Turbo VR6 DeLorean

[DeLorean03]

I don't know - I think you're going to miss K-Jet and not know what to do with your time when you're not trouble shooting something every other week :nervous:

Um, nope. Sure won't miss it :P.

[Tomcio]

I don't know - I think you're going to miss K-Jet and not know what to do with your time when you're not trouble shooting something every other week :nervous:

Oh, c'mon guys. K-Jet is not that bad. I've put a lot of miles on my two cars without ever touching the K-Jet. Absolutely trouble free miles with good performance. My 6149 with stock K-Jet would start right up every time, even in freezing weather (0F, -15C) and delivered 8 seconds 0-60 every time at 24MPG average. If you need to come back to it all the time it means you didn't fix it in the first place! Fix it right and be trouble free for a long time.
I did have to fix mine when I first got the cars (clean, replace filters, replace injectors, replace seals) but after that I didn't have to worry about it anymore.
I'm not saying that K-Jet is perfect but it is a very reliable system that works when fixed right.

[toyotafreak88]

Awesome job! looks and sounds amazing, and the BOV sounds just right I think. I don't have time to read everything but I hope to see some hard pulls, perhaps a drag time with it! :D

[opethmike]

Oh, c'mon guys. K-Jet is not that bad. I've put a lot of miles on my two cars without ever touching the K-Jet. Absolutely trouble free miles with good performance. My 6149 with stock K-Jet would start right up every time, even in freezing weather (0F, -15C) and delivered 8 seconds 0-60 every time at 24MPG average. If you need to come back to it all the time it means you didn't fix it in the first place! Fix it right and be trouble free for a long time.
I did have to fix mine when I first got the cars (clean, replace filters, replace injectors, replace seals) but after that I didn't have to worry about it anymore.
I'm not saying that K-Jet is perfect but it is a very reliable system that works when fixed right.

+1

[SherryC]

I don't know - I think you're going to miss K-Jet and not know what to do with your time when you're not trouble shooting something every other week :nervous:

Shhhhh..... Imma get him to help restore my D in his spare time !!!

[DeLorean03]

What "spare time" ??

[SherryC]

What "spare time" ??

Awright, ya got me there :rofl:

[SEO Motorsports]

Today I drove the car to work on the new injectors and I must say it's not the same car. The car is much smoother and my A/F reading are very stable now. I guess it's a good thing to have six working injectors!

I replace the one leaking axle seal the transmission had last night and just need to install the new brake kit and this car should be ready to go.

[DeLorean03]

Excellent stuff, Eddie!

[Nicholas R]

I replace the one leaking axle seal the transmission had last night and just need to install the new brake kit and this car should be ready to go.

You make that sound like such a small job, lol. You actually pulled the drive shaft flange out of the transmission and replaced the lip seal? I assume you had to drain all the fluid right? Just want to be sure I'm thinking about the right seal. I guess having a lift really makes things nice :biggrin:

[Starglider]

I'm not saying that K-Jet is perfect but it is a very reliable system that works when fixed right.

That's true for a stock engine but the DMC-12's early K-Jet does not deal with forced induction well. This is why the BAE & Island kits were hard to tune, why Legend had such a hard time tuning the prototypes and why the DMCH supercharger needs an extra injector with a separate controller.

[SEO Motorsports]

You make that sound like such a small job, lol. You actually pulled the drive shaft flange out of the transmission and replaced the lip seal? I assume you had to drain all the fluid right? Just want to be sure I'm thinking about the right seal. I guess having a lift really makes things nice :biggrin:

An hour fro start to finish. I had to sleeve the output shaft hub because the seal surface was not in good shape. I had a no fluid come out when I removed the seal because it was leaking, so I just topped it off when everything was back together.

[DeLorean03]

Caliper brackets get machined into shape and sent out tomorrow:

26759

[Nicholas R]

Caliper brackets get machined into shape and sent out tomorrow:

26759

What material is that? You're going to love the new brakes. You will definitely feel the difference; no doubt.

[DeLorean03]

What material is that? You're going to love the new brakes. You will definitely feel the difference; no doubt.

They are made from 6061 aluminum.

Yeah, Nick, I can't wait to get these bad boys. The machinist is working on them now. Should go out towards Eddie either Monday or Tuesday!

[DGI]

Just read through the entire thread.

I've always been a D enthusiast and have been collecting memorabilia for quite some time. I recently wrote off the possibility of owning this car because of its lack of power and general compromises a 30 year old car would offer over a similar car. I mean by the time I buy and modify a D I will logically be somewhere in the $30-35K range for a clean car. That's Z06/Viper/996 territory.

This conversion has re-sparked my interest in the car. I already own a VR motor'd car and am VERY happy with its performance and reliability. Adding a turbo will only make it more fun and putting it in a car that I have dreamed of owning since I was a little kid is the icing on the cake. I WILL be a customer of Ed's as soon as its financially possible (newborn at home is ~50 days old).

Thanks for chatting with me today Ed and hopefully I can see you and the car up in OH in a couple weeks. Otherwise I'll swing by your shop to say hello next time I come down to FL.

Cheers!

[DeLorean03]

Caliper brackets were delivered to Eddie today. He is assembling the brake system tonight, and possibly will have the car on the road with the new setup by sometime tomorrow.

I arrive to pick the car up 2 weeks from today or yesterday by plane. Driving it all 14 hours back to Dayton.

If that isn't a good testament of Eddie's work, I don't know what is D: ...

[DeLorean03]

It just got a lil' bit more real...

http://i1246.photobucket.com/albums/gg607/delorean03/IMG_2904.jpg (http://s1246.photobucket.com/user/delorean03/media/IMG_2904.jpg.html)

[Nicholas R]

It just got a lil' bit more real...

http://i1246.photobucket.com/albums/gg607/delorean03/IMG_2904.jpg (http://s1246.photobucket.com/user/delorean03/media/IMG_2904.jpg.html)

Nice! 11" discs? Is that a black oxide coating on them from wilwood?

[DeLorean03]

Nice! 11" discs? Is that a black oxide coating on them from wilwood?

Sure is :).

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/wil-160-7097bk/overview/

[pezzonovante88]

Niiiiice. Jealous ;)

[DeLorean03]

Niiiiice. Jealous ;)

Thank you!

