First Drive – Electric car

[Dangermouse]

I had my first drive in an electric car yesterday and I must say that I was impressed.

I have noticed recently a marked increase in Nissan Leafs (don’t think it’s “Leaves”??) in my area. There are still more Priuses but the Leafs are definitely driven more aggressively/normally in the morning commute – they are very quick in the 0-30 dash. Prius owners seem to hypermile.

Anyway, I had seen one in my office parking lot occasionally and I finally found out who the owner was and talked myself into a drive.

Standard compact car inside, comfortable with the usual ICE and heater/AC controls (apparently there is a separate 12VDC battery for those luxuries). This one had comfortable cloth seats though I think leather is available (looking on their website, reminded me of what it must have been like in a DeLorean dealership – two interiors; grey or black).

Push button start brings a lot of lights/displays but no sound. The “gearstick” operation needed instruction from my co-worker, an engraving might be nice. The only time it felt golf-cartish was when I was backing out of the parking spot, when it had a very faint beep-beep, not loud enough to be heard in a busy Walmart parking lot in my opinion. Perhaps it is adjustable.

But driving on the road is just like a compact family car, no issues with merging with traffic, acceleration, braking etc. Didn’t try flooring the accelerator, partially because the owner was sitting beside me, but also keeping an eye on the battery level, which is always in the back of your mind according to the owner.

Range is 85 miles and as he has a 30 mile round trip commute, in theory he only needs to charge every other day, but he plugs it in every night, just in case.

Certainly made me consider getting one. At the moment they are about $29k, with $12.5k in tax deductions (federal and state) resulting in a net cost of about $17k. Used, private party sales, according to KBB for both 2012 and 2013 versions are both around $19k which seems incredible. In theory you could make money.


(I see that in the UK they offer a purchase model whereby there is a lower price for the car, but you then rent the battery pack at about $100/month. Don’t see that sales model here)

I would imagine that a Tesla would be even more fun.

[Ryan]

The Tesla model S is my new dream car. I am very interested to see what their model E is going to look like and what it will end up costing.

[Chris4099]

As an electric car owner (Tesla Model S), I can tell you they will change the way you feel about driving forever. Driving an ICE (internal combustion engine) just feels archaic these days with the engine vibration, idling at a stop light, lack of regenerative braking and of course the trips to the gas station (don't underestimate the convenience of charging at home overnight)! Also don't let any detractors talk you out of it. Chances are they've never actually driven one or fully understand the advantages. As long as you have a second car or can rent one for those occasional road trips, there's no reason not to get an EV. Even then, thanks to DC quick charging become more available, those issues will start to go away.

[RammJaeger]

I'd be happy to get an electric Delorean or convert min over if DMCH ever releases theirs.

[Michael]

I drove the Leaf back when they were first introduced. I have also driven a Prius at length...which did not impress me. The Leaf however did impress me. The only thing right now holding 100% electric cars back is the range and recharge time. Once that has been addressed the electric car will be the ride of choice. Hybrids like the Volt, Prius, Civic, Camry, etc. are a waste. Even with the range and refueling problems addressed on the hybrids, the cost of maintenance for batteries every 5 years or so plus the upfront premiums barely cover the fuel savings. It's all but a wash but you do get the PC crowd thumbs up.

The one electric car that has really stood apart from the rest was the Tesla. It actually has decent range especially considering the performance(I believe it was around 150 miles). I talked at length to a tesla owner who enlightened me on how well this car conforms to the demands..which is even more of a feat where I live because of the distance of normal commutes here.

My Leaf experience was a little different. The range supposedly was around 70 miles on a fresh charge...but that's if you are extremely careful with the throttle. I left with 70 miles, drove about 5 miles and got back with 50 miles left..I did drive it hard. Also we live in a place with a lot of hills and climbs. I can only assume things like air conditioning and headlights pull it down even further.

As mentioned the electric car does have a place, but I don't like the idea of having a short leash. I think that holds a lot of people back from making the switch. And if you have the money for a dependable road trip car...then you have the money for gas instead of spending 35k+ on a alternative fuel car to save $1000.00 a year on gas.

They are not quite there yet..they are close but not now.

[Chris4099]

I just read about how Georgia Power has ToU rates that are pretty impressive.

http://www.georgiapower.com/pricing/files/rates-and-schedules/2.30_tou-pev-3.pdf

Basically if you charge a Leaf at night, you will pay less then 1 cent for every two miles driven. In other words to fill up the Leaf after a full day of driving (using 90% of capacity), it will only cost you just over 30 cents (counting charger efficiently loss)! The only drawback is your daytime rates will be higher then what you are paying now. But depending on what appliances you have and how you use them, the usage can be shifted to off-peak times to reduce the costs. If they also allow Net Metering with this, then PV solar might be tempting as you would be producing excess energy during peak times and selling it back at higher rates. Basically reducing your ROI.

