can share you knowledge! If it makes any difference, I am looking to paint the engine and trans a semi-gloss or gloss black (not flat) for easy cleanup.
A lot of prep work done right. (which after seeing your progress I'm sure you are able to do) and POR 15 engine enamel top coated with engine enamel high temp.
A lot of prep work done right. (which after seeing your progress I'm sure you are able to do) and POR 15 engine enamel top coated with engine enamel high temp.
This is where I am at a loss. Everyone says prep is key and I agree... but how to you properly prep an engine block with all the nooks and crannies? you cant get a wire wheel, brush, or even a scotch brite pad into all the places.
So I am assuming the por15 engine enamel is not UV resistant such as the other products so it needs a top coat?
Delorean Industries
08-07-2013, 06:04 PM
This is where I am at a loss. Everyone says prep is key and I agree... but how to you properly prep an engine block with all the nooks and crannies? you cant get a wire wheel, brush, or even a scotch brite pad into all the places.
So I am assuming the por15 engine enamel is not UV resistant such as the other products so it needs a top coat?
Buy a mini hand held sand blaster and prep the service with that. Lots of masking and sealing but it is worth it. For the price of the 3.0 head gasket kit I would pull the heads and send them out. I have never fired a used 3.0 out of the box with any success and done plenty.
DMCMW Dave
08-07-2013, 06:22 PM
So I am assuming the por15 engine enamel is not UV resistant such as the other products so it needs a top coat?
How much UV light do you think gets on an engine block?
Buy a mini hand held sand blaster and prep the service with that. Lots of masking and sealing but it is worth it. For the price of the 3.0 head gasket kit I would pull the heads and send them out. I have never fired a used 3.0 out of the box with any success and done plenty.
A sandblaster is one thing, but a decent compressor is another. Both things I do not have. As for top end work I will get the engine running and go from there. I dont want to deal with any internals ATM, but if it is an issue I can cross that bridge when I get there. Not exactly a proactive approach, but I will give you a call when I need head gaskets!
How much UV light do you think gets on an engine block?
Spent a little time reading into it, I think I will just do the plain old por 15 3 step process with some semi glass black por 15 and call it a day. So to answer your question, <= zero UV light haha
David T
08-07-2013, 10:56 PM
A sandblaster is one thing, but a decent compressor is another. Both things I do not have. As for top end work I will get the engine running and go from there. I dont want to deal with any internals ATM, but if it is an issue I can cross that bridge when I get there. Not exactly a proactive approach, but I will give you a call when I need head gaskets!
Spent a little time reading into it, I think I will just do the plain old por 15 3 step process with some semi glass black por 15 and call it a day. So to answer your question, <= zero UV light haha
One way is to just spray it down with Gunk or oven cleaner and rinse. It will clean and brighten it up. You are correct, it is a LOT of work to try to prep it well with all of the cavities. All depends on how much work you want to do and what you want it to look like when you are done. In any case seal the motor up well so you don't get any dirt inside while trying to pretty it up.
David Teitelbaum
One way is to just spray it down with Gunk or oven cleaner and rinse. It will clean and brighten it up. You are correct, it is a LOT of work to try to prep it well with all of the cavities. All depends on how much work you want to do and what you want it to look like when you are done. In any case seal the motor up well so you don't get any dirt inside while trying to pretty it up.
David Teitelbaum
Everything has been degreased and pressure washed. I am still debating on what is the best method to use... I have never used Por15 and a little more research has shown people painting their valleys and it turning to a mushy mess went coolant hits it. I know brake fluid will do similar. Also the prep involves rinsing with water in between the metal ready and marine clean. My engine is not fully sealed up yet (valve covers, timing cover, intake) as I dont want to get overspray or chemicals on these powder coated parts. So im thinking of prepping with a heavy scuff pad, wiping everything down with thinner, and shooting on some engine primer and enamel. Not looking for a perfect finish but something that gives a consistent color to the engine.