Don't be too jealous though; anyone can have this setup. Lou came to our forums and generously gave us most of the information needed to do this too. I called him up and got the information for all the "little bits" like adapters, bolts to connect the wheel hat to the rotors, and new brake lines. Only thing you need from him are the custom caliper brackets.

Ordered everything from Summit Racing, Fastenal, and Car Shop, Inc.

I have all of the information - all the part numbers, quantity needed, - everything.

Hot rodded Wilwood brake setup (http://dmctalk.org/showthread.php?9166-Front-brake-ugrade-kit)

Eddie has finished installing the brake kit; everything is good with a slight modification to the car's suspension. NOTHING game-ending - just a small grinding job he needs to do so the car brakes perfectly when not in a straight line. I'll let him fill everyone in on that.

Other than that, he said "holy crap does the car stop fast now."

[Nicholas R]

I have to agree with Ed. No matter what some people may say, you're going to notice a huge improvement in braking performance. Well done to you, Ed, and Lou!

[DeLorean03]

I have to agree with Ed. No matter what some people may say, you're going to notice a huge improvement in braking performance. Well done to you, Ed, and Lou!

Thanks, Nick! I can't wait to see what the Wilwood hardware does! Can't believe the show is only a lil' more than a month away!

[Timebender]

I have a quick question- how do you install AC when you do an engine swap? I'm looking at an 81 with a Corvette c350 in it, and it runs okay, been sitting over 20 years, the owner never drove it but fired it up once in a whole, as it's non-smogged and we're in California. Anyway there's no AC, and this week alone it's been close to 100 out.
Thoughts? Also the guy wants 15k, but knowing it won't pass smog, has a hacked up front under the bonnet for a bigger radiator, and lots of frame mods/brackets welded in for the engine, what would you offer? Interior is in okay shape, electrical kind of works...

[Henrik]

Not sure of this answers your question but when I pulled my engine I unbolted the compressor (but left the hoses still connected) and simply hung the compressor off to the side of the engine bay. In other words, regardless of the motor you're looking at, the AC system is separate or at least it should be "restorable". (Did any Ds come without AC I wonder?)
26945

Really, I was just looking for an excuse to post something in this awesome thread!

[Nicholas R]

I have a quick question- how do you install AC when you do an engine swap? I'm looking at an 81 with a Corvette c350 in it, and it runs okay, been sitting over 20 years, the owner never drove it but fired it up once in a whole, as it's non-smogged and we're in California. Anyway there's no AC, and this week alone it's been close to 100 out.
Thoughts? Also the guy wants 15k, but knowing it won't pass smog, has a hacked up front under the bonnet for a bigger radiator, and lots of frame mods/brackets welded in for the engine, what would you offer? Interior is in okay shape, electrical kind of works...

That depends; is there no AC because it never came from the factory? Or no AC because the engine has no compressor? AC systems are very simple: compressor, condenser, evaporator, accumulator/dryer, orifice tube, blowerfan/ducting. What components, if any, are still in the car? If you've got nothing, you're in for a lot of work.

[DGI]

that brake setup looks serious. many times I upgrade brakes and suspension on my cars before messing with power/drivetrain. Thanks for posting a link to the brake upgrade thread!

[SEO Motorsports]

I finished up installing the brakes yesterday and had to make some small modifications that I will relay to Lou to correct a slight issue when the car is lowered and the suspension geometry changes. These brakes are very nice once the pads are broken in and you get the black oxide coating off, this take 10-20 miles of driving and braking and everything settles inn. I like the feel of the brakes and best of all, there is no brake fading like the solid rotors on the stock brake setup. It took me 5 hours to install these brakes but I had to pull the brake off multiple times until I corrected the issue. These should be able to be installed in 4 hours on jack stands in a garage with hand tools. Changing the brake pads will take 30 min or less!!, it's a very nice setup and will make a nice addition to car with added performance. This is the setup I will now recommend to my customers.

[Timebender]

That depends; is there no AC because it never came from the factory? Or no AC because the engine has no compressor? AC systems are very simple: compressor, condenser, evaporator, accumulator/dryer, orifice tube, blowerfan/ducting. What components, if any, are still in the car? If you've got nothing, you're in for a lot of work.

I'm guessing at most only the compressor is missing- didn't get a really good look unfortunately. I'd hope that the guy who did the conversion didn't rip out all the hoses etc.

[Nicholas R]

In that case you should have no problem. You just need a compressor that works with your belt/accessory configuration. You'll also want to get some of the aerosol AC line flush to be sure everything is clear. (Might also consider a new accumulator and orifice tube). Then just hook it up and balance it. There should be a spec out there for the amount required; or you could charge based on pressure (though that's not as reliable).

[Timebender]

Thanks Nick

[PJK]

Any 0-60 or 1/4 miles times? I realize this swap wasn't intended to be all about the performance, but I am interested to know how much it did improve it.

[DeLorean03]

Any 0-60 or 1/4 miles times? I realize this swap wasn't intended to be all about the performance, but I am interested to know how much it did improve it.

The car has just been finished and is undergoing final tuning/minimal cosmetic touch-ups right now. We are working on getting it on a dyno within the next two weeks so there's some kind of "verification" as to why this project was done.

Don't get me wrong - part of this was definitely geared towards performance. Claims have it that an automatic DeLorean has like - 95HP - at the wheels. That's just horrible. I chose Eddie to do this project for several reasons:

1. When kept in tune with proper precautions, the automatic trans is stronger than wet toilet paper.
2. To give the DeLorean the speed it looks like it has.
3. To finally do away with KJet and install a more modern fuel system.
4. To break free of applications used from the 1970s (mainly brakes and fuel system)
5. To be able to spring-board to other projects down the road (for example, mate the VR6 with a Porsche transmission if it comes to it)
6. To be able to get people off my quarter panels in traffic
7. To give Eddie some strong networking opportunities with this car rolling out as one of his inaugural projects from SEO Motorsports.
8. And finally, to be able to just get in the car, shut the door, turn the key, and cruise.


There are other minimal reasons, but that is my input from my side. I am sure Eddie has his own reasons.

There will come a time that I take this car to a drag strip and open it up. With my car, it is a product of Eddie's shop, and I know everyone's itching to know those kinds of stats.