I myself use ToU rates and dropped my electric bill by over $20-30 and that was with a night time rate that's still 4 times greater then what Georgia Power is offering. I also have solar which greatly off-sets the peak and mid time period rates. However, my peak time is lower rate and being Oregon I have less AC demands during the summer. So making sure you do some number crunching first before switching to this billing if you decide to go there.

[Rich W]

After the Winter we have had (and still having), including a couple more cold nights this week in the -5 degress to -10 degrees range,
I would like to hear how this latest "science experiment" went this very cold Winter, in the Central IL town of Normal, IL.

http://www.greencarreports.com/news/1089012_how-did-a-small-illinois-town-end-up-with-300-plug-in-cars

Although they originally wanted to acquire up to 1000 Leafs, their Plan B was 1000 MiEVs from Mitsubishi, eventually settling for 300 units.

With a range of only 60-80 miles, the MiEV would barely cover my daily commute, so I would really prefer a 100+ mile range for daily use.

However, a Normal, IL Mitsubishi dealer was offering a special $69/month lease for 24 months in 2013, which seemed very hard to pass up.

[Dangermouse]

I drove the Leaf back when they were first introduced. I have also driven a Prius at length...which did not impress me.

As mentioned the electric car does have a place, but I don't like the idea of having a short leash. I think that holds a lot of people back from making the switch. And if you have the money for a dependable road trip car...then you have the money for gas instead of spending 35k+ on a alternative fuel car to save $1000.00 a year on gas.

They are not quite there yet..they are close but not now.

I had a Prius as a rental car a couple of times and if you drive them like any other car, the mileages is way below the touted rates. I did find myself hypermiling just to see what could be done, turning into the guy rambling along a road with a huge tailback of traffic behind him.:boxface:

The co-worker owner was very clear that this would be a second car (at least). He bought it to replace a Corolla, but now he thinks he may keep both (plus the minivan) He watches what trips his family members took in it, from a range perspective. But he has a 2 year lease at about $140/mo, so he's happy to try it.

[Dangermouse]

I just read about how Georgia Power has ToU rates that are pretty impressive.
.

Yes and no.

My regular domestic rate is about 10c, so 1 cent at night is fantastic. Put your clothes dryer and dishwasher on timers and run them at night and you would save quite a bit.

GA Power are obviously trying to smooth out their consumption profile between day and night, which is a good idea for them.

The problem, of course is that 20c rate for on-peak summer AC costs here in the south. As it is, my power bill goes up by at least $150/mo in summer. My friends estimated $20/month car recharge cost would be eaten up in no time. :what_the:

[Chris4099]

I can say from personal experience that I loose up to 20% range in extreme cold situations. For a Leaf owner, as long as the route trip commute is 60 miles or less, then this is not going to be a factor. The range lose can also be minimized by pre-heating the car while still parked in the garage. Once the car is warmed up, power consumption to heat the cabin is greatly reduced. Another trick is to reduce the cabin temp and use seat heaters which are far more efficient. While this works just fine for me, it has a much lower GWAF (girlfriend/wife acceptance factor) then keeping the cabin air temp warm as my fiancee can attest to. LOL

Fortunately for Dermot, I don't think he needs to worry about sub zero temps really hurting his range in Georgia! :)

[Exolis]

I had a Leaf for the weekend, after that I didn't have range anxiety, for typical usage. Just to clarify a little bit, it does have the High Voltage system and 12V System. The A/C Controls are 12V, but the Heat Pump and Heater work off of the High Voltage System. Basically the 12V system will turn on and off the High Voltage System, one press is ACC, 2 is IGN On and 1 Press with Brake applied is "Eng On", in which you should hear a little chime doing so(might be configurable to change the chime).

The Ranges vary quiet a bit (as has been said), the indicator that shows how many miles you have left if basically an estimate based on driving habits and charge. Driving in ECO Mode, with little loads on (in the spring time), I think I got the indicator up to 125 miles. Then around 75 with AC, RR Defroster, Heat Seats, etc going.

I've been thinking of getting the Leaf myself, with the tax incentives, Nissan Discount and the fact my work has several 220V chargers and Quick Chargers, I would essentially never had to pay to charge my car lol.

Haven't driven the Model S, while I'm sure it's very nice and all, but if I could afford that I would rather buy a QX60.