What's a reasonable price for a replacement engine?

[DMCVegas]

From pessimism to optimism... So, what's the best head gasket to buy? Oh, never mind, I'll just call Josh at DPI, who only stocks the best.

Honestly yes, call Josh on this one. And please, let us know what you find too. I've heard rumors that the Fel Pro gaskets are the way to go compared to the Volvo ones, and that the stock DMCH ones aren't as good as what went on at the factory in Douvrin... So I've no damn clue as to what is going on, and wouldn't be in any position to give advice on that one.

I see there have been a boatload of replies since the last time I checked in. Sorry I haven't been around to answer them all -- either Gmail or vBulletin is doing something weird where I don't get notifications that there's been a reply to a thread I'm subscribed to until a few days after the reply has been posted.

Anyway, we got off the track a little bit, but I appreciate all of the input here so far.

What's the best way to test for a head gasket leak without the engine running? I have a compression tester ... should I hook it up and look for bubbles in the coolant?

-Farrar

No worries at all. My wife is going to school to finish her degree, and working at the same time. So I know how hectic things can get.

As for blown head gaskets, it's funny because we were talking about that not too long ago in another thread.
http://dmctalk.org/showthread.php?12537-Ooze-Theory

I've got two engines, one with a good head gasket, and one with a blown one. I finally got around to creating a side-by-side comparison of the photos that I promised previously, and here they are. The first photo is of the oil filler cap.



On the left you can see the Oil Filler Cap from the PRV with a blown Head Gasket. Lots of people will tell you that when water gets into oil, it looks like chocolate milk. Now that might be true for differentials and whatnot when that oil gets exposed to muddy water. But when it's coolant that gets mixed in with engine oil, it looks nothing like chocolate milk. It looks like snot.

On the right side you see a clean oil cap on a properly running engine with a good head gasket. Inside of the Oil Filler Cap is part #102418; Filter Cartridge. DMCH doesn't sell, or even list this part. I've no idea why. But rest assured, it is serviceable. The bottom insert pops right out with a screwdriver. When you pull it out, it looks like a roll of chain link fencing that someone clipped together. Drop it in a bucket of parts cleaner, and it's good to go. But again, this is where Crank Case gasses get sucked up into the intake to be burned off. They all get pulled through that Filter. I imagine that it is probably for situations just like this, to keep the intake manifold and air inlet assembly clean. So when enough of this goop goes in there to get clogged, that's when you have excess pressures build up in the crank case. And the only real way out for them is though the main seals on the crankshaft ends.

Next up are the Oil Filler Necks.



Again the engine with the blown head gasket is on the left. The first thing that you notice is the absence of a screen. I don't even know what the part number for that thing is. But what I do know is that it's this clear-ish plastic screen that just sits down in there. It looks gold because it's been stained by the oil. But if an engine ever overheats at all, that little screen will melt faster than a crayon on asphalt in summertime. It becomes this deformed, white blob of plastic that starts to drip down. Looks nasty. And during the next oil change it'll be removed. Now I don't know if the 3.0L engines have that screen. But what I can tell you about the 2.7 & 2.8 models is if you ever see that screen deformed or missing, you know you're dealing with an over heated engine.

Also, look at the top of the Filler Neck. You can see all of that rust from where the water vapor has been condensing.

Now I don't know if there is a specific way for you to check the liners at the bottom of the block for leaking per se. But once you slide the heads off, you should see some obvious damage of where the head gasket is torn/deformed, and there would be streaks of coolant or rust where there shouldn't be any.

[Farrar]

Robert, that greenish/yellowish crap is EXACTLY what my car has had on the bottom of its oil cap for over three years. I was told that I simply wasn't driving the car enough to get it hot, and so condensation was collecting there, and just to change the oil more often. Well, live and learn.

I have never once seen that plastic filter screen. Thanks for the photo. That was informative -- and disheartening. It means that my car's engine had been overheated and the previous owner never even told me about it. I guess I overpaid. Again, live and learn.