So..... I am considering an idea at DCS 2014. I think what would be really cool is if we could get some non-stock DeLoreans all together and go here:

http://www.kilkare.com/

And we could light some tires against each other or some other cars that think all we brought are "slow as hell" DeLoreans.

Would make for an interesting night.....!!

[NightFlyer]

So..... I am considering an idea at DCS 2014. I think what would be really cool is if we could get some non-stock DeLoreans all together and go here:

http://www.kilkare.com/

And we could light some tires against each other or some other cars that think all we brought are "slow as hell" DeLoreans.

Would make for an interesting night.....!!

Already setup and planned.

http://www.dmctoday.com/showthread.php?706-Kil-Kare-Dragway-DCS-Thursday-June-12-5pm-10pm

Would you like to join us? :biggrin:

[DeLorean03]

Already setup and planned.

http://www.dmctoday.com/showthread.php?706-Kil-Kare-Dragway-DCS-Thursday-June-12-5pm-10pm

Would you like to join us? :biggrin:

I was thinking a lil' later in the weekend. That time is the prime time that everyone is showing up for DCS, and I'd like that to be more of a "laid back and relax" kind of night.

Don't get me wrong - very cool that you've taken the initiative to plan that out, and if Eddie comes earlier than Thursday, he and I may come out there. Then again.... Thursday may be way more low-key at the drag strip, so Eddie and I may push to come on out there....

We'll see as the time gets closer!

And I meant no disrespect with the "slow as hell" comment. That was just me speaking what nearly anyone would say at a cruise-in.

Just because I got this new setup doesn't mean I am trying to talk down to stock owners or anything - just throwing that out there.

[NightFlyer]

I was thinking a lil' later in the weekend. That time is the prime time that everyone is showing up for DCS, and I'd like that to be more of a "laid back and relax" kind of night.

Don't get me wrong - very cool that you've taken the initiative to plan that out, and if Eddie comes earlier than Thursday, he and I may come out there. Then again.... Thursday may be way more low-key at the drag strip, so Eddie and I may push to come on out there....

We'll see as the time gets closer!

And I meant no disrespect with the "slow as hell" comment. That was just me speaking what nearly anyone would say at a cruise-in.

Just because I got this new setup doesn't mean I am trying to talk down to stock owners or anything - just throwing that out there.

Yeah right - turbo VR6 that he hasn't even driven yet and he's already talkin smack about stock/OEM cars! The nerve of this guy! :mad2:

J/K - I know you were just playing. :smile:

Believe me, I would have preferred the outing to be a little later in the weekend as well, however, that Thursday is the only time that they have open racing according to their posted schedule. Friday, Saturday, and Sunday have planned structured events:

June 13th- Friday Night Lightz- Gates Open 6:00PM-11:00PM

June 14th & 15th - Outlaw weekend - Xtreme Outlaw Series & 1,000' Box & No Box Gates open at 10:00AM
Spectators $10, Seniors 65 & Up, Military, Police, Fire Half Price, 12 & under FREE

The Friday Night Lightz program is a structured by class elimination trophy/cash racing w/ entry fees. Outlaw Weekend is a sponsored series which isn't open to non-invited racers. That leaves Thursday as the only opportunity for fun, laid back, screw around grudge racing.

So, I hope that we see you out there - I'd love to see what the VR6 turbo can put down the 1/4 mile. :biggrin:

FYI - depending upon what your car is capable of, you may need to a bring a helmet if your car runs 14 seconds or faster (and it will be subjected to a more thorough tech/safety inspection than the rest of us).

[opethmike]

Viva la K-jet!

[NightFlyer]

You should have Eddie install a line-loc so that you can build boost at the start line before launching without having to do a neutral drop on the transmission (which I personally wouldn't do). :biggrin:

[DeLorean03]

So, I hope that we see you out there - I'd love to see what the VR6 turbo can put down the 1/4 mile. :biggrin:

FYI - depending upon what your car is capable of, you may need to a bring a helmet if your car runs 14 seconds or faster (and it will be subjected to a more thorough tech/safety inspection than the rest of us).

We'll see. I dunno what it can do yet. The dyno is more what I am concerned about, but Eddie is working on that, and we may have one ready when I go pick the car up soon. I'll keep everyone in the loop on that one.

Maybe on Thursday night, we'll show up a bit later in the evening. I dunno yet - we'll see ;).

[NightFlyer]

If Nick is going to DCS, we need to get him out to the track with the LS1 - now that would be a great heads-up: the LS1 vs the boosted VR6 :cool1:

[DeLorean03]

More and more, everyone has been clamoring for that matchup. That or one of us versus the 2JZ. I think I can speak for Nick when I say that neither of us will be waiting at the Christmas tree stop-n-go lights ;).

[SEO Motorsports]

LOL, lets not get carried away here. This car is not a drag car nor do I recommends brake boosting this transmission. The transmission handles the power it's making now just fine, but brake boosting and launching is not going to be good for that transmission because this VR6 puts down the power fast and hard. Holding the transmission under a hard load generates a lot of heat fast and there is no air flowing through the cooler. To keep the transmission happy, the car is running a two stage oil cooling system. I kept Jeremiah's original oil cooler and added a cooler made for an RV or truck. I recommend a least be moving 15-20mph and then you can floor it and have run, AKA roll racing. This car is definitely a highway monster and just keeps pulling.

[SEO Motorsports]

Here is a video of the car getting on the highway and I let off about 50 feet before the onramp was over. The car was being held back because I finally noticed I had my over boost protection set to low and the boost was just hitting it and the ECU was pulling timing and cutting the power. Ignore the temp gauge, it's off and I still need to address that.

http://i40.photobucket.com/albums/e239/crazyedfsu/th_IMG_1193_zps09d2cba1.jpg (http://i40.photobucket.com/albums/e239/crazyedfsu/IMG_1193_zps09d2cba1.mp4)

http://s40.photobucket.com/user/crazyedfsu/media/IMG_1193_zps09d2cba1.mp4.html

[ALEXAKOS]

This is more like what McFly should have had to reach that clock tower at 88MPH with that short city road he had to accelerate.....:partyhat:
In other words.... Some serious DELOREAN acceleration!