I have heard oven cleaner is not good to use on aluminum? I have used it to clean aluminum parts before, it works great. I just thought it causes corrosion?
silverhair01
08-08-2013, 01:10 AM
Everything has been degreased and pressure washed. I am still debating on what is the best method to use... I have never used Por15 and a little more research has shown people painting their valleys and it turning to a mushy mess went coolant hits it. I know brake fluid will do similar. Also the prep involves rinsing with water in between the metal ready and marine clean. My engine is not fully sealed up yet (valve covers, timing cover, intake) as I dont want to get overspray or chemicals on these powder coated parts. So im thinking of prepping with a heavy scuff pad, wiping everything down with thinner, and shooting on some engine primer and enamel. Not looking for a perfect finish but something that gives a consistent color to the engine.
I have heard oven cleaner is not good to use on aluminum? I have used it to clean aluminum parts before, it works great. I just thought it causes corrosion?
Knowing what oven cleaner does to aluminum if its left on there, I would never clean an aluminum auto part with it.
TTait
08-08-2013, 02:05 AM
How much UV light do you think gets on an engine block?
That was my thought... I'm sure a hot exhaust can put off some IR, but so long as the car is right side up I'm not too worried about UV...
dmc6960
08-08-2013, 08:45 AM
That was my thought... I'm sure a hot exhaust can put off some IR, but so long as the car is right side up I'm not too worried about UV...
What about just the right angle with the engine cover vents? I could see my engine looking at it just right. Granted that would not be a continuous exposure.
+1 on prep work
If you decide to coat it with anything, wash it down with "hot" lacquer thinner and blow it off as you go. I have had the best luck using a quality High Temp, "Cast Coat Aluminum" color (there are several out there, but few look right and they change formulas/actual color often...test a spot to get as close as you can). Use very, very, light coats allowing each to totally dry. Down the road, chips, peels, etc (you will get them) will blend in since it is the same color, until you have a chance to touch it up. Just looks better longer and easy to maintain over all to me.
EDIT: Let the engine warm fully the first time you get it warm (cures better)!
Thanks for all the input guys!
DMCMW Dave
08-08-2013, 10:44 AM
Knowing what oven cleaner does to aluminum if its left on there, I would never clean an aluminum auto part with it.
I agree. The outside of the block would be no big deal but I'd be worried about it getting into joints between parts, or on top of the engine mount ears, where you can't really completely rinse it. It cleans aluminum by etching off the outer layer. . . .
Morpheus
08-08-2013, 10:55 AM
So is it preferable to paint an engine block or powder coat it?
Delorean Industries
08-08-2013, 11:13 AM
So is it preferable to paint an engine block or powder coat it?
ceramic coating is the best option available.
jawn101
08-08-2013, 12:33 PM
ceramic coating is the best option available.
Speaking as someone who just had something ceramic coated for the first time ever (my muffler) I would like to agree here... that coating is amazing, beautiful and basically impervious to anything short of an apocalyptic scenario.
vwdmc16
08-08-2013, 04:01 PM
Agreed with Jon but total disassembly is needed,i was telling my por15 experience with Josh, the underside of the car gets plenty of uv light. My frame and transmission painting has faded and darkened badly, it need an enamel top coat.
And now i am thinking of leaving everything o-naturale. Care to share a picture for your trans for reference Clint? This picture of Nick's valley also scared me a little. Its purely cosmetic, and if it starts peeling it will end up looking worse than if it was never painted at all.
Mark D
08-08-2013, 04:55 PM
I'm pretty sure that same VOD picture convinced me several years back just to degrease and clean everything really well and leave it at that. I'm sure painting would look nice for a while but it just seems impossible to get everything totally clean in all the nooks and crannies without taking the whole engine apart. I just know after doing all that hard work cleaning and painting I'd spill brake fluid on it somehow and it would get ruined anyway.:frown:
I'm pretty sure that same VOD picture convinced me several years back just to degrease and clean everything really well and leave it at that. I'm sure painting would look nice for a while but it just seems impossible to get everything totally clean in all the nooks and crannies without taking the whole engine apart. I just know after doing all that hard work cleaning and painting I'd spill brake fluid on it somehow and it would get ruined anyway.:frown:
My thoughts exactly. And it is amplified with my pure absolute hate for painting.
