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Thread: Car running poorly

  1. #21
    '82 T3 FABombjoy's Avatar
    Join Date:  May 2011

    Location:  Lansing, MI

    Posts:    1,023

    My VIN:    10270

    Quote Originally Posted by Helirich View Post
    If it is leaning the engine out and I can't adjust the CP down, how can I set it up per the chart? I do have a plug in the access hole.
    -Connect fuel pressure gauges & set for control pressure. Connect dwell meter for good measure.
    -Remove vacuum enrichment hose from T and plug engine side
    -Run car to temp. Do what is necessary to keep it idling.
    -Reference high end of pressure chart for temp, adjust WUR hex screw until CP reads center of spec
    -If fueling becomes poor and idle suffers, make small corrections to CP and adjust CO to compensate
    -Repeat last 2 until control pressure full hot reading is correct
    -Adjust CO per dwell procedure.
    -Allow vehicle to completely cool, then recheck control pressure referenced at engine ambient temp. Ice it down if you want to check it even lower.
    -If how & cold control pressures are withing spec, solve no further fueling issues with control pressure adjustments. Seal the bottom cap and leave it alone.
    -Connect vacuum enrichment circuit to handheld vacuum pump and perform pressure checks per manual

    If you still have fuel problems after this, it's not the WUR
    Luke S :: 10270 :: 82 Grey 5-Speed :: Single Watercooled T3 .60/.48 :: Borla Exhaust :: MSD Ignition :: MS3X Fully SFI Odd-fire EFI :: DevilsOwn Methanol Injection

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  2. #22
    Senior Member
    Join Date:  Dec 2018

    Posts:    425

    Quote Originally Posted by FABombjoy View Post
    -Connect fuel pressure gauges & set for control pressure. Connect dwell meter for good measure.
    -Remove vacuum enrichment hose from T and plug engine side
    -Run car to temp. Do what is necessary to keep it idling.
    -Reference high end of pressure chart for temp, adjust WUR hex screw until CP reads center of spec
    -If fueling becomes poor and idle suffers, make small corrections to CP and adjust CO to compensate
    -Repeat last 2 until control pressure full hot reading is correct
    -Adjust CO per dwell procedure.
    -Allow vehicle to completely cool, then recheck control pressure referenced at engine ambient temp. Ice it down if you want to check it even lower.
    -If how & cold control pressures are withing spec, solve no further fueling issues with control pressure adjustments. Seal the bottom cap and leave it alone.
    -Connect vacuum enrichment circuit to handheld vacuum pump and perform pressure checks per manual

    If you still have fuel problems after this, it's not the WUR
    I think you don't understand what I'm saying. I have never seen the control pressure below 58 psi. I have the adjustment set as low as it will go. I haven't checked the chart, but someone on this forum told me it should never be above 55 psi. So unless my high readings are a result of the gauge, it's bad. I'm going out to work on it right now. So maybe I'll have something to report tonite.

  3. #23
    Administrator Ron's Avatar
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    I've done it the way Luke does as a quick check if the engine is warm, and it works.

    But to set the WUR after a rebuild, the following works best for me:
    Begin with the engine dead cold, vacuum plugged.
    Using a laser gun, aim at the seam joining the WUR and valve cover.
    Find the pressure for that temp in the chart.
    Setup for Primary pressure check. (If it's off, you are wasting your time.)
    Start the engine.
    Primary pressure should be 75 psi (+/- 4).
    If OK, immediately switch to Control pressure. (Expect it to run ruff.)
    Control pressure should match value previously found in chart. (Expect ~40 psi@~85F)
    Compare the pressures with the chart as the temp rises.
    The pressure should stop rising at 52 psi (+/- 3), 104F.
    If OK, follow the vacuum checks listed.

    If something goes wrong or you have to make adjustments, let it cool completely and start over.
    Confirm all basic settings (timing etc,) then set CO.

  4. #24
    Administrator Ron's Avatar
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    Location:  North GA

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    Quote Originally Posted by Helirich View Post
    I think you don't understand what I'm saying. I have never seen the control pressure below 58 psi. I have the adjustment set as low as it will go. I haven't checked the chart, but someone on this forum told me it should never be above 55 psi. So unless my high readings are a result of the gauge, it's bad. I'm going out to work on it right now. So maybe I'll have something to report tonite.
    Yep, the manual shows 3.8 bar = 55.114343 psi as max.
    58 and warm follows it running lean, as suspected. But again, it doesn't make sense that it would start (at 80 something?) and run so well until well after it hit 104 and surely not for several minutes at 150 afterwards (before wimping out)...

  5. #25
    '82 T3 FABombjoy's Avatar
    Join Date:  May 2011

    Location:  Lansing, MI

    Posts:    1,023

    My VIN:    10270

    Something about the rebuild isn't right. Hard to say without full details, pics, etc.