Well done buddy. I bet it feels friggin awesome !!:biggrin::thumbup:

[SEO Motorsports]

It's VERY fun to drive and I have to say again, being an auto car it's much more comfortable to drive and enjoy. Having an auto car is not a bad thing anymore if you ask me. A good well implemented turbo kit with EFI on a Auto car should get the job done for most owners.

[Starglider]

It's VERY fun to drive and I have to say again, being an auto car it's much more comfortable to drive and enjoy.

I'm sure doubling the power helps a lot, but three speeds still seems a bit limiting for powerband and economy. I have a 4-speed auto in my 4x4 and it's only tolerable because it has a low range mode (for off road) and I don't drive it fast. I have not driven an auto DMC-12, but the manual really feels like it needs those 5 speeds. Of course, you could swap in a more modern transmission : you mentioned a Porsche trans earlier, will be interesting to see if you go for that.

[SEO Motorsports]

I can swap in a Porsche transaxle but it's going to cost a lot more.

[SEO Motorsports]

Today I took the VR6 DeLorean to the dyno to see what it put down. It was a Mustang dyno owned by a car enthusiast that was generous enough to let me use the dyno on such a short notice. I was a little shocked when I found out I had to drive on the dyno because he didn’t want to be responsible if anything went wrong. I have run a manual car on the dyno many times but this was my first auto car. I must say that it was a PITA to get a clean run because the car wanted to upshift even when I turned off the kick down signal to the tranny ECU.

http://i40.photobucket.com/albums/e239/crazyedfsu/IMG_1198_zpse98aacee.jpg (http://s40.photobucket.com/user/crazyedfsu/media/IMG_1198_zpse98aacee.jpg.html)


The temp was in the 90’s in the shop and the best numbers were 206hp 268ftlbs of torque (Corrected) at the wheels on 5.5psi of boost and this engine has had its compression dropped to 9:1, so that falls in line of where we should be. After I saw the torque numbers I was not about to turn up the boost anymore because torque is what breaks things. I knew the car was putting down some good torque numbers but I did not expect that much torque and so fast. To get these numbers I had to let the car shift from second to third so we could get full power with the throttle completely open. To be realistic the torque number may be a little high (10%) because of the car getting a head start from second to third. Unfortunately the dyno graph was all over the place with the car upshifting and then shifting back to third gear. I did get a picture of the computer screen though.


http://i40.photobucket.com/albums/e239/crazyedfsu/IMG_1200_zpse3558253.jpg (http://s40.photobucket.com/user/crazyedfsu/media/IMG_1200_zpse3558253.jpg.html)




Here is the cleanest run I could get a graph of with the car going through most of the RPM range without upshifting and jumping back to third in the middle of the run. I had to roll into it and hold the throttle at about 80% to keep it from upshifting on this run so the power numbers are naturally lower but you can see the hp just keeps wanting to climb and the torque is a nice flat line all the way across.


http://i40.photobucket.com/albums/e239/crazyedfsu/Scan0001_zps65d3a39d.jpg (http://s40.photobucket.com/user/crazyedfsu/media/Scan0001_zps65d3a39d.jpg.html)



I was hoping to be able to send Jeremiah off with 250whp, 225whp on this mustang dyno but I had to make the call and stay where it was at and keep the car reliable until we build an auto tranny or go 5-speed. Making power with this engine is not the problem its keeping this transmission together I’m more worried about at the moment. I was not expecting the torque to be that much higher than the HP and run all through the RPM band, which was the most impressive part of the whole thing. The last car I personally witnessed with that nice of a torque curve was my 996 turbo. Overall I was happy with the results and the greatest thing was I was able to turn the A/C on and drive it home.

[NightFlyer]

Kudos to you for actually posting the results :thumbup:

So often in the community, we hear claims about what stage and spec packages will do for the performance of a car, but I'm personally unaware of anyone that has actually posted up any kind of definitive results before.

So I LOVE seeing this - AWESOME :aniclap:

I'm shocked about the torque as well. Guess that custom intake really has things geared towards the low end torque - and you said it wasn't a drag car... :wink:

Can you give some more background/info on the donor VR6? Displacement? 12V or 24V? Year of manufacturer? I think that the first gen VR6's were known for biasing torque over horsepower.

If it wasn't for the fragility of the trans, as a straight line 1/4 mile performance kind of guy, I'd actually welcome the little extra torque over horse.

That's one hell of a response 'curve' (or lack thereof) - that thing is constantly wanting to make power :biggrin:

[DeLorean03]

It is also relevant to note this is a Mustang Dynamometer, which are known to be a bit more stingy with the numbers. Search nearly any car forums, and the average deduction in numbers between Mustang and Dynojet is in the 10-12% range. I may try to put it on a Dynojet just to confirm it - as LS1Tech Forums and Corvette Forums constantly compare Mustang and Dynojet.

We could also advertise BHP and Torque numbers, but hey, the "after" numbers are already there.

I'm pleased with the situation. The transmission is the weakest link here. We got to this point - we'll get to a 5 speed conversion too - in a year or two.

[SEO Motorsports]

Kudos to you for actually posting the results :thumbup:

So often in the community, we hear claims about what stage and spec packages will do for the performance of a car, but I'm personally unaware of anyone that has actually posted up any kind of definitive results before.

So I LOVE seeing this - AWESOME :aniclap:

I'm shocked about the torque as well. Guess that custom intake really has things geared towards the low end torque - and you said it wasn't a drag car... :wink:

Can you give some more background/info on the donor VR6? Displacement? 12V or 24V? Year of manufacturer? I think that the first gen VR6's were known for biasing torque over horsepower.

If it wasn't for the fragility of the trans, as a straight line 1/4 mile performance kind of guy, I'd actually welcome the little extra torque over horse.

That's one hell of a response 'curve' (or lack thereof) - that thing is constantly wanting to make power :biggrin:


I appreciate the kind words. I would have to attribute the high torque to the turbo I sized for this because I did not want turbo lag. The donor engine is out of a 2001 VW Passat and it's a 12v VR6 that originally came with 10.5:1 compression. Normally torque somewhat climbs with the HP but I think the transmission is holding the engine in it's torque band where it likes it. The only bad part about this is that the transmission has to take that 245ftlbs of torque blow every time between second to third. I was expecting the torque to come in under the third gear load and not climb that high in second gear. As you can see in the graph the shift from second to third the torque was instantly there where the hp fell as expected. It's very simple to turn up the power but we're going to let Jeremiah have a little fun before we go experimenting to much. I had the car pushing about 8 PSI for a few days and it was considerably faster but I didn't want to chance it.