I do have plans to rebuild my transmission over one winter eventually. During this the case will be blasted and powder coated. But that is a while from now!
Spilling things on your engine is a given! oil, brake fluid, fuel, coolant... makes quick work of reversing hours of work like you said!
Mark D
08-08-2013, 05:16 PM
Yeah I think if it's something that can be removed easily like the valve covers and timing chain cover it would be worth the time and effort to blast and powder/ceramic coat. I wouldn't want to sand blast and engine for fear of getting grit inside. Maybe CO2 blasting since it just evaporates afterwards?
The trans casing halves seem like they would be OK to media blast... I'd still probably try and mask off the inner side as best as possible since blasting media can embed itself onto to the surface.
dallarax19
08-08-2013, 05:31 PM
Aluminum Prep;
https://buyat.ppg.com/refinishproductcatalog/ViewProduct.aspx?ProductID=5df2e61c-ee2b-436a-b911-5278212bdcd2
https://buyat.ppg.com/refinishproductcatalog/ViewProduct.aspx?ProductID=e050b713-0574-417f-b2f6-44cdbd366d67
Paint:
https://buyat.ppg.com/refinishproductcatalog/ViewProduct.aspx?ProductID=26f0b8be-236e-4214-827b-58ef2dd2503b
https://buyat.ppg.com/refinishproductcatalog/ViewProduct.aspx?ProductID=fb421e78-c91c-4d20-a7de-d9452105efa9
I have used POR15 on an iron block and aluminum trans housing and it worked well but was not resistant to fuel and harsh cleaners. I have limited miles on that particular rebuild but it seems to hold up well. For the $$ it has been a good choice.
This time however I am looking to get a more permanent solution so I am pursuing Urethane paint. Anyone not had success with this or have a better recommendation?
http://dmctalk.org/showthread.php?7654-What-is-the-best-method-to-clean-the-block&highlight=dallarax19
DMCMW Dave
08-08-2013, 06:20 PM
I'm pretty sure that same VOD picture convinced me several years back just to degrease and clean everything really well and leave it at that. I'm sure painting would look nice for a while but it just seems impossible to get everything totally clean in all the nooks and crannies without taking the whole engine apart. I just know after doing all that hard work cleaning and painting I'd spill brake fluid on it somehow and it would get ruined anyway.:frown:
Yeah - to me painting the valley is a problem, as you tend to spill coolant AND brake fluid (clutch bleeding) in there, neither of which is good for paint. Not good for aluminum either, but you can rinse it out, and it will dry out in heat, where paint tends to turn into a messy gel and make the problem worse.
Bitsyncmaster
08-08-2013, 06:56 PM
This time however I am looking to get a more permanent solution so I am pursuing Urethane paint. Anyone not had success with this or have a better recommendation?
Urethane sounds like a good idea. It's a real tough paint and resistant to most solvents. It's just hard to find it in colors.
mluder
08-09-2013, 01:47 AM
If you do decide to paint you'll want to be very careful of bolt holes, mating surfaces, etc. The engine and many ancillary parts such as the alternator must maintain continuity to ground or you could have any sort of electrical problems down the road.
My advice is test along the way. Any time a gound lug or bracket is attached, check for continuity between the parts.
Cheers
Steven
vwdmc16
08-15-2013, 10:23 PM
Care to share a picture for your trans for reference Clint?
Sorry it took so long. you can see how the paint is flaking off near the drain, I bet the metal is so soaked with oil residue that no cleaning short or sandblasting could remove it enough for the POR to stick, Also you see it is no longer " silver".
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