    I thought it runs rough when testing system pressure? I've been slowly purging all of my k-jet knowledge LOL
    Luke S :: 10270 :: 82 Grey 5-Speed :: Single Watercooled T3 .60/.48 :: Borla Exhaust :: MSD Ignition :: MS3X Fully SFI Odd-fire EFI :: DevilsOwn Methanol Injection

    Console5.com - Game console parts, kits, games and more. [shop] [wiki] [RSS] [f] [t]

  6. #26
    Administrator Ron's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FABombjoy View Post
    I thought it runs rough when testing system pressure? I've been slowly purging all of my k-jet knowledge LOL
    No, you are right -- It will definitely run ruff when set to Primary, if that is what you meant. After a WUR rebuild, it probably will (...not with a factory job as it should come pre-set.)

  7. #27
    Senior Member
    Join Date:  Dec 2018

    Posts:    425

    More driving, less answers

    So I removed the WUR from the valve cover and unplugged it. I left the vacuum hooked up and wrapped it up in rags and masking tape. Took it for the same drive as yesterday. I would say it is 6 miles out and the same back. Yesterday, it started running bad at mile five. Of course, I did drive around my yard for five minutes before I went out.

    Today, I drove the out and back and it never ran bad. I pulled in the garage and bolted the muffler on. (I had been running with it off) This took a little time, but the engine never cooled completely down. Then I took it for another run. (The only change is the muffler)

    Same course, out and back. It appeared to drive better than the first drive. This might have been just illusion because it didn't sound obnoxious. On both of these drives, I got it up to 75 mph and then backed off to 65 for most of the paved road. I pulled it in to the garage and plugged the WUR in, but left it wrapped in the rags. Out for another run.

    This time I went a differnt way because it has a shorter route over dirt road. (Didn't want to keep dusting the neighbors) The engine was noticeably rougher running, but not as bad as yesterday. I was not forced to drive in second gear because of power. I pull in the garage and unwrapped the WUR and screwed it back on the valve cover. Out for another ride.

    Took the short course to the pavement again. This time it ran rough and I thought about turning around. Then it kind of "cleared its throat" and seemed to get better. Out on the paved road, I got it up to 65. Coming back it wasn't too bad.

    The best ride was the second. (WUR unplugged and insulated from the valve cover) but I can't say any of them were terrible.

    Oh, and the temp never got to the line between the 100 and 220. I did have the AC on, so the fans would be running.

    It seems to run smooth between 2500 and 3500. (And have good power) Is that where you guys drive it? It seems that 5th gear is just for holding speed. You can't go faster unless you go to 4th. Not sure if this car will do 88 mph in its current tune.

  8. #28
    Senior Member
    Join Date:  Dec 2018

    Posts:    425

    So today I decide to take the car for a long drive. (If it would make it.) First, I filled the tank. I put about 8 gallons in and I could see the gas in the filler neck. Now if you do the math, I put five gallons in the other nite. So all told that's 13 gallons since that night. Of course I have driven some since then, but not allot. Since the tank is supposed to be 13.5, I had to be pretty low. The guage said alittle less than a quarter tank which would be 3+ gallons. Could it be that when it gets that low, it runs bad? I have the new fuel pump/gauge sender in one. Are those style senders good? I could put my old sender back in the tank if that works better.

    Anyways, I drove to the fastenal. (About ten miles) No problem. Drove to a locksmith. (About 4 more miles) No problem except they don't have blank keys for the car. I drove to Oriely's and bought some wiper blades. (About 2 more miles) No problem. Drove to tractor supply and back home. The car drove great the whole time.

    I assume the mixture is still not correct, but it must be close to run like this. Was the gas just low? I don't know. I'm not ruling it out. Maybe the WUR return line was clogged at the FD? The line was new and I rebuilt the regulator, but if it was clogged right at the FD, it would raise the control pressure. Then maybe driving around it got unclogged. Yesterday, it did feel like it suddenly "cleared its throat". All I can say is I'm grinning now.

    A heartfelt thanks to all that tried to help me.

  9. #29
    Senior Member
    Join Date:  May 2011

    Location:  Northern NJ

    Posts:    8,028

    My VIN:    10757 1st place Concourse 1998

    You were very low on fuel. When turning, braking or accelerating you could have been starving the motor for fuel. With the OEM set-up if you have problems it usually happens when you are less than 1/2 because the pick-up hose has a hole or it is kinked or something else is wrong.
    David Teitelbaum

  10. #30
    Senior Member Rich's Avatar
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    Location:  San Francisco Bay Area, Calif.

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    My VIN:    0934

    Club(s):   (NCDMC) (DCUK)

    Nice to read about the progress. A car that reliably starts, warms up, gets you around town, idles and doesn't misfire makes other problems seem solvable.

    Two follow-up questions to see how close you are to tidying this one up:

    1. Did you notice the coolant temp reading during today's (successful) runs? How close to that middle line between 110F and 220F is it after it warms up and the A/C is on?

    2. Did it feel like it had 130HP? You mentioned "power loss" as a main issue some time ago. Good power now at all engine speeds?

    PS, DMC sells blank keys for the car. They can cut the the keys there, too.
    March '81, 5-speed, black interior

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