[Lightning]

Good job. I'm curious what my car will look like after you are done compared to stock, too bad we didn't baseline it.

[SEO Motorsports]

Good job. I'm curious what my car will look like after you are done compared to stock, too bad we didn't baseline it.

Your car should be MUCH easier to get numbers out of. That auto "slush box" as every one keeps referring to it as eats up a lot of the power, but once again it shift WAY faster than you can with a manual car so it makes up for it.

[opethmike]

Which auto shifts faster than manual? Certainly not the DeLorean's.....?

[SEO Motorsports]

The time it take for this auto to shift between gears is much faster than any human can do in a manual car. Are you referring to the same thing or something else?

[Josh]

The time it take for this auto to shift between gears is much faster than any human can do in a manual car. Are you referring to the same thing or something else?

I can agree for the actual event of shifting the gears. But not for the actual decision to shift the gears, not by a longshot lol

[SEO Motorsports]

I can agree for the actual event of shifting the gears. But not for the actual decision to shift the gears, not by a longshot lol


I agree that the transmission can't read our minds, that would be a ridiculous assumption. But we could reprogram the transmission ECU to change the shift points to what we want and that's not such a long shot.

[NightFlyer]

I appreciate the kind words. I would have to attribute the high torque to the turbo I sized for this because I did not want turbo lag. The donor engine is out of a 2001 VW Passat and it's a 12v VR6 that originally came with 10.5:1 compression. Normally torque somewhat climbs with the HP but I think the transmission is holding the engine in it's torque band where it likes it. The only bad part about this is that the transmission has to take that 245ftlbs of torque blow every time between second to third. I was expecting the torque to come in under the third gear load and not climb that high in second gear. As you can see in the graph the shift from second to third the torque was instantly there where the hp fell as expected. It's very simple to turn up the power but we're going to let Jeremiah have a little fun before we go experimenting to much. I had the car pushing about 8 PSI for a few days and it was considerably faster but I didn't want to chance it.

Specs show rated torque to be 181 ft-lbs. @ 3200 rpm and rated horsepower to be 174 hp @ 5800 rpm. NA, torque builds fast in the lower band, then ramps down as horsepower climbs to its max in the upper band.

Combining the naturally torque happy motor with a small turbo = torque monster in the lower power band :biggrin:

Like you said, going to a bigger turbo would help even things out a bit, but then you'd also be increasing lag.

Regardless, it's still an AWESOME feat! :thumbup:

[vwdmc16]

Nice to get some hard data number! nothing beats torque!

Please tell you dyno operator to clean up that print out, why is there negative numbers on the Y axis for power and tq? thats not needed to display a power run. And is the the X axis on a time scale? Why not RPM? Ive run dozens of hours on a Mustang dyno, its pretty easy to fix up that graph, He should be able to load that saved run and fix the x and y axis for a new print out.


I think next we need to see a third person video comparing this beast to a stock D rolling acceleration.

[DeLorean03]

I think next we need to see a third person video comparing this beast to a stock D rolling acceleration.

DCS is only a month away .....;)

[SEO Motorsports]

Nice to get some hard data number! nothing beats torque!

Please tell you dyno operator to clean up that print out, why is there negative numbers on the Y axis for power and tq? thats not needed to display a power run. And is the the X axis on a time scale? Why not RPM? Ive run dozens of hours on a Mustang dyno, its pretty easy to fix up that graph, He should be able to load that saved run and fix the x and y axis for a new print out.


I think next we need to see a third person video comparing this beast to a stock D rolling acceleration.


I don't know how well this guy knew how to manipulate the SW. I will ask if he can do what you recommended. I should have asked for all the log files, I will ask next time.

[SEO Motorsports]

Specs show rated torque to be 181 ft-lbs. @ 3200 rpm and rated horsepower to be 174 hp @ 5800 rpm. NA, torque builds fast in the lower band, then ramps down as horsepower climbs to its max in the upper band.

Combining the naturally torque happy motor with a small turbo = torque monster in the lower power band :biggrin:

Like you said, going to a bigger turbo would help even things out a bit, but then you'd also be increasing lag.

Regardless, it's still an AWESOME feat! :thumbup:

I guess I am not use to working with automatic cars on the dyno but it is a very fun car to drive. we did what we planned to do and that was build a platform that has a lot of potential for the future. All Jeremiah has to do is decide between a built auto or go with a manual transmission.

[thirdmanj]

i guess i am not use to working with automatic cars on the dyno but it is a very fun car to drive. We did what we planned to do and that was build a platform that has a lot of potential for the future. All jeremiah has to do is decide between a built auto or go with a manual transmission.

Man-U-al, Man-U-al, Man-U-al!!

[NightFlyer]

DCS is only a month away .....;)

Do you and Eddie think you guys will make it out to Kil-Kare on Thursday night for our little outing?

I may have a BAE turbo'd PRV car showing up to that event - it will be a lot of fun :biggrin:

We need to get Nick out there too with the LS1 :thumbup:

BTW - For anyone who does plan on running on their car at the track on Thursday night, make sure you wear long pants, as shorts are not allowed on racers. Also, make sure that you're wearing at least a short sleeve shirt, as sleeveless shirts are not allowed on racers - leave the wife beaters and tank tops at the hotel.

[DeLorean03]

Do you and Eddie think you guys will make it out to Kil-Kare on Thursday night for our little outing?

I may have a BAE turbo'd PRV car showing up to that event - it will be a lot of fun :biggrin:

We need to get Nick out there too with the LS1 :thumbup:

BTW - For anyone who does plan on running on their car at the track on Thursday night, make sure you wear long pants, as shorts are not allowed on racers. Also, make sure that you're wearing at least a short sleeve shirt, as sleeveless shirts are not allowed on racers - leave the wife beaters and tank tops at the hotel.

We can, but we're not racing the turbo VR6 on a dragstrip. The worst thing we can do to this car is floor it at idle; the heat buildup in the transmission due to the torque converter holding pressure would be pretty massive.

This car is for blasting down the interstate - not drag racing. Just making that very clear before there's too much buildup of seeing it perform at idle.

[Nicholas R]

Do you and Eddie think you guys will make it out to Kil-Kare on Thursday night for our little outing?

I may have a BAE turbo'd PRV car showing up to that event - it will be a lot of fun :biggrin:

We need to get Nick out there too with the LS1 :thumbup:

BTW - For anyone who does plan on running on their car at the track on Thursday night, make sure you wear long pants, as shorts are not allowed on racers. Also, make sure that you're wearing at least a short sleeve shirt, as sleeveless shirts are not allowed on racers - leave the wife beaters and tank tops at the hotel.

I'm going to see what I can do but so far I can't make any promises until Friday. That week I'm driving from Orlando to Cincinnati, then Cincinnati to Detroit for business, then back to Cincinnati. After DCS I'm driving to Ashville, NC for a wedding, then back to Orlando. I'm not sure if I'll be free Thursday or not.

Do you know if Kilkare requires helmets? You should find out. Last time I went to Thursday Night Lightz was in 2012 and at the time it was hosted by Edgewater down in Cincinnati. At the time they required helmets for all drivers in cars running 1/4mi in 13.99sec or less.

I already am packing normal clothes, business clothes, a wedding suit, my typical road trip tools/extra parts, my pinball machine backglass, and I'm hoping to pickup a transmission at DCS to drive back to FL with (all in a DeLorean). Needless to say, space is precious. Bringing my helmet may not be in the cards.

[NightFlyer]

I'm going to see what I can do but so far I can't make any promises until Friday. That week I'm driving from Orlando to Cincinnati, then Cincinnati to Detroit for business, then back to Cincinnati. After DCS I'm driving to Ashville, NC for a wedding, then back to Orlando. I'm not sure if I'll be free Thursday or not.

Do you know if Kilkare requires helmets? You should find out. Last time I went to Thursday Night Lightz was in 2012 and at the time it was hosted by Edgewater down in Cincinnati. At the time they required helmets for all drivers in cars running 1/4mi in 13.99sec or less.

I already am packing normal clothes, business clothes, a wedding suit, my typical road trip tools/extra parts, my pinball machine backglass, and I'm hoping to pickup a transmission at DCS to drive back to FL with (all in a DeLorean). Needless to say, space is precious. Bringing my helmet may not be in the cards.

Thursday night is merely a test and tune session - not a structured elimination Night Lightz program, which is happening on Friday. That's why we're going out there on Thursday - we just want to screw around a little and have some fun, not competition race.

Helmets are only required if your car runs the 1/4 in less than 14 seconds, or as you already stated, 13.99 or less. I'll have a helmet there (even though I don't require one) for others to use if they need it and want to use it.

[NightFlyer]

We can, but we're not racing the turbo VR6 on a dragstrip. The worst thing we can do to this car is floor it at idle; the heat buildup in the transmission due to the torque converter holding pressure would be pretty massive.

This car is for blasting down the interstate - not drag racing. Just making that very clear before there's too much buildup of seeing it perform at idle.

You can run your car down the track however you like - there's no rule saying that you have to floor it off the line.... :wink:

Seeing as I'll have the stock/OEM NCTs on my car, I don't plan on beating on it any. Just going out there to have a good time :smile:

I don't think that any of us with D's are going to be bleach/water boxing our cars at all either :biggrin:

[SEO Motorsports]

I don't see running it at the track being a problem, just don't brake boost it at the start.

[DeLorean03]

Been here since Friday...and boy....is it getting fun.

27251

[NightFlyer]

I'm guessing that you have an ear-to-ear constant grin on your face :thumbup:

[SEO Motorsports]

I've been getting texts from Jeremiah as he's driving up and he's doing well and should be in Ohio by 4am.

[DeLorean03]

As Eddie stated, I made it home safely to Ohio. Started the drive at around 10am and got home at about 5:15am the next morning.

http://i1246.photobucket.com/albums/gg607/delorean03/Home.jpg (http://s1246.photobucket.com/user/delorean03/media/Home.jpg.html)

The car made it home with zero issues on its maiden voyage. It was a wild drive - needless to say - there were people all over the interstate going nuts, and it was a very enjoyable time. Very long drive though...my goodness...stupid Orlando downtown traffic.

Everyone here has seen the pictures and videos of this car, but it is a completely different story face to face. Pictures say a lot, but seeing Eddie's work in person is a whole different world. His attention to detail and methodical craftsmanship is seriously second to none. The car's engine is so well organized; everything has a place and a purpose. Nothing is just in a random spot or "There's no where else to put this except here..." mentality - everything is so clean and thought out. He has gone so above and beyond my expectations.

He has done something remarkable and truly special with this vehicle. I had many people walk up to me at gas stations all throughout the drive. All walks of life - people just getting off work, college kids, veteran leather-clad motorcyclists - and everyone loved the car. A few people saw and heard the engine, and the smile it gave them when revving it a couple times was just awesome. After being a DeLorean owner for 11 years this November, hearing people say "Would you please rev it for me a couple times?" or "Hey, would you please get up a lil on it when you leave this traffic light?" is a VERY different and welcoming world.

Eddie has me setup with TunerStudio, an absolutely AMAZING piece of software. No more analog meters or breaking the fuel system open over a possibly warm engine and being uncomfortable in a hot engine bay. This is an example of what I see now from my laptop while hooked up to the MegaSquirt ECU (not my actual stats, just a pulled example from Google Image search):

http://i1246.photobucket.com/albums/gg607/delorean03/TunderStudio_Ex-1.jpg (http://s1246.photobucket.com/user/delorean03/media/TunderStudio_Ex-1.jpg.html)

That's just the start-up gauges. The sheer number of things this software can do is staggering, and the list of variables you can alter at the click of a mouse button is ...well....the future ;).