I looked up what it takes to change a head gasket on a PRV. There is absolutely no way I can do that -- there are too many special tools required, and I, too, am finishing out college while working part-time.

It looks like I will have to prepare this car for long-term storage. I graduate in the spring, and after that I will (I hope) have a full-time job again, and I will have new options to consider after that time.

Thanks, everyone, for all your help and suggestions -- and Robert especially for the photos.

[Farrar]

I guess one way to check for a head gasket leak is to look at your oil dipstick two days apart and if the level goes up, yet you're dripping oil on the floor, you've got a head gasket leak. Another symptom I guess is coolant disappearing from the expansion tank.

Looks like Robert's diagnosis was right on. I've put the car up on jackstands and am draining the oil/coolant tonight. Going to prep the car for long-term inactivity.

Thanks for all your help, gang!

[Rich_NYS]

I have never once seen that plastic filter screen. Thanks for the photo. That was informative -- and disheartening. It means that my car's engine had been overheated and the previous owner never even told me about it. I guess I overpaid. Again, live and learn.

+1, thanks Robert that was very informative for sure.

Sorry to hear the diagnosis, Farrar.

[DMCVegas]

That whole, "You're not driving the car to get it hot enough" line really only applies if you live in a very cold climate, where you never warm your engine up before driving, and your commute is so short that the bitter cold never lets it warm up. On top of that, it also has to do with the particular engine design too. The Chrysler PowerTech engines with their oil filler necks are perfect examples of this. Not just a design problem, but also a very common one too. So if this was a problem with your DeLorean not warming up as these people told you, trust me that it would be a common enough issue that it would have been covered decades ago.

Make sure that if nothing else, you also prep the fuel system before you drain the coolant and decommission the engine. Otherwise you'll have to pull the injectors and let them spray into some jars or something to do this. Burning the fuel off inside of the engine is a bit safer though. That way when you're ready to get the car back onto the road, you won't have to deal with an expensive fuel system repair.

Now I don't know about the risks of rust on the crankshaft, connecting rods, bearings, and oil passages. But that snot is probably all over the inside of the engine. I had asked Rob Grady about long-term problems with internal rust on the PRV in that other thread, but he never responded. So I don't know if there is a risk of internal rust causing permanent damage, or if you can just pull the block and get it hot tanked.*â€*

In any case, if you DO have a blown head gasket, where water has gone into the combustion chambers (mine started with just water in the oil passages with no steam in the exhaust), you're also going to want to pull the spark plugs, and vacuum, or blow all of the water out of them. Then when you're done and the cylinders are dry, fog the combustion chambers. I know that Sta-Bil and Marvel Mystery Oil can both be used, just make certain that they, or whatever other product you choose to use, are safe for catalytic convertors.

Right now you're planning ahead for the future. The biggest problem with that is that we never know what the future holds in store. 6 months turned into 10 years for me. So please, learn from my mistakes. You've got to go ahead and plan for that worst case scenario. Along those lines too, you've also got to keep some options open, and decide about what you might just want to do down the line. You've got some block problems, and who knows about what else might be going on. Probably nothing else, though Josh does say that you probably do have other problems. In any case, it might just be easier to drop a 3.0L in with EFI rather than rebuild your 2.8L. Plus you could sell of the K-Jetronic parts to offset the cost.

Or you could even go with another engine swap entirely. Who knows. But I would at least plan on preserving as much as you currently have right now in order to keep your options open later.



*Old Fashioned "Hot Tank" chemicals are NOT safe for aluminum blocks. There are however less caustic chemicals now that are safe for aluminum. You just have to find a shop that offers that service.

â€*Given the fact that you already have an epoxy repair on the VOD for block rot, you also might want to instead clean the disassembled block by hand. Get a blow gun to blow out passages, and some Simple Green, if not Chemtool as well. And rest assured, it will probably be messy. But, it could save the block. If you wanted.

[Farrar]

Thanks for the info, Robert. Since I have at least two "block rot" holes in the engine valley, I plan to just replace the engine when time allows.