For the first time in almost 11 years, I feel I have what I really have always wanted in a DeLorean - a modern car with some solid pick-up and go. It's no 2014 Corvette killer - do not get me wrong - but it is pretty quick. Eddie designed this project to where there is zero turbo lag. You push the pedal, and this car moves. Brakes are very strong. I actually had to use them lastnight because some "Sunday drunk" in Tennessee decided to merge into my lane with zero warning. I went from 70+ to probably 35 in what seemed like 2-3 seconds, and the car handled just fine. The brake setup proved its worth right there, and I will be upgrading the rears with Lou's follow up kit coming later this year.

The exterior lowering of this car really makes the car's image pop. Seriously, I don't know how I went 10 years with it looking like a dang 4x4. The lowering kit was well worth it, and thank you to DMCMW and DPI for supplying me the springs and shocks. Seriously awesome hardware, and the car's image is solid now. It looks aggressive; it looks ready to have some fun!

Eddie and I discussed this many times, it's the same car, and yet it is not. As Eddie said, it looks very crisp and sharp, and the exhaust note is complete music to my ears. Knowing that engine is back there ready to go at a moment's notice is so surreal; I am beyond pleased with what Eddie has done here.

Guys, it is easy for me to spend other people's money. It takes nothing for me to share my raw enthusiasm for what has become of this car. Don't get me wrong; this was not a cheap endeavor, and I do not regret the spending of one cent on this. The transformation was so completely worth it on every level imaginable. If you have the cash and patience, SEO Motorsports will blow away all expectations.

I know I've said this many a times in this thread but: engine, exhaust, EFI, springs, shocks, brakes, and all the custom fabrication (and believe me, that's some serious hours) - done in 7 months. Honestly, the fact Eddie did this from Nov 2013 to May 2014 with a 40 hour job and a family is spectacular.

This is something truly special. I'll never regret or look back.

http://i1246.photobucket.com/albums/gg607/delorean03/Home_1.jpg (http://s1246.photobucket.com/user/delorean03/media/Home_1.jpg.html)

[250in5]

CONGRATULATIONS on this!! Paying someone else to do work (at this level) is a stressful and tumultuous undertaking by both parties. Your enthusiasm for this project and the results has already got me trying to find a car carrier to send my car down to FL. Seriously.
Making it "fast" isn't my main concern but, like you said- I don't want to have to drive in the slow lane anymore and this looks to be a very reasonable engine swap with reliable (and readily-available) parts used. I can't wait to see a video of the end result with the car running (turbo mounted up).

Thanks for venturing out and doing something that the rest of us haven't...yet. ;o) Kudos to you both- looking forward to more photos too!

Korry

Oh, and here is my little turbo motorcycle for you Ed...alcohol-turbo-MFI. We set the Funnybike World Record in the 1/4-mile...6.47 at 217mph. 45psi of boost gets the job done. ;o) I do love me some turbocharged motors and looking forward to my turbocharged Delorean as well!27333

[SEO Motorsports]

You'll enjoy the car after more than doubling the power and getting rid of a lot of the wiring and vacuum hose mess in the engine bay. The goal is fast enough to have fun but reliable enough to take your significant other out and not be worried it's not going to start!...ask me how I know that......

[250in5]

Ed,

BOY, that's the truth. I always have my fingers crossed when I drive my car- especially when it is warm out...like today!

Now, let's see what you can do with a 5-speed car and a turbo....let the games begin. ;o)

[DeLorean03]

Quick update on this thread: two things I forgot to mention.

1. This was a 1020 mile drive over 16 hours in one day - its main maiden voyage.

2. My MPG is nearly 24 MPG now. It was 16 MPG with the PRV. Granted, I was running open loop on the stock motor.

Korry, thank you for your kind words. Eddie is the guy with the magic; I was just the guy writing checks and agreeing to things that he and I would discuss. Eddie kept this process very stress free. There were a couple moments where we had to discuss some options, but overall, this was a very smooth and painless process.

After having driven it such a long drive, I am taking a couple days off from driving it. Don't worry though, I'll get some videos of it running soon. Just need a break - plus Ohio overcast here is keeping rain clouds very imminent throughout the sky ._. ...

[Domi]

1020 miles, what a trip!
Probably some pretty nice landscape along the road. Any pic of your trip?

[NightFlyer]

1020 miles, what a trip!
Probably some pretty nice landscape along the road. Any pic of your trip?

Having done that trip myself (never in my D though), it's actually a rather mundane and boring drive, which is why you push to get it done and over with as quickly as possible. :ehh:

[NightFlyer]

Quick update on this thread: two things I forgot to mention.

1. This was a 1020 mile drive over 16 hours in one day - its main maiden voyage.

2. My MPG is nearly 24 MPG now. It was 16 MPG with the PRV. Granted, I was running open loop on the stock motor.

Korry, thank you for your kind words. Eddie is the guy with the magic; I was just the guy writing checks and agreeing to things that he and I would discuss. Eddie kept this process very stress free. There were a couple moments where we had to discuss some options, but overall, this was a very smooth and painless process.

After having driven it such a long drive, I am taking a couple days off from driving it. Don't worry though, I'll get some videos of it running soon. Just need a break - plus Ohio overcast here is keeping rain clouds very imminent throughout the sky ._. ...

You were only netting 16mpg with the auto PRV in open loop?!?!

Last summer, there were a few times when I hit over 30 mpg with my 5 speed (that was admittedly actively trying for top mpg numbers, which included select shifting and an average speed of 52mph). Even when I wasn't trying for max mpg, I'd still average around 27. And that's without the CO being fine tuned, although I was running closed loop (assuming the lambda was working, as my car runs so cool, I think it jumps in and out of closed loop).

We'll get some videos of you at Kil-Kare :biggrin:

The only question is whether or not they'll be more epic than watching me spill my transaxle and popping the NCTs while going down the track :thumbup:

[Rich W]

Having done that trip myself (never in my D though), it's actually a rather mundane and boring drive, which is why you push to get it done and over with as quickly as possible. :ehh:

Having driven a very similar route many times (even once, just for a "fun" drive), I will have to at least partially disagree.
While I may be as much as 2/3 in agreement (as mundane), there is at least 1/3 of the route that begs to be driven "spiritedly".

The I-75 route from Lexington, KY through Chattanooga, TN, is a very fun drive in a sports car, during most months of the year.

However, driving this route with a truck and trailer is less desireable (especially in bad weather) when you will hope for mundane.

[SEO Motorsports]

You were only netting 16mpg with the auto PRV in open loop?!?!

Last summer, there were a few times when I hit over 30 mpg with my 5 speed (that was admittedly actively trying for top mpg numbers, which included select shifting and an average speed of 52mph). Even when I wasn't trying for max mpg, I'd still average around 27. And that's without the CO being fine tuned, although I was running closed loop (assuming the lambda was working, as my car runs so cool, I think it jumps in and out of closed loop).

We'll get some videos of you at Kil-Kare :biggrin:

The only question is whether or not they'll be more epic than watching me spill my transaxle and popping the NCTs while going down the track :thumbup:

Do the drive in third gear all the way and compare the numbers.

[DeLorean03]

1020 miles, what a trip!
Probably some pretty nice landscape along the road. Any pic of your trip?

Just 3-4 actually. It was a lonnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnng drive.

This was after a flash rainstorm where the rain was so bad people were pulling over on the interstate.

http://i1246.photobucket.com/albums/gg607/delorean03/Rain.jpg (http://s1246.photobucket.com/user/delorean03/media/Rain.jpg.html)

[Domi]

Thanks for the pic!
Yes, I guess after so many miles, you must be tired, and don't think to take pictures, but just want to go back home.

[NightFlyer]

Having driven a very similar route many times (even once, just for a "fun" drive), I will have to at least partially disagree.
While I may be as much as 2/3 in agreement (as mundane), there is at least 1/3 of the route that begs to be driven "spiritedly".

The I-75 route from Lexington, KY through Chattanooga, TN, is a very fun drive in a sports car, during most months of the year.

However, driving this route with a truck and trailer is less desireable (especially in bad weather) when you will hope for mundane.

Yes, I should have excepted the Appalachia portion of the trip :thumbup:

[DeLorean03]

For those who are interested, I shot a 5 min video of the car - talking briefly about it and starting it, revving it, and letting it idle.

More videos to come as time goes along.

Enjoy!


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bO3Mxd13fMM&feature=youtu.be

[Nicholas R]

Do the drive in third gear all the way and compare the numbers.

I believe 4th in the manual is closest to 3rd in the automatic. They're both almost exactly 1:1.

I also agree, 16mpg seems a little low. I used to get in the low 20s on the highway open loop with the automatic. Still, every car is different; and the overdriven 5th gear definitely helps the MPG.

[SEO Motorsports]

From the research I've done the first three gears on the auto match the first three on the manual. But the car was not built to be an economy car anyways.

[Domi]

Great video, thank you for taking the time to do it and share it with us :thumbup:

[Nicholas R]

From the research I've done the first three gears on the auto match the first three on the manual. But the car was not built to be an economy car anyways.

I think you're probably thinking of 2nd, 3rd, and 4th in the manual essentially being 1st, 2nd, and 3rd in the automatic.

Here's an excerpt from the auto and manual sections of the shop manuals. 4th is almost exactly 1:1 like 3rd. I think it's because the manual 1st gear is so damn low; I really wish it was closer to ~2.8 or so so that it wasn't so damn short. I also remember when I had the auto being upset that I didn't have an overdriven gear like 5th.

This is what I was basing my statements off of. That being said, the shop manuals also say that the final drive ratios for both transmissions is 3.44:1. When I had my manual transmission apart I specifically remember counting 32 teeth on the crown gear and 9 on the pinion (I have pics to show it to). 32/9=3.55 not 3.44. If the crown gear had 31 teeth instead it would be 3.44 bit I've gone back and checked my photos and counted the teeth over and over and it's definitely 32 teeth. Either I have a weird transmission/differential or the shop manual is wrong. Given that my cars rpms while driving are the same as all other manuals I've driven, I think it's a documentation error.

http://img.tapatalk.com/d/14/05/23/e6utemym.jpg

http://img.tapatalk.com/d/14/05/23/7a5yhedu.jpg

[SEO Motorsports]

Ok, good to know thanks. I did hear once that some manual transmissions had longer gears than others.

[Henrik]

For those who are interested, I shot a 5 min video of the car - talking briefly about it and starting it, revving it, and letting it idle.

More videos to come as time goes along.

Enjoy!


Thanks for posting Jeremiah. A very clean installation indeed. One question though: At about 1:35 you are talking about a wood block being used to protect the oil pan. Conceptually I understand wht you're saying (hey, they even do that in F1!) but if you could post a few close-ups of that I would appreciate it.

Thanks,

[DeLorean03]

It's not an actual wood block. Eddie took a 2 x 4 and held it up against the frame. When I went "Ok.....?", he pointed out that the wood was closer to the ground than the tip of the oil pan. He was visually showing me that the wood - being right up against the edge of the frame, would bottom out first before the oil pan.

Basically he is saying the frame will hit the ground before we bottom out the oil pan of the engine.

[SEO Motorsports]

The oil pan is about 1" higher than the bottom of the frame.

[hillbillydmc]

The Delorean looks and sounds great, very clean installation Eddie. :)

[SEO Motorsports]

Thanks, I want a ride in your car one of these days.

[DGI]

Congrats!!!! The project looks great. I've never been more excited to buy a D... The search is on for me. Enjoy your "new" car and stay safe.

[Dangermouse]

I came across this while wandering the internets: a well adjusted person in Germany has taken a VW Lupo, which is two sizes below a Golf, and fitted it with not one, but two VR6's

Listen to it start (twice) and go:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v7VSNnhF0Io&list=UUFrPMQW39QqA2DrhMIl8fig

there is a build "slideshow" video in there too. He is calling it a W12, which obviously it isn't

Go on J, you know you want a second one now, in the front.

[ALEXAKOS]

A well adjusted person?
Did you mean a well adjusted pair of VR6's?

Cause that person needs some serious adjusting just fro thinking on making a mod like that!

[Tomcio]

I came across this while wandering the internets: a well adjusted person in Germany has taken a VW Lupo, which is two sizes below a Golf, and fitted it with not one, but two VR6's

All I can say is that this guy is well... well... nuts ;)
BTW, he's not from Germany but from Croatia.

[Dangermouse]

Ah, well that explains it :p

[Farrar]

BTW, he's not from Germany but from Croatia.

Yeah, he's not a Kraut, he's a Croat!

Sorry